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WTF is the Freezone?

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Most people seem to attest to OT 2 before completing the entire check-sheet.

Some people, expecting more for their money complete it even when they *do* think they've achieved the 'ep'

The more disturbings bits of OT-2 are at the end of the seldom finished check-sheets.

Zinj

Wrong word, Zinji, that might confuse some people. "Check-sheet" only applies to a course. The material audited on OT2 is named "platens". There are 21 of them. Some are short, but overall the amount of material is HUGE. It's not that it takes so long to read, although that would take quite a time. Each line is said aloud, a line at a time, and it is supposed to read. You say it again, it reads again. You say it again. It reads again. To start with, it might read 50 times. If one is actually managing to get reads still deep into it, this might get down to 6 reads an item. Or might stay higher. But it takes up a lot of time.

When I was working in the Solo Tech area at SH, I know of only one person out of hundreds who got through the entire "run", once through the whole shebang. It was a GOWW staff member, doing it in her study time. She audited daily, pretty much, maybe an hour a day. it took her an entire year. We were quite proud of her, actually--admired her. It was an achievement. The entire "implant" was supposed to be TEN runs through the entire thing. Maybe someone has done it, but it sure isn't common!

The EP is something like "all possible charge off the materials", which means when it just F/Ns and won't read any more that's it. It's a convenient EP, because some people can't run it at all and try as they might can't get any reads off more than a few items. Especially when not "set up" properly. Heh.

What "more disturbing bits" are you referring to?

Paul
 

Div6

Crusader
Just a note re. this link:

http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/isd/isd-5j.htm

Not going to dig out the Clearing Course materials right now, but the original materials include dates, durations, and detailed descriptions of "Implants," in addition to the material presented in the trimmed down version in the above link.

Simply, it contains more off-the-wall "secret but vital to your survival" Hubbardian significance than the above version, or some other trimmed down versions, depict.

Also, these items, dates, durations, the light to the front and to the left, etc., per Hubbard's explanation, already exist in the person's mind. He doesn't "create" them, they are already there.

"Spot the thetan," on the Clearing Course, means spot the thetan as yourself during the incident. On OT 2, it also had that meaning, until Hubbard decided that OT 2 was not "another bank," but part of the R6 Bank with "implanted dates," meaning the actual date of OT 2 was 75 million years ago - and, if anyone wants to start a nasty fight amongst "tech terminals" in the Scientology Freezone, ask whether "spot the thetan" on (de facto Clearing Course part 2) OT 2, means "spot the thetan, yourself, in the incident," or means something ambiguous, or means "spot the thetan as an 'entity'," that is, another being/entity - the argument can become quite heated.

The actual and complete CC - OT 2 are loaded with significance, and with hypnotic suggestion-mind games by Hubbard, plus - of course - "dichotomies," which repeated enough can make for a kind of "key-out" - the relative truth of desensitized 'dichotomies," combined with gobs of secret, dangerous, not-discoverable by anyone but Hubbard, and vital to your survival significance, produces the solvent (truth), and lacquer (off the wall significance) mix to make for an effective mind-glue.

Some few stroll through the experience unscathed, most (certainly for a while, often a long time) are stuck in the mind-glue, some never recover from the (combination) of "vital" off-the-wall Hubbardiian significance + handling some degree of actual truth + "key-out" + "floating Needle/floating TA" experience.

OT 3 takes it to the next level, with the person being told even more outrageous significance, and that he's surrounded with thousands of Body Thetans (including "Clusters"), that are problem-Body Thetans, in other words, it's not just spiritual phenomena in one's vicinity, it's a serious problem that must be corrected by making the BTs "blow" (go away.)

Public service announcement:

http://forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=77478&postcount=14


I take it you have had some experience with this....might be an amusing story. Isn't the point of the whole drill to unglue the stuck attention units of the beings who "have been made one" through the 36 days of implants?

Hubbard's MU was not the weirdness of Inc II IMO, but the idea that it only happened once......there are MANY instances of "grouper" type incidents on the track. Fixating on Inc II to the exclusion of others is just silly. Of course he took it much further, making it the foundation story for his fake navy, and his "religious order".....

And if you do have originals of the CC materials, etc. I think for educational purposes they SHOULD be put up on Wikileaks.

Do you have a scanner?
 

asagai

Patron Meritorious
I take it you have had some experience with this....might be an amusing story. Isn't the point of the whole drill to unglue the stuck attention units of the beings who "have been made one" through the 36 days of implants?

