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Where do I go from here?

20000000

Patron
One of the big difficulties I had with leaving Scientology was having to admin to myself that Scientology does not actually have a road to Total Freedom. Once I confronted that, it was easy to disconnect. But there was a big hole in my life.

I had been involved with Scientology for 20 years, 10 of those on staff. My sole purpose was to get myself up the Bridge and help others. One of the things that I had to confront was the fact if Scientology did not have the answers, who did. Did anyone?

My wife and I have spent since then researching the different practices out there from all sorts of avenues, having a look at each and trying to evaluate them. The other thing I have done is put into perspective what Scientology does actually achieve, and how it achieves it, taken from a viewpoint of what gets done on it's "OT Levels". I have also been auditing on FreeSolo for a few months. The results have been good, put into their correct perspective. How far will this take me? I am not sure.

Do I think there is a road out? Yes, but it is not a well marked out. I don't think Scn has it. I think there are various people that have the answers in bits and pieces. Someone is going to have to put the materials together in a Scientific way, and have them properly validated. How that will get done, I don't know.

So for me personnaly, I will continue auditing on FreeSolo and see how far it takes me. I will then also continue researching, and finding alternatives.

In the mean time I will enjoy life being out of Scn.

Hey ScnRebel

Have you had any experience with the works of Harry Palmer?
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
Hey ScnRebel

Have you had any experience with the works of Harry Palmer?

hello, cutting in here to answer both posts :)

I personally steered clear of anything like Avatar. Harry is a squirrel by scientology standards and Avatar is considered a cult in many countries, like scientology. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Palmer_(author) I just saw
the Inside New Zealand How To Spot A Cult tapes over at YouTube and
Avatar is one of the cults discussed. You may want to check it out - not sure which of the 11 eight min tapes's it's on but they can be found here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/vestcoastanon#p/a

I found comfort through a revitalization of my faith in God and an education in understanding of Christianity. I also went and got Cognative Therapy, which really helped me move out of the unwanted thought processes, emotions and reactions attributable to scientology indoctrination. I learned to love wogs, make friends, grieve losses and help people again as I did before I became a scientologist. Best of all, I became a better & more loving parent.

I am a nondenominational Christian and will probably never be involved in organized religion again.

Best wishes to you on your journey.

Mary McConnell
 

20000000

Patron
hello, cutting in here to answer both posts :)

I personally steered clear of anything like Avatar. Harry is a squirrel by scientology standards and Avatar is considered a cult in many countries, like scientology. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Palmer_(author) I just saw
the Inside New Zealand How To Spot A Cult tapes over at YouTube and
Avatar is one of the cults discussed. You may want to check it out - not sure which of the 11 eight min tapes's it's on but they can be found here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/vestcoastanon#p/a

I found comfort through a revitalization of my faith in God and an education in understanding of Christianity. I also went and got Cognative Therapy, which really helped me move out of the unwanted thought processes, emotions and reactions attributable to scientology indoctrination. I learned to love wogs, make friends, grieve losses and help people again as I did before I became a scientologist. Best of all, I became a better & more loving parent.

I am a nondenominational Christian and will probably never be involved in organized religion again.

Best wishes to you on your journey.

Mary McConnell

Hey AnonyMary

Thanks for the info.

I must admit that the first part of the book I read, I found very interesting and had found a bit of truth in it. After a while of research, I also found it to be a cult setup and another attempt to make money out of BS.:omg:

That's what I truely like about this thread. People on ESMB have data to help & guide others on their search for knowledge.

Thank's to all you guys out there that are sharing your knowledge and experiences.
 

Hoodwinked

Patron with Honors
I felt the same way that ScnRebel felt: that after realizing that Scientology does not have a road to Total Freedom and after disconnecting, there was a big hole in my life. I had spent over 30 years studying Scientology and getting to OT VII with a brief stint on staff.

