Hypothetical Question

Discussion in 'Leaving Scientology' started by Jamesafter, Dec 5, 2016.

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  1. Jamesafter

    Jamesafter New Member

    So if someone has just blown and can only stay at a "friend of a friend of a friend's" apartment for a few days, is cut off from family, has no money, has a ton of O/W's, no work experience except for MEST and has always been pretty much a F-up, what's the next step?
  2. CommunicatorIC

    CommunicatorIC @IndieScieNews on Twitter

    First, forget about supposedly having "a ton of O/W's." That is bullshit. Most importantly, thinking that is not helpful.

    Second, forget about supposedly having alwyas been "pretty much a F-up." I suspect that is also bullshit. In any event, thinking that is not helpful.

    Does this hypothetical person have any non-Scientology family, no matter how far removed? Any non-Scientology friends, no matter how old? If so, contact them.

    If this hypothetical person's only work experience is MEST work, he can find a temp agency.

    This hypothetical person can also consider finding a Salvation Army or other homeless shelter. In addition to providing food and shelter, they provide or can refer him to job training.

    Another resource is a food pantry.
  3. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    Well, I'll relate my story, although convoluted here on ESMB.

    I blew from the SO, and showed up on my aunts door, I knocked , she answered, I said HELP. She took me in, I told her my story, and she gave me a place to stay, we were family, although I have not talked to her for many years, or was I close to her, but she loved me mom, her sister. It was the only option I had at the time and thousands of miles from Mom and Dad and I was a mess. My aunt did not even know I was in scientology,

    I told my aunt I would pay her back.

    I only had a motorcycle which is what I arrived in her front door and only 50 bucks in my pocket. I traveled around on her 3 speed bicycle looking for a job. I filed out job applications, left and right. I finally got a job after a few weeks, and proceeded to make money and support myself, and then payed back my aunt for her help.

    Here's whats funny, I said to the person that eventually hired me, I asked him after some time, Dick, his real name, why did you hire me with knowing my job history. And he answered, GIb, you were the only person that said you wanted to work.
  4. Mick Wenlock

    Mick Wenlock Admin Emeritus (retired)

    Oh please, "a ton of o/ws" what total tosh. Some people may get out feeling fucked up - after all,the realization that one has to covertly depart something one has given so much to is not a moment where one thinks what a success they have been.

    What you have the experience and qualifications to do for money is as varied as the people coming out. I know people who were auto engineers, graphic artists, engineers etc and some who had only basic knowledge of physical work. The next step for everyone is the same - start trying to survive. When my wife and I were declared we had about $60. We were in a country where we did not speak the language, we had no family there, we had no friends who were not scientologists. It was an INCREDIBLY tough time. Tougher than I can properly describe. But here is a strange thing - every struggle, every day of just trying to find somewhere to sleep, every day of trying to figure out where to get cheap food, every day of walking because there is no money for transport - was LESS painful than being in the SO because every time we solved one of those problems we felt a little better.
  5. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    In the US, there's a company called "People Ready" (used to be Labor Ready), which connects people to temp work. There are other companies doing similar. You get paid on a daily basis. A friend of mine would hire people from them for short-term projects. If the client company likes you, they can make you an offer to be an employee.

    If you are willing to work at Sea Org pace, you will find lots of places wanting to keep you.
  6. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    That sounds awful ... you certainly sound as if you could use some help to get on your feet but I agree you should immediately lose the "ton of O/W's and thoughts of being a F-up mentality" ... it's not helpful and I very much doubt you are either, scientology has just about everyone feeling like that at some stage, none of us are perfect but the cult tries to turn every mistake and real or imagined wrongdoing into a major personality defect!

    If we knew which country you are in it may be easier to assist but if I were you I would concentrate today on finding a safe place to sleep (go to your local charities, explain briefly and politely and ask for help, they often have refuges, beds and food for people in this situation and they are usually free of charge, just ask and immediately write down any leads, phone numbers etc that you are given so you can follow them up) and then use your MEST work experience and get yourself employed, do anything and do it well ... then you can start to make plans for a real future and please try and stay positive and view what you are going through as a temporary (though unpleasant) side effect of escaping the madness of the cult ... you are free now and that's fantastic ... you must be basically strong to have achieved that.

    There are really good people out there who will want to help, try and open up a little to anyone you feel comfortable with and let them help if they offer, you will find ways to "keep your exchange in". Offer to work for a place to sleep if you think it will be accepted, do whatever you need to do to get somewhere safe to crash and when you have some money go to thrift/charity stores for basics (they usually charge a little but you will find what you need).

    Once you have enough clothing (and whatever else you need) check the internet for "house-sitters" if you feel you are able to be responsible for someones home while they are away on holiday (and possibly any pets and garden watering if required) ... you will need a Police clearance certificate but if accepted you will get a home to live in and take care of for a month or so at a time and you can arrange for another one straight after if you are good at it (you'll get references from the previous jobs you have done) ... I know someone who did it for a year and it really helped him to start again after a nasty divorce. You will still be able to work if you arrange placements where you can travel to your job.


