Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Whattodo, Feb 15, 2018.

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  1. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    Its hard enough working in a small company and deciding on the right decisions for the company and yourself personally but when the other person alongside you is a Scientologist and getting more engrained by the minute then its so hard to take their advice, instructions as useful advice or take it as a load of claptrap!! Then you don't want to offend them either in fear of being an PTS or even a SP!

    Basically I have been a little overwhelmed with the number of tasks I have in my job and in addition to other issues within the business that complicate matters which I won't go into. I'm not exactly an ex-scientologist, yes I did a couple of courses so I struggle with some of the terminology and scientology speak to be truthful!

    However can someone tell me if the below comments are very much engrained with scientology methodology or tech as they call it??? These were the words of advice for solving my issues at work

    " You could start with getting educated/trained on the matter and invest in yourself. Pity, that you are opposed to the avenue that I know will help you. Companies are made of people, who get products, making oneself more able is a totally valid and vital expense and tax deductible too. The right course not any course is the best.
    You are going to flail around for ever more unless you embrace that aspect. It frustrates me that is for sure.
    Management of a company has 2 phases
    1. Doing the job whilst manning up and training others to do the work
    2. Managing the entity by use of statistic and other management tools
    We can’t even get up to Phase 1, let alone Phase 2 as we are just doing it all. You cannot expand well in this scenario. You have to take the current scene and turn it into an ideal scene but that is impossible if you have never worked out what the Ideal scene is.
    Me doing a few bits for you isn’t a solution. You are either a manager or a salesman, take your pick?"

    This was followed by shortly by

    "Good Leadership
    1 – Works on not unpopular programs

    2 – Issues positive orders
    3 – Obtains or enforces compliance
    Bad Leadership
    1 – Issues no or weak orders

    2 – Does not obtain or enforce compliance
    One does not need to shout, punish or be miserable to be a leader

    Admin Scale - See attachment
    Key though is once you have goals, purposes and policy you can skip down to Ideal Scene. The key to an ideal scene is whether it can be statisticised and those statistic measured bring about the fulfilment of the goal.
    Once you have that ironed out then it is then easier to do the Plans, project, programs and orders aspects."

    Has this been ripped out of a book or is that actually coming from the person I know? there was an attachment to this email about an admin scale.

    The other question I have is do people in Scientology who apply all this study, tech and other practices etc to their work or their businesses end up being more successful? When they suggest the right course I'm just thinking that they wont think any course other than a scientology one is the right one and a waste of money so in essence I want be able to look at any courses I wish to do unless I pay for it personally.
  2. renegade

    renegade Silver Meritorious Patron

    This IS Scn. admin policies used to run an org.

    The only one that is never applied is:

    "One does not need to shout, punish or be miserable to be a leader"
  3. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    It's all part of Scientology's admin crap. DON'T LISTEN TO IT.

    If you do start doing these courses to "improve" your business it will ultimately ruin you. Trust me!
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  4. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    Yeah reading some of the stories then this obviously isn't applied.

    We are in the UK but he's been out to flag probably 3 times in the last year. Last time was a holiday but he ended up doing a course. Evertime he comes back new ideas and concepts are pushed.

    My concern is that he wants to make it a company run with scientology principles and processes or that is his ideal scenario.

    Do scientology companies usually pay fees or % of profits, sure I had read that someone had experienced this working for another company run by scientologists. This is my fear! What are those geezers called that run round pressuring everyone to spend money, make donations or sign up to courses?
  5. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    Is this the same guy and his family that sold a house (or something like that) and have spent the proceeds on $camology? You posted about this on another thread I believe? (Sorry, haven't gone back to locate that thread). He's a business partner of yours. Yes?

    It sounds like he's immersed in $camology up to his neck! And if he is a business partner of yours he WILL be peddling Hubbard's snake oil to get $camology practises into your business. BE CAREFUL.

    Your last paragraph refers to WISE (World Institute of Scientology Enterprises). If you ever join that to "improve" your business then yes, you will be paying them around 10% of your profits...... Plus enrolment fees....... Plus mandatory courses....... At YOUR expense!!

