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The History of RTC

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
Wow, they were lining up jobs for exSO? That's different. I'd imagine not just to keep tabs, but to get them working and paying their SO debts straight away.

Good point. Didn't think of that.



When I routed out, ex-staff were still viewed as F/Lers and lowlifes, though some businesses welcomed us. I worked at a few of them the first year or two, but eventually tired of the low pay, lack of benefits and nagging to pay my F/L debt.

My recollection is that these businesses for the most part welcomed ex-staff as employees. Ex-staff were used to slaving away for no pay and pretty much expected to be treated like shit. What's not to like? :eyeroll:
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
I vaguely remember the sinister man posters, too.

Mike Howson had long lines as AOLA's Public MAA. Back then, it only costs $50 to see the MAA and Mike had a real knack for arbitration and a good reputation. WISE charged hefty sums and never seemed to resolve any of the issues. It became off-policy for public to buy an MAA handling at one of the service orgs to resolve a business dispute because they had WISE. So even though AOLA stopped selling the separate MAA handlings, pre-OTs still ended up at the MAA's office when the C/S would send them, anyway, because they could not resolve the problems with WISE. Sometimes the WISE reps just made matters worse.

Wow, they were lining up jobs for exSO? That's different. I'd imagine not just to keep tabs, but to get them working and paying their SO debts straight away. When I routed out, ex-staff were still viewed as F/Lers and lowlifes, though some businesses welcomed us. I worked at a few of them the first year or two, but eventually tired of the low pay, lack of benefits and nagging to pay my F/L debt.

Yes, the WISE reps were fairly worthless. A friend of mine had a dispute with another Scn (family member) over an inheritance. The other family member had been off lines for years, but was still considered a Scn by the org, so it had to go to WISE. WISE wanted 10% of the disputed amount UP FRONT before they would even look at the matter, with no guarantee that they would be able to enforce any judgement. My friend said "screw this" and went to a regular court. They didn't declare him over that, probably because they knew he was on the edge of walking away from Scn.

Contrast that with a dispute I had in the mid-1980's with another Scn over a sum of money she had borrowed from me. I bought a Chaplain's Court for some reasonable amount of money (I think it was in the neighborhood of $50). It was a short court. The Chaplain looked at the paper she signed, and worked out with her that she could do $X/week, and she signed an agreement to that effect. Shortly afterwards she disappears and I get no further payments. Some months later, a friend notifies me she's in LA getting auditing. I fax him a letter with a copy of the agreement, to relay to the MAA, saying she's in violation of a Chaplain's Court agreement, and demanding a Civil Committee of Evidence. Boom! Her auditing stops, because you can't get audited while in a justice cycle. She borrows the money from somebody else and pays me back, so she can get back on auditing. I'm satisfied (the guy she borrowed from is likely screwed, but that's HIS problem).
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
My recollection is that all Scientologist owned businesses had to sign up with WISE, regardless of what they did.

Am I mistaken?

You had to be WISE if you (A) hired other Scns, or (B) did business with other Scns. I did not hire Scns, nor did I do business with other Scns, so they did not bother me. My business at the time was a one-man consultancy, so they didn't think me worth while (and I avoided telling them how much money I made, so it stayed that way).
 

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
You had to be WISE if you (A) hired other Scns, or (B) did business with other Scns. I did not hire Scns, nor did I do business with other Scns, so they did not bother me. My business at the time was a one-man consultancy, so they didn't think me worth while (and I avoided telling them how much money I made, so it stayed that way).


There's probably very few Scientologist owned businesses that didn't fall under A or B.

Most, I'm sure, fell under both.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
My recollection is that these businesses for the most part welcomed ex-staff as employees. Ex-staff were used to slaving away for no pay and pretty much expected to be treated like shit. What's not to like? :eyeroll:

Ex-staff also had little choice. Consider a corporate manager reviewing your resume: "I spent the last 10 years being a cult slave".:omg: "Oh, thank you for your application. We'll be sure to call you if we have an opening which matches your unique experience".:duh:

When I got out of the SO, I had the good fortune of being able to work for a while for a non-Scn who knew of my Scn experience, but didn't care since I had worked for him before Scn and he had been happy with me. I had also worked for a Scn just before going into the SO, and he agreed to say I had worked for him during half the time I was in the SO. Between the two of them, I was able to cover up the time I was in the SO (which was not a long time)
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Apparently those routing out were given money too.

Not a lot; I think $500. Still, $500 more than the rest of us got.

The $500 was not them "being compassionate." It was the consideration (legal usage) for waiving one's rights in signing the stuff you had to to get out of there (won't tattle to the press etc). $500 was probably the lowest amount they thought would qualify.

Paul
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
My recollection is that these businesses for the most part welcomed ex-staff as employees. Ex-staff were used to slaving away for no pay and pretty much expected to be treated like shit. What's not to like? :eyeroll:

Exactly! A few months after I had routed out of the SO in 1996 I applied for and started a job in a Scn business in Glendale. I thought there would be some bad feeling in terms of "huh, DB having left the SO" but it was the exact opposite.

