Hi im new with questions

Discussion in 'New Member Introductions' started by lightweight, Dec 17, 2018.

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  1. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    I get that Paul. So what's the benefit of claiming you were a Scientologist in a past life if you can't resume your progress on the Bridge from the last point in your PC folders - with a certain amount of expensive corrective actions, of course?

    Do we think the COS will let someone start OT III just because they attest to completing OT II in a past life?

    And what about all those past life commendations and IAS statuses?

    In Tibet if you recognize your prayer wheel and tea pot you're solid but the only workable spiritual technology in the universe doesn't have a mechanism for confirming reincarnation so it's all a do over?

    I don't ever recall anything about a policy on destroying PC folders after someone dies. My assumption is that they keep them indefinitely. If they don't let people claim use of them in the next life then why keep them?
     
  2. Operating DB

    Operating DB Truman Show Dropout

    While reading this page I rehabbed a win. I'm so glad I didn't go further than Power Processing. The stuff after that is enough to twist one's brain into knots. Whew! I dodged a bullet.
     
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  3. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Hubbard Policy is to keep the pc folders -- so they keep them. Why? Because Hubbard said so. A more pragmatic reason would be if they got shredded the public might get the idea the execs didn't believe in reincarnation. Now, I've never seen any HCOB -- oh, I think I have.

    From just-jogged memory, it said if some pc asserts he had done advanced courses in a previous life he would get sent to an AO and get the shit sec-checked out of him and if he could make a good case -- i.e. give name and details of his previous life identity, maybe knowledge of the Ad Course materials -- he would be allowed to continue on from his previously-declared case state. I don't remember what else had to happen, although I seem to remember:
    • There were some hoops to jump through so the AO didn't get a bunch of nutters dumped on them clogging up the lines
    • There weren't too many hoops -- it looked like it would be doable if someone genuinely fitted the bill.
    I don't remember the distribution of the issue, but it seemed sensible. I never had to deal with such a person, and don't know if anyone ever made it through all the hoops.

    Paul
     
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  4. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    When the Dn Clr Issues came out. I audited a couple dozen who came along and claimed "Clear from Past Life Auditing". Never had anyone name any PL auditor, other than lrh, and no prior folders were evr located, even if a name were recalled.I don't remember all the "hoops" as you called them, but the first thing was a "date/locate" , and it got more burdensome from there.
     
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  5. guanoloco

    guanoloco As-Wased

    I used to keep a private record of all of the past life Clears in my local area. It was ridiculous...out of all the area Clears the vast majority were past life Clears. Way over 50%. Who audited them? You guessed it.

    It was so stupid that if true it would mean that going Clear was a death sentence for real. This was decades ago so from 1945 on it didn't bode well for the efficacy of Clear tech by any means. Many of these people were of the age that they would've had to have died immediately upon going Clear in order for their age to match reality.

    I kept this information to myself and chalked it up to "dub-in" at the time.
     
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  6. TomKat

    TomKat Patron with Honors

    And in the end it turns out that their attestation to the fictitious state was just as valid as anyone else's :)
     
  7. lightweight

    lightweight Patron

    Can anyone tell me please - apparently when you get the clear cog you get a definite needle phenomenon - and i remember back about 15 years ago there were lots of people suddenly going clear cos of being 'past life' clear and then they suddenly were not a couple of years later and I was told that they didn't get the needle phenomenon.

    What is this needle supposed to do? Why did Miscavidge suddenly say they were not clear? Must be a story behind that Im sure.....
     
  8. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    Maybe the story is that if you're not clear you need to do something again, and if you need to do something again you need to pay for it again. I don't know but that might have something to do with it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2018
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  9. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    A similar thing happened around 1980. There was a rush to attest to Natural Clear. In retrospect this was probably consistent with leading up to the pillaging of the mission network in 82. By creating "Clear Inflation" those people would then progress to spending money in higher level orgs where more money would go to Hubbard instead of franchise holders.

    Of course, the attestations would later be challenged and because many people attested hoping to take a financial or ego building shortcut to the OT Levels, they themselves would be in a condition of doubt over their own clear status which would inevitably pop up in session, especially since nothing else changed. Then comes the Clear Certainty RD and other expensive and time consuming actions to verify the clear status and/or go back to the point of the Bridge where they cheated.

