What's new

The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

Status
Not open for further replies.

Maria Cuervo

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

@Maria Cuervo
If the paranoid,fairgame El ron were removed from contemporary Scientology,it would work 100 times better.
If someone enrolls at a Werner Erhard training seminar,
they pay the fee and later say "well I tried it out but got nothing from it".Thats the end of it.Theres no refund and no judge would have LMark Educn pay this seminar attendee.No guarantees.
And if Scientology quit hounding people who quit,who left,who badmouth it,nobody would care about the critiques.It would wind upna Caveat Emptor.
All Scn needs,for those who value aspects of the tech,is a whole new laissez faire management who are not operating on the "what was the GI?" mentality.

The problem is that Scientology is the product of the paranoid fairgame El Ron. So from paranoia only paranoia comes. See?

And further, all those cults like landmark and EST are seriously just branches off the same sick tree. I do GET that some Indies do their own stuff that by now has very little resemblance or inheritance from SCN. Good for them. But that is not what you are saying. There is no way a sick tree can give good fruit. I could get into a long explanation of ways Scn does not work and has no tech. But then I would bore everyone here and why do that? If you would like to read what I already said on these issues it's on my blog here on the forum. (Linked below).

The brainwashing is the tech. Not a particular person who executes that tech while under the effect of that tech.

I don't agree that EST or landmark give results. They give squat results btw. I doubt it seriously. But then you could accuse me of not having tried them. True. I have been out more than 35 years and I never joined the indies or the FZ or anyone else. I've avoided the tech like the plague. I'm a different kind of squirrel / SP - instead I studied philosophy in a university. Which pretty much immunized me from ever indulging in the idiotic thought that Hubbard was a philosopher. So thankful for that! I only even started remembering Scn's brainwashed 1984 definitions doublespeak mumbo jumbo terms because I was here and some exes still use the systems and structures originating from Hubbard.
 
Last edited:

SPsince83

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

The problem is that Scientology is the product of the paranoid fairgame El Ron. So from paranoia only paranoia comes. See?

And further, all those cults like landmark and EST are seriously just branches off the same sick tree. I do GET that some Indies do their own stuff that by now has very little resemblance or inheritance from SCN. Good for them. But that is not what you are saying. There is no way a sick tree can give good fruit. I could get into a long explanation of ways Scn does not work and has no tech. But then I would bore everyone here and why do that? If you would like to read what I already said on these issues it's on my blog here on the forum. (Linked below).

The brainwashing is the tech. Not a particular person who executes that tech while under the effect of that tech.

I don't agree that EST or landmark give squat results btw. I doubt it seriously. But then you could accuse me of not having tried them. True. I have been out more than 35 years and I never joined the indies or the FZ or anyone else. I've avoided the tech like the plague. I'm a different kind of squirrel / SP - instead I studied philosophy in a university. Which pretty much immunized me from ever indulging in the idiotic thought that Hubbard was a philosopher. So thankful for that! I only even started remembering Scn's brainwashed 1984 definitions doublespeak mumbo jumbo terms because I was here and some exes still use the systems and structures originating from Hubbard.

It's worse than that. It comes from the mind of the fearless subhunter who depth charged a magnetic lode. The mind of the man who swindled the #1 American disciple of the wickedest man in the world. The mind of the man who's church's cross can be found on the back of every Aleister Crowley tarot deck. The man who abandoned 3 wives and 6 children.

If book one is so good, show me a clear. Just one. Anywhere. According to DMSMH he could make one at will, yet he never displayed one. Oh yeah, there was that one public demonstration that failed. Oops. Never made that mistake again, did he? Case histories? Bibliographies? Peer review? Sadly missing. I was a class V grad auditor with several thousand chair hours as well as a cramming officer and qual sec and dianetic clear according to a class ix c/s. I know the tech pretty well. Damn well for non SO staff. Even pretty good for SO IMHO. It's bullshit. from a bullshitter. That which is good is neither unique nor original to scn. Talk to a friend. Pet your cat. Listen to some favorite music. Go look at the stars on a moonless night in the middle of Nevada. Read some Steinbeck. Kesey if you prefer. Go see your favorite sports team. Whatever. Paint a picture. All of which did me more good than 8 years of Elwrong's bullshit.
 

Maria Cuervo

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

It's worse than that. It comes from the mind of the fearless subhunter who depth charged a magnetic lode. The mind of the man who swindled the #1 American disciple of the wickedest man in the world. The mind of the man who's church's cross can be found on the back of every Aleister Crowley tarot deck. The man who abandoned 3 wives and 6 children.

If book one is so good, show me a clear. Just one. Anywhere. According to DMSMH he could make one at will, yet he never displayed one. Oh yeah, there was that one public demonstration that failed. Oops. Never made that mistake again, did he? Case histories? Bibliographies? Peer review? Sadly missing. I was a class V grad auditor with several thousand chair hours as well as a cramming officer and qual sec and dianetic clear according to a class ix c/s. I know the tech pretty well. Damn well for non SO staff. Even pretty good for SO IMHO. It's bullshit. from a bullshitter. That which is good is neither unique nor original to scn. Talk to a friend. Pet your cat. Listen to some favorite music. Go look at the stars on a moonless night in the middle of Nevada. Read some Steinbeck. Kesey if you prefer. Go see your favorite sports team. Whatever. Paint a picture. All of which did me more good than 8 years of Elwrong's bullshit.