    Good luck James ... stay in touch with us if you can, let us know how you are going.

  7. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    The "tons of OWs" may be inval, very likely for ex SO.
    Also could be self inval, again very likely for ex SO.

    On the bright side you seem comfortable with mest work.
    Thats probably the largest area for job opportunities. Good
    start and probably therapeutic without the inval/self inval.

    From there the world's your lobster.[better than an oyster]
  8. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    O/Ws by WHOSE definition? Yours, or someone else's?

    Instilling guilt over silly, minor offenses or over actions long past is a vicious tool used by the weak to control the strong. The fact that you even experience guilt shows that you have a sense of integrity, of what is right and wrong and want to do the right thing. Instilling guilt in others is a form of attack by getting them to hurt themselves.

    There is forgiveness. Forgiving others as well as forgiving yourself. Forgiveness is a far more powerful tool if you use it. Forgiveness allows a new start and a clean slate.

    MEST work is completely undermined. It is so much more than the low status scientology gives it.

    What makes us human? What makes us physically or otherwise superior or different?

    It is love, compassion and just a few physical things, but one important one: our hands.

    I had hand surgery two years ago and had a delightful conversation with the surgeon about our hands being our most important body part, our most human body part.

    Last night I was petting and rubbing my dog and realized there was nothing more that she enjoyed or appreciated than a human rubbing and cuddling her with HANDS. That's true for most social animals.

    What's so special about hands?

    Everything. We type, we create, we build. We catch, we throw, we cut, dice, rub, mold, flex. We use our fingers together or separately, we have this incredible wrist and arm range and dexterity.

    With our hands, we can share and create what we otherwise can only dream.

    I've never appreciated my hands more than when that surgeon saved my thumb and two fingers.

    You'll be alright. Think forward. Dream and build it and it will happen.
  9. Leland

    Leland Crusader

    A homeless friend of mine, (living in her car ) found a facility in Santa Monica....that provided a mailing address and food...and access to job training.

    She got some training in "executive assistant" software....and wound up at a job that paid $55,000 per year.

    It can be done.

    Edited: so....get training in some occupation of some sort.
  10. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    Walk into any Church, Temple or Mosque and they will help you with basic needs on a RIGHT NOW basis.

    It's the reason they exist.
  11. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Rebuilding your life after leaving the Sea Org with nothing means you will have to invest a lot in wherever it is that you rebuild. It's like starting a business, you better like doing whatever it is that you will be doing because you will be doing a hell of a lot of it for a very long time.

    So if you are in Los Angeles or a similar city where the lower end jobs and welfare type resources are taken up by so many illegal aliens and refugees and there is a lot of crime, congestion and life is held cheap, then select a location that suits you best with a good quality of life and go there to rebuild.

    Others have commented on the guilt tripping and this is so true. Scientology makes you second guess yourself crazy. It also teaches you to use a system of perfect solutions for every problem and to hold other systems of reasoning in contempt. You need to disregard all of this. Inval and eval even as Scientology concepts are mostly intended for use in auditing - not day to day living. In the real world threading the needle on inval and eval is called political correctness. Think and speak freely.

    You might not be able to break into the occupation that you want without experience so approach it in steps. If you want to be a bank teller then get a job as a janitor in the bank while going to school to learn banking. Cities and counties often have occupational programs where you can work with the equipment of a trade to get some experience but if the instructor sees that you are competent and motivated they will recommend you to a list of employers who have a standing request for first dibs at the best students.

    And don't give your contact info to anyone who can share it with the Church. They will try to find you and they will follow you forevvver.
  12. Leland

    Leland Crusader

    There is a fairly new Temporary employment agency called Shiftgig.

    You can sign on with them...( if you have a cell phone ) and get work of some sort...right away. ( even if just washing dishes.) And they pay weekly.

    If you work in a kitchen...you'll get a meal also.
  13. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor


    Lots of very good advice being offered by various posters!

    When I left the SO I had a few dollars in my pocket. Too few to count, lol.

    If I had to give someone advice, I'd say:

    1. FOCUS on one thing at a time.

    2. Start by FOCUSING on how to make enough to cover a place to live and food. That's it. Don't worry about medium and long range plans. Not yet. Just getting a place to stay and a way to make enough to pay rent/food is wonderfully therapeutic!

    3. Once you have figured out a way to survive (i.e. not be frozen to death or perish by starvation--a skill 7.4 billion people living on earth somehow figured out), then you can start to LOOK FOR OPPORTUNITIES.

    4. LOOKING for opportunities is a simple, doable and brilliantly effective plan. It doesn't say how long you will have to look. It doesn't say how great the opportunities need to be. All it means, is you are LOOKING for something better.

    6. The more places you LOOK, the more OPPORTUNITIES will magically appear.

    7. An OPPORTUNITY can be very modest indeed. It might just be another job. It might be talking to someone who found profitable work (hence you are very smart to be talking to folks here on ESMB, great start!)

