What's new

Anti Scientology cultist?

George Layton

Silver Meritorious Patron
The alternative to being "anti-" something is to be "pro-", but then you must articulate what values you are seeking to promote or exemplify. This is problematic from the days of a.r.s. forward because much of the "cult of the anti-cult", as the admirable intellect of Bernie styled it, is really about seeking excuses to act and think like a 13 year old engaged in a schoolyard taunting match.

Pro- free speech? A.r.s. liked to fly its colors in that way. Also, Andreas tried to make Operation Clambake about this, but it was largely HIS fortitude in keeping his eye on that prize that accomplished anything of the sort. The majority of regular denizens of Clambake were simply rehashing a.r.s. juvenile style thought and argument and demonstrating that in both a.r.s. and Clambake the task is to be the most outrageous acting-out or dramatizing person. Genuinely useful critical dialogue was invariably drowned out by juvenile acting-out in both forums. Clambake failed to be a genuinely CRITICAL community as evidenced by how easily nonsense about minute electric potentials associated with the e-meter somehow overpower the very stout electrochemical potency of the human body and produce addiction. This happened despite at least a few people in Clambake having the background to know better, yet it took an embarassing retraction by a media organ to finally show this silly notion has no traction except among select "true believers" of the cult of the anti-cult. Apparently you can stand up for free speech as what you are "pro-" about, but at the expense of rational and productive discourse that you'd want from a critical community, or else be glaringly shown a liar by the threads you willingly join.

Pro- decency? Much of the cult of the anti-cult is about providing frequent and shocking enough verbal indecency as its main battle tactic. A few civilly speaking and informed people in places the ex-scientologist might go manage to provide extremely valuable critical information, to great and good effect. But civilly speaking, critically thinking people and the cult of the anti-cult are mutually exclusive things. One would not be so prone to fall prey to the Mirror Image Rule that Bernie so aptly illustrated if one simply resolved to not "deliberate" like an obnoxious and smugly self-assured 13 year old. This allure is too much to resist for the "COTAC" though, and trying to define itself as pro-decency is a losing game for it.

I could continue to list all sorts of potential "pro-" principles about which COTAC could organize itself and present itself to the world as based upon. Unfortunately too much in the way of contradicting verbiage and other conduct by the COTAC defeats almost all such attempts. They must be anti-, as they cannot conform to desirable "pro-" principles in their actual conduct.

I really don't understand how from the mid-90s when I first started to monitor a.r.s. to the mid-teens some 20 years later, the old game of "Yousa not march in lock-step with us, so yousa OSA: yousa bad!!!!" still gets played with gusto.

What's so funny about wanting GENUINE critical deliberation, EVIDENCE that consists of more than luridly described speculations that often passes for "evidence" with the COTAC, and the ability to act in a social environment not dominated by seemingly 13 year old smug taunters who set the standard for the milleu? Why must someone be thought to be sucking up to DM or a false flag operator to simply desire these things???

It can be pondered and debated in so many ways but it ALL is still a distraction from the abuses ongoing in scientology today and the exposure of those abuses.
 

TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
IMHO, open-minded is when one actually got involved, and feeling stupid is in hindsight. There may be crossovers, of course. But as we know, it's hard AF to leave, as it was intended to be. Thus, the feeling stupid overlap.

Yes. All kidding aside, I think the exact point I fell resolutely into the stupid classification was staying after seeing how they made people live in the basement of Big Blue with mattresses on the floor. There was nothing in my berthing that I needed so much that I couldn't have just walked straight out the door and hopped a bus or stuck out my thumb. LRH did that. Other people facilitated it but it should have been clear in that moment that at the heart of Scientology was LRH's deep desire to debase people. All things considered I'm not doing too badly but in a parallel dimension the me that left is living a completely different life.

The bottom line is that regardless of how goofy LRH and his stuff was they were deceptive and abusive and took advantage of people. There are lots of people who due to age, handicap, circumstances, education or environment can be deceived at some point in their lives. The burden is on everyone else to be decent and not predate on them.

Big Scientology fail.
 

TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
:thumbsup:
And... even hindsight is not always 20/20.
BTW, this is one sub theme in the movie "Ground Hog Day" (starring Bill Murray).

Love that movie!

How about a version called The LRH Birthday Game where a Scientology Commanding Officer continually relives the chance to get his org's stats up in time to win.
 

Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
It can be pondered and debated in so many ways but it ALL is still a distraction from the abuses ongoing in scientology today and the exposure of those abuses.

To me there is something I call the 'ick' factor. In other words, if you're going to get your mind around things, there should be no 'ick' at all. That noicer calm zen-space, with no words... So opposite of anything Hubbard, just so far away from the heart of life... no feelings 'cause you are to0o tangled up in the bs. iya.


:booze:
 

Anonycat

Crusader
Yes. All kidding aside, I think the exact point I fell resolutely into the stupid classification was staying after seeing how they made people live in the basement of Big Blue with mattresses on the floor. There was nothing in my berthing that I needed so much that I couldn't have just walked straight out the door and hopped a bus or stuck out my thumb. LRH did that. Other people facilitated it but it should have been clear in that moment that at the heart of Scientology was LRH's deep desire to debase people. All things considered I'm not doing too badly but in a parallel dimension the me that left is living a completely different life.