Anything, even doing nothing but watching TV, would be better than following anything Hubbard wrote. And none of the offshoots are better either. Forget EST or Landmark. Pure disaster. There has never been a clear or an OT and never will. But there will be empty wallets.
 

JustSheila

Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

It's worse than that. It comes from the mind of the fearless subhunter who depth charged a magnetic lode. The mind of the man who swindled the #1 American disciple of the wickedest man in the world. The mind of the man who's church's cross can be found on the back of every Aleister Crowley tarot deck. The man who abandoned 3 wives and 6 children.

If book one is so good, show me a clear. Just one. Anywhere. According to DMSMH he could make one at will, yet he never displayed one. Oh yeah, there was that one public demonstration that failed. Oops. Never made that mistake again, did he? Case histories? Bibliographies? Peer review? Sadly missing. I was a class V grad auditor with several thousand chair hours as well as a cramming officer and qual sec and dianetic clear according to a class ix c/s. I know the tech pretty well. Damn well for non SO staff. Even pretty good for SO IMHO. It's bullshit. from a bullshitter. That which is good is neither unique nor original to scn. Talk to a friend. Pet your cat. Listen to some favorite music. Go look at the stars on a moonless night in the middle of Nevada. Read some Steinbeck. Kesey if you prefer. Go see your favorite sports team. Whatever. Paint a picture. All of which did me more good than 8 years of Elwrong's bullshit.

I couldn't agree with you more SPsince83. Who could beat your metaphors and imagery, though? Nice! "the mind of the man whose church's cross can be found on the back of every Aleister Crowley tarot deck..." "the mind of the man who swindled the #1 American disciple of the wickedest man in the world." :thumbsup: :clap: :clap: :clap:

All completely true, too.
 

SPsince83

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

I couldn't agree with you more SPsince83. Who could beat your metaphors and imagery, though? Nice! "the mind of the man whose church's cross can be found on the back of every Aleister Crowley tarot deck..." "the mind of the man who swindled the #1 American disciple of the wickedest man in the world." :thumbsup: :clap: :clap: :clap:

All completely true, too.

We aim to please, Sheila
 

TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Why do this though? I was just getting out the popcorn and your raid seems ridiculous. If the tech is wrong then how does replacing someone fix that? Also it then makes them victims of attack. Why not let it all go? The recent movie and other things are already popcorn worthy. My approach would be laissez-faire. Let it implode on its own based on its beliefs and actions. Sure you could kick everyone out, if you survived a lawsuit. But you'd still end up with Scn itself. Even the old text is flawed. All of it. So changing management just perpetuates the myth that Scn is a religion and is a technology.

Let me even be more unpopular. Yes I find the whole thing useless. For me the experiences as staff were sometimes stupid, such as low pay and the ethics dept (totally and utterly useless blather). Ethics is so weatherlike in their system. LOL. The tech itself was interesting to me but then I had not been exposed to anything else so I didn't realize how limited Scn and Dianetics really are. Saying all that, I really didn't have terrible experiences except for the one time at CCLA when I left after my child came back from daycare looking pretty bad. Other than that I really don't have a complaint. HOWEVER I do know that OTHERS have suffered a lot and were broken. Based on intimate knowledge I can see that, not just hearsay. Being an auditor I saw cases come in and out and I saw how people lost their homes and savings. And other things. In general if CoS stopped being so obssessive compulsive about regging, chilled on the overrunning of TRs and paid their staff minimum wage things would be better. Also, the use of private investigators and other methods of controlling high profile exes just makes them look crass. But replacing management would not guarantee that these changes would take place since the tech itself precludes it. Is that correct that the tech itself leads to these abuses or am I wrong. I was hearing that the green vols are not written in stone....they are guidelines...but I don't know what to what degree reforms would be possible without the CoS itself going squirrel. (Which I would think was fine if they did so in order to improve conditions. ) So...the fact they exist does not bother me. What bothers me are certain immoral actions they are notorious for. I don't know that those actions are directly linked to DM or to a specific leader or if they are embedded in the tech.

Let the games begin! May the first person to rewrite KSW win!

This is baked into the loaf like sprouts in Ezekiel Bread. Trying to interpret green on white in a Scientology org like it can be applied for the benefit of the individual is like taking God out of the bible.

DM is The Most High simply because he can. This was LRH's personal salt mine and he made no provisions to create a democracy upon his death. Even if someone of angelic purity took over it could simply be a matter of time before the next Lucifer arose.

Is it really worth it? I wonder what Christ would have done if he knew how many people would be killed and burned in his name? Still, the bible spread literacy over the world for thousands of years, so OK, we can still use a dictionary to look up definitions. That can be Scientology's legacy to mankind.

No one seems to be more effective at creating devout Ex-Scientologists than LRH or DM themselves. Maybe Davey was just meant to be - A Messenger from God.
 
