Religion After Scientology

Discussion in 'Life After Scientology' started by FormerScn, Jul 23, 2017.

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  1. FormerScn

    FormerScn Patron

    I've begun to renew my interest in the religion of my birth and I was wondering whether others have done the same.

    When I finally began to wake up from Scientology I felt so lost. Getting back into the rituals and reading the scriptures of my childhood has made me feel less so, but I can already tell that this is not really going to work for me in the long run. I mean I already left it once because I thought it was too strict and crazy.

    I am embarrassed to admit it, but Scientology really was something I considered my religion. There's a big hole there where Scientology used to be.

    Has this happened to anyone else, and has anyone found a way to fill it?
     
  2. Before you go jumping into a Christian practice or ritual, try asking yourself what it is you really believe. How do you know you want to do something spiritually? Something I have been asking myself for a long time. Most Scientologists aren't too big on getting into a Church or another religion after doing Scientology.
     
  3. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    This is a really good question.

    Myself, I never wanted to go back to the religion of my birth (Mormon). I just never wanted anything to do with ANY religion after the cult experience. Not that the Mormons are so bad, relatively speaking, they are actually not. But like all religions they have cultish aspects, as well as a few weird beliefs, like the special underwear. And they like to send their teenagers off to other countries to proselytize, which can be a real Mind-F..k. Anyway, I don't want to go off on a Mormon rant....

    I can actually understand your desire to get involved in something. Leaving Scn can leave a big hole in one's life. You miss being part of a group, any group. The sense of belonging.

    I would just say that before you jump into anything else, really spend some time figuring out what you believe and what you're willing to accept...or not accept.

    I could never accept the "Jesus died to pay for your sins" Shtick. It's just that I am a logical person and that NEVER made any sense to me. I dare anyone to even try to explain how that works.

    Anyway, there are religious groups that are more about community and helping people, and less about forcing dumb shit down your throat.

    Good luck finding something you can feel good about. Keep us posted if you do.

    Oh yeah...I was going to add that I really looked at my actual beliefs when I left the cult. Here's what I came up with: I believe in common sense, I believe in logic, I believe in nature, the natural world and its laws, I believe in trying to be a good person and deal with people the way you would like to be dealt with....the Golden Rule. I don't believe there is any way to avoid the "human condition". (There's no Clears or OTs or immortality.)


    I don't believe a prayer turns wine into the blood of Christ. Yikes!
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  4. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    I think a lot of people go through a kind of decompression, distancing from the Church, ignoring phone calls, stop going to events, etc. They may study or apply Scientology on their own (again) without outside influences or coercion. Then they start to realize that they are self censuring and still following behavioral mandates in order to preserve their option to take courses or go up the Bridge and stay in good standing. But the truth emanating from the internet and the pervasive negative public opinion is impossible to ignore. Eventually people start to question why they are self censuring. There is no LRH, DM, OSA or ethics officer in the house, looking over their shoulder. Besides, we got into Scientology because it promised freedom to think and act and pursue our unlimited potential, "what is true for you is true for you", yes? Of course what LRH really meant by this is that whatever he told you was true for you and you should not pay any attention to criticism of that or all the great wins that you attest to in Qual. In our naivete we thought it acknowledged our right to question even Scientology.

    So once the self imposed shackles have been thrown off and we read enough truth the reality sets in that everything we thought we knew must be reassessed. I think this is a great opportunity!

    The "stable datum" to Scientology is that you are spiritual in nature, a composite being: body, mind, soul. Once you accept this then everything else in your personal belief system can be oriented around it. This is what makes the Xenu/BT mythology possible. If you are virtually eternal, trillions of years old then what isn't possible in some way at some time, some place in your existence? Maybe the details and logistics don't make complete sense but that can be dismissed due to lack of clarity in your or someone else's whole track recall ability or LRH is sparing you the full details and speaking metaphorically out of consideration to spare you a case of pneumonia or to avoid messing up your case with inval and eval. We are only capable of comprehending the level just above the one we are in, you know?

    But, what if we decide just for the purposes of resetting everything that there is no such stable datum, no underlying principle that we must orient our world view around? Then you are free to create your own truth and if you come back to you being an immortal spiritual being with a mind and a body then you have done it on your own terms.

    I think this profoundly changes the dynamics of how we perceive things like ethics. If you are immortal then the consequences of your actions are mitigated by the possibility of another chance in another lifetime, or excused by what may have happened in a previous life. If there is no cycle of birth, death and rebirth and this is it, then whatever you do is based purely on your own personal integrity or lack of it.