When I woke up and realized that there are NO OT's, I was devastated. I had a couple of friends who attended a church rooted in Science of Mind. I attended that church for a couple of years and got some benefit from it and really enjoyed it. The reverend at this church frequently said: "Remember, you are not a human being having a spirtual experience, you are a spiritual being having a human experience." I met people in this church of all racial, ethnic, spiritual backgrounds who all found some kind of common ground at this church.

The thing that has helped me the most has been participating in a study group in "A Course In Miracles." The information in A Course In Miracles really resonates with me and has led me to believe that there is NOT only one way out as LRH claims. I have been reading a book entitled "The Disappearance of the Universe" which is based on A Course In Miracles. This book has been very therapeutic and eye-opening for me.

The above paths that I have chosen to take have required very little outlay of $$$$ which I can really appreciate after years of being regged into financial ruin. Another benefit has been meeting other "like-minded" people which, for me, is therapeutic in itself.
 

smartone

My Own Boss
Smartone.

What type of dancing do you do?

I am also interested in what dancing does for you. Is it the aesthetics, the energy, action, control. Please tell me more.


I apologise for the delay in replying to your question. I haven't checked this thread for a while.

The type of dancing I do is ballroom: Waltz, Foxtrot, Tango. I also dance Latin: Salsa, Cha-Cha, Merenge, etc.

I love the energy, aesthetics of wearing my beautiful dance dresses, the competitions and the type of people we meet.
 

paul.spiritualquest

Patron with Honors
Hi 20 million!

is that 20 million debt, or 20 million income? :D Or maybe it´s a 2 followed by a lot of lost zeros... :unsure:

Your thread is very appropriate, not only because of the hole left after leaving Scn., but because I consider one of the biggest abuses in Scn. is to be disabused to keep looking for spiritual solutions and paths, once having been betrayed so strongly. Many people simply give their backs to spirituality once leaving, having been so thoroughly betrayed. It was one of the biggest Hubbardian achievements, to make us believe it is the only and the only workable path, which it is NOT.

For me personally, this board, opened my eyes, to many possibilities, I did an Idenics session, that helped, I looked a bit into Knowledgism, I read Tolle, which I loved, I also read Newton´s second book, which gave me a lot of insight.

My first step is regaining, my own sovereignity, or call it whatever. I found Covey´s books (The 8th habit, First things First, The 7 habits) very appropriate. I´m ellaborating for already 2 months on my own personal constitution. Basically it is something like the American constitution, but your own set of principles. It goes far beyond a Code of Honor, besides, that one was his, not ours. :D I´m just checking the main point, where do I want to go?

I call it the WALL of WALLS. Let me explain. Basically administration is moving a group of people up a ladder to a defined goal, but where we put that ladder, on which wall it leans, is leadership. First of all, one needs to decide which wall is the right for ONESELF. We took all this admin scale mumbo jumbo, as the truth, while it was all aligned to Hubbard´s goals, and not ours. (I´m glad I never finished a complete admin scale while in). I believe the most important exercise is to decide one´s direction, and from the choice of so many walls, there is for sure, one wall or a few, the most important ones, which is very personal for every person. So, I´m in the middle of that exercise, but it has no urgency, though a lot of IMPORTANCE. Another thing, I learned, is to distinguish between urgencies and importances, I was so brainwashed into living in the urgency (a very Scientological think), that I wouldn´t really value or see the importances. All this is being reflected in the written exercise of my personal constitution. Some times, I don´t write a sentence for a month, some other´s I re-read, no hurry. I can only strongly recomend for everybody to write his/her own set of very personal principles. To give it the form of a constitution, makes it only more fun! Not in the sense of formality or legal language, but in the sense of being able to clarify one´s own ideas, regarding importances.

This has all to do, with living, loving, leaving a legacy. I strongly recomend you Covey, just from an administrative viewpoint, to clean up the Hubbardian admin model.

I also enjoy a lot to go an unstructured path. I spend a lot of the week, just meditating, I mean just thinking or letting things come to me. This is sometimes structured, connected to writing, and most of the times, completely unstructured. Thinking was something frowned upon in the cult, but it is helpful. Sometimes my ideas just wander, or I contemplate something which I never had contemplated before ever. It just dawns on me. After that I write it up.

