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Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australia

ccas

Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

This "beating" has bugged me from the beginning about this story. I'm not trying to minimise what happened. It is very real to me that this staff member encountered horrific conditions on staff, had some kind of breakdown, was imprisoned in some babywatch isolation environment, and suffered severe physical injury punching through a glass window to try to escape, for which injury she was hospitalized.

I could never think with being beaten as a part of that. It just didn't ring true, although physical restraint did.

Has there ever been any amplification of this part?

Paul
You are thinking with Scientology in your head. His brother didn't. Good for her.
 
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

Exactly. Any ex knows more about that situation than any "wog" lawyer possibly could. They made him look like a complete patsy. The sick bay still has me rofling - never seen one of those in a Scientology org - ever!! They had trouble even finding a place for you to lie down if you needed to get sessionable. In a place where the category of sick or not sick is "can we see breath on a mirror?" it's not surprising they don't have sick bays for their minions to go slacking off in. And why would the "sick bay" be at Dundas? And who sends a person having a mental breakdown to "sick bay"?? Rofl!!

I would suspect either the sec checking fucked with her head à la Nancy Many, or she simply couldn't tolerate the abuse and degradation of the RPF or she was locked up because she wanted to leave and the trauma of the imprisonment itself caused her to crack.

So, yeah, what a pack of mongrels! And then to further abuse her by fraudulently obtaining a statement from a mentally incapacitated person is disgusting and shows what scuzzbags they truly are. There are no depths too low to stoop to in the Office of Special Affairs. Like the Borg, there's not a hell of a lot of humanity left in those evil zombies.

All done within an atmosphere of massive culture shock. She may have already been in OZ a few months (maybe not) before she joined the SO, but she would have been coddled along as a public to get more money, more family and friends to get into the cult. So that would have been a bit of insulation against culture shock. Once inside the SO, the culture shock would be massive. I suspect even people who join the SO within their own culture get culture shock when they first get into the SO. Much more so when a Taiwanese joins in OZ.
 

tetloj

Silver Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

Absolutely appalling. What a clown that lawyer came across as.

For those who don't know Lateline is a flagship current affairs program of the national broadcaster - audience is mostly well educated, news afficionados.

It would be great to see some of the tabloids ACA, Today Tonight pick this up...thus getting into the homes of the news-lite population.

The idea of a cult trawling for bodies in Taiwan to come to Australia could also get the radio talkback going.

THEN someone MIGHT get shamed into action.
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

What gets me, and seems to being overlooked, is that she looked perfectly healthy and happy before she went to Sydney. Why isn't anyone pushing for what really happened there to cause the mental breakdown? We exes know the likely scenario, and it can be enough to trigger great mental distress. She was not like that before! If she wanted to leave, cracked it and was put on the Introspection Rundown this fact needs to be repeated and repeated. It's not about someone with mental health problems not being looked after - it's about causing the mental health problems in the first place!

I can't believe that this "statement" she gave is not being fully questioned - those words are not hers, and scientology seems to expect that they will "handle" the situation. Bastards.

And where is Virginia?????

I don't think I have ever seen a lawyer as a spokesman in Australia, and a terrible job he did of it too. If he has half a brain he will be as shocked as anyone at the blatant lying that left him looking like a total tool.

FTS, you are spot on. The initial trigger was her request to leave. THIS is why she went into isolation, not sniffles and sneezes.

I have known people who have been thrown in isolation for their disagreements or upsets with the ethics officer. Just thrown in a room, the door locked with guards who will not utter a word, no R factor as to why they are there. What a horrific terrifying experience!

And even more frightening, it is becoming more commonplace. And the victims have signed the Lisa clause when they started out, likely with no idea of its implications at that stage, so are at an extreme disadvantage when prosecuting for unlawful imprisonment.

This "beating" has bugged me from the beginning about this story. I'm not trying to minimise what happened. It is very real to me that this staff member encountered horrific conditions on staff, had some kind of breakdown, was imprisoned in some babywatch isolation environment, and suffered severe physical injury punching through a glass window to try to escape, for which injury she was hospitalized.

I could never think with being beaten as a part of that. It just didn't ring true, although physical restraint did.

Has there ever been any amplification of this part?

Paul

She told Jack that one of the guys guarding her told her to take off her glasses because she looked much prettier without them, then hit her on the temple with a fire extinguisher.

I don't think this is a standard part of the Introspection R/D, if indeed that is what they were trying to do, or just some untrained ethics officer's idea of a "type 3 handling" (more likely).

Or she was just under guard because she asked to leave. Most likely scenario.

Could be that the "guard" was one of the bottom of the barrel recruits that they couldn't do anything else with, so gave him the simple job of guarding a "type 3" or potential escapee. Anything could have happened and we will likely never know the truth, as Alice is no longer in any condition to tell us.