Last edited:

Elcrapaco

Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

@Maria Cuervo
Interestingly,Maria,when I mentioned to Koos Nolst trenite how keyed out we
all got from auditing so how could he reconcile this with LRH being pure evil,which
is Koos' opinion.Koos also puts out global suppressive declares on Hubbard.Anyway,
he said well,the only reason it worked is because he stole it from
other sources.Like misunderstood words and unconsciousness etc came
from Count Korzbzky.I did find it strange that LRH's definition of ART
is a direct rip off from Tolstoy.Tolstoy defined ART almost exactly as did
LRH but many years before.Anyway,I digress.The point is Koos,as much
as he loathes SCN and LRH still acknowledges the tech worked because
it was ripped off from other sources.
But you know,you may be completely right and it was all a total
bunch of BS,every drop.I just really dont know.I go back and forth also
on Hubbard being evil.Sometimes I think the tech may have worked
at first,especially Dianetics. But after awhile he got overwhelmed by something
and went partly nuts.According to Koos, Satan in the 20th century incarnated
as LRH.Koos feels LRH is working 24/7 from the deadzone to destroy anyone
and everyone who were associated with or are currently in SCN.Thats a stretch.
 

Elcrapaco

Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

@Maria Cuervo
I admit I dont know the tech beyond a dianetic auditor,and was only in it
barely 2 years.I dont mean to offend you with my opinions.Its just that after
the early 80's,when DM began pulling his tricks the whole thing started
to disintegrate.My memories of St. Hill are positive.Admittedly,I had
no real involvement as I was public riding in every day on my motorcycle
to get auditing.So who knows?.It got me off drugs,I got clearer,lighter more
focused.I felt I had good friends there.All I can describe is my experiences
there,and they were overall positive.
But its not something I need NOWADAYS in the slightest.Plus I love
to get high so I wouldnt qualify as a PC...lol.
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

<snip> Koos Nolst trenite <snip>

Really? Koos Nolst Trenite? I mean really? That was one of the very few people who's ever made it into my kill-file (ban-list), back in the old Usenet/ARS days - and deservedly so, I might add... :hysterical:
 

JustSheila

Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Why do this though? I was just getting out the popcorn and your raid seems ridiculous. If the tech is wrong then how does replacing someone fix that? Also it then makes them victims of attack. Why not let it all go? The recent movie and other things are already popcorn worthy. My approach would be laissez-faire. Let it implode on its own based on its beliefs and actions. Sure you could kick everyone out, if you survived a lawsuit. But you'd still end up with Scn itself. Even the old text is flawed. All of it. So changing management just perpetuates the myth that Scn is a religion and is a technology.

Let me even be more unpopular. Yes I find the whole thing useless. <snip>

:clap: :clap: :clap:

That attitude won't make you unpopular with me! :giggle:

Oh, Maria, it seems you and I are bound by fate to agree wholeheartedly or disagree completely. :hysterical: Funny stuff. My view is the tek was always shit, and whether you heat it, beat it, fry it, bake it, re-warm it, homogenize it, change the cooks, change the sauce or do whatever you can to disguise or try to change it, shit is still shit.
 

Maria Cuervo

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

@Maria Cuervo
Interestingly,Maria,when I mentioned to Koos Nolst trenite how keyed out we
all got from auditing so how could he reconcile this with LRH being pure evil,which
is Koos' opinion.Koos also puts out global suppressive declares on Hubbard.Anyway,
he said well,the only reason it worked is because he stole it from
other sources.Like misunderstood words and unconsciousness etc came
from Count Korzbzky.I did find it strange that LRH's definition of ART
is a direct rip off from Tolstoy.Tolstoy defined ART almost exactly as did
LRH but many years before.Anyway,I digress.The point is Koos,as much
as he loathes SCN and LRH still acknowledges the tech worked because
it was ripped off from other sources.
But you know,you may be completely right and it was all a total
bunch of BS,every drop.I just really dont know.I go back and forth also
on Hubbard being evil.Sometimes I think the tech may have worked
at first,especially Dianetics. But after awhile he got overwhelmed by something
and went partly nuts.According to Koos, Satan in the 20th century incarnated
as LRH.Koos feels LRH is working 24/7 from the deadzone to destroy anyone
and everyone who were associated with or are currently in SCN.Thats a stretch.

I have heard all that for years about Hubbard got it here or there. In the end the combination of ideas into this strange hydra monster is all I can comment on. And it is bad to the bone. As Gizmo said, the only good in it was by association - seeing a sunset or some human thing done during a time period in the cos. The influence I will grant is Crowley. For sure that cross is on the back of the card deck + all of Scn is a very bad unhealthy satanic soul sucking magick spell. There is not one sentence in one volume, not one process, not one Scn term that is more than a pack of bs used to enslave and mind control anyone who partakes. As for looking up words and so on, dictionaries existed as early as 3 BC. Even when Hubbard plagiarizes his take on whatever he borrows turns everything to crap. There is no point to try and find good in it to save. The baby is as bad as the bath water. Again let them fall on their own sword of evil deeds.
 

