I went to the London Scientology centre today to see what it was like......

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Dirty Den Watts, Aug 30, 2017.

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  1. strativarius

    strativarius Comfortably Numb

  2. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    WOG = Worthy Oriental Gentleman

    The expression is so commonly used amongst Scientologists in place of "non-Scientologists" that often they barely think of it as being derogatory. Scientologists consider themselves to be a new superior species of human, Homo Novis, so to use the expression WOG is simply to acknowledge the reality that there is us and then there is everybody else.

    If you go to the London Org you might ask Maria to explain it to you along with how there is no such thing as a Disconnection policy.

  3. I may go in there and ask those questions..... would they be willing to answer you think?
  4. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    Leah Remini's show isn't widely available in the UK. They probably won't know anything about it.
  5. That's interesting

    I may go in there after I am done shopping, as the Tesco I go to is in St Paul's. My mind is prepared for it
  6. tr8theta

    tr8theta I Love Kitties

    When my son first used a stove...he burnt his hand...he never tried it again...maybe you should do the same (stay away from the dangerous waters...there are sharks lurking below)
  7. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    You bought a book and they interpret that as a "strong reach". They will desperately want to build on that but if they sense that you fall into the critic or investigatory journalist category then they will want to offload you ASAP.

    If they feel that your pointed questions are sincere then they may try to respond to them. Note, I didn’t say “answer” them. Their instinct is to “handle” not “answer”. An answer in Scientology is more appropriately called “an acceptable truth” and staff who deal with raw public are trained and drilled in how to use this to deflect difficult questions. The reason we don’t see Scientologists discussing the subject in uncontrolled venues is because once you get past the initial acceptable truth response and start to dial down into the details and things that don’t make sense they can’t maintain either the acceptable or truth part.

    Scientologists perceive themselves as being oppressed by a lot of things”: psychiatry, governments, military, intelligence agencies, IRS, news media, that very large class of SPs which includes exes, family, friends co-workers, and even “conservatism” or a general lack of acceptance of new ideas in society.

    They will say what you have heard are lies and distortions.

    Scientologists also attribute everything to subconscious mental phenomena. In their world view people are wholly incapable of making sane decisions without Scientology. All your actions and motivations are not under your own logical control and they are there to help you overcome this deficiency through pure intention and force of will. You by yourself are helpless but you combined with the registrar or the ethics officer or recruiter, together you can overcome your own reactive mind which is itself trying to survive and which deep down in it’s lizard brain knows that Scientology is it’s mortal enemy. So it is for your own good that they must drag you into Scientology kicking and screaming and it doesn’t hurt that they get a stat for it either.

    You could read up so that you have a better understanding of how they think and how they will react but that might make you too obvious and they could sense that you have prepared. There may be some advantage to being a bit raw and more naturally awkward. I think the trick would be to keep the questions real and within their comfort zone. If you ask about Lisa McPherson and explain how you saw the autopsy pictures with over 100 insect feeding sites that would probably blow them out of the water. And quite frankly, unless they are OSA certified to research this controversial stuff, they really probably don’t know about it or only know the Church propaganda. Anything critical of Scientology is instinctively considered "entheta". Entheta is bad news, it's upsetting and it can restimulate case which in turn can require time consuming and expensive auditing, or if they don't handle the situation well they get sent to cramming which is their internal get-your-head-straight corrective training. Just being exposed to anti-Scientology entheta is very bad juju.