    And if you ever have a scientology customer database, and higher level scientology employees then they've got you by the balls...............

    If you ever decide that you've had enough then your customers and high level employees will disconnect from you. You'll lose the lot.

    My advice is to get shot of your snake oil business partner, whatever it takes. Buy him out, or whatever you need to do.

    If you don't you'll find your business is more and more under the thumb of what is nothing more than a modern day protection racket.

  6. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    My recollection of the WISE contract was that it was not 10% of profits. It was 10% of gross revenue. In other words, you would be required to pay them regardless of whether you had any profits.
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  7. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    Is this person your boss or partner? Because I can read Scientolo-cheese (between the lines) and I can see that you are being sold classes. That you have to pay for out of your own pocket! What a load of crap.

    Tell them this (here's some hard-core cheese):

    "Let's read it, drill it, do it."

    When they sputter and lose their shit, they might recover enough to say, "Well OK, let's do that! So you need to buy Volume bla, bla, bla.

    So you then say:

    "Let's use your copy". So then they lose more of their shit and they might recover enough to say, "We each need our own copy of the book".

    So you then say:

    "Give me your's and I'll just photo copy the relevant pages".

    So now they're going to lose ALL OF THEIR SHIT!!, and they might recover enough to say, "You can't make copies of LRH's sacred scriptures!! That's a crime."

    So you then say:

    "OK, go borrow the relevant book from the local library and that way we'll have 2 copies so we can read it, drill it and do it! Didn't you tell me the amazing win that all of the latest versions of LRH's masterworks were in all the libraries? So go borrow one, bring it down and we'll start!"

    Please do this!



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  8. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    They didn't sell their house but have spent most of their earnings and savings on courses etc.

    It's more complicated by the fact we are related which is why I have to tread so carefully. I listen and say nothing, I'm neutral on the topic which is probably so slightly surprised when he said I was opposed. I take alot of his put downs on the chin, i do sense scientologists have a superiority complex and the we are just wee mortals who are incapable unless we have the tech. It's sad seeing him be so gullable and hoodwinked as he's an intelligent bloke. If the penny drops one day things are going to crash down!

    The other day we were speaking about allergies and he said he was speaking to an it vii and they can't shake a cat allergy. So im guessing he believes that ot's gain abilities to cure themselves but maybe a seed of doubt may have been sown.

    I struggle to understand why they avoid reading or watching anything anti scientology or anyone' who talks negatively or has left is obviously a suppressive person. If they told him lrh had a unicorn he'd believe it! He is good at his job though, very organised, methodical and accurate but never wrong and never makes a mistake!
  9. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    I'm an OEC/ FEBC grad. The highest admin training.
    Though there is much good ideas in this body of knowledge
    It has some nonsense and toxic elements.

    The proof of the pudding is the serious decline of
    CO$. They're admin tech has failed big time.They were
    once per survey hated more than Al Queda. I can't find the
    post detailing that, but here's something along these line.

    "In just two sets of memos, the FBI laid laid out a number of investigations into Scientology, as well as allegations from informants. The COS was accused of killing an informant, money laundering and destroying evidence, infiltrating the government to steal documents, targeting enemies for harassment, committing obstruction of justice, attempting to compromise a Federal judge so they would rule in COS’ favor, kidnapping, extortion, child slavery, sexual slavery, drugs and theft. Considering all of that, it’s no surprise the COS tried to make the FBI destroy their files on Scientology and control what could be released through FOIA.
    You can read the file from the latest release below, or the rest on the request page."

    The counseling tech though not perfect can be beneficial.

    Mike Rinders Blog is probably the best record of the
    idiocies of CO$.
  10. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    My advice to anyone working at a Scientologist-owned business:
    1. Start to (quietly) look for another job.
    2. Say nothing that could be construed as critical of Scientology.
    3. Say nothing that could be construed as critical of the "management tech" being used.
    4. As soon as you have another job lined up, go!
    Inevitably, a Scientology management environment will become abusive and highly stressful. That's built into the "tech".
    The owners will siphon off more and more money from the business to the Church of Scientology.
    Inevitably, a business using Scientology management "tech" will fail.
    Inevitably, any non-Scientologist in such an environment will be blamed for any and all failures.
    Get out as soon as you can.
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
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  11. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    Thanks for the clarification. I must admit, I wrote the post in a hurry and didn't have time to research.