Maria Cuervo

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Maria Cuervo,
Were posting from completely different viewpoints.While I might laugh at OT8 ,as I did in a recent post, I have always believed,nay experienced,the tech to work amazingly.By tech,I am referring to everything below power and power plus.How can you explain that several self improvement groups like EST,its recent incarnation Landmark Education,Lifespring and many other "self empowerment" groups are diluted versions of Dianetics minus the cultlike blows,overts,witholds crap.So if these self help groups like EST/landmark education work for thousands,and theyre based on Dianetics,how can you flaw the tech??I believe we have to distinguish the 3rd dynamic GROUP aspect of Scn which fails miserably.All the admin tech may possibly be crap.And,LRH could still have messed up bigtime after Dianetics.But that doesnt mean the early tech didnt work.Thats just my point of view.The reason to get rid of DM is because if 500 or more scientologists worldwide are posting derogatory comments about this guy,then I doubt theyre all lying.Also,the Scn I knew in england was laissez faire,at least to me.I had a blast and the auditing for 2 years,getting audited almost everyday came to $8000.00.

Getting over the belief that the tech is amazing is a hurdle. This article from Jon Atack may help.

http://tonyortega.org/2015/05/16/jo...lters-you-find-a-cowering-12-year-old-inside/
 

SPsince83

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

@Maria Cuervo
Interestingly,Maria,when I mentioned to Koos Nolst trenite how keyed out we
all got from auditing so how could he reconcile this with LRH being pure evil,which
is Koos' opinion.Koos also puts out global suppressive declares on Hubbard.Anyway,
he said well,the only reason it worked is because he stole it from
other sources.Like misunderstood words and unconsciousness etc came
from Count Korzbzky.I did find it strange that LRH's definition of ART
is a direct rip off from Tolstoy.Tolstoy defined ART almost exactly as did
LRH but many years before.Anyway,I digress.The point is Koos,as much
as he loathes SCN and LRH still acknowledges the tech worked because
it was ripped off from other sources.
But you know,you may be completely right and it was all a total
bunch of BS,every drop.I just really dont know.I go back and forth also
on Hubbard being evil.Sometimes I think the tech may have worked
at first,especially Dianetics. But after awhile he got overwhelmed by something
and went partly nuts.According to Koos, Satan in the 20th century incarnated
as LRH.Koos feels LRH is working 24/7 from the deadzone to destroy anyone
and everyone who were associated with or are currently in SCN.Thats a stretch.

This is not original to me but it applies: Scientology; what's good is not unique. What's unique is not good. Leave the subject alone. Go get laid.
 

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Pardon me for not respecting those who prefer regular death & the required formal burial in a plot of hallowed ground. If the loved ones of said 'puter believe it has no use or existence beyond giving up the ghost then so be it.

Where shall I send condolences & flowers ?



Therefore, it MUST have a mind of it's own !

So.....................

While a 'puter can die a physical death as all too may of us have had to experience. Some died far too young for it to be fair & some lived such long productive lives yet others languished in the corner collected dust bunnies.

The serious question that must be faced in all seriousness is the eternal spiritual life of each iteration of our 'puters ( I'm going to look really silly if he said PUTTERS but, hey, same difference, huh ?)

Up there is 'puter Heaven ( or down there is 'puter Hell - same difference isn't it ? ) can my old Win 95 read those Win 8's who left so early ?

Can they hear us plead for help with our confounding new system ? Do they appeal to the 'puter Gods to bring back DOS & run off this new breeds riff-raff clogging the purity of Holy Bandwidth ?

Are they begging for mercy to be shone on we klutzes ?

Are they even up there ? If they are, have they gone on to a new game of their own rules or do they look down upon us & laugh ?

Are they allowed to mess with our progress or can they only observe ? is there a limit on how often - if they even can - come help us by 'puter mental therapy - or telepathy ( same ain't they?)

Does a 'puter just choose to come into our family or it completely random selection off the shelf? Are the one not selected by us hurt because we weren't impressed with the color, size, shape, features?

Did it scar them forever ( or at least until some guru tech convinced them that only He could remove their painful past - for a donation, of course ) ?

What are they doing up there ? Are they wishing they could go back & change some keystrokes that would have changed the course of their path to make it all better now ?

Oh, there is so much to learn of the fate - and history - of our dearly departed 'puters ( or putters, as the case may be ).

If we paid more attention to them while they were here wouldn't they be better off for it ?

How many strokes or how much love bombing does it take to make a 'puter happy ?

Are there all the same or each unique ?

Oh, so very much to delve into about 'put(t)ers....... I'm off to compose some things about 'put(t)ers so I can at least look intelligent on that topic !

What is the appropriate amount of time ( if there really is time ) to grieve for our dead ( are they really ? ) 'put(t)ers ?

Do they even have a spiritual existence ?

later fellow 'puter lovers !

... Oh, can I change my name to Gizmarelda ? That just sounds so much sexy than the bland gizmo !

Or vice versa

..................unless vice alone makes a Happy Meal.
 
Last edited:

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

This is not original to me but it applies: Scientology; what's good is not unique. What's unique is not good. Leave the subject alone. Go get laid.

Ah, the more one gets laid the better !

Variations are even better !

Isn't there some book on the technology of sex ? Was it " Do it by Numbers " or " Nookey by the Bookey " maybe ' Sooner than a Nooner "? I forget. Oh well.


Back to the topic at hand . . . . . . .3 somes are so wonderfully addicting ! Be it 2 gals & a guy / 2 guys & a gal / or 3 guys or 3 gals.