I believe the more unstructured, the better. Don´t look for a pre-made path, better find your own one. In the end, all answers are within you, and ONLY there.

For me personally, the two major recomendations are: Covey, Dr. Newton, and Tolle as a read. And as therapies, I can recomend Idenics, and Knowledgism also looks properly researched to me, though I haven´t come yet to it. There is a great card to choose from, no more menus! :no: I don´t see also a problem with some Scientology processing that is valuable.
 

20000000

Patron
I felt the same way that ScnRebel felt: that after realizing that Scientology does not have a road to Total Freedom and after disconnecting, there was a big hole in my life. I had spent over 30 years studying Scientology and getting to OT VII with a brief stint on staff.

When I woke up and realized that there are NO OT's, I was devastated. I had a couple of friends who attended a church rooted in Science of Mind. I attended that church for a couple of years and got some benefit from it and really enjoyed it. The reverend at this church frequently said: "Remember, you are not a human being having a spirtual experience, you are a spiritual being having a human experience." I met people in this church of all racial, ethnic, spiritual backgrounds who all found some kind of common ground at this church.

The thing that has helped me the most has been participating in a study group in "A Course In Miracles." The information in A Course In Miracles really resonates with me and has led me to believe that there is NOT only one way out as LRH claims. I have been reading a book entitled "The Disappearance of the Universe" which is based on A Course In Miracles. This book has been very therapeutic and eye-opening for me.

The above paths that I have chosen to take have required very little outlay of $$$$ which I can really appreciate after years of being regged into financial ruin. Another benefit has been meeting other "like-minded" people which, for me, is therapeutic in itself.

Thanks for your imput to this thread Hoodwinked.

You are correct in saying that getting in comm with other "like-minded" people is therapeutic in itself. I have experienced great change since joining ESMB. We all have different viewpoints but share similar purposes.

I will have a look at "The Disappearance of the Universe". Thanks for that.:thumbsup:
 

EP - Ethics Particle

Gold Meritorious Patron
The ESMB "Gestalt"...

Thanks for your imput to this thread Hoodwinked.

You are correct in saying that getting in comm with other "like-minded" people is therapeutic in itself. I have experienced great change since joining ESMB. We all have different viewpoints but share similar purposes.

I will have a look at "The Disappearance of the Universe". Thanks for that.:thumbsup:

Just ran across this (quote below) while looking for a good definition of "gestalt" that would, IMO, touch upon the "stuff that happens" to anyone joining this crew and "tuning in" to the frequencies (for lack of a better word). :confused2: :yes: EP

Geistspeakers
By Keith Baker

"The dominant religion of the Doppelgangers is outlined in
The Complete Guide to Doppelgangers. In brief, Doppelgangers
believe that the world is alive and that all living creatures are a
part of this overall life force. In time, a single Doppelganger clan
– a gestalt – will spread across the entire world, encompassing the
planet with its telepathic field. This gestalt will become the Zeitgeist,
the spirit of the age.
The Zeitgeist will ascend to a new plane
of existence, the world will be repopulated, and the struggle will
begin anew.
Doppelgangers are not given to extravagant displays of religious
ritual. By existing, by expanding the scope of their gestalt,
they are fulfilling the precepts of their religion. But the urban doppelgangers
– those adapted to live among sentient humanoids –
have developed a mystical tradition known as the geistspeaker.
Geistspeakers commune with the Zeitgeists of ages past, drawing
on the knowledge and experience of these powerful spirits to
guide their gestalt in its quest to embody the current age. Geistspeakers
also learn to tap into the lifeforce of their own gestalt,
channeling this energy to heal or empower their kindred. In short,
knowledge comes from the spirits of ages past; physical effects
are powered by the pure mental energy of the gestalt.

The Geistspeaker

Geistspeakers are clerics that venerate the Zeitgeists of the
former ages. They possess all of the normal abilities and limitations
of clerics, and channel positive energy."
 

