decreasing COS membership

[FizzledReligion]

Hello,

From what I have heard, the COS is shrinking, and has been for a couple decades at least. Was the sense (or factual knowledge) of this decrease a major factor in your decision to leave? As a caring outsider, this for me is merely a "feel good" question, I suppose; I'm just hoping that we're accelerating toward the ultimate end of the COS.

Still, I'd imagine that there will always some people who (admirably, you could say) will continue fight for it, even if they are the last one left.

~FR

 

[GE cmdr]

Hello,

From what I have heard, the COS is shrinking, and has been for a couple decades at least. Was the sense (or factual knowledge) of this decrease a major factor in your decision to leave? As a caring outsider, this for me is merely a "feel good" question, I suppose; I'm just hoping that we're accelerating toward the ultimate end of the COS.

Still, I'd imagine that there will always some people who (admirably, you could say) will continue fight for it, even if they are the last one left.

~FR

Yes, it was a contributing factor for me. Durring my time, i saw 2 missions completely collapse. They went from a place that was constantly busy to a smaller offices and from there they were there by appointment only. Meanwhile COB preaching BIGGEST EXPANSION EVER...while the org closest to me goes belly up.

I mean I always assumed it's an event, they are GOING to keep it happy and light. I thought that extended to showing only the upstats and not advertising the down ones. But it became apparent to me that they were just making shit up. Like new "stats" and ideal orgs

BIG NEW BUILDING THAT IS TOTALLY OPEN!!! HERE IS A CGI RENDERING OF WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE!!! OVER 2,000 CHAIRS!!! IF YOU TOOK ALL THE COPER WIRE IT WOULD WRAP AROUND A 1 GALLON JUG OF MILK 5 MILLION TIMES!!! THATS 500 BILLION GALLONS OF MILK WRAPPED IN WIRE!! STRAIGHT UP AND VERTICAL!!!

 

[FizzledReligion]

LOL, that's awesome! And yeah, I do "feel good" knowing you smelled the crap and got out of the stall.

I must say that the brazen, obvious lying I hear about in COS is making me take another more critical look at everything (and I already thought I was a more-than-average critical thinker).

 

[GE cmdr]

LOL, that's awesome! And yeah, I do "feel good" knowing you smelled the crap and got out of the stall.

I must say that the brazen, obvious lying I hear about in COS is making me take another more critical look at everything (and I already thought I was a more-than-average critical thinker).

d
Well unfortunately, scientology is black and white, you are in or you are out. To me, I feel that the Sci tech is awesome it's just i can't deal with COBs behavior and still be affiliated with the church.

 

[FizzledReligion]

Can you do the tech on your own...be your own promoter up the ladder without the org? Do you need to keep away from more advanced material until you reach the appropriate level, or is that constraint not important? I thought that was baked into the creed, no?

 

[Terril park]

d
Well unfortunately, scientology is black and white, you are in or you are out. To me, I feel that the Sci tech is awesome it's just i can't deal with COBs behavior and still be affiliated with the church.

You don't have to. There is the COB free freezone and independent scientology. Almost certainly now larger than CO$. You can do
any service you wish, OT levels and L's included.

 

[GE cmdr]

You don't have to. There is the COB free freezone and independent scientology. Almost certainly now larger than CO$. You can do
any service you wish, OT levels and L's included.

i am waiting for 2 things

1. COB dropping dead
2. Pat to come out of hiding

 

[Dulloldfart]

There is freezone and independednt feild auditors but it gets a little tricky. With some of the OT levels its hard to tell what you are getting yourself into. Is this the actual level, is it a freezone remake, is it completely made up? Read the fischman version of OT8 and you will see what im talking about.

The Prometheus Reports (for example at http://freezonescientologist.info/Prometheus/) are fairly accurate rewrites of Hubbard's stuff. It omits the New OT1 in use after about 1984, which is basically running problems processes on antagonistic people/places until flat. The joke you are talking about is possibly some silly command that looks like a rudiment and seems to be perpetuated by some moron as "OT1". There is the 13-step OT1 in use for years prior to 1984 there.

The whole reading OT levels being bad for you is mostly myth, i don't think i have ever actually read that anywhere. I think they were kept confidential for PR reasons and RUNNING them without being ready can be dangerous.

The whole OT2/3 trip is fiction. There would appear to be genuine underlying phenomena that the procedures tap into, but Hubbard's theory is ridiculous.

Paul

 

[GE cmdr]

The whole OT2/3 trip is fiction. There would appear to be genuine underlying phenomena that the procedures tap into, but Hubbard's theory is ridiculous.

Paul

d

Well there is something to the process part of it, if the story side is true or not I do not know and never will. The only thing I ever found interesting about it is that he came up with this stuff in the 60s. The KT boundry layer, the layer that is around the entire planet was discovered to be around 66 million years old wasn't discovered until much latter. Maybe hubbard was a little off in his estimates or maybe our dating methods are not perfect. So in 67 he said you would find a layer of green glass if you dug deep enough, there wasn't green glass but there was evidence of an explosion that covered the planet.

 

[AngeloV]

d

Well there is something to the process part of it, if the story side is true or not I do not know and never will. The only thing I ever found interesting about it is that he came up with this stuff in the 60s. The KT boundry layer, the layer that is around the entire planet was discovered to be around 66 million years old wasn't discovered until much latter. Maybe hubbard was a little off in his estimates or maybe our dating methods are not perfect. So in 67 he said you would find a layer of green glass if you dug deep enough, there wasn't green glass but there was evidence of an explosion that covered the planet.

Oh, yes Dr. Hubbard was a mere few million years off the mark.