While there is no need to confess participations ( or lack of ) in that particular activity yet a few could at least admit it sounds juicy !

I heard someone say the difference in porn & prostitution is a camera.

Sex as a spectator sport has never sounded appealing to me.

Maybe like teachers are said to be those who can't do the porn watchers are somewhat the same ?

Maybe only the shadow knows ?

Was this an under share ?
 

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

:cheerleader:

Today, the 17 th, is hereby declared your LUCKY Day ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:

Good things are headed your way today ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:

Enjoy ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:
 

Elcrapaco

Patron
Re: THE OLD DAYS - ABOARD THE APOLLO - 1973

My experience gives some insights of how things were when LRH was around and was even aboard ship on the Apollo in late 1973. The amazing things to me were the ineptness of the Sea Org in carrying out nearly all cycles I was involved in and the terrible waste of potentially valuable manpower.

I had been in the Sea Org for about 2 years at a Pac org in the Treasury Division and was very successful there and was holding down a fairly large area of responsibility and out of nowhere, I was ordered to leave my Org and become staff on the Apollo. I was excited about going "to work with Ron" and felt that destiny was calling me. On the downside, a large hole was left in the staff of my Org which, of course, was eventually filed.

I had assumed that the Apollo was an Org of the elite OT's of the world and would be run totally on policy, especially with LRH on board. I was a Dianetic Completion and Grade IV release at the time so I figured I would be low on the totem pole but I was eager to learn and fit in. I thought that at this top management Org on the planet, there would be high comraderie and almost a feeling of being in an elite brotherhood. Two months of being there thoroughly disabused me of my naive attitude!

From the beginning almost everything went wrong. All cycles, small and large were mishandled. To shorten this story, I will list the outpoints rather than do a narrative of them.

1. Arriving at the Lisbon airport, I called a secrete phone number I had been given and made contact with the Apollo. I was told that a driver would pick me up in about 1 hour but it took over 6 hours for him to show up! It was so deflating being kept waiting for 6 hours in a small room at an airport and then receiving no apology from the driver or anybody else.

2. Routing on I had one suitcase and a box with all my OEC Volumes. I was told that I was to be posted in Treasury and to leave my suitcase down in the berthing area and my box of OEC volumes in Treasury division while I went on my routing form. When I got to Treasury, I thought I would be welcomed eagerly by my fellow staff, since I would probably lighten their work loads a little, but instead I was given the cold shoulder. No one would talk to me and looked annoyed that I was there. Also, I was told there was no desk for me and there was no place to leave my OEC Volumes. I set them on the floor near an unoccupied desk of a guy who was at study and went to do the rounting form. I completed it in a little under 2 hours and went back to Treasury but my box of OEC Volumes was gone. No one there showed any interest in helping me find it and knew nothing about it. They were busy and did not want to be bothered. As it turned out, the Volumes were never found. I looked in the courserooms and the Qual Library and they were gone. Maybe someone threw the box overboard, I would not be surprised. I had paid hundreds of dollars for the entire set of OEC volumes.

3. The Personnel Officer was Maria Starkey, wife of the Captain, Norman. She was perhaps the most evil person I have ever met. She told me I was going to be the new Purchasing Officer and I would be given lists of materials to get price quotes on. She said LRH had recently done an "eval" and found the Apollo was not getting 3 bids on each item, as policy called for, so he had a phone installed on the Apollo and I was the new person who would use this phone to get the price quotes. She said the Org would save lots of money by getting price quotes. I protested that I did not speak Portuguese and Starkey said that was WOG think. As a Sea Org member, I could do any job I was given and she told me it make it go right.

4. When I went back to Treasury Division to begin, I was given no Hat Write Up. I was just told to "START!" I was given a list of items including CO2 gas for fire extinguishers and teakwood. I had 2 years of Spanish in high school and I was sitting there scared and caved in. My entire hat was getting phone quotes for items in Portugal but I spoke no Portuguese. I tried doing some "reach and withdraw" on the telephone and finally made the first call using my high school Spanish and when a live operator came on the line I tried to talk hesitatingly in broken Spanish and she just hung up on me. I complained to an Exec, John Braggin, who sat near me that I should not be posted here. He knew Portuguese and made a call for me and got some quotes. Captain Norman Starkey came by and asked what the problem was and I told him. He said that intention was senior to language and picked up the phone and spoke with great intention to the operator - "Ingles, Ingles".
The operator got someone who spoke English and he gave me the phone and I got more quotes. Starkey left and I picked up the phone and said Ingles, Ingles and the operator hung up on me again. The intention was just not strong enough in me. Anyway, I had my quotes and there was nothing else on my list for now so I went off to try and find my tech volumes.