20000000

Patron
is that 20 million debt, or 20 million income? :D Or maybe it´s a 2 followed by a lot of lost zeros... :unsure:

Your thread is very appropriate, not only because of the hole left after leaving Scn., but because I consider one of the biggest abuses in Scn. is to be disabused to keep looking for spiritual solutions and paths, once having been betrayed so strongly. Many people simply give their backs to spirituality once leaving, having been so thoroughly betrayed. It was one of the biggest Hubbardian achievements, to make us believe it is the only and the only workable path, which it is NOT.

For me personally, this board, opened my eyes, to many possibilities, I did an Idenics session, that helped, I looked a bit into Knowledgism, I read Tolle, which I loved, I also read Newton´s second book, which gave me a lot of insight.

My first step is regaining, my own sovereignity, or call it whatever. I found Covey´s books (The 8th habit, First things First, The 7 habits) very appropriate. I´m ellaborating for already 2 months on my own personal constitution. Basically it is something like the American constitution, but your own set of principles. It goes far beyond a Code of Honor, besides, that one was his, not ours. :D I´m just checking the main point, where do I want to go?

I call it the WALL of WALLS. Let me explain. Basically administration is moving a group of people up a ladder to a defined goal, but where we put that ladder, on which wall it leans, is leadership. First of all, one needs to decide which wall is the right for ONESELF. We took all this admin scale mumbo jumbo, as the truth, while it was all aligned to Hubbard´s goals, and not ours. (I´m glad I never finished a complete admin scale while in). I believe the most important exercise is to decide one´s direction, and from the choice of so many walls, there is for sure, one wall or a few, the most important ones, which is very personal for every person. So, I´m in the middle of that exercise, but it has no urgency, though a lot of IMPORTANCE. Another thing, I learned, is to distinguish between urgencies and importances, I was so brainwashed into living in the urgency (a very Scientological think), that I wouldn´t really value or see the importances. All this is being reflected in the written exercise of my personal constitution. Some times, I don´t write a sentence for a month, some other´s I re-read, no hurry. I can only strongly recomend for everybody to write his/her own set of very personal principles. To give it the form of a constitution, makes it only more fun! Not in the sense of formality or legal language, but in the sense of being able to clarify one´s own ideas, regarding importances.

This has all to do, with living, loving, leaving a legacy. I strongly recomend you Covey, just from an administrative viewpoint, to clean up the Hubbardian admin model.

I also enjoy a lot to go an unstructured path. I spend a lot of the week, just meditating, I mean just thinking or letting things come to me. This is sometimes structured, connected to writing, and most of the times, completely unstructured. Thinking was something frowned upon in the cult, but it is helpful. Sometimes my ideas just wander, or I contemplate something which I never had contemplated before ever. It just dawns on me. After that I write it up.

I believe the more unstructured, the better. Don´t look for a pre-made path, better find your own one. In the end, all answers are within you, and ONLY there.

For me personally, the two major recomendations are: Covey, Dr. Newton, and Tolle as a read. And as therapies, I can recomend Idenics, and Knowledgism also looks properly researched to me, though I haven´t come yet to it. There is a great card to choose from, no more menus! :no: I don´t see also a problem with some Scientology processing that is valuable.


Hey Paul.spiritualquest

Thanks for your contribution to this thread. I find your viewpoint very interesting.:yes:

Yes, the LRH clang really had a way to make us all believe that scn is the only way. Every post to this thread opens my eyes a little wider and gives me more hope to finding the destination for my spritual path.

Thanks once again for the list of books. I have been keeping myself very busy reading and researching lately.
 

20000000

Patron
is that 20 million debt, or 20 million income? :D Or maybe it´s a 2 followed by a lot of lost zeros... :unsure:

Your thread is very appropriate, not only because of the hole left after leaving Scn., but because I consider one of the biggest abuses in Scn. is to be disabused to keep looking for spiritual solutions and paths, once having been betrayed so strongly. Many people simply give their backs to spirituality once leaving, having been so thoroughly betrayed. It was one of the biggest Hubbardian achievements, to make us believe it is the only and the only workable path, which it is NOT.

