SP declares on a "need to know" basis

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by renegade, May 7, 2018.

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  1. renegade

    renegade Silver Meritorious Patron

    I just saw a January 2018, comment on Mike Rinder's blog that SP declares are on a need to know basis.

    How do you know if you have been declared if it's kept secret?

    Recently, a FB friend said that there was a rash of unfriending going on from people still in. Does that mean he has been secretly declared? He never received an SP declare. Is there a new secret disconnection policy?

    Another friend said her children's FB page was being monitored. If they posted pictures of exes not in good standing, they'd be called to see the EO to get handlings to disconnect.
     
  2. uncover

    uncover Gold Meritorious Patron

    Look..... between good friends.... like you and me.... you neither "need to know" the answers, NOR DO YOU HAVE THE RANK TO ASK SUCH QUESTIONS !!!

    BTW, I heard that you want to buy another "basics"-package ? So let's do this now.... :cool:
    .
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  3. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    The typical SP declare makes lots of assertions about the criminality of the SP. Int management is less willing to risk lawsuits for libel or defamation of character. They just don't have the money to spare any more, and lawyers are increasingly willing to go after them.

    So what they do instead is quietly spread the word around that "Renegade is a bad guy, don't associate with him", but not in an open manner that you could prove in court. They long ago stopped disseminating official declares, and now it appears that they might not even write them down at all.
     
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  4. Miss Ellie

    Miss Ellie Patron with Honors

    I vote we boycott the CO$ until they publish SP declares on a daily basis... Ok weekly... Ok monthly... Ok quarterly. Without our love and support they will realize they are the true SPs.

    Maybe I was declared and never told...oh darn. Fame and glory denied.
     
  5. cakemaker

    cakemaker Patron Meritorious

    Maybe more than a fear of lawsuit is that the declares will be posted on forums such as this.
    Because they are so laughable and full of lies, they serve to prove how unjust and worthless scientology ethics is.
     
  6. screamer2

    screamer2 Occam's Ball Crusher

    In address to your question, "How do you know if you have been declared if it's kept secret?"

    You don't know.

    I don't know.

    No one knows.

    $cientology is Kafkaesque in the extreme.

    I look at this as an extension or harmonic of the policy of confiscation of passports.

    Could it be that ALL $cientologists may be declared on a moment's notice based upon the paperwork they signed when they joined the cult, the 'declares' simply being held in abeyance until it becomes financially expedient for the cult to issue the declares against them?

    And could it be that (as in homeopathy) the more dilute the substance, the more powerful it is?

    So an undeclared declare hanging over one's head is much more powerful than a declare actually issued. A declare that is rumored is much more powerful than a declare actually issued? So the cult just fails to release actual declares?
     
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  7. renegade

    renegade Silver Meritorious Patron

    I was told "so and so" is declared so I asked "Where is the goldenrod? If it isn't written, it isn't true."

    The EO said, "I can't find it, but they have been declared."
     
  8. FoTi

    FoTi Crusader

    Declares....shmares....who gives a hoot?
     
  9. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    I suspect that the CofS usually keeps SP declares secret because they now know how bad it makes them look in the eyes of the general wog public.

    However, IMO, CofS internet hate pages on specific individuals is a different topic.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2018
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  10. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    The CofS defames itself with its practice of defaming others. Truly stupid
     
  11. phenomanon

    phenomanon Front door security.

    Me too, Miss Ellie.
    I never got a Declare notice. I resigned in 1983 while I was still in good standing, and CJC never would send me a copy of the Declare that I so very richly deserve. At the time I left, I was a well known and popular auditor, with a following of my own. COS charged "priority rates" for my auditing services. I am quite sure that they did not want their public to know that I had blown.
     
  12. Wilbur

    Wilbur Patron with Honors

    I got my goldenrod. Then I thought about doing my A-E steps. I did some dissemination of Scientology. I won't go into the details, but I did some dissemination to fairly large audiences of a secular aspect of Scientology tech. Hundreds of people. It went really well. So I phoned CJC excitedly, told him what I'd been doing, and promised that I would do more of this, and count it towards my amends project on the A-E steps. Stone cold silence. Followed by...."You didn't have 'issue authority' for that." Dumb-founded, I remonstrated with him that I had contacted many people and communicated to them the wonders of Scientology tech. 'Issue authority' was just a minor detail, no harm done. Think of all the new people I could interest in Scientology. "No, you don't have issue authority. You need to stop doing that immediately" (I always hated the way Scientologists told you that you 'need' to do something, rather than that you ought to). So I asked, "well, in that case, what WOULD be an acceptable amends project?" "Get a number of What is Scientology books placed into libraries" (at my own expense, of course). I pointed out that that basically just involved writing out a cheque. He appeared to realise that, and didn't think it an objection.