The nex day, I found out with great joy that LRH had done a new "eval" and had appointed 5 new Programs Chiefs for the Flag Bureaux, which was understaffed, and I was one of them, I was to be be programs chief for CCLA. All 5 of us new appointees were to route onto the Data Evaluators course immediately. The problem was that we needed to have completed the Data Evaluators' Course in order to do "evals" and I had just routed on and would have to go on post totally unhatted until this rather long course was completed. Never fear, I was sure I would start on a low gradient as Programs Chief in training and that my senior would take me under her wing and take the time to hat me and groove me into the post. THIS MADE SENSE, HOW COULD IT BE ANY OTHER WAY? My senior, Sandy Wilhere, was tied with Maria Starkey for the most evil person I ever met. She was hostile to me from the first second. I was told that I was not in training and that I was the Programs Chief for CCLA. I told her I had just routed on to course to learn how to do Evals and this was only my first day of a long course so how could I be expected to do them. She said the usual, a Sea Org member has no case on post and can do any post given him or her. I said that is absurd. I said if that was the case, why did auditors have to go through years of training to be a class 8, why couldn't a new person just go in and do the post of Class 8 auditor. She told me I was nattering and that LRH says a Sea Org member is expected to do any job assigned.

5. I said okay and that I would make it go right but could she please hand me her Hat Write Up. She said that there was no Hat Write Up and for me to just START! I was shocked. I said that this is the Flag Ship, LRH is onbaoard so how is it possible that there is no Hat Write Up, A thru J, for your post. She said there is no hat write up and just START!.

6. I spent nearly 3 days doing my first eval and proudly presented it to Sandy for her inspection. She scanned it for about 15 seconds and then said, "This is just Bullshit." and she tore it up into pieces. I complained that she just scanned the first page, how did she know so quickly that it was no good. She ordered me to cramming and ordered a lot of Method 9 word clearing done on me. Two days later, I fixed the eval and thought I had improved it but this time she only scanned for 7 seconds and this one she threw in the waste basket and then stomped on it violently with her shoes over and over saying that the eval was just crap. Story to be continued .......


Second installment of my story.
The Data Evaluators Course had Mary Sue, Diana, Quentin and Suzette all enrolled on it. It was exciting to hear their names called at roll call and to hear them answer "Here." The course supervisor was a tall guy with blondish hair from New York City, I believe his name was Dave Cohen. The last time I went in to AOLA in 2003, he was on staff there. I consider him to be a fine guy and good staff member.

THE SITUATION WHICH I WAS ASSIGNED TO EVALUATE AS MY FIRST DUTY ON POST - CCLA had been started by Yvonne Gillham (Jentzch) in 1969 based on an LRH program and by 1970 it had grown to 150 staff members and was a growing and active Org. They did have some legitimate Celebrities on their lines almost from the beginning. Two early celebrities were actor Steven Boyd and Candice Bergen, daughter of an extremely well known ventroloquist, and an actress and personality in her own right. Steven Boyd was very big at the time after co starring in the Movie "Ben Hur" with Charleton Heston. Unfortunately for CCLA, Boyd had dropped out just before I arrived in early 1971 and Bergen was on her way out. The other names were Chick Correa, and actress Karen Black, who was making a big splash in Hollywood at the time. There were also actors Geoffry Lewis and Robert F Lyons, Rock groups David Bowie, and Edwin Bear, etc. Behind the scenes there were some very big names such as Director Erniest Lehman and movie exec and acting coach Milton Katsellas. Lehman did not want it publicized that he was a Scientlogist but he came in for auditing on a regular basis. One of the biggest behind the scenes type of celebrities was Flo Barnett, who became David Miscavige's mother-in-law years later. She got the famous star Shelly Winters into the Org to have dinner with the staff and got Anne Francis to do the comm course.

Despite the above list of Celebrities, most of the people on lines were not celebrities and by 1973 CCLA was getting a reputation for being just an upstat Class 4 Org rather than a real Celebrity Centre. If a guy with a good job came in and had money to purchase services, CCLA would enroll him or her with no questions asked. LRH had defined a celebrity as, "someone who excelled in the fields of entertainment, sports, science and busines AND THEIR ENTOURAGES". He was looking for "opinion leaders", people who rank and file people turn to for cues on what was in and what was out in society. The term celebrity was made a little broader by saying that it was someone who was celebrated in his field. If a guy was a successful stockbroker or computer programmer at Boeing or somesuch, the rules were bent a little by Yvonne to enroll him even though he was not really a Celebrity as per LRH's definition. I was taken in under these bent rules and I certainly was not a celebrity in any sense of the word.

When I got instructed to do an "eval" on why CCLA was becoming a large upstat Class IV Org but not a Celebrity Centre, I felt that I already knew the "why" and already knew how to correct it. I had already thought about this situation long and hard before I arrived at the Apollo and I wrote to Yvonne and told her my observations and how to fix them. At the staff meetings, every Thursday night, all 27 Gross Divisional Statistics (GDS's) were shown to the staff along with their graphs and 3 week and 6 week trends. CCLA had a Division 6 stat called, "New Bodies in the Shop." It had to do with how many new people were in the Org taking a service or participating in an activity for the current week. The word "bodies" was the key to the whole eval as far as I was concerned. Using the word bodies, instead of people or prospects or something more dignified than just bodies tends to belittle the public and non Scientology field. Every class 4 Org as well as the Advanced Orgs and the St. Hill Orgs had this GDS. I do not know where the term came from but it must have been coined by LRH since he gave each division a GDS when he created the Org Board. In some businesses, it might fit well, such as the catering business. If the company knew how many bodies were to be at an event, they would know how much food to cook. For a Celebrity Centre it definitely was not the correct GDS!!