    I think I've lost track of the many different states of clear:

    Dianetic Clear
    Theta Clear
    Natural Clear
    Past Life Clear
    Keyed-Out Clear

    After the 77 FBI raids Hubbard was in deep hiding and his health was failing. I think he knew his end was coming and all he cared about was cashing in so he had enough money to fight off the law and keep from getting caught. He created the Safe Environment Fund just for that purpose. Manipulating clear states for economic gain would be a given.
    _____
    Edit to add Keyed-Out Clear.
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2018
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  10. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    The needle phenomena was a Tone Arm F/N. A floating TA.
     
  11. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    I suggest adding "keyed-out Clear" to that list.
     
  12. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Thanks, Fixed.
     
  13. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron


    Cleared Theta Clear, Cleared Cannibal, Mest Clear, Dynamic Clear, False Clear, One-Shot Clear.

    Is that clear?
     
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  14. CaliMule

    CaliMule Work Hard and Bray

    I remember a near constant stream of those and figured out it was being used as an escape from too heavy regging in an era before price rise pressure was making regging so easy. It seemed to be a useful excuse to those who wanted a pause.

    I should have attested to "keyed-out clear" when it was so hip and easy to do, but didn't. When I decided to go out the door forever, I was tempted to say "I can't schedule services because . . ." and I never could come up with a reason that wouldn't be too shocking for my family who raised me in Scientology, or for that matter that could fool them since they had after all raised me in Scientology and knew what I would and wouldn't do in light of that. "Keyed-out clear" only works as an excuse for so long, and having something permanent like psych history or current drug habit seems the more surefire reg repellant.

    ====

    Floating TA has already been given in the answer to this thread's question, and it is actually a known phenomenon prior to the big "natural clear" and "dianetic clear" surge. Having a "persistent F/N" and "floating TA" were actually considered problems to a few auditors and directors of processing because it made someone as unsessionable as if they'd just gotten drunk. It was never seen as a problem by PCs that their auditing couldn't proceed, because anyone with a persistent F/N or floating TA knows "life is good".
     
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  15. guanoloco

    guanoloco As-Wased

    That makes perfect sense regarding the missions.

    Bravo!!
     
  16. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    Don't forget the most common "Clear": keyed-in Clear
     
  17. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    I think Hubbard either quickly recognized that there were built in limitations to Dianetics that restricted income potential or Dianetics was always intended as a transition to something like space opera Scientology. Yes, having a persistent F/N or being healthy, happy, successful and having no ruin equated to no need for all the solutions to life's problems offered by Dianetics and Scientology.

    To my thinking one of he most deviously clever strategies adopted by Hubbard was talking people into thinking they were aliens in a past life. Think about it. With Dianetics your need for services was limited to this life and prenatal engrams. If you were in good shape case wise then there was even less need for it. Scientology fielded the more Eastern idea of reincarnation which opened up a vast repository of things that required income generating services. But the human existence on earth is still relatively limited. The oldest fossils of humanoid go back maybe 7 million years and even the earliest squirrel type primates only goes back 50 million years. There would probably be limited interest in auditing out engrams as an aye-aye in the Cenozoic Era. But the idea that we lived trillions of years in advanced alien societies throughout the galaxies was pure evil genius.

    Now the possibilities for things that could have gone horribly wrong in the distant past and the need for Scientology services to fix them was infinite and absolutely anything he conjured up in a lecture had plausibility no matter how much it stretched the imagination.
     
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  18. lightweight

    lightweight Patron

    Ive just read about the ship freewinds having asbestos on it. I think Lawrence Woodcraft talked about this first in 2001? I was there early part of 21st century for 10 days. Wondering if there is anyone going down with lung cancer that we should know about? Not happy at all about learning about this.
     
  19. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    I have not seen anything where a specific case of cancer was attributable to exposure on the ship but it is extremely difficult to confirm something like this and symptoms may not appear for decades. I think it is fair to say that we see all too many instances where long term staff succumb to some kind of cancer and the consensus is that the general lifestyle precipitates it - stress, poor nutrition, sleep deprivation, lack of good health care, unsafe working conditions, etc., and oh yeah, chain smoking.

    The other thing is lead. I cringe when I watch the footage of people on those old ships chipping paint without any respirators or other safety measures - all the work on those old building also. Do we think the COS conducted any lead tests on all of that prior to commencing work?

    I think the guys I saw who did fiberglass removal wore respirators but I also think they just checked them out from a communal bin from Supply for each shift. Do we think they were sterilized between shifts, if that is even possible without entirely new filter cartridges? Just nasty.
     
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  20. charles

    charles Patron

    Isnt a floating ta quite common though...i remember lots of pcs coming out of session boasting they had this and were so keyed out (mesmorized?) And they were only on lower grades etc....?