Hubbard's MU was not the weirdness of Inc II IMO, but the idea that it only happened once......there are MANY instances of "grouper" type incidents on the track. Fixating on Inc II to the exclusion of others is just silly. Of course he took it much further, making it the foundation story for his fake navy, and his "religious order".....

And if you do have originals of the CC materials, etc. I think for educational purposes they SHOULD be put up on Wikileaks.

Do you have a scanner?

Finding and running out "incidents" that made "beings" "one" is individuation or left-hand path magic. Unless one knows that one is running "black" magic, one is putting oneself at the effect of the "black magician".

Hubbard was a left-hand path (Crowley) magic practitioner and that is what he was running on his pupils (scientologists) when he suggested the idea that there were "incidents" that "clustered" beings or made them "one". He ran compulsive individuation processes on himself and on his slaves on the CC, OTII and in particular on OTIII and NOTs..

This is what OTIII is - individuation processing. Hubbard's aim was to create individuated units called OTs who would become his "slaves" per his admissions. This is what his Seo Org is - a system of individuated "slaves" cut off from each other, the world, humanity and life.

Of course, like many magicians, Ron said he was doing the opposite of what he was really doing, he said he was freeing or blowing off BTs, but in fact his process is designed to individuate the Pre-OT. He then implanted his Ron-being into the blank slaves to fill the individuated void.

R6, GPMs, CC, OTII, OTIII & NOTs run the concepts of individuation, separation, opposition, goals, self, power. All Hubbard's magical goals in his "admissions". Frequently he said he was "running-off" those things just like Op Pro by Dup "ran-off" hypnotism, while all the time implanting those things with his "processes".

The remedy for this is to run concepts of unity, oneness, co-operation, being, surrender, etc. Anything that is the opposite of the subjects dealt with on Ron's "advanced" levels.

The Way to Happiness religious/spiritual concepts such as the "virtues" and "Golden Rule" are also excellent for countering Ron's mind games that he played on us.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Scientology bashing is fair. Nothing wrong with it. If it can't stand the bashing, then it ain't very strong. Bashing scientologists is another story. Human beings should be treated with respect. They are capable of learning, changing and ceasing holding views which are counterproductive, but not usually while they are under siege.

The fact that most people who were scientologists but have left have decided it is largely bullshit deserves consideration. There is a contingent of people who consider that it is not, in fact, bullshit (mostly freezoners). Majority opinion seems to be that the old man was an occultist and not worth listening to, and that the Church he founded is a destructive reflection of his personality given life through his adherents following the policies he laid down, and usually getting even more sadistic, themselves.

This doesn't make ESMB biased! If the population of the US elects a Nazi, that doesn't make the democracy suspect, it makes the citizens of a common opinion supporting a Nazi. ESMB seems composed of people sharing their views. I don't see any bias. I just see concensus.

I'm pretty sick of hearing scientologists defend their views by attacking others as being biased and bashers. If you are going to support a group that destroys families and attempts to brainwash people using sci-fi stories and hypnosis, expect people to find that contemptible. And if you don't like that, fuck off.

That said, I happen to think there is something worth understanding in scientology, and I don't share the concensus that it is nothing but a brainwashing scam (although it is *at LEAST* a brainwashing scam).

The FreeZone has a right to exist, but where it is employing brainwashing techniques such as introducing people to suggested memories, and then getting them to do them in "the sevens" (http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/isd/isd-5j.htm), they should be held accountable. It's one thing to help people sort out their problems, repressed emotions or incomplete cycles of action, and quite another to encourage magical thinking and disassociated ideation.


I think there's bias in all the critical venues just as there's bias in CofS and in the Freezone.

Perhaps the reason some Scn'ists defend their views by painting others as biased or bigoted is due to some of the ad hominem stuff that gets posted. I know you've seen some of those posts- you've commented on them. And I know that you aren't in favor of that approach. Thing is, it cuts both ways. There are people on this forum who jump all over Freezoners and other Scn'ists then scream blue murder about how hostile the Scn'ists are and how they make it unsafe for others to post. And there are some Scn'ists accusing others on various forums of bigotry- which is a card that has such a sharp edge, that playing it usually ends up in the would be player getting cut with it.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
What you're talking about, TAJ, sounds like "permission to exist". I don't need it. Sounds like you don't need it.

I wish more scientologists would realize they don't need it, either.

Maybe they would if there weren't so many posts telling them to stop posting in some cases, or to stop doing or believing what they do, in others.
 

