Exes and Antis

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Clay Pigeon, Oct 28, 2017.

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  1. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Silver Meritorious Patron

    It's really good to see Emma back as it seems ESMB has drifted off of her original vision. The board seems to have come alive in the past twentyfour hours but where it consistently had nearly two full pages of todays posts recently it has almost always been much less than a full page and often in single digits.

    The abuses of Co$$$$$ are truly serious and if these abuses are to be addressed it must come from outside; from the exes. It can ONLY (a word Hubbard relentlessy abused as all you people who left ONLY because of YOUR MU's and OW's can attest) Antis can't do it. Co$$$ has a right to be there and groups are allowed their own bylaws within the context of public law.

    And the antis make ESMB inhospitable for exes who would seek mutual support in finding ways to reform the damned thing. they also seem to make this board in some degree inhospitable for exes who would speak well of auditing and/or training or speak great times they had while in or great people they knew

    Where are so many great posters of earlier years? Gadfly, Voltaire's Child, The Anabaptist Jacques etc.

    Why are new members not lasting? Not a week goes by without one or two new member intros but none of them seem to plug into the conversation.

    Well, Emma is back and I'm up for renewing this board's former vitality.
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  2. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    The previous board showed every new post as it was posted ... this one just shows the latest post for each thread, so there could be 100 new posts but only the last one for each thread shows up and until you click on a thread you can't see any earlier posts ... the previous system meant you could see a "hot thread" at a glance which was a good thing (I thought) but may not be possible on this board.

    An "ex" scientologist and an "anti" tend to be the same but at varying stages of "deculting", it's insulting to suggest that they are vastly different kinds of people as I suspect you realise. On some boards it seems to amuse the person running it to rant and rave about the "ASC" (anti scientology cult) perhaps in an attempt to get a reaction or make themselves appear relevant (I'm not sure which and don't much care).

    Of the three posters you mention above only one of them (VC) would ever have called herself an indie (ie someone who would perhaps like to see or practice a reformed version of scientology) but she announced very clearly (here, about 8 years ago) that she was no longer an indie and now saw herself as an ex.

    Many brilliant posters (including TAJ and Gadfly) simply moved on, they had said what they wanted to say ... surely that's a good thing, it suggests that they got their real lives back? I know for a fact that ESMB helps enormously with that.

    If you want "reform" (or to seriously discuss reform) I'm sure you can find many places to go and work towards that ... I doubt you'll ever find "reform" welcomed here for what I would have thought were obvious reasons ... that does not make it inhospitable and never has. We don't tend to actively encourage people to stay fixated on cultic thinking and I'm always appalled when I see the occasional person trying to recruit here for their own cult spin offs (and I don't hesitate to say so) and if people can't cope with that (as you are implying) perhaps they are not ready for ESMB, the internet ... or the real world at all for that matter.

    You can't please everyone , but we're not selling anything here ... so we're not trying to.
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  3. Emma

    Emma Mother of Dragons Administrator

    ESMB is for EXES (mainly). You might have an MU on "ex". It means "no longer". If someone is no longer a Scientologist it means they are outta there, not hanging around to fix anything.

    We get the occasional person who is on the fence, but not many. I doubt any of those are going to read ESMB, engage with others then go back inside the church all ready to create a revolution. They usually decide we are right & leave the church, or run away convinced LRH was right about exes being SPs.

    See the header? Meet other exes, Share your experiences, Reunite with old friends. That was the original mission. There was never any interest in reformation.
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  4. Lone Star

    Lone Star Crusader

    Reformers go to alanzos blog. :whistling:
  5. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    The absence of this feature - which, as I recall, also showed some new content of the particular post - tends not to invite participation.

    Apparently, there's nothing that can be done about it.

    At least the old content is preserved.
  6. George Layton

    George Layton Silver Meritorious Patron

    There has just got to be a baby in this bathwater somewhere god damn it!
  7. Lone Star

    Lone Star Crusader

    Okay Dragon Queen we want some of the old features back! We want all the good stuff from the old site plus the good stuff from the new. We want our cake and to eat it too!!



    Yer goddamn right you understand!!
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
  8. Tanchi

    Tanchi Patron with Honors

    And to trash exes.
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  9. EZ Linus

    EZ Linus Patron with Honors

    Isn't, or wasn't there a section on this forum (a sub forum) for indies? I don't understand why most of us have to feel bad for having very strong viewpoints against something so abusive?

    I very much miss and love my friends that are still in. I am absolutely heartbroken. Heartbroken!--that I can't speak to them anymore. You have no idea how much emotional suffering that's caused me just by itself! Of course I had great times, not being brainwashed, but with the people. It's the people that I miss. It's the people that I still love. I always will.

    I don't want to talk about what a great time I had with them here, it's kind of like they are dead, unless they leave, which quite a few have.
  10. screamer2

    screamer2 Occam's Ball Crusher

    Um. there will be cake?
  11. Lone Star

    Lone Star Crusader

    At the end of the day there will be cake. Literally. If you will.
  12. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor

    The abuses of Co$$$$$ are truly serious and if these abuses are to be addressed it must come from outside; from the exes civil litigation, consumer regulatory agencies & law enforcement.

    No. Sociopathic cults that lie, attack, defraud, terrorize and fair-game innocent victims do not have "a right to be there". [HELPFUL TIPS: 1. More clay 2. Try not reading "Advance!" and "Freedom" magazine for 3-10 days]

    Excellent observation! Is there supposed to be an outpoint in that somewhere? LOL.