    8. In my decades of experience in life, finance & business, IF YOU LOOK LONG ENOUGH YOU WILL ALWAYS FIND AN OPPORTUNITY THAT IS BETTER THAN WHAT YOU CURRENTLY HAVE. Or, minimally, a 2nd opportunity that doesn't require that you abandon the one you are already making work.


    10. The greatest OPPORTUNITIES can sometimes come from the most unimpressive sources. Could be that you:


    * meet someone on a smoke break outside a blues bar..someone who you exchange telephone numbers with...that years later results in the introduction of someone who helps you grow a wildly successful business.

    * have a terribly unsuccessful (and costly) experience which later becomes the foundation and starting point of something that generates more money than you ever made before.

    * learn of an idea about something you have absolutely no education, training or experience with. But you keep exploring it...and eventually it becomes the spark of a whole new kind of life and business for you. (And that forces you to learn about something new, so what? LOL) ​

    Well, those things actually happened to me. It wasn't a freakishly strange and rare event, I came to learn. Because I was actively LOOKING for OPPORTUNITIES and I knew I was looking. So, I explored everything I could think of...not dismissing everything that came my way because "it's not my ideal scene", lol, or "I don't know anything about that" or some other excuse.

    I came to learn that life seems to have a vast and abundant amount of everything, if you only look for it.

    In teaching others about becoming an entrepreneur, I have sometimes use the analogy of being thirsty out in the desert. At first you look for anything that even remotely might mean "water". A weed growing. A small bush. It's always good to keep walking in that direction. Maybe you'll find an oasis with a tiny bit of drinkable water.

    Then.......keep going. You might eventually find a tiny creek.

    Later, a modest bubbling brook.

    Keep going in that direction, that is likely a good path to stay on.

    Later still, you find a river.

    Follow it.

    The river eventually runs to a reservoir. Or a lake.

    Or maybe it winds it way to the ocean!

    Water. Follow it. It leads to more water. Same with money.
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2016
  14. Jamesafter

    Jamesafter New Member

    Thanks guys. I don't want to say too much on here because I'm sure that those who are looking for the hypothetical person are reading this and won't take too long to figure out who he is.

    I will say thank you again for your advice and encouragement, and thank you for this whole message board. Just reading the stuff on here is pretty amazing.
  15. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation


    Things can only get better for you now Jamesafter.

    Take care, come back when and if you can, we'll be here.

  16. The_Fixer

    The_Fixer Class Clown

    Damn! Good shit there, HH.

    But yeah, first things first.

    Whatever the church told you is at least 90% bullshit.

    You are and can be way better than what the church says you are. The church can only hold it's power by making you feel otherwise. That is really it's only power it can hold over you, but you really don't need to believe it. Re-read the first sentence in this paragraph and hold onto that.

    That is your first step.

    Everyone else has offered you good advice, I really like what HelluvaHoax said above.

    That guy is a dude who knows what he is talking about.
  17. Mick Wenlock

    Mick Wenlock Admin Emeritus (retired)

    You are very right - but overcoming the mindset of someone who has just got OUT of a "religion" and for whom asking anyone for help is de facto proof that they are as bad as the cofs says they are - is hard.
  18. Mick Wenlock

    Mick Wenlock Admin Emeritus (retired)

    First thing I would say to you - don't worry about "them" finding the person you are referring to. "They" no longer matter - at all. After spending time in a cult where every utterance, every look every belief is scrutinized by others and the fear of being "found out" is so prevalent it is very, very hard to shake.

    Lots of good advice in this thread from people who have been through it. One step at a time.
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
  19. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    In real world MEST work means a lot of things. The fastest way to find this kind of work is to ask someone for reference. After I left Sea Org, I asked one of my friends for a reference, and he gave it to me -- next day I was working for a home cleaning service. As the time went by, I found work as a computer programmer. (I took computer science courses at a college, although it was not my major).

    If you do not have a reference, apply to local stores for the position of a salesperson. My friend found a job this way after she left Sea Org.

    If you're physically strong, you can easily find a job as a furniture deliverer. Actually, I applied for this job and got accepted, but decided not to take it after my friend helped me to get the aforementioned job.

    Temp agencies are another option; when I was a college student, I got several job assignments with their help. However, you might have to wait for several weeks for a new assignment.
  20. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    I would add to my prior post:

    For somebody with no prior (non-Scn) work history, temp agencies are a safer option for companies. They get to have you around, see how you work, see how you get along with other people there, before taking the step of offering you regular employment. Companies hate hiring people who "don't work out", having to fire them, and worrying about whether the fired person will sue for discrimination or whatever.

    My second piece of advice: make friends. People go to new places, people know people in different companies. When there is a job opening, an employer can be more comfortable hiring somebody recommended by somebody he trusts. If I'm hiring, and I have a choice between somebody with a good resume, versus somebody who comes recommended by somebody whose opinions I trust, I'll generally give a preference to the latter candidate.
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016