Div6

Crusader
Finding and running out "incidents" that made "beings" "one" is individuation or left-hand path magic. Unless one knows that one is running "black" magic, one is putting oneself at the effect of the "black magician".

<snip>



IT IS?

And I thought it was more like "cultural de-programming".

Is Man basically good?

Or evil?
 

Smitty

Silver Meritorious Patron
reply to Div6

IT IS?
And I thought it was more like "cultural de-programming".
Is Man basically good?
Or evil?

Neither. Good and evil are personal opinions.
Most humans are social. A few are anti-social.
Smitty
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
Emma- I am not a Freezoner.

I am not trying to suppress criticism- just this attitude that individuals are so right on something that they continue to ask others the same old questions when they already have the 'pile of ol crap' answer in their head already, so it's pointless even to ask or answer.

Cat's Squirrel- that last paragraph of yours, I agree 100%. Even I felt like picketing once, but knew I didn't want to look at or talk to or even be in the same environ as some of those Scientologists- just knowing what a dark place it was.

I know what you mean. I think Dani has a lot of guts to go back and picket her old org. It would give me the shivers to see those people again under such circumstances, if any of them are still there.

BTW, are you ex-Plymouth Org as well?
 

Ralph Hilton

Patron Meritorious
Wrong word, Zinji, that might confuse some people. "Check-sheet" only applies to a course. The material audited on OT2 is named "platens". There are 21 of them. Some are short, but overall the amount of material is HUGE. It's not that it takes so long to read, although that would take quite a time. Each line is said aloud, a line at a time, and it is supposed to read. You say it again, it reads again. You say it again. It reads again. To start with, it might read 50 times. If one is actually managing to get reads still deep into it, this might get down to 6 reads an item. Or might stay higher. But it takes up a lot of time.

When I was working in the Solo Tech area at SH, I know of only one person out of hundreds who got through the entire "run", once through the whole shebang. It was a GOWW staff member, doing it in her study time. She audited daily, pretty much, maybe an hour a day. it took her an entire year. We were quite proud of her, actually--admired her. It was an achievement. The entire "implant" was supposed to be TEN runs through the entire thing. Maybe someone has done it, but it sure isn't common!

The EP is something like "all possible charge off the materials", which means when it just F/Ns and won't read any more that's it. It's a convenient EP, because some people can't run it at all and try as they might can't get any reads off more than a few items. Especially when not "set up" properly. Heh.

What "more disturbing bits" are you referring to?

Paul

I've been reading through older posts catching up a bit. I'd generally expect people to finish at least one run through the complete materials. I couldn't get more reads after 6 times through it all. The original LRH instructions were to run it through 10 times. That was later amended by someone else.
 

Alan

Gold Meritorious Patron
I've been reading through older posts catching up a bit. I'd generally expect people to finish at least one run through the complete materials. I couldn't get more reads after 6 times through it all. The original LRH instructions were to run it through 10 times. That was later amended by someone else.

I ran all 10 times - it started as a evaluation - became a mock-up process - became an holographic creative mock-up process - became a multi-viewpoint holopgraphic positioning process - became a creative holographic game - I could be-do-have/own or not be-do-have/own anything I wanted at will :)

That when I ran into the next levels - My be-do-have/own were very mediocre! :omg:

Alan
 

xenusdad

Patron with Honors
Why not?

Why can't someone invent a time machine and go back to Tilden, Nebraska on March 13, 1910 and "accidentally" make sure the birth goes wrong?

Oops! I dropped the baby on his head! Whilst hanging over a 4th floor balcony!

Ok ok ok!!! I am joking and it is in bad taste. Hence the "why not?" in the title.

But really, WTF is it with FZers? Can they not smell shit when smelling shit?

Pete
An Ex On A Mission
 
Why can't someone invent a time machine and go back to Tilden, Nebraska on March 13, 1910 and "accidentally" make sure the birth goes wrong?

Oops! I dropped the baby on his head! Whilst hanging over a 4th floor balcony!

Ok ok ok!!! I am joking and it is in bad taste. Hence the "why not?" in the title.

But really, WTF is it with FZers? Can they not smell shit when smelling shit?

Pete
An Ex On A Mission

Or go back and make sure one of the many failed abortion attempts he believed his mother tried on him ... was successful.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
It wouldn't work. Hubbard had been working on this stuff for many lifetimes.

If I could go back in time and talk to him, I'd like to have contacted him pretty early on and addressed his cupidity and anger issues.
 
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