I have no reason to believe he knows either of Lisa McPherson or the Lisa Clause. I don't know that he has any background in Scientology.

Could well be why he was chosen. I think the cult realizes what hot water they are in and just needed a dupe to put between them and criminal charges.

All done within an atmosphere of massive culture shock. She may have already been in OZ a few months (maybe not) before she joined the SO, but she would have been coddled along as a public to get more money, more family and friends to get into the cult. So that would have been a bit of insulation against culture shock. Once inside the SO, the culture shock would be massive. I suspect even people who join the SO within their own culture get culture shock when they first get into the SO. Much more so when a Taiwanese joins in OZ.

She was not already in Australia. She went directly onto EPF. I don't think she ever got further away from Dundas than the corner store.
 
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

FTS, you are spot on. The initial trigger was her request to leave. THIS is why she went into isolation, not sniffles and sneezes.

I have known people who have been thrown in isolation for their disagreements or upsets with the ethics officer. Just thrown in a room, the door locked with guards who will not utter a word, no R factor as to why they are there. What a horrific terrifying experience!

And even more frightening, it is becoming more commonplace. And the victims have signed the Lisa clause when they started out, likely with no idea of its implications at that stage, so are at an extreme disadvantage when prosecuting for unlawful imprisonment.



She told Jack that one of the guys guarding her told her to take off her glasses because she looked much prettier without them, then hit her on the temple with a fire extinguisher.

I don't think this is a standard part of the Introspection R/D, if indeed that is what they were trying to do, or just some untrained ethics officer's idea of a "type 3 handling" (more likely).

Or she was just under guard because she asked to leave. Most likely scenario.

Could be that the "guard" was one of the bottom of the barrel recruits that they couldn't do anything else with, so gave him the simple job of guarding a "type 3" or potential escapee. Anything could have happened and we will likely never know the truth, as Alice is no longer in any condition to tell us.



Could well be why he was chosen. I think the cult realizes what hot water they are in and just needed a dupe to put between them and criminal charges.



She was not already in Australia. She went directly onto EPF. I don't think she ever got further away from Dundas than the corner store.

Holy Fuck! Straight to EPF.
 

MissWog

Silver Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

She told Jack that one of the guys guarding her told her to take off her glasses because she looked much prettier without them, then hit her on the temple with a fire extinguisher. ]

I have no idea what to say to this
 

tetloj

Silver Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

Just put a few bits and bobs about the lawyer at the Bunker:

http://www.gibsonssolicitors.com.au/

Web page looks pretty lame. Love who they refer to the firm as the Firm...he he he

OMG - he does radio!! 3AW is a Melbourne station.

Stuart Gibson can be heard each Wednesday afternooon on 3aw radio with his 'Show Case" segment advising on Litigation, Media and IP cases.
Here's another nice news story:Stuart Gibson takes on twitter (note this on the page of the station he talks on)
http://www.3aw.com.au/blogs/breaking-news-blog/melbourne-lawyer-takes-on-twitter/20120217-1tdec.html.

And SMH article (one of our betters newspapers)
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/payback-for-the-internets-creepy-cowboys-20120129-1qnzb.html.

Talks about his Hollywood clients

 

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

This "beating" has bugged me from the beginning about this story. I'm not trying to minimise what happened. It is very real to me that this staff member encountered horrific conditions on staff, had some kind of breakdown, was imprisoned in some babywatch isolation environment, and suffered severe physical injury punching through a glass window to try to escape, for which injury she was hospitalized.

I could never think with being beaten as a part of that. It just didn't ring true, although physical restraint did.

Has there ever been any amplification of this part?

Paul

As far as I know, the law says any unwanted touch is considered an assault. If you toss a glass of water in someone's face that is an assault whether you put your hands on them or not. The Scientology drill where you are taught to physically force someone to face the wall, or walk across the room feels like a violation, and carried further, people being restrained and forced to stay in the room during an auditing session when they have tried to leave over and over (Jenna Hill describes this in her book), is also, in my opinion, an assault. It is also not uncommon, from what I've read, to be slapped for a "transgression" (Jenna also describes being punched by one teacher.) The fact that this woman was in the Sea Org makes me think anything is possible in the way she was treated.

I thought it was creepy, when the camera showed the people in rows, marching and taking orders in their blue outfits. So creepy and sad.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

I have no reason to believe he knows either of Lisa McPherson or the Lisa Clause. I don't know that he has any background in Scientology.
Yes, that much was pretty obvious. He wasn't lying, he just doesn't know!
I'm guessing that he's probably regretting accepting this particular client by now. :duh:
 

Caroline

Patron Meritorious
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

I have no reason to believe he knows either of Lisa McPherson or the Lisa Clause. I don't know that he has any background in Scientology.

One big reason, of course, is that it would be malpractice to not know of these things.

It would be humorous, but it’s not reasonable that the Scientologists selected the most ignorant attorney on the planet in this exploding case. Alice is still alive.