    Paying 10% of gross revenue is even worse!! Even the UK tax authorities don't make a company do that...............
  12. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    You've named that tune in one!!

    Yep, $camologists really do think they are superior, and that if you follow the drivel of hubbard then you'll never go wrong. In fact they MUST follow hubbard's drivel. If they don't then questions are asked of them...............

    In answer to your last paragraph: Anything anti $camology, or anything negative about it is "entheta" in the eyes of this so called church. People in it are INDOCTRINATED into believing this. If they look at anything negative it'll come up in their auditing sessions because they believe the emeter actually works............ Then they're dragged into ethics for a sec check to get the details. At their expense of course................

    I've no doubt that your relative IS very good at their job. However, $camology will slowly take over their life, and your business.

    The bottom line of it is that the cult's #1 goal is to screw as much money as possible out of people.

    I was once in a difficult position advice wise when it came to people who had relatives and family in the cult, because of their disconnection policies.
    These days I just say "Stay well clear of this cult. If it involves some people in it disconnecting from you then sobeit. You'll have to deal with that, hopefully they'll wake up. Whatever it takes DO NOT let them have ANY dealings with your life".
  13. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    The business doing well drives the income which means more courses. He has is away for the next 5/6 weeks doing their next set of courses.

    This bridge is like heroin to an addict, I just wonder what will wake them up.

    It's so tempting to tell them your views, show them or point them to sources to expose scamology but you know it will be to no avail. It will come up in their auditing and then I will need to be handled.
  14. exbritscino

    exbritscino Patron with Honors

    It looks like you can see what the problem is, but aren't too sure what to do about it............ The trouble is, neither do I..........Nor do many others!!

    Yes, the bridge is like heroin to an addict, but it needs to be taken into consideration how much persuasion from registrars, (sales people), that participants undergo before relenting and paying more money in.

    These registrars are trained not to let a prospect go until they have a sales close. It may take hours of persuasion, all night if needed, but they will do it if possible. If they don't then they often end up in trouble themselves for "cutting across the org's GI" (Gross Income).
  15. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    You have come upon the basic issue. Auditing IS like drugs. The auditing process produces a state of euphoria. That is the hook. Over time, the person exhibits many of the symptoms of an addict.

    Effectively, you are working at a place whose owner is an addict. Over time, Flag will suck all his assets away, until his finances are in tatters. You should create a plan on how you are going to find a job elsewhere.

    ADDING: if this is a family business, and your assets are tied in, you should speak with an attorney TODAY about how to protect your share of the assets. I've seen too many cases where one partner sucks common assets out of a company for Scn purposes, like buying IAS patronship, and leaves the company on the edge of bankruptcy.

    You should treat the situation exactly the same as if you discovered the person had a drug dependency.
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
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  16. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    People say the church is a case in hand in terms of its failed tech, pr etc yet in their eyes negative publicity is good publicity and it' still the fasting growing religion. Islam might have something to say about that which is another can of worms. The world would be a better place without religion!
  17. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Then again, keep in mind that, in the last 100 years, the biggest episodes of mass murder have been carried out by atheists (Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc)
  18. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron with Honors

    Also very true, there certainly something in human nature that can twist some minds.

    I dont think he would go as far of secretly draining reserves away from the company without my knowledge but I will make it my business to know what the costs are month to month. He's extremely ethical so I doubt he would be contradict his own views and beliefs to be fair.

    Just hope he starts to experience and witness some of the actions carried out in higher management and wake up and realise the ethics are out with the org itself. He's stubborn though and I just think he would stay in denial unless something smacks him in the face. I can only hope!

    Was there any specific incidents that made you guys question everything or was it a culmination of a few things?
  19. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    They are called FSMs, or Field Staff Members.
  20. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    FSMs are essentially independent sales agents, working off commission. An FSM gets 10% of the sales he makes, 15% if it's for training.