For me personally, this board, opened my eyes, to many possibilities, I did an Idenics session, that helped, I looked a bit into Knowledgism, I read Tolle, which I loved, I also read Newton´s second book, which gave me a lot of insight.

My first step is regaining, my own sovereignity, or call it whatever. I found Covey´s books (The 8th habit, First things First, The 7 habits) very appropriate. I´m ellaborating for already 2 months on my own personal constitution. Basically it is something like the American constitution, but your own set of principles. It goes far beyond a Code of Honor, besides, that one was his, not ours. :D I´m just checking the main point, where do I want to go?

I call it the WALL of WALLS. Let me explain. Basically administration is moving a group of people up a ladder to a defined goal, but where we put that ladder, on which wall it leans, is leadership. First of all, one needs to decide which wall is the right for ONESELF. We took all this admin scale mumbo jumbo, as the truth, while it was all aligned to Hubbard´s goals, and not ours. (I´m glad I never finished a complete admin scale while in). I believe the most important exercise is to decide one´s direction, and from the choice of so many walls, there is for sure, one wall or a few, the most important ones, which is very personal for every person. So, I´m in the middle of that exercise, but it has no urgency, though a lot of IMPORTANCE. Another thing, I learned, is to distinguish between urgencies and importances, I was so brainwashed into living in the urgency (a very Scientological think), that I wouldn´t really value or see the importances. All this is being reflected in the written exercise of my personal constitution. Some times, I don´t write a sentence for a month, some other´s I re-read, no hurry. I can only strongly recomend for everybody to write his/her own set of very personal principles. To give it the form of a constitution, makes it only more fun! Not in the sense of formality or legal language, but in the sense of being able to clarify one´s own ideas, regarding importances.

This has all to do, with living, loving, leaving a legacy. I strongly recomend you Covey, just from an administrative viewpoint, to clean up the Hubbardian admin model.

I also enjoy a lot to go an unstructured path. I spend a lot of the week, just meditating, I mean just thinking or letting things come to me. This is sometimes structured, connected to writing, and most of the times, completely unstructured. Thinking was something frowned upon in the cult, but it is helpful. Sometimes my ideas just wander, or I contemplate something which I never had contemplated before ever. It just dawns on me. After that I write it up.

I believe the more unstructured, the better. Don´t look for a pre-made path, better find your own one. In the end, all answers are within you, and ONLY there.

For me personally, the two major recomendations are: Covey, Dr. Newton, and Tolle as a read. And as therapies, I can recomend Idenics, and Knowledgism also looks properly researched to me, though I haven´t come yet to it. There is a great card to choose from, no more menus! :no: I don´t see also a problem with some Scientology processing that is valuable.


Hey Paul.spiritualquest

Thanks for your contribution to this thread. I find your viewpoint very interesting.:yes:

Yes, the LRH clang really had a way to make us all believe that scn is the only way. Every post to this thread opens my eyes a little wider and gives me more hope to finding the destination for my spritual path.

Thanks once again for the list of books. I have been keeping myself very busy reading and researching lately.
 

20000000

Patron
Just ran across this (quote below) while looking for a good definition of "gestalt" that would, IMO, touch upon the "stuff that happens" to anyone joining this crew and "tuning in" to the frequencies (for lack of a better word). :confused2: :yes: EP

Geistspeakers
By Keith Baker

"The dominant religion of the Doppelgangers is outlined in
The Complete Guide to Doppelgangers. In brief, Doppelgangers
believe that the world is alive and that all living creatures are a
part of this overall life force. In time, a single Doppelganger clan
– a gestalt – will spread across the entire world, encompassing the
planet with its telepathic field. This gestalt will become the Zeitgeist,
the spirit of the age.
The Zeitgeist will ascend to a new plane
of existence, the world will be repopulated, and the struggle will
begin anew.
Doppelgangers are not given to extravagant displays of religious
ritual. By existing, by expanding the scope of their gestalt,
they are fulfilling the precepts of their religion. But the urban doppelgangers
– those adapted to live among sentient humanoids –
have developed a mystical tradition known as the geistspeaker.
Geistspeakers commune with the Zeitgeists of ages past, drawing
on the knowledge and experience of these powerful spirits to
guide their gestalt in its quest to embody the current age. Geistspeakers
also learn to tap into the lifeforce of their own gestalt,
channeling this energy to heal or empower their kindred. In short,
knowledge comes from the spirits of ages past; physical effects
are powered by the pure mental energy of the gestalt.