    Asking about Disconnection is probably such a common theme that it would trigger a well rehearsed patter. So would Fair Game, but if you know that policy only cancelled the use of the term “Fair Game” and didn’t cancel it’s practice then that would show that you were too hot to handle. If it were me, I’d ask about how the Church responds where someone doesn’t believe what LRH says and they want to have a logical debate over a specific point or policy? That would be very generic and appropriate from someone walking in off the street and not tip your hand. They will probably tell you that they believe in personal integrity and that “What is true for you, is true for you”, etc. You could ask if there are restrictions on what Scientologists can do, say or read. Well, the whole subject is about telling people what they can do, say or read so it would be fun to hear that explanation. Scientology has a solution for everything and if you don’t apply Scientology’s solution then you are aberrated (mentally defective), have evil intentions, off-source or out-KSW (not doing what LRH says), have a misunderstood word, got overts and withholds, have counter intention, a squirrel (other or altered practices), ARC Broken (upset), low IQ, on drugs and need to do the Purification Rundown, a namby pamby dilettante, got other fish to fry, …well you get the idea. Scientology's derogatory classifications for people and groups is very extensive.
  8. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    The link I gave goes to Google Books, right to the relevant page.
  9. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    In the old days there was a lot of pressure to route people onto a course to get the stat and money plus they know that because your reactive mind will revulse at the thought that it will be “cleared” they have a limited window to get you involved. But by getting a person on course they are now in a fully controlled indoctrination environment where all their questions can be directed back to Scientology written or taped references and verbal data ist streng verbotten and if there is still something about the question that is not resolved they can use the Study Tech or internal disciplinary procedure to keep you corralled.

    I have to think that nowadays the incentive to get raw meat onto course is heavily driven by the need to short circuit free thinking and debate before the prospect discovers too much on the internet. The guy at the feeder outlet told you to bring money. They know they have one shot at this and they don’t want to have to deal with the “I don’t have enough money on me” excuse.

    Even if you don’t have enough money they will say that you need to “start the flow”, “put the postulate out there that you want to go Clear or improve your abilities or handle your ruin, etc.” by paying whatever you have toward your first course.

    One thing Scientology taught me is that people say what they think. I know, I know, that seems too obvious but it is amazing if you pay attention what people will tell you about themselves. Scientologists are indoctrinated to say whatever is on their mind - “A lie is the lowest form of create”. They must juggle the desperate need to tell everything with the need to do the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics, even if that means lying.

    If you come on too strong it will trigger the greatest good response but if you seem like you are strongly in agreement with Scientology they will actually tell you what and how they think but you had better forgotten your wallet or just had it stolen on the metro.
  10. anon1

    anon1 Patron

    Hey Dirty Den,

    Have you been in yet? From what you're saying, there's no way you can be lured in. As many have said before the hook is in the intro courses which are basic common sense and use practical communication that really do help you in life. And that's it. The rest is crackers.

    A Scientology 'church' is not at all called a church by scientology, it's called an Org which is short for Organization. Calling it a church is a front. Most new scn call it a church until they're heavily in.

    Orgs run on a VERY strict time frame. 9:30am-12pm, lunch until 12:45pm then muster for the staff and the public resume in courserooms or auditing at 1pm. 15 minute break from 3:15pm to 3:30pm then back on until 6pm. The 9:30pm-6pm staff then leave and go home and the evening and weekend staff take over (evening and weekend staff have 9-5 jobs in the day). That crew takes over until 10pm.

    If you do choose to go in the org will seem completely empty during the working hours because people are locked away in auditing (therapy) rooms (and there probably aren't a lot of people anyway) or they are on course. If you seem genuine and they don't smell a rat, you can ask politely and they may show you the big courseroom or a tour.

    If you are there in the break times you may be surprised to see young, attractive and good people around. They will be very charming and love bomb you and seem very intelligent.

    Be stuck with them on a desert island for a week and you will soon begin to the insanity in their way of thinking.

    Scientologists KNOW (believe) a lot of things. They will be assessing your emotional tone level. Scns categorise people based on their 'social' (superficial) tone level and their 'chronic' tone level. If you have a chronic illness (diabetes etc), are gay, make snide remarks or make fun of scn you will instantly be placed at 1.1 or 'covert hostility' which means you are a sexual deviant who is chronically trying to do people in but pretending to be nice.

    If you say there is nothing wrong with you when you do the personality test, they will deduct that you are so superficial that you refuse to look at or accept your 'reactive mind' (no such thing, concept stolen from psychology by Ron).