When Sandy gave me the eval to do, I read it and immediately blurted out that I already knew the "Why", To tell her this was a big mistake. She told me my idea was absurd and to just do the eval according to policy and come up with the right why. The first two evals I did I described in my first installment. On the third try, I had been on the course for over a week and tried to apply the tech. No matter how I tried, I could not suppress the concept that if Div 6 was shooting for more and more bodies in the shop on a weekly basis, that is what they were going to get. Why would the number of real Celebrities into the Org increase if none of the GDS's were pushing for more celebrites in the shop? I tried to approach it from another angle in eval form but in the end, I arrived at a similar why as before embellished with some other findings. Sandy exploded after reading about 15 seconds into my third eval and ripped it up in front of my eyes. She sent me to cramming and wrote big reports about me to the cramming officer. After cramming, I wrote a 4th eval wherein I found a completely different why. I thought the 4th eval was terrible myself as it was just a half hearted effort to placate Sandy. She read it, tore it up and assigned me Danger. She said she was going to bypass me and do the eval herself. I eventually read her eval and it was a very complex document, using all the correct terminology and giving a program to correct the situation which consisted of many targets and orders and so forth which I did not think it would have any effect on getting in more Celebrities.

READING THE TELEXES - I was still on the Evaluators Course but was no longer allowed to write Evals so I did the only thing left in my hat which was to read the telexes coming in from all around the world that related to Celebrity Centre L.A..
PTS CITY - Most of the stuff coming in had to do with panics, emergency scenes needing handling and non optimum situations. There was some good news too. Eddie Robin, who was a billiards player and lived at CCLA had won the American Billiard Championship and the news was sent to LRH. It cheered him up and he put something about it in the Orders of the Day, a sort of Ship newsletter. The Class IV Hamburg Org in Germany was doing $50,000 a week.This was very good news. Some people who were going to Germany to audit Dianetics wanted the R3R commands in German. I speak fair German myself but one of the other Programs Chiefs was from Germany and she helped me put the R3R commands into German for them. There was an Scientologist from the early 1950's, Hap Hazard, who was into aeronautics and wrote articles for an Airplane magazine in the 1970's and he got an article published in the Airplane magazines about LRH's barstorming aircraft activities of the early 1930's, including stunt flying and daredevil feats. LRH got very good press from this magazine.

That was about it for the good news. The bad news outnumbered the good news by a wide margin. I will give two examples. Celebrity Centre was only doing about $7,000 per week GI in 1973, the biggest week ever was around $12,000
while there would be low weeks in the $3,500 range. A 1973 dollar was probably about $5 in today's money. One week, just before I left for the Apollo, CCLA sent a two person team to Peter Gillham's Scientology center in Phoenix to sign up new Phoenix public to come to CCLA to do their Academy Level training packages which were $1,000 each. The two person team, a single rock singer and a married Div 6 woman traveled together and they brought back twenty $1,000 training packages worth $20,000 to CCLA in August or September. Added to CCLA's regular income of a little over $5,000, the Org did $25,000 doubling their previous all time high. There was a big party thrown at CCLA to celebrate. Not so fast though, the $20,000 was put up by a business man on the beginning communications course in Phoenix and it was only a loan and he was to be paid back with interest in full within 60 days. When it came time to repay the man his loan, no one in Phoenix knew anything about it and they referred him to CCLA. CCLA was not made aware the money had to be paid back and it was exposed that their 2 person team had an out 2D. CC did not have anywhere near that kind of money so the bill ended up at World Wide headquarters and the man was threatening a lawsuit. A lot of people at CCLA were busted over this fiasco and even Yvonne was assigned some kind of condition. Flag paid the investor off with interest and for the next month, CCLA staff received no pay Base pay (which was only $10 per week). and ate rice and beans and all the CCLA gross income except the barest essentials such as rice, beans, phone, electricity, rent and postage was taken by Flag as repayment. The repurcusions this had on the staff caused very low moral because none of the rank and file staff had anything to do with creating this problem. I guess, they were going along with current think in the Orgs among management, "they just pulled it in" due to earlier out-ethics.

GOOD NEWS TURNS TO BAD AND THE FINAL BOMB THAT ENDS MY STINT AS PROGRAMS CHIEF - Flo Barnett actually brought movie icon Rock Hudson into the Center. He was having personal problems and she found his ruin and got him to agree to an auditing demonstration session. Also, a Scientologist living in Santa Barbara, Cal. knew Jane Russel, an enormously famous Hollywood sex symbol of the 1940's and 1950's and sold her a Dianetics book. Yvonne, in her exuberance, telexed an exageration that Jane Russel was reading Dianetics and Rock Hudson was in session. LRH reacted very positively and wanted to send support from Flag to make sure that these stars received "kid gloves" treatment". Alas, before LRH could react, a class 6 auditor took Rock Hudson in session over a "present time problem" having to do with his car being parked at a meter on the street with only 45 minutes left on the timer. The auditor, Carmine, took him in and even though Hudson had a small win and F/N, Carmine decided to keep going for a major win which was against the orders of his CS. Rock Hudson blew session to handle the parking meter, had bad indicators and never returned and Jane Russel, though paying $3 or $4 for her book, never actually had any interest in reading it.