Really, OT 3 is complete and utter fiction and is falsifiable - some of the volcanoes listed DID NOT EXIST in time period....or maybe you think he was a bit off the mark on that too.

You really need to do some homework and untangle yourself from the cult. You are giving a bald faced liar and conman credibility he does not deserve. At all.

 

[dchoiceisalwaysrs]

Can you do the tech on your own...be your own promoter up the ladder without the org? Do you need to keep away from more advanced material until you reach the appropriate level, or is that constraint not important? I thought that was baked into the creed, no?

The following is so so clear. I think it will answer a tone of questions..

It should be required reading for any one below or should I say who has not yet reached the depths of delusion of OTVII and OT8.

IN FACT it should be part of a full disclosure which is required by law to be read and an independent examination with a 100% to pass grade, before any scn group including the front groups can be joined.


http://www.ezlink.com/~perry/CoS/Theology/stacy.htm

In my opinion, this insistence on letting go of any boundaries for what is true and what is imaginary, and the requirement that one is not allowed to compare notes with anyone else about what is coming up in the auditing sessions, is all part of a gradual indoctrination that prepares people for what they will be required to accept as reality on the upper levels.

And
But having already installed L. Ron Hubbard in my mind as the unerring dispenser of Truth, there was no way for me to reject the information. I remember feeling completely numb and making sure to arrange my expression so that the course supervisor would not realize how stunned I was

And

And that is why nothing can stand in the way of Scientology's forward expansion. That is why anyone who tries to stop Scientology must be ruthlessly moved out of the way. Truly, it is a matter of the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics! How can we be concerned about the fate of one individual critic, or one individual Suppressive Person, when the fate of the entire Universe is at stake?
Now when you read Keeping Scientology Working you truly understand what LRH meant when he said: "The whole agonized future of this planet, every man, woman and child on it, and your own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology."
Now it is perfectly clear to you why LRH set up the Guardian's Office, now known as the Office of Special Affairs, and said "The goal of the Department is to bring the government and hostile philosophies or societies into a state of complete compliance with the goals of Scientology. This is done by high level ability to control and in its absence by low level ability to overwhelm. Introvert such agencies. Control such agencies. Scientology is the only game on Earth where everybody wins. There is no overt [meaning crime] in bringing good order."
This is what goes on in the mind of a high-level Scientologist.

 

[dchoiceisalwaysrs]

I really had insufficient information as to the actual membership.

What shot me out was the abuses at the top. When I found out about them I was done done done in less than a minute.

 

[arcxcauseblows]

replied to wrong thread...

 

[Knows]

Hello,

From what I have heard, the COS is shrinking, and has been for a couple decades at least. Was the sense (or factual knowledge) of this decrease a major factor in your decision to leave? As a caring outsider, this for me is merely a "feel good" question, I suppose; I'm just hoping that we're accelerating toward the ultimate end of the COS.

Still, I'd imagine that there will always some people who (admirably, you could say) will continue fight for it, even if they are the last one left.

~FR

yes - it is true. I was in last in 2011 and it was dead, dead, dead. I was one of the only paying public in the Org and I had traveled around the country to visit many other Orgs to find out they are all DEAD!

Now - they are just a shell of that dead .... blown staff members and no public coming in

The families that started these Org's keep it going and some of them are dying now of cancer - so sad...they are not that old either. The stress is too much.

Now - Orgs are referred to as mORGues.

So appropriate.

 

[The Anabaptist Jacques]

I left when I no longer accepted the religious philosophy.

I new the membership was declining. But that didn't matter.

It was a decision based on my views, not anyone's statistics.

I didn't do a Doubt formula; I simply believed something else.

The Anabaptist Jacques

 

[FizzledReligion]

Now - they are just a shell of that dead .... blown staff members and no public coming in

No amount of stat fudgery can hide this. SOB must see the writing in the wall. Hate to say it, but I hope it's driving him crazy.

 

[TrevAnon]

In 1990, ARIS had found about 45,000 Scientologists. In 2001, it found 55,000, and in 2008, it found 25,000.

http://www.villagevoice.com/news/scientologists-how-many-of-them-are-there-anyway-6717701

As of 2013, active Scientologists fewer than 20,000 worldwide'

http://tonyortega.org/2016/02/13/sc...ve-scientologists-fewer-than-20000-worldwide/

I think "John P. Capitalist", a frequent contributor to the Bunker who is pretty good at doing estimates, currently thinks there are 17,000 scilons.

The problem, AFAIK, is that people in the cult only know about their own org. If that is getting smaller and smaller and they keep hearing about worldwide expansion yada yada yada they think other orgs must be doing well.

Surprise - those other orgs are also failing.

I think the decreasing membership was a reason to leave for e.g. Chris Shelton who had insight in the numbers for more orgs, and so knew the glitzy stories at the events were lies. But he may be able to correct me here.

Also: http://www.mikerindersblog.org/10-million-scientologists-where-are-they/

 

[FizzledReligion]

TrevA, I just saw a video of a talk by Chris Shelton...good stuff

 

[Teanntás]

yes - it is true. I was in last in 2011 and it was dead, dead, dead. I was one of the only paying public in the Org and I had traveled around the country to visit many other Orgs to find out they are all DEAD!

Now - they are just a shell of that dead .... blown staff members and no public coming in

The families that started these Org's keep it going and some of them are dying now of cancer - so sad...they are not that old either. The stress is too much.

Now - Orgs are referred to as mORGues.

So appropriate.

As a side note : Why would an organization that was growing bother to use its staff to make hundreds of calls to someone like me who hasn't stepped inside a Scientology organization in about 30 years. There's only one answer - desperation.

 

[TrevAnon]

TrevA, I just saw a video of a talk by Chris Shelton...good stuff

I've been following him for quite some time now.