Paul
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
My recollection is that all Scientologist owned businesses had to sign up with WISE, regardless of what they did.

Am I mistaken?

That policy varied over the years, as well as the fee. It ranged all the way from 10% of gross (! an impossible number for many businesses to remain competitive and properly finance their operations) to membership fees of several hundred dollars a year plus courses and consulting as sold.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
The $500 was not them "being compassionate." It was the consideration (legal usage) for waiving one's rights in signing the stuff you had to to get out of there (won't tattle to the press etc). $500 was probably the lowest amount they thought would qualify.

Paul

This is absolutely correct.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
I remember being at a staff briefing; I think it was probably sometime in the mid-80s.

...

I don't remember much about the briefing except for a few things. As Mike said, the briefer said that the purpose of WISE was to keep External Influences of Scientology business away from the staff. I don't actually remember if it was this time or another time, but we were also told one of WISE's purposes was to keep business disputes between Scientologists in these businesses off org lines. (From what I remember regarding AOLA's MAA area, they did a lousy job of that.)

Years later, after I was long out, I remember reading (maybe on ARS? Don't remember.) that Sea Org staff routing out were getting jobs lined up for them by COS with some of these Scn owned businesses. I thought that was an .... interesting change of heart, and surprisingly pragmatic for an organization which is generally anything but.

It does make sense to do this. It keeps these ex-staff in the fold and does allow COS to indirectly control them even after they leave staff, as their financial livelihood depends on toeing the party line.

I don't know what is happening now, but at least up until 8 years ago when I still routinely got information from the inside, going all the way back to when I was in the SO, there were two primary circumstances where the COS helped line up jobs.

1. if the person was connected to a VIP, or something like that. Someone who would flap or become a problem if their niece, nephew, cousin, aunt, uncle child, wound up homeless or turning tricks or jumping off a bridge. Served two purposes, kept tabs on them, stopped the Empire from looking too bad. This could also expand to people well liked, or friends of important people.

2. Real security threats. All former intel staff pretty much got cushy jobs at David Morse & Associates if they wanted them, all the way back to the GO disband. This was basically golden hand cuffs. These guys were being paid double to quadruple or more than what they would have made based on their market qualifications.

If you blew, you didn't get this help, so it was kind of like a covert carrot, if we can't break you in the routing out process, we will make sure we know where you are, what you are getting paid, that you will make good money, but can't step out of line or we will take it all away.
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
My recollection is that all Scientologist owned businesses had to sign up with WISE, regardless of what they did.

Am I mistaken?

At one point, this was true. In the 80s. Anyone using an org board or ethics and other management policies for growing and maintaining their business were pressured to join and pay minimal membership. Quentin Strube was running this in Los Angeles as well as NY, for WISE Int. But so many people made a stink of it, ignored it or protested it ( as I did) that the practice was eventually stopped)

Denise ( then Larry) Brennan posted about this and more on WWP back in 2010

[..]The real extortion was mostly run by WISE Sea Org staff like Quentin Strube from WISE in NY. He would find out what scientologists were doing any kind of personal business and demand of them that they join WISE, even at a low membership level. If they would not join he would assume they were "out ethics" and threaten to notify all WISE members that the person would not join and none of the members should do business with him/her. That right there is extortion in my book.

WISE had little to nothing to offer for membership fees but got many through such threats which had meaning if you wanted to continue to be a scientologist or even continue to deal with scientologists. [..]
https://whyweprotest.net/threads/wise-leaks-numerous.55377/reply?quote=1148941

I was like " No way! Do you think I am stupid and can't read what WISE membership is for?". That didn't go over too well but I stuck to my guns. There was no way I was paying 10% of my gross business income to WISE just because I had a business.
 
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AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
I remember being at a staff briefing; I think it was probably sometime in the mid-80s.

It was a campaign that was being done by Int Management with or via WISE. There was probably more to it than posters, but all I remember are the posters.

These big posters were supposed to be put in the "staff only" areas of the Class V (at the time Class IV) orgs. There were a few different ones, but the basic message was the same. They depicted a person representing a staff member with a shadowy black figure complete with a hat ("black hat evil sinister guy") trying to get his clutches on the staff member. I don't remember the headline exactly but the message was that Black Hat Guy was Outside Businesses/External Influences trying to steal staff from delivering Total Freedom.

I don't remember much about the briefing except for a few things. As Mike said, the briefer said that the purpose of WISE was to keep External Influences of Scientology business away from the staff. I don't actually remember if it was this time or another time, but we were also told one of WISE's purposes was to keep business disputes between Scientologists in these businesses off org lines. (From what I remember regarding AOLA's MAA area, they did a lousy job of that.)

Years later, after I was long out, I remember reading (maybe on ARS? Don't remember.) that Sea Org staff routing out were getting jobs lined up for them by COS with some of these Scn owned businesses. I thought that was an .... interesting change of heart, and surprisingly pragmatic for an organization which is generally anything but.

It does make sense to do this. It keeps these ex-staff in the fold and does allow COS to indirectly control them even after they leave staff, as their financial livelihood depends on toeing the party line.