Did they hire him the night before the ABC interview, because of his extraordinary ability to categorically deny just about anything? No, it’s much more likely that he had at his fingertips everything about this incident – Alice Wu in iso – that has been reported, including on these message boards, the facts of the case, and his clients’ history and reputation.

The level of either irresponsibility or insanity necessary for him to deny categorically what he denied can be seen in analogous situations with Mike Rinder and Tommy Davis.

Davis categorically denied disconnection. The irresponsibility or insanity necessary for Tommy to categorically not to have known that disconnection was happening all around him is simply beyond belief. Tommy did know, and when he categorically denied its existence he lied.

Rinder categorically denied ever being beaten by Miscavige. Now he says Miscavige beat him some fifty times. The irresponsibility or insanity necessary for Mike to categorically not to have known that Miscavige beat him is unfathomable. Mike did know, and when he categorically denied knowing he lied.

Stuart Gibson knows about Scientology’s iso tech and its most famous product Lisa McPherson, and when he categorically denied its existence he lied. He very well might not have any background in Scientology, but he speaks like a Scientology PR and performed here in the same capacity as Rinder and Davis, and now Pouw.

In Gibson’s case, even if he was so honestly ignorant or irresponsible that he didn’t know of isolation in Scientology, he lied by categorically denying its existence on what he had to know was no evidence.

We must trust Steve Cannane’s reporting, and the editing, but accepting the story’s accuracy, I remain convinced Gibson lied. He does fall back on instructions from his clients, but not where he categorically denies iso’s existence.

We’re considering clarifying the matter with Gibson directly, and will post our communication here if we do so.
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

We’re considering clarifying the matter with Gibson directly, and will post our communication here if we do so.

Yes, please. :clap:

That will be the source of great lulz. :biggrin:

Not only that, but he would never get away with claiming the same thing again.
 

Nurse Pinch

Patron with Honors
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

I actually felt a bit sorry for the lawyer. The cult will have said to him "If you want to know about Scilontrollogy, you should talk to a Scilon, don't believe everything you read". They would have then gone around to his office and "briefed" him on the case. The phrase, "Isolation is a derogatory term", smacks of something a Scilon handler would have said to him. You can see at 5:15, the exact moment the poor bastard realizes he has been fucked by his client. His answer later in the interview at 8:42 is not nearly as forthright, as he starts to realize the extent of his clients deception. Great stuff.

Pinchy.
 

ChurchOfCylontology

Patron with Honors
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

As far as I know, the law says any unwanted touch is considered an assault. If you toss a glass of water in someone's face that is an assault whether you put your hands on them or not. The Scientology drill where you are taught to physically force someone to face the wall, or walk across the room feels like a violation, and carried further, people being restrained and forced to stay in the room during an auditing session when they have tried to leave over and over (Jenna Hill describes this in her book), is also, in my opinion, an assault. It is also not uncommon, from what I've read, to be slapped for a "transgression" (Jenna also describes being punched by one teacher.) The fact that this woman was in the Sea Org makes me think anything is possible in the way she was treated.

I thought it was creepy, when the camera showed the people in rows, marching and taking orders in their blue outfits. So creepy and sad.

Assault is a broader term that means the victim had an apprehension or expectation of violence. If I pick up a baseball and pretend to throw it at you, with perceived intention of inflicting harm, but I miss then that is assault. My torts professor actually demonstrated assault by picking up the chalkboard eraser and throwing it at a student but missing on purpose. However the student didn't know that he missed on purpose and had the expectation of being hit. This is assault.

A lot of law professors are assholes. I really don't miss that experience.
 

oneonewasaracecar

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

I actually felt a bit sorry for the lawyer. The cult will have said to him "If you want to know about Scilontrollogy, you should talk to a Scilon, don't believe everything you read". They would have then gone around to his office and "briefed" him on the case. The phrase, "Isolation is a derogatory term", smacks of something a Scilon handler would have said to him. You can see at 5:15, the exact moment the poor bastard realizes he has been fucked by his client. His answer later in the interview at 8:42 is not nearly as forthright, as he starts to realize the extent of his clients deception. Great stuff.

Pinchy.
I have to disagree. Google this guy. He does litigation against bloggers. He attacks free speech. He is not nice.

Also, he ain't innocent. He doesn't know specifics about doctrine, but he wouldn't go on TV without knowing who Scientology were.
 

Purple Rain

Crusader
Re: Young girl imprisoned, beaten and abused in Sea Org Headquarter, Dundas, Australi

I have to disagree. Google this guy. He does litigation against bloggers. He attacks free speech. He is not nice.

Also, he ain't innocent. He doesn't know specifics about doctrine, but he wouldn't go on TV without knowing who Scientology were.

Yep. He is an anti-free speech vulture. I despise him. He'll probably sue everyone for me saying that as well.
 
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