    I was done with the church at that point. Thanks CJC. If I was into conspiracy theories, I'd swear that he was planted there by whoever took over the church, with the task of ensuring that nobody who had come to their senses ever 'reached' towards the church ever again. Or perhaps a benevolent god put him there to ward people away.

    I've mentioned this before, I think, but while I was in Scientology, at St. Hill UK, there was a public division or call in guy there (I'd better not mention his name). There was one occasion when I could have sworn he was trying to warn me to get the hell out. It just suddenly occurred to me that he was kind of 'protecting' me, and trying to steer me away from the insanity. At the time I wondered whether he was a plant. Afterwards, when I realised how insane the church was, I wondered whether there might, for whatever reason, be people who'd secreted themselves into the church to help steer people out. There were one or two occasions when this thought crossed my mind. Or perhaps someone who has spent 20 years in the Sea Org suddenly thinks 'I'm going to help a few people get out of here before I leave". I wonder....

    W.
     
  13. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    After a long time in the SO, you forget about the idealistic goals you may have once had, and focus on more immediate things like "staying out of the RPF", "getting some income so I can eat something better than the crap in the galley", "getting my libs this week".

    Realize one thing: if you got a hundred, or a thousand new people into Scientology, it would not count towards the CJC's stats. Meanwhile, if it came out that you were doing stuff without Issue Authority, then the CJC's head would be on the chopping block if he had given any appearance of having approved the activity.

    Meanwhile, if you bought a whole bunch of books upon the CJC's instructions, then the CJC would have gotten the book commission.
     
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  14. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    When I was at St Hill on training for a while in the mid 90's, I got to know a few of the sea org members, who were also training, quite well. At least two of them had sufficient confidence in me to not write a Knowledge Report on them. They confided in me that if they had the means then they'd be getting the hell out!!!! And, no, I didn't KR them 'cause I was of exactly the same opinion.............

    After I eventually escaped from the insanity, a friend of mine, who was on the Tech Training Corps at the same time as me, said that virtually all the Outer Org Trainees secretly thought that it was all bollocks too!! WTF?? To my knowledge out of that group of 30 or so people, only one or two of them are still "in".

    As a footnote it's interesting to see how people with these thoughts could easily fool the E meter during E meter checks etc........ You just pick up the cans, put on your best smile, think to yourself that you'll be away and gone soon, and the needle floats a treat!! No "mental mass" on things = a floating needle.
     
  15. Wilbur

    Wilbur Patron with Honors

    I also got that vibe from some of the SO members at St. Hill, whilst on the TTC. I did some part time work whilst on the TTC, so I worked with SO members in the evenings and weekends. I remember one Australian guy in the SO there. While I looked on, he completed OTI, II and III. I expected that he would be looking brighter and brighter, and getting more and more enthusiastic about the Sea Org, as he went through the OT levels. But in reality, he seemed to want nothing more than simply to go back to Australia. He told me so. He seemed a fairly awake, intelligent guy, and at the time it stunned me that he would be talking about getting back home, rather than about how great the OT levels were. Of course, when I asked him how the OT levels were, he made the obligatory positive noises. But his faint praise of his journey to OT seemed pretty damning, to me.

    Even the SO members still in their naive, enthusiastic phase looked exhausted much of the time. One American guy had an SO uniform that was coming apart at the seams (literally), and he had worn holes in the soles of his shoes. He was a fairly gentle guy, and I could see that those who couldn't scream aggressively at others were basically trodden on.

    It intrigued me that, in all of my time at St. Hill on the TTC, around a year, not once did any of the SO members I worked around try to convince me to join the Sea Org. Not one of them even said "well, you know, after you get through your auditor training and get back to your org, you should figure out how to get replaced and get into the sea org." I even approached the head of the Universe Corps at one point and enquired about whether I would qualify for the Universe Corps. He showed no interest in recruiting me. It was as if I had an invisible force-field around me that prevented recruiters from approaching me. It's not like I was obviously out-qualled or anything like that. So it always intrigued me that I was never really approached for the SO at St. Hill. It was very different from the vibe at ITO.
     
  16. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Looking back, if you had known what the actual SO conditions were like, would you have been likely to go "Screw this, the recruiter lied!" and route out immediately? If you were sufficiently strong-willed that you would not have been cowed, they would not want you.
     
  17. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    I enjoyed your book Chris.
    I also left a sort of book review on your FSM (lol that confused me for a few seconds until I redefined it from scn FSM to Former Scientology Member) website.
    By the way what happened regards your paid for Scn Mission?

    The website by the way shows your design skills and I like it.

    Thinking about how connected you were to the OT committee, do you think you would be able to give a fairly accurate estimate as to how many of the OT8 members have exited the CofS.
     

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