The bomb that finished me off was that Building Inspectors from the City of Los Angeles visited the Celebrity Centre at 1809 W. 8th St and cited the building which was putting on nightly shows and serving food and refreshments as unlicensed to serve food and not equipped to put on shows where over a hundred people attended each night. The electrical wiring did not meet code and the building was deemed a fire trap. The officials were friendly and helpful but they gave Celebrity Centre a limited amount of time to get the proper licensing and bring the building up to code or to vacate. Immediately, there was a huge panic and it ended up on my desk. I talked to my friend Al Bouton, a great guy, who was Estates Programs Chief. He was already working on solutions and was investigating different buildings where the Org could move to. It had already been decided that it would cost too much to bring W. 8th St. to code. I sent some telexes to Yvonne telling her that we were working on getting the Org a new building and she would be hearing from us son. She was in a panic, sending telexes daily requesting help. Remember, I had never even been given a basic hat write up so I had no chart showing the flow lines of my post. I had no hat training on the structure of World WIde Management and who to contact there. Anyway, LRH's messenger came to my berthing a couple of nights later and told me I was removed from post and that I was to stay up 24 hours and work on sorting files in the hold of the ship. I SAW HERE THAT THE "LITTLE GUY" OR "MINOR PLAYER" which was personified by me, or in the case of Celebrity Centre, the whole rank and file staff being denied their pay over something they had absolutely no knowledge of were TAKING THE FALL for oversights instigated by upper level management and the leadership.

A FALSE ACCUSATION MADE BY LRH HIMSELF TO ME - After I was removed from post, an LRH messenger came to my berthing area with a message from the Commodore. The messenger said that the Commodore knew about the funds I had embezzled from CCLA Treasury and I was not to go to sleep but to stay up all night sorting folders in the hold of the ship. I protested to the messenger, saying I gave CCLA all my money and never took a penny from them except my pay. The messenger said in a questioning voice, "You did not embezzle CCLA money?" I said absolutely not !! The messenger left and returned about 5 minutes later. She said, "The Commodore says that you have lied before about crimes you have committed but this time you are not going to get away with it.." I told her to tell the Commodore I would work out of my lower condition on the EPF and would be back as a contributing staff member. She left and did not return.

MAJOR CHANGE IN MY THOUGHT PATTERN - I believed that LRH knew everything and could read minds. I knew also that I was 100% scrupulously honest at CCLA and never took a penny. I had new information now that LRH was not infallible. I still greatly admired him and was reverent toward him but I knew for sure something that few staff members have experienced directly. LRH did not automatically know everything and could be wrong on serious matters. As my career in Scientology progressed, this tidbit of knowledge made me stronger and helped me to think more clearly when the chips were down.

My next installment will be on my stint on the EPF but I am going to end off for now...........

"Scientology is the only religion in the world.....with a Cashiers
booth"cm
After I left Scientology I had this realisation that LRH manifested all the traits of a suppressive person to the
letter.He always was blaming "wrong target",and as he put it,"ki king the cat".It could be what he could least confront in himself and anyone else,the traits of a suppressive person,he projected outwardly onto others.But,according to his own thinking,whomever you blame,you elect as cause over yourself.Practically everybody ever in Scientology was eventually declared suppressive,LRH's infamous projection.
 

IVisitor

Patron
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

:cheerleader:

Today, the 17 th, is hereby declared your LUCKY Day ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:

Good things are headed your way today ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:

Enjoy ! :cheerleader:

:cheerleader:
Today I had reached an extreme low point in my life [in a way],
then the telephone rang ... and things started to look a little better ...
I still see no reasons for cheering.
It seems like I can never ever get what I want.
It had taken lots of serious convincing to bring me to that point,
therefore I'm still rather seriously convinced of that. ;-|
Of course I don't like it, therefore I may be liable to get rid of it, as soon as such would be possible.
 

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

I sort of drifted back to the 2 lovely 26 year old gals in Barbados that were looking hot a hot 40 year worldly man to spend 2 luscious weeks with.

Most men by age 40 have worked through the self satisfying teen age years and into having learned through their 20's & 30's through their wide & deep experiences how to bring to the table whatever please their mate.

Ah, and at 40 here is a master of love making ready to create with those young ladies such incredible heights that would last them a lifetime ! They'd always swoon forever after over the indelible memories of the time they went to heights they'd never even dare dream of !

Ah, those intense weeks on an Island Paradise ! And It'd work both ways ! For a guy to look back on a trip that proved to be sexually as good as it gets - and beyond !

But, ah, was not to be. Oh well memories anyway.

Man, that story had such potential. And staying power all these years later !


On the flip side such an encounter could leave one like Al Capone ended up..... deep sea fishing in a back yard swimming pool.

While,. I'm not a fan of per-ordained destiny it could be, maybe, that what happens in our life happens for a reason - or maybe no reason.

Each of us could be on some course never to be knocked off of it by anything or anyone we or could be a ping pong ball in a hurricane just going which ever way the wind happens to blow at the moment.

Maybe it matters. Maybe it doesn't.

I'd vote ( only for myself ) to make the best of today... but do it right today not somewhere in the future.

Is love the key ? Is there even a key........or a lock ? Oh, a combination to it ? OK.

Love making more or a less takes a combination, doesn't it ?

Time out, incoming message.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top