All ESMB Members Invited to Clearwater Event

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Type4_PTS, Dec 18, 2017.

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  1. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Anyone here coming to this March 10th event?

    I'm going to working on a job in another part of the country, but will get there if I can.
  2. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

  3. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Silver Meritorious Patron

    Awesome Pitsy.

    I might have a few shekels in my grouch bag by then and I've been meaning to get down there to visit a couple friends from back in the day.

    If I can get there I will.

    Thanx for the "heads up".

    You gonna be there?

    You got another dinner on me if we're both there. We'll pick up a couple others we meet there and make a foursome of it. On me.
  4. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Thank-you, but it's going to be a last minute decision as to whether I'll be able to be there or not.
  5. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    It's looking good for me to get over there for at least some of the afternoon/evening in Clearwater.

    I've got to say though, given our exchanges in recent years, I found your post and invitation quite odd.

    You seem to have an agenda as a Hubbard apologist which I find pretty distasteful. Your actions of derailing countless threads and other violations of ESMB forum rules led me to strongly support Emma's ban of Commander Birdsong, your previous identity. And when you went on a crusade of defending Hubbard's abuse of children (imprisoning small children in chain lockers for days and weeks at a time), lets just say you pretty much killed any chance of my wanting to meet you for dinner during the next 75 million years or so.

    Check back with me after that.
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2018
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  6. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    I'm going!
  7. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Hi Len, look forward to meeting you!
  8. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    Same here.
  9. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    How is the get together going? Ohhhhhh, wait I live 13 hours in the future. I guess I will have to wait until March 11th to get an update. Safe traveling all future attendees.
  10. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Hello to all. I really miss being there with you. Hope to hear from some of ya about all the fun being had.
  11. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

  12. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

  13. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous

    that's such an opportunity to ''really'' travel your time track to the past...
    (mission into time)
    from Oz to Florida, USA :p
  14. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous


    I would have fly to Clearwater this time, if other ciscumstances weren't prevenying tme from leaving at this time.
    I think I shall make a list fo whom is still talking to me..for next time :D not to be left in a corner :oops:
    (it would have been an opportunity to face the past devils within me (flag SO)... )
    When exactly is the event ???

    Anyway, have fun guys! ;)
  15. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Since the event is over we could meet in Oz (wherever that is) and then take the yellow brick road into the past. Don't forget your slippers.
  16. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous

    I didn't realized it was an old thread :oops:
    I had a locational and am back in pt now!

    However, I would be honored to slip my slippers into the futur. ;) Wherever that is, either Oz or Lord of the Rings land and make a stop by the yellow brick road! (it's so far though)
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  17. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Silver Meritorious Patron

    O don't be silly Pitsy...

    I don't usually think in terms of "agenda" but it does seem I'm working on a hell of an agenda these days getting a proposed Amendment to the floor of Congress, liberating 27 million North Koreans and engineering reparations for slavery among other things such as securing the Mars Design Center for the metropolitan Boston area.

    The only serious "agenda" item I've ever had vis-a-vis CoS is to make sure it doesn't turn into an all consuming totalitarian juggernaut.

    I've never defended child abuse and certainly never endorsed putting a four year old child in the chain locker for two days (48 hours Pitsy. NOT "weeks"). However Derek was unharmed, the offense is a misdemeanor on which the statute of limitations is loooong since expired and howling about it more than a quarter century after Ron's death does nothing but show how lame and empty the anti-scilon case against LRH truly is.


    Derek Greene was unharmed.

    My son is dead.

    His death was a wrongful death and he might have survived if I had been with him and it was his uncle, my erstwhile brother-in-law Greg Wilhere then one of Scientology's top half dozen executives who stopped my last best shot at breaking through the blockade. I am a Christian Pitsy. We are slow to anger and quick to forgive. Greg is someone I love and care deeply about and if he had known what he was doing he would not have done it. And even worse, if he had at least a vague understanding of CoS tech and policy he would know that I have been heavily "third partied". I am not going to allow my presumably understandable bitter and resentful sentiments toward the man eclipse the spiritual light which unites us nor dictate my conduct toward him or my relationship to the theory and practice of auditing...
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  18. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    You clearly DID have a serious agenda on ESMB in the past and you admitted just several months ago that you are in fact a Hubbard apologist. Anyone can go back and read your postings (such as in the "In Defense of Hubbard" thread ) and see for themselves.

    And yes, absolutely you defended child abuse and you denied that placing children into the chain locker of a ship was even real child abuse!

    You're still to this day attempting to minimize the extent that children were abused. Derek Greene is only one of MANY incidents. There are other accounts of children being ordered to the chain locker for weeks at a time, and you were certainly aware of that because you've posted about it in the past. And once again you're attempting to minimize the magnitude of the crimes, insisting it's "only a misdemeanor".

    I've got zero desire to redo the discussion on this; anyone who wishes can search it and read about it. But to refresh your memory, here's a few quotes, from yourself and others. (there's dozens of others)

    David Mayo:
    "They used to have people locked in the chain locker, including small children. It was very dangerous because if the anchor started to slip and start running out, it would turn a body into pulp in no time at all. I saw children locked up in the chain locker. He had a birthday party on March 13 1968; there was a woman who he ordered locked in the chain locker. During the party he had her brought out. She was filthy, covered with dirt and rust, and had not been allowed to wash or change clothes - she had been in there a week. She was pretty dirty - he brought her out to the party, he said he was giving her a reprieve and permitting her to come to the party, as if that was a nice gesture. She still wasn't allowed to wash or change, so she was brought to the party and had to stay and later she was returned [to the locker]. He said he was giving her a reprieve but it was just flaunting her degradation. It had looked like things were lightening up a little, people thought maybe things were getting better, then this happened and people were shocked and it gave us a sinister chill. She was in a dress.