    As far as "finding ways to reform" Scientology, there is an excellent book containing workable tech on that subject, titled:

    Last edited: Oct 29, 2017
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  13. Emma

    Emma Mother of Dragons Administrator

    I have looked & looked for a way to display ALL news posts but it's just not available on this software. No one has created a plug-in for it either.

    The only thing that comes close is by clicking on Members > Recent activity


    Unfortunately there will be no cake.

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  14. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Silver Meritorious Patron

    Emma, I'm an ex and have been for more than forty years. I left and stopped talking Scientologese the day I walked out the door and have been doing other things, many, many other things for years and I am currently embarked on the profoundly ambitious task of getting a proposal to amend The Constitution of the United States of America, an initiative which as it happens, is predicated on a court case against CoS

    But I am a trained auditor and I learned much from the study and practice of auditing which I have used often and given tremendous amounts of benefit to many people w/o the use of meter or model session or any sort of CS1 education of a preclear. I cannot honestly have anything but a very high regard for the better aspects of Hubbard's work. Which is not to say I'm an "Indie". I don't even know any Indies.


    As a PC I am a ARC Straghtwire Release but before I ever heard of Elron or Scn I was exploring and practicing "exteriorization" and other "charismatic", "psychedelic", "psychic" or "OT" phenomena. Never mind doing the "OT" levels just studying the Axioms and other basic thoroughly accessible materials one can learn to develop "OT" abilities and I have done some FANTASTIC things. I provided immeasurable comfort for my lifelong best pal as he lay dying of cancer and then studied my own time track of the process and discovered an anomaly which led to a theory which was communicated to the University of Washington Hospital a year later. I do not know if my own research was directly influential but the theory was verified three years later when Massachusetts General announced a huge breakthrough in the early diagnosis of cancer which is saving lives even as we speak. In 1985 for months I had, for lack of better terms "a nasty hot blip on my theta radarscope" which prompted the weaving of a sublime improvisational theatre spiderweb. It trapped Leonard Lake who had tortured and murdered twentythree people the last of whom was my personal friend Maurice Osakas. Leonard's career was over within 24 hrs. A real peachykeen kinda guy. He and his amigo videotaped their adventures. One of the victims was a young hippie couple and their baby and there is tape of a young woman in chains being taunted "Baby die, Mommy cry"

    Please pardon me if I dispute those who say there is no such thing as "OT"

    Yes, I understand your vision of ESMB

    It's not here for committed scilons seeking reform.


    Those who are out are people still hoping to reconnect with family and friends still in and often have other interests and concerns for those inside or might be going inside.

    That perforce means some members are engaged with reform and it will have to be reform. Scientology and Dianetics are not going away, the church has a right to be there so it has to be reform and Alanzo a goddam scilon jackass the two of us would have trouble staying in the same room for three minutes.

    Maybe I am a jackass myself but contrary to the opinion of some of my detractors I am not a scilon jackass
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  15. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Last edited: Oct 29, 2017
  16. EZ Linus

    EZ Linus Patron with Honors

    Clay, I'd be very interested in your proposal to amend the Constitution, only it is such a strict policy of my own to never speak publicly, and not even among friends, about politics. That's something I'll have to just sit on my hands about. However, the fact that it's in the same post regarding a spiritual search of your own, I hope the two are not connected.

    I understand (I think) where you're coming from. I do think you kind of skim the line of an indie though. Just because you might not be organized or a member of an organized indie group doesn't mean you wouldn't be looked upon as one. The fact that you promote Hubbard's ideas as positive does not sit well with me for one. Having the viewpoint that you are a spiritual being that can leave your body and generally be mind over matter is very different. I personally don't subscribe to that, but I know many people do. I used to. (Duh!) I even used to well before I got into Scientology. Hubbard did not have a monopoly on astral projection, or "exteriorization" (origins of Kung foo go back as far as 4000 years for instance). Personally, I have pretty strong feelings as to what all of Hubbard's OT phenomena are, or rather any end of session "realization" euphoria is. I was trained enough, and I've been educated since. I've also been a jackass throughout.

    As far as the cult having a "right" to be there? People have a right to believe anything they want. They do NOT have a right to exist to abuse children or adults, and also can not defraud any individual by way of financial extortion, trickery, shake-downs and the like. And you'd like to push your agenda about Hubbard's writings being a good thing for what? For the bits of little peppered "truths" you and some others have found within--that can actually be better achieved elsewhere in life?

    I don't mean to cause trouble. I'm actually a nice person, I swear. (Where are the hearts and flowers icons?)
  17. Lone Star

    Lone Star Crusader

    B B B B B B Bird Bird Bird ......Bird is the word. B B Bird Bird Bird.... Bird is the word...
  18. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous

    L Ron Hubbard

    Get out of this body!


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  19. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous

    Bird is the word...,
    is the word....
    is the word ....:p
  20. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    EZ Linus, you are fairly new here so I'll let you into a secret.

    Clay Pigeon is an old-time member known as Commander Birdsong. He's been banned numerous times from this board but he keeps coming back under a new ID. He always pushes the same agenda until he gets banned again. Seems he can't help himself.

    That's why people keep referring to "Birdy". We know who he is.
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