The bottom line is that regardless of how goofy LRH and his stuff was they were deceptive and abusive and took advantage of people. There are lots of people who due to age, handicap, circumstances, education or environment can be deceived at some point in their lives. The burden is on everyone else to be decent and not predate on them.

Big Scientology fail.

In the early 1980s, my friend was staff at Big Blue, and was so broke, he'd tell me about trying to find trees that bare fruit, or anything, so he could eat. He told me about these carob trees that had big seed pods, but the seeds were really hard, and difficult to chew. And he told me of the cheapest seedy rooms to rent, and selecting one that he didn't see stabbings or other violence at. Finally, he came home, and left the cult forever.
 

TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
In the early 1980s, my friend was staff at Big Blue, and was so broke, he'd tell me about trying to find trees that bare fruit, or anything, so he could eat. He told me about these carob trees that had big seed pods, but the seeds were really hard, and difficult to chew. And he told me of the cheapest seedy rooms to rent, and selecting one that he didn't see stabbings or other violence at. Finally, he came home, and left the cult forever.

You raise the point of what it is like to try to get back on your feet in Los Angeles after leaving the Sea Org.

In my opinion it is a noisy, dirty, congested, drab place and the people are stressed and inconsiderate. Yes, that is a lot of generalization but basically there are a lot of more promising places a person can try to re-establish their lives. The tendency is to appeal to other Scientologists for help or employment but they too tend to be stressed, often due to their own self inflicted obligations to Scientology.

Los Angeles was being flooded with war refugees in the 70s and illegal aliens hit a new high in the 80s. They compete for low wage/low skill jobs that ex-SO may need with a weak resume and little resources and that market is completely saturated now.

The hills above Hollywood had a lot of homeless encampments years ago and there were lots of dumpster divers. I can't imagine what its like now. The strain and competition on low/no income support systems and housing must be intense. To me Los Angeles equates to cockroaches and bedbugs. Its not enough to keep your own place and things clean, if your neighbor or the people that came before you weren't - you get the vermin.

By the time people have been in the SO their savings are probably depleted and their connections to family and friends who can provide a support network could be minimal.

I tried to restart in LA after getting out but having done that, my advice would be to immediately relocate and invest your time and energy somewhere nicer.

Any ex-Sea Org members who found this advice helpful can send Commendations to my ethics folder via ESMB Director of Inspections and Reports. Much appreciated, thanks.
 

Anonycat

Crusader
You raise the point of what it is like to try to get back on your feet in Los Angeles after leaving the Sea Org.

In my opinion it is a noisy, dirty, congested, drab place and the people are stressed and inconsiderate. Yes, that is a lot of generalization but basically there are a lot of more promising places a person can try to re-establish their lives. The tendency is to appeal to other Scientologists for help or employment but they too tend to be stressed, often due to their own self inflicted obligations to Scientology.

Los Angeles was being flooded with war refugees in the 70s and illegal aliens hit a new high in the 80s. They compete for low wage/low skill jobs that ex-SO may need with a weak resume and little resources and that market is completely saturated now.

The hills above Hollywood had a lot of homeless encampments years ago and there were lots of dumpster divers. I can't imagine what its like now. The strain and competition on low/no income support systems and housing must be intense. To me Los Angeles equates to cockroaches and bedbugs. Its not enough to keep your own place and things clean, if your neighbor or the people that came before you weren't - you get the vermin.

By the time people have been in the SO their savings are probably depleted and their connections to family and friends who can provide a support network could be minimal.

I tried to restart in LA after getting out but having done that, my advice would be to immediately relocate and invest your time and energy somewhere nicer.

Any ex-Sea Org members who found this advice helpful can send Commendations to my ethics folder via ESMB Director of Inspections and Reports. Much appreciated, thanks.

This friend was not from L.A., but Northern California, and after returning home and leaving the cult, went to University, and went on to get a deep 6-figure income. The best thing he ever did was to turn his back on the cult. Getting $250,000 a year is a far cry from eating carob seeds to survive.
 

an0n

Patron
Recent development.. Miscavige now using acronym ASC to describe primary activities within Scientology..

-Always Sending Cash
-Always Sec Checked

Has a as-isness ring to it
 

Gib

Crusader
I am a proud member of the ex-Scientology community.
I am against Scientology, thus Anti-Scientology.

The OSA program to create the pejorative meme, "Anti Scientology Cult" has succeeded only in uniting the words Scientology and Cult
and is designed, I think, to stanch the hemorrhaging of membership from Scientology organizations.

Just like the ridiculous idea that seeks to divide the anti-Scientology community into ex-Scientologists and never-ins, Scientology, ever obsessed with
de-legitimizing a growing army of critics in the media and the popular culture only winds up proving the critics' points.

OSA is too sleep deprived to be effective.

Which reminds me, one of the best things about being an ex-Scientologist is getting 8 hours of sleep.

I agree with you, but I think it's time to loose the meme ASC, ex scientologist, anti-scientology and even critic of scientology for us exmembers.

If I were to label myself, it would be scientology whistleblower. A non ex-member would be a critic. So, I actually think it would better to communicate to the public if ex-members labeled themselves as whistleblowers and made it known and the media did the same and Tony O actually made that distinction as well.

The term whistleblower did not come into the human language until 1970 per wiki. Hubbard never knew the term but he knew the term critic. Hubbard teachings tell us a critic is bad, an SP, so inmembers immediately close their eyes and ears. The Hubbard/COS does not have a handling for "whistleblower" as far as I know.
 
Last edited:
Top