    I rather like the concept that we are spiritual beings but I also like the idea that we conduct ourselves without using it as any kind of rationalization. I don't think this kind of viewpoint is possible for a Scientologist. They are not free to accept both possibilities and to choose the best qualities of both.
     
  5. phenomanon

    phenomanon Gold Meritorious Patron

    It happened to all of us.
    We are here.
     
  6. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    I think the important thing is to not jump into another religion. Just take your time and look around. There is a huge amount of information available about all aspects of life.The internet has opened up a whole new world.

    I never had a religion before I got into scientology, I was just looking for the meaning of life. I then spent 17 years thinking Hubbard had all the answers until I eventually left scientology and found out he was just a know-nothing blowhard.

    Like you I didn't know what to do next but I just kept looking around, buying books, visiting websites, constantly searching for knowledge. The one thing I didn't do was join a religion because I now believe that no religion has the answers. I think all the answers are out there but it's like a jigsaw. You have to get pieces from different places until you've got the full picture.
     
  7. scooter

    scooter Gold Meritorious Patron

    I joined the ASC !!!:yes:

    Seriously, fighting back against the cult helped me enormously and it meant I was doing something good for the planet as well as exorcising my own personal demons.:coolwink:

    I considered other religions briefly but that quickly disappeared. I'm more interested in making the world a better place for my kids and I have been active on a political and environmental level where I can.

    I have many former passions that I spend time on now that I just don't have the time to bother with the cult much anymore. And I like my Hubbard-free zone. :woohoo:
     
  8. FormerScn

    FormerScn Patron

    I think you are probably right, but it is so depressing.
     
  9. hummingbird

    hummingbird Patron with Honors

    I was raised Catholic, and the thought of going back to that makes me scream inside.

    Never ever again will I buy into any of the religions available. They are all based on myths and lies. The only ones I can I can barely tolerate are the Eastern ones.

    Like WildKat, I could never wrap my brain around the concept that Jesus "died for my sins." What a horrible thing to tell a child. And it's all to guilt you into some mind-fuck. No thank you very much.

    I have my family and a whole life to enjoy. I don't need the chains of some religion. They were all created and developed by mortal men just like you, no matter the lies they tell. No one has the right to tell me what to think. And for that, I can thank the cult.
     
  10. Miss Ellie

    Miss Ellie Patron with Honors

    As you search remember any group will have a leader.
    A group will have members or followers.
    A group will have a stated purpose.
    A group will have rules.
    A group will have activities focused on the purpose.
    A group will have a reaction when you join.
    A group will have a reaction when you stop or leave.

    Find a group religious or otherwise and see how they react to the joining and leaving.

    You want a group that is as accepting when you leave as when you join. They will miss you but wish you well on your journey. From the atheist movement to churches to social/political groups see how they think of or speak of former members. That is a good way to judge who you want to be part of.

    Take a study of religion class at a college. Visit 10 churches in 10 weeks, look on facebook for social/political groups and go to some meetings. Where do you fit in? You may need to look awhile to find a group. We are social creatures who need a purpose. Go find yours and enjoy the journey.

    Always keep your eyes and heart open and do not let anyone tell you they are the "only" way to happiness. There are many roads for you to test and take.

    :happydance: :yes:
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  11. FormerScn

    FormerScn Patron

    Thank you so much for this.
     
  12. [redacted]

    [redacted] New Member

    Losing the certitude and safety of my beliefs was probably the hardest part of leaving. Leah Remini has said she's returned to her Catholic tradition, but I think that's slightly unusual for most exes -- there's a sort of mental exhaustion and mistrust of the whole idea of organized religions.

    When I lived in a larger town, I attended a Unitarian Universalist church and found solace in the community and acceptance/tolerance there. It's probably not a good fit for people who are more socially or politically conservative, though.

    Best wishes to you on your path.
     
  13. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    :thumbsup: :happydance::roflmao:
     
  14. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    I've been feeling melancholy and philosophical lately, so here's my contribution on the meaning of life.....

    IS THAT ALL THERE IS?

    Do you remember the song “Is that all there is?” by Peggy Lee? The link, with lyrics, is below.

    I think it captures the mood I've been feeling lately. I'm in my 60’s and I definitely get the feeling that my life is behind me, not ahead. What is there to plan for except a comfortable retirement and how you think you might want to die?