    From time to time, Hubbard would cancel such activities, like the chain locker, and blame it on someone else. He said that no one was to be put into the chain locker by his order or decree, and Baron Burez was an evil monster for having chain lockered people. Baron was a US crew member and went into disfavour. He would start such pronouncements with, "It has just come to my attention that..."

    The length of time for children would vary, but no one was there less than a day. The average was a week or two. Three weeks was about the maximum. Age didn't matter. The youngest kids were 5, 6 or 7. Old, young, men, women, big, little; it wouldn't matter because to Scientologists the being is ageless so you don't think in terms of how young or old someone is."

    I had my monthly lunch today with my very dear friend and Attorney of 25 years who is in his 44th year of practicing Family and Business Law, and has prevailed in over 80% of the Cases he has argued for Plaintiffs/Defendants before a Judge and/or Jury. We talk about everything from Football to Politics to getting along with Women to getting old to WWII (he’s a most impressive buff) to our current life goings on, and everything else in between.

    On a whim, I summarized for him the particulars of the Derek Greene Apollo chain locker incident and some of the other Apollo children in chain locker stories I have read, and have had related to me by first hand observers.

    He said that the elemental facts would constitute, in all US Jurisdictions Endangerment of a Child, which is classified as Child Abuse and, due to the age of the child, in virtually all US Jurisdictions would be a Felony, and certainly in all US Jurisdictions if the child was injured.

    He said that give or take a year or two in most US Jurisdiction, if a child age 8 -17 was Endangered more than once in the summarized fashion, it could constitute a Felony as well, depending upon the particulars and number of incidents; that if any child from 8 to 17 was injured, or suffered damage to their health (physical or mental) during the first and only occurrence, or any occurrence, it would also constitute a Felony; that there are some Jurisdictions where, in the case of a child 8-17 Endangered as the stories describe for several days...depending on other mitigating circumstances...would be a Misdemeanor; that in most of those jurisdictions a "serial" or multiple and repeated commission of the Misdemeanor Act of Child Endangerment within a time span of years, not decades, constitutes a Felony, as would any injury or damage to that child during any commission of the Misdemeanor Act.

    He also said that if the person that committed the offense was not a parent, close Relative or Legal Guardian of the child they would invariably be viewed by and dealt with more sternly and harshly by the Judicial System; that he Statutes re: Child Endangerment and Abuse haven’t changed as much as some might think…but, the enforcement of those Statutes by Law Enforcement and Jurists has changed significantly.

    He said that he could not comment as to the International Maritime aspects without “hitting the books” but, if he were Counsel for the Defendant in a US Court, he would tell his client to prepare for the worst of outcomes.

    We have all broken the Law to a greater to lesser degree more than once. Some of us are the survivors of very harsh parental discipline, perhaps even outright child abuse, horribly bad times and the horror of violence and war.

    There is suffering, injustice and cruelty throughout all human history and across the globe every breath we take. Relativism gets Humankind nowhere—just take a good look at the current state of affairs in the CofS. Better yet, just look at the “Legacy” of El Ron…a documented liar, charlatan. Con man and felon (and I’m not talking about Child Abuse) and this Board is littered with the documents, links to the documents and first hand, eye witness accounts of such.

    Several years ago I made a Post here on ESMB about my recently departed friend. He had a series of numbers Tattooed on his arm from when he was an orphaned child in a Nazi Concentration Camp. He died a wealthy man, loved by his wife, many children, grandchildren, treasured by his multitude of friends, revered for his many works of a lifetime of generous philanthropy and truly a Divine Testament to the Transcendent Spirit of the Human Heart.

    Now, I’m not so histrionic as to make even a remote equivalence of my friend’s story to Scn, the SO, the Apollo, El Ron or Derek Greene.

    What I do see here is an equivalence of Relativism, in all its forms, being played out to get “views”.



    Commander Birdsong:
    i repeat myself far too often but it here it comes again

    lrh was an autocrat. with some exceptions of time and place, if you don't want to be there you start walking and in ten minutes you are somewhere else.

    RON WAS NOT A SLAVEMASTER. CoS DOES NOT PRACTICE SLAVERY as similar as it may be in appearance

    i really don't like hearing ron called a child abuser as it distracts from the very serious matter of real child abuse. yeah, i'm glad i didn't have him for a father, but he was OK in many ways. sticking a kid in a chain locker isn't a very nice thing to do to a kid but the kid came out unharmed


    you wanna yap about ron being a child abuser, yap away but you not only detract from the serious subject of child abuse you lose points with intelligent readers of which i suspect this board has many silently lurking
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  19. Free Being Me

    Free Being Me Crusader

    I'll leave this collection of quotes here so this thread isn't derailed.
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2018
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  20. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    I've already derailed my own thread, which I wouldn't have done had it not already achieved its purpose, which was to give a heads up about an event which happened several weeks ago.