The Geistspeaker

Geistspeakers are clerics that venerate the Zeitgeists of the
former ages. They possess all of the normal abilities and limitations
of clerics, and channel positive energy."

:omg:Wow:omg:
 

PeterMan

Patron with Honors
Life/Scientology

Here are my methods:

1. Watch horror movies to de-sensitize oneself. (As in double-terminaling.)

2. Do what one loves.

3. Embrace one's sexuality (if need be).
 

angel101

New Member
I cleared it out :) rather than leaving it in the past

My approach to handling all the cling film type rubbish from scientology was to gently disolve it in infinite love. I agree with your choice of reading tolle, a good point of entry back into the infinite realm :)

my biggest mistake when trying to disolve the rubbish, was knowing what the heck was mine and what belonged to others and my so called friends who jumped out of the boat as soon as they saw I couldnt swim.

I spent 6 years out in the ocean, on my own most of the time, waiting for some bloody big shark to eat me, but it never happened :) So I reached dry land and worked out what to do to fly with the grace of a dove and land with the strength of an eagle, funny then I had the heart of a lion.

Thankfully I have some friends who have been in the same boat, and have helped me deal with the communication skills I needed to fully embrace my presence and power. Then there are some friends that fell out at the same time I jumped, maybe one day we can reconnect.

a fantastic source of information is RogerB, he is a gem

and I enjoy reading James Tyberonn at Earth Keeper

Have a fun weekend :)
 

EP - Ethics Particle

Gold Meritorious Patron
Encounters with Angels!

My approach to handling all the cling film type rubbish from scientology was to gently disolve it in infinite love. I agree with your choice of reading tolle, a good point of entry back into the infinite realm :)

my biggest mistake when trying to disolve the rubbish, was knowing what the heck was mine and what belonged to others and my so called friends who jumped out of the boat as soon as they saw I couldnt swim.

I spent 6 years out in the ocean, on my own most of the time, waiting for some bloody big shark to eat me, but it never happened :) So I reached dry land and worked out what to do to fly with the grace of a dove and land with the strength of an eagle, funny then I had the heart of a lion.

Thankfully I have some friends who have been in the same boat, and have helped me deal with the communication skills I needed to fully embrace my presence and power. Then there are some friends that fell out at the same time I jumped, maybe one day we can reconnect.

a fantastic source of information is RogerB, he is a gem

and I enjoy reading James Tyberonn at Earth Keeper

Have a fun weekend :)

:wave::welcome:

Obviously you belong here, angel101! :thumbsup:

EP
 

Arthur Dent

Silver Meritorious Patron
My approach to handling all the cling film type rubbish from scientology was to gently disolve it in infinite love. I agree with your choice of reading tolle, a good point of entry back into the infinite realm :)

my biggest mistake when trying to disolve the rubbish, was knowing what the heck was mine and what belonged to others and my so called friends who jumped out of the boat as soon as they saw I couldnt swim.

I spent 6 years out in the ocean, on my own most of the time, waiting for some bloody big shark to eat me, but it never happened :) So I reached dry land and worked out what to do to fly with the grace of a dove and land with the strength of an eagle, funny then I had the heart of a lion.

Thankfully I have some friends who have been in the same boat, and have helped me deal with the communication skills I needed to fully embrace my presence and power. Then there are some friends that fell out at the same time I jumped, maybe one day we can reconnect.

a fantastic source of information is RogerB, he is a gem

and I enjoy reading James Tyberonn at Earth Keeper

Have a fun weekend :)

Big welcome, Angel101!
 
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