    Perhaps I'm only feeling this way because I missed out on having kids, and therefore no grandkids either. I gave up having kids in part due to the influence of a certain cult and the idea that “you only have this brief breath in eternity to go free, you've had countless lifetimes of having kids, how boring! Why would you want to waste THIS lifetime having kids when you can achieve spiritual freedom with Scientology ?” What a crock of shite that turned out to be, right? Of course, I have my mate and my pets, and walks in the forest; they bring some moments of joy. But there is still a feeling of emptiness.

    I mentioned not having kids and the other reason for that was, growing up in the 70’s we had pounded into our heads, through media and popular culture, that having so many kids was ruining the planet because of overpopulation and if you cared about the earth, you would have zero or one child, certainly no more than two, bare minimum “replacement level”. A lot of people in my generation agreed with this, so while the First World population started dwindling to below replacement level, Third World populations continued to boom, and now the solution (especially in Europe) to dying cultures is massive immigration from the Third World. But that's a rant for another day.

    Back to the subject, is that really ALL there is? I guess it comes down to how you achieve meaning in your life. Are there any real goals worth fighting for, beyond mere survival? Most people are happy to raise their family, enjoy their grandchildren and then fade into obscurity, while trying to leave some legacy for their kids. Others join cults and sacrifice the family, in order to “save the planet” LOL! Well that cult is certainly on the way out.

    What about traditional religion? God, Jesus, Heaven and all that stuff? Well I guess some people find meaning there, and they go to their deathbeds thinking Heaven and a perfect life will await them in the clouds with Jesus. Or maybe it's Allah and 72 virgins!

    But if you have no children, no religion, no cult, no Big Dream to look forward to, no “Pie in the Sky when you Die”, what is there? Really, what is left?

    Is that all there is? Yeah, I guess so.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WNFe4nak-oM
     
  15. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

  16. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Your post reminded me of this article which gives an “honorable” mention to Scientology but then goes on to quote Cicero about old age. I don’t necessarily agree with the gist of the article but it is an interesting read.

    http://www.claremont.org/crb/article/september-song/

    In his 1976 essay, “The ‘Me’ Decade and the Third Great Awakening,” Tom Wolfe analyzed an “unprecedented post-World War II American development: the luxury, enjoyed by so many millions of middling folk, of dwelling upon the self.” The postwar economic boom afforded Americans of all classes, Wolfe wrote, the leisure time and income to sculpt their personalities and their very selves—a solipsistic enterprise that was previously reserved for the wealthy. The Esalen Institute’s “encounter sessions” for personality change, the Scientology movement, psychedelic and New Left communes, ecstatic spiritualism and “charismatic Christianity,” feminism, the sexual revolution, “psychological consultation”—all were ultimately devoted to the study and service of “Me.”
    ///
    For a richer understanding of the vital contributions that a society’s elders can make, one can turn to Luther College Classics professor Philip Freeman, who recently completed an excellent new translation of Cicero’s dialogue on old age, De Senectute—here retitled How to Grow Old: Ancient Wisdom for the Second Half of Life—that was well-known to American founders like John Adams and Thomas Jefferson.
    The first-century B.C. Roman statesman and philosopher composed it during a difficult time both personally and professionally. He went through two divorces in quick succession, his beloved daughter Tullia died, and he was forced out of politics in Rome as his nemesis Julius Caesar assumed dictatorial control. In his early sixties and alone, he could have wallowed in self-pity, or even committed suicide like his friend Cato the Younger. Instead, he threw himself into writing.
    Old age, Cicero believed, offered far more advantages than disadvantages. One could finally put aside the arduous struggles of youth—“lust, ambition, strife, quarreling, and other passions”—and return to living “within” one’s soul, by which he meant a devotion “to knowledge and learning.” Anyone who failed to recognize this when they grew old, and became “morose, anxious, ill-tempered, and hard to please,” should blame their character, not their age, Cicero suggests: “Older people who are reasonable, good-tempered, and gracious will bear aging well. Those who are mean-spirited and irritable will be unhappy at every period of their lives.” (Cicero speaks in the dialogue, according to Freeman, through the voice of Cato the Elder who is asked by two younger friends what old age is like.)
    * * *
    There are four main reasons that people fear old age, Cicero writes: it seemingly deprives us of an active life, weakens us, denies us sensual pleasures, and brings us closer to death. Addressing each in turn, he asserts that great deeds often don’t require strength but rather “wisdom, character, and sober judgment,” qualities that “grow richer as time passes” (members of the Roman Senate were known as senes or “elders”). Leaders like the consul Valerius Corvinus were happier in old age “since his influence was greater and he had fewer responsibilities.” The old have ample opportunities to offer their wisdom to the less experienced, and yet also more time to take up hobbies like farming that can soothe sorrow and instill discipline (Cato includes a somewhat tedious disquisition on the pleasures of farming). Rather than becoming frail, the old can maintain strong minds through the “mental gymnastics” of reading, thinking, writing, and, in the evening, going over everything one has done that day. And the loss of sexual desire is a blessing, not a curse, he insists. “If you don’t long for something, you don’t miss it.”
    Death, of course, looms over all of these concerns, but even when contemplating it, the philosopher is quite cheerful. Either our souls are immortal and they happily enter eternity when we die, he says, or they are destroyed, and then we don’t feel anything. The former belief makes him happy, even if it is false, and the latter is of no concern. He is decidedly against nostalgia. The world will change whether we like it or not, and “the past returns no more and the future we cannot know.” And yet, “a man should live on as long as he is able to fulfill his duties and obligations, holding death of no account…. Therefore, old people should not cling greedily to whatever bit of life they have left, nor should they give it up without good reason.”
    * * *
    What, exactly, are these “duties and obligations”? This is where boomers should really listen up, and where Cicero proves most useful. It is by fulfilling our generational duties, toward those who came before us and those who will come after us, that the old achieve personal happiness and leave a lasting legacy. In another horticultural metaphor, Cato says that the farmer “plants trees for the use of another age” and expresses gratitude to “the immortal gods, who have not only handed down to me these things from my ancestors but also determined that I should pass them on to my descendants.” “What responsibility could be more honorable,” he asks, then leading the young to virtue and “prepar[ing] them for the many duties of life”? There is also the pleasure of convivium or “living together” with friends and neighbors. “[W]hen at home with my neighbors,” Cato says in the dialogue, “I join them every day for a meal where we talk as long into the night as we can about all sorts of things.”
    ///
     