    There is a lot to discuss really but if you go in now without knowing anything, you may waste an opportunity to learn and build up for a truly interesting experience.

    I for one, don't think there is any concern you'll be won over.


  11. strativarius

    strativarius Comfortably Numb

    Maybe on your computer it does, but on mine it doesn't. Anyway, not to worry, it's not a big deal.
  12. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    For me it goes to page 67, if that is any help
  13. strativarius

    strativarius Comfortably Numb

    Well, that's very strange, here's what I get...

  14. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor


    Outstanding quotes from your post have been enshrined for eternity on the thread named "TOP 100 STUPID MOMENTS IN SCIENTOLOGY". Accordingly, a very theta award in the form of a MEST lapel pin has been mailed to you. Wear it and you will instantly become envied by Scientologists and Ex-Scientologists alike, due to its status-endowed mojo.
  15. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

  16. Thank you so much for your big replies, very in sightful. I have read twice your replies and will out in to place in my head how I will ask the things you mentioned

    I looked up and watched a video on Lisa Mcpherson, VERY sinister and to me looks like they murdered her under handedly

    I know where the St Paul's S O C is and may go in their with a friend. I just want to see what these guys in there have to say, and I will ask in a way where it looks like I am interested in joining (obviously I am not), but a little cautious.... to avoid being given thrown out quickly

    I will probably be thrown out any way

    Cheers again
  17. Thanks for your big reply also

    No I haven't been in the church yet, planning to go Wednesday, but getting prepped up before hand, rehearse my questions, etc
  18. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    It is good to bring a friend (witness). Make sure they are grooved in on the fake contact info and your excuse for leaving on cue. Be aware they are trained with "Big League Sales Closing Techniques" by Les Dane and one of the most common strategies is to divide and conquer. They may try to split you up and tag team.

    Staff who deal with raw meat public/wogs are especially drilled on communication trickery (TRs) to manipulate the intro conversation. And I do mean DRILLED, like hundreds of hours. Here are a few:

    The full ack (Acknowledgement): OKAY, I got that, I understand, that's it. This is used to stop your comm or overwhelm in lieu of an honest "shut up". If an SP enters the org they will full ack them all the way out the door, between attempts to introvert them with black Dianetics by demanding to know their crimes.

    The half ack: Soft okaay, hmm, I see, ah, riight. Spoken with an inviting come-on lilt to draw you out and keep you talking so they can get a fix on an in or weakness, encourage interest, etc. You might try this to keep them talking but don't be too obvious or they will figure out they are being half acked on purpose.

    I always had a problem with this stuff. It does work after a fashion but on staff it is often used for manipulation and head fuckery.

    I get the impression that you expect to have some kind of engaging intellectual conversation but I think you will be extremely disappointed. They are heavily disciplined to not give VD (Verbal Data). It is literally a crime in Scientology to try to explain the Tech verbally. They can provide cursory deflective talking points but when it comes down to the actual nitty gritty they will desperately try to refer you to something in writing or a video that is a direct quote from Source aka LRH or something that has been very carefully worded to receive Issue Authority for public dissemination. If you have seen some of the videos of Scientologists giving "wins" you will notice that they can't get into specifics that actually explain anything. That is because of the ban on VD, so they can only blah blah about how they feel or their own subjective experience. The problem is that after you have been in for a while this gets pretty routine so you have to get increasingly more creative until after so many years or decades they sound like completely insane woo rants.

  19. ToeOut83

    ToeOut83 Patron

    This is just my tuppence worth, but....I personally found that when I was ready to leave but the registrar was still in the process if trying to register me on a course, s/he has a well-scripted patter (verbal routine) to counter your every reason/excuse to leave: There IS
  20. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    There WAS a well-scripted patter. Registrars drill on sales techniques EVERY DAY. Registrars with years of experience have seen every objection, and have trained themselves to have a counter for everything. They are either smooth and efficient at getting the sale, or they are quickly replaced, in a Darwinian process.

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