Would you like to see CofS revamped and reformed?

Discussion in 'Human Potential, Self Discovery' started by Voltaire's Child, Feb 14, 2009.

  1. No, I don't think reform could happen.It would never get off the ground- it would be the same.

    34 vote(s)
  2. Yes. It's possible and I would rejoin once I was sure it wasn't like it was before.

    5 vote(s)
  3. Maybe possible but I'd not rejoin as it would be: "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."

    9 vote(s)
  4. I don't care if it's possible or not.I don't want to see anyone out there spreading Scn.

    14 vote(s)
  5. Yes, I think it's possible but I wouldn't rejoin because I'm too used to going my own way.

    6 vote(s)
  6. Yes, I think it's possible but I wouldn't rejoin because I don't want to do any Scn.

    4 vote(s)
Multiple votes are allowed.
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  1. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    A topic that frequently comes up on critical Scn forums is whether or not people would like to see (or even believe it could happen) CofS revamped, reformed, perhaps a coup taken place, and, by extension, would they rejoin or not if this were to happen. I've seen people speculate that this was or was not the wish or belief of others. But the only way anyone's going to know if someone else desires this, hopes it could happen or doesn't at all- is if they tell you.

    IMO, AFAIK, not everyone who likes any elements of "tech" or "Scn" or "Dianetics" is hoping for reform. Some probably are. Most not. I would not guess that most people who have zero interest in or liking for tech, Scn, Dn, etc would hope for or believe in the possibility of reform, but I am curious as to whether anyone like that still may be in favor of that in a "Well, that dress isn't my style but it looks nice on you. As long as I don't have to wear it." sort of way. Probably few or none, I'm thinking, but I don't know.

    So hence this poll. Multiple choices are an option.
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2009
  2. nozeno

    nozeno Gold Meritorious Patron

  3. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Banned

    Don't forget to salt the earth.

  4. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    I voted choice #3.
  5. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    It's helpful in polls to include an "other" option for the things the poll-maker didn't think of.

    For example, I think it very unlikely a reformed CofS would work, but were one to arise from the ashes I would take a good look at it before deciding, not decide ahead of time.

  6. EP - Ethics Particle

    EP - Ethics Particle Gold Meritorious Patron

    My rationale...

    I voted choice #4 because it is the activity of spreading, selling, promoting that ushers in the real hazards, IMHO. I'm fine with all the materials being fully available and anyone with enough curiosity, drive and persistence to read/listen/study the whole shebang prolly does not have enough time in a normal lifespan to be able to do much damage with it. :D :no: :coolwink:

    Particularly considerin' how much persiflage ole ronny threw in there and how many times he changed directions...and, and, and...:p

    Just sayin...:whistling:

  7. klidov

    klidov Silver Meritorious Patron

    The forum is fine, ~IMO~.

    None of the options offered fit how I feel.
  8. uncle sam

    uncle sam Silver Meritorious Patron

    are you joking

    or are you out of your fucking mind! A snow ball in hell! Peace in the middle east! Forest fires at the north pole! The cos is not going to bring happiness to the people!
  9. Iknowtoomuch

    Iknowtoomuch Gold Meritorious Patron

    KSW prevents it from changing.
  10. Megalomaniac

    Megalomaniac Silver Meritorious Patron

    Though I'll likely never re-join, I prefer reform over destruction. Reasons:
    1. Destroying a corporation doesn't destroy the evil. Those who are causing damage would simply re-group under a new name. Nothing achieved.
    2. People have a right to form whatever groups they choose. The existence of the group is not my business.
    3. The goal of "correcting abuses" is common to both Scientologists, Anonymous, ex-Scientologists, and pretty much any sane person. The goal of "destroying the Church of Scientology" immediately creates a war.
    4. Correcting abuses is a positive goal and puts me in a positive frame of mind when I pursue it. Destroying Scientology is a negative goal and when I find myself with this goal, it puts me in a bad state of mind. This may be some residual influence the Church has on me, but I think it's more of the fact that destroying something is a limited activity and makes me put my attention on the negative. Improving things is an unlimited activity and puts my attention on both the positive and the negative.
    And yes, when the needed reforms are made, KSW will be toast. This will destroy the Church of Scientology. But that is a speculated and insignificant by-product and not my main goal.
  11. Mark A. Baker

    Mark A. Baker Sponsor

    Unfortunately you left out: "It might be possible to "reform the church", although it would be VERY VERY difficult, and I MIGHT be willing to rejoin IF ALL cult-like elements are eliminated (e.g. SO, LRH worship, etc.) BUT ONLY if I was satisfied with the charter, there is OPEN accountability, and there is DIRECT REPRESENTATION of ALL the membership in church management".

    Admittedly, prior lifetime overts have made me VERY SCEPTICAL of priesthoods. "Do not unto me as I've done unto you." :)

    Mark A. Baker
  12. Iknowtoomuch

    Iknowtoomuch Gold Meritorious Patron

    In other words=not Scientology.:D
  13. Mark A. Baker

    Mark A. Baker Sponsor

    Your words, not mine. :)

    Mark A. Baker
  14. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Well, there is an option for that POV, too.
  15. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Ah, but you see, I was limited to how many characters I could put in the poll answers/choices.
  16. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    I disagree. They don't apply KSW- not that I'm a KSW fan. But they really aren't "standard". They change and ignore policy (and tech) all the time in the cult.

    I think that to really change things, you'd have to have people not only willing to delete some of the HARMFUL policies LRH wrote (and then how would you get people in charge to all agree on which ones could stay and which ones should go) but also to set it up like a very loose knit grassroots type thing. IMO, the incorporation and cultic trappings of CofS prevent that.
  17. Human Again

    Human Again Silver Meritorious Patron

    None of the poll answers work for me, Fluff.

    I think the base material and it's point of origin are faulty. There are plenty of workable, healthy alternatives.

    My preference is to can Scientology and the material of LRH.

    Let those who wish to help others toward enlightenment and who got wisdom during their years in Scientology come up with their own, new and fresh ways of helping others and begin practices/schools etc of their own.

    End the myth of "Source" being exterior from the individual.
  18. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Yes, it was difficult to think of all the choices that should be there. Maybe #4 might be a good one for you, but then again, maybe not.

    Ah well.

    I had been inspired, if you could call it that, to put up the poll because I've seen and been in so many exchanges where people (who were TELLING the person instead of ASKING the person) were saying "Oh, but you want to go back and you're hoping for reform." Well, some of the people whom one might think would want to do so- do not want to. And then of course, people being individuals, there are many many other thoughts on the matter.
  19. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    What I found interesting is that no one selected choice 2. I know there was a perception out there- and I thought it was what some people wanted, too- that there are people hoping for reform and who'd want to go back. Well, if there are, they weren't taking part in the poll.
  20. uniquemand

    uniquemand Unbeliever

    If all the reforms I wanted were enacted, I would go back.