  17. guanoloco

    guanoloco As-Wased

    Hello there.

    Scientology is basically spiritual materialism.

    It's also an activist "religion" as in the maxims "something can be done about it" and "the wrong thing to do is nothing".

    That being said I've posted before about a trilogy of books that shredded my Scientology "valence". This "valence" was dependent upon Scientology.

    YMMV as these books were in my transition phase. Sounds like you're already out.

    These books are based around Applied Kinesiology which is woo and not the point of the trilogy for the purposes I'm sharing this.

    These books are accused of being a cult and their author, David R. Hawkins, is accused of being a cult guru, yadda, yadda, yadda.

    I don't know how this is because the books don't call for action...there's no organization to join...there's nothing to do...no donations...no Bridge, etc.

    At any rate I'm certain you can pick them up cheap on Amazon, eBay or any book store of your convenience.

    They are:

    Power vs Force
    The Eye of the I
    I: Reality and Subjectivity


    After reading these I had zero need for Scientology, activism or anything else. There's nothing to "fix", "repair", "correct", etc. There's no void to fill. They absolutely blasted through the smoke and mirrors of Scientology. I recommend them highly to any Scientologist...ex or otherwise. Then read Nibs's interviews where he states that Scientology basically addresses the ego. It is pseudo spiritual. All good stuff.

    I think you'll get a lot out of this trilogy. I know I did.

    This is not an advertisement for joining a cult, following a guru or accepting Applied Kinesiology.

    Good luck!!
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  18. Miss Ellie

    Miss Ellie Patron with Honors

    It is not to late to leave your mark. You could have up to 40 more years - folks in my family die young if under 100.

    Start today and make a difference. Volunteer with foster children, volunteer at a school, many hospitals need volunteers to rock babies. If animals are your thing work with groups that raise funds and help adopt unwanted animals to loving homes. Many environmental groups are out there. Save the whales, save the otters, save the ocean, save the lakes & streams.

    What is your passion, photography? You can use that skill to help many causes & organizations. Remodel low income housing for seniors, be a fund raiser, be what you want to be.

    Each day is a gift - take it unwrap it and enjoy it till the next. Don't look at the days behind... look ahead. You will be remembered by the people you touch, by the deeds you do. None of us will be remembered if we do not live, love & touch others.

    :yes:
     
  19. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    Thanks for that. I think my passion has been to write....which probably explains why I spend so much time on ESMB. :p
     
  20. Welcome to Ascology!
     

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