The period of time when these shenanigans were going on, yes, the field was considered full of out-ethics businesses and field practices who were ripping off orgs. Int Finance and management put much pressure on IHELP, Narconon and WISE to people flowing to the orgs via their programs and stop the staff ripoffs that were occurring. This got distorted to mean anyone using the tech, even a student training to become an auditor and using PCs from the field on internships had to join IHELP and anyone with a business had to jo9in WISE if they benefited financially from using the admin tech in their business.

The hiring of CL IV/V org staff was a big issue because most staff, who could not live on what they were making while on staff, started to get into the working in saner environments where stat pushes were nothing like what occurred in the org. The whole mentality of making money, liking ones job, working with others who were not shouting at you or pressuring you to abandon IRL needs and work excessive hours for no exchange... it became a good solution for many, resulting in either leaving staff or not re-signing contracts. Oh how management hated this.

However, in the case of WISE, it had a stated purpose, which was to get standard admin LRH management tech studied and in use by businesses in the world via trained consultants and WISE FSMs. Once they used it, it was supposed to make scientologists out of those signed up, similar to what Narconon is for. WISE was the bridge to the Bridge in the business world.

IHELP was used to help corral and control auditors and student auditors, so they didn't give free auditing to org PCs.

There was much paranoia within management back in the early 80s, and much of this lingered on due to stat programs created to stem the perceived cut income lines occurring, and these stat programs became policies of sorts to those working in WISE and IHELP, because they helped bring in more money and better control of the field.

Eventually these off policy practices of mandatory joining of anyone who used the tech stopped and activities centered on the stated purposes of each front group and off of using it to police the field, but it took some years and many complaints before a change occurred. This is how it was back in the 80s but I have no idea if WISE or IHELP went off the rails on the public again since.

The staff ripoffs issue remained for some time, but I think it became less of an issue after the IRS agreement and later wage laws requiring for religious organizations to pay like everyone else anyone not SO. I believe staff had to get minimum wage in the US. At least this is what I observed and read.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Actually, part of what I wrote above doesn't sit right with me. I don't think the concept of EXSO DB extended out to the public. I can remember dozens of times Scientology public went out of their way to be kind of help me, knowing my SO background, and the same for many others. There could even be some celebrity status as EX SO in the Public community, which results in part of the trap of staying in that world rather than biting the bullet and starting from the bottom up in the real world.

That doesn't change my opinion on the business problems in that community, just that I think many public did appreciate and want to support ex SO.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
At one point, this was true. In the 80s. Anyone using an org board or ethics and other management policies for growing and maintaining their business were pressured to join and pay minimal membership. Quentin Strube was running this in Los Angeles as well as NY, for WISE Int. But so many people made a stink of it, ignored it or protested it ( as I did) that the practice was eventually stopped)

Denise ( then Larry) Brennan posted about this and more on WWP back in 2010


https://whyweprotest.net/threads/wise-leaks-numerous.55377/reply?quote=1148941

I was like " No way! Do you think I am stupid and can't read what WISE membership is for?". That didn't go over too well but I stuck to my guns. There was no way I was paying 10% of my gross business income to WISE just because I had a business.

One argument which was run on people was "If you are using LRH tech, then you must join WISE. If you are NOT using LRH tech in your business, then you are squirrel and need to go to Ethics!"
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
One argument which was run on people was "If you are using LRH tech, then you must join WISE. If you are NOT using LRH tech in your business, then you are squirrel and need to go to Ethics!"

I remember that, LOL, and what is worse is I remember completely agreeing with that logic.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
Actually, part of what I wrote above doesn't sit right with me. I don't think the concept of EXSO DB extended out to the public. I can remember dozens of times Scientology public went out of their way to be kind of help me, knowing my SO background, and the same for many others. There could even be some celebrity status as EX SO in the Public community, which results in part of the trap of staying in that world rather than biting the bullet and starting from the bottom up in the real world.

That doesn't change my opinion on the business problems in that community, just that I think many public did appreciate and want to support ex SO.

HCO PL 12 Oct 1967 Issue II, titled “Sea Org Resignation, For Personnel Files” stated that anybody who resigned from the SO was an out-ethics degraded being and not eligible for org staff. It wasn't in the green volumes, so most public would not know about it.
 

Leland

Crusader
One argument which was run on people was "If you are using LRH tech, then you must join WISE. If you are NOT using LRH tech in your business, then you are squirrel and need to go to Ethics!"

That way the Cult moved from "administering to you as a person spiritually" in a "church" setting....to taking over your outside interests....job...business.....and further separating one out from any real contact with life....

Business were then encouraged to "donate".....

Businesses were then encouraged to send in their staff for "training."

It is interesting to me....even these celeb "Movie Stars" have "handlers"......or "help" that actually spies on them.
 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
HCO PL 12 Oct 1967 Issue II, titled “Sea Org Resignation, For Personnel Files” stated that anybody who resigned from the SO was an out-ethics degraded being and not eligible for org staff. It wasn't in the green volumes, so most public would not know about it.

My ratty copy.

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