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Call your local Org

Div6

Crusader
Tell them that you recieved the Truth Rundown, and realized that your folders are not safe with them, and ask for them back.

If everyone were to do this, I think a message might begin to get through.


See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clergy-penitent_privilege

"The First Amendment is largely cited as the jurisprudential basis. The earliest and most influential case acknowledging the priest-penitent privilege was People v. Phillips, where the Court of General Sessions of the City of New York refused to compel a priest to testify or face criminal punishment. The Court opined:

"It is essential to the free exercise of a religion, that its ordinances should be administered - that its ceremonies as well as its essentials should be protected. Secrecy is of the essence of penance. The sinner will not confess, nor will the priest receive his confession, if the veil of secrecy is removed: To decide that the minister shall promulgate what he receives in confession, is to declare that there shall be no penance..."

A few years after Phillips was decided, People v. Smith distinguished the case on the grounds that the defendant had approached the minister as a "friend or adviser," not in his capacity as a professional or spiritual advisor. As with most privileges, a debate still exists about the circumstances under which the priest-penitent privilege applies. The capacity in which the clergyman is acting at the time of the communication is relevant in many jurisdictions.

In twenty-five states, the clergyman-communicant statutory privilege does not clearly indicate who holds the privilege. In seventeen states, the penitent's right to hold the privilege is clearly stated. In only six states, both a penitent and a member of the clergy are expressly allowed by the statute to hold the privilege."
 
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DCAnon

Silver Meritorious Patron
http://www.rantrave.com/Rant/Psycopaths-make-Terror-in-Scientology.aspx


Direct threat.

The secret Church files on these formerly-respected psychopaths reveal that they had admitted crimes in their confidential confessions to the Church. Once these psychopaths started criticizing the church, the Church had no choice but to reveal their criminal secrets. These developments should warn all critics who turn against the Church that they can not expect to hide behind the 'secrecy' of their confidential Church files.
 

Wisened One

Crusader
Yeah, and while I'm on the phone with my local org, think I'll specifically request my declare mailed to me (WITH ALL MY FOLDERS) asap! :thumbsup:
 

Feral

Rogue male
Div 6, you are a freakin' genius. If Dm had brains like that on his side, we'd be the ones in trouble.

I'm calling them today.
 

Div6

Crusader
Div 6, you are a freakin' genius. If Dm had brains like that on his side, we'd be the ones in trouble.

I'm calling them today.

That is quite the compliment, and I thank you for it.

Having had some time to think about this some more, I am contemplating sending a letter via a lawyer requesting it in writing, and CC:ing the Org DSA, DM as CoB RTC, and his lawyers Yingling and Walsh. The specific point bering that since he and his group have publically renounced the sanctity of the confessional, they therefore have no right to any folders or personal data, including but not limited to:

PC Folders
Ethics Files
Personnel Files
Academy Files
DSA Files
including anyrhing that may have been scanned, digitized or otherwise entered in to any database anywhere within the Scientology orgs.
Further, any copies of any reports, stats, chits or other data written by me on others should also be destroyed.

A notarized statement from the person executing the destruction is requested, as well as a statement saying that no copies were made or retained.

After all, the CoS DID work to get the Freedom of Information act going in the US....

If we all did that, that would keep them bust for quite a while.
 
That is quite the compliment, and I thank you for it.

Having had some time to think about this some more, I am contemplating sending a letter via a lawyer requesting it in writing, and CC:ing the Org DSA, DM as CoB RTC, and his lawyers Yingling and Walsh. The specific point bering that since he and his group have publically renounced the sanctity of the confessional, they therefore have no right to any folders or personal data, including but not limited to:

PC Folders
Ethics Files
Personnel Files
Academy Files
DSA Files
including anyrhing that may have been scanned, digitized or otherwise entered in to any database anywhere within the Scientology orgs.
Further, any copies of any reports, stats, chits or other data written by me on others should also be destroyed.

A notarized statement from the person executing the destruction is requested, as well as a statement saying that no copies were made or retained.

After all, the CoS DID work to get the Freedom of Information act going in the US....

If we all did that, that would keep them bust for quite a while.

If you do get an attorney to author a legal document for you, you should post a link to it with the personal information removed of course, so others can use it as a template to do the same.
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
The specific point bering that since he and his group have publically renounced the sanctity of the confessional, they therefore have no right to any folders or personal data, including but not limited to:

Does this have any factual basis in law, or is it just a nice moral idea?

Paul
 

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
There is no way the Church is going to hand them over. No CS is going to allow a pc folder into the public domain, let alone an ethics folder - if they arent handing out people own declares to them for fear of it being public, then a pc folder is never going to make it out of an org ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE CLEAR OR ABOVE.

You will be told that your folder has been lost, sent to another org, or just told point-blank no. If by some legal miracle you DO get a folder, it will be missing any data incriminating to the church, and they will keep copies of anything they do give you.

Simply for asking they will assume you are trying to take your folder to cover up crimes you have against the Church - so your folders that may have been sitting in storage for years will be gone through with a fine-tooth comb, and you will be put on to top of OSAs radar. Remember that the only LOGICAL reason in a Scientologists mind for you wanting those files, is to attack the Church, or protect yourself when you attack the Church in the future. So of course, they will want to attack you first.

Im not saying you shouldnt try, just be prepared for the backlash and runaround. Let me know how you go! If everyone suddenly asked for their files back, it would be the flap of the century - particularly for Class V orgs who are sheltered from news of whats happening around the world!
 

Feral

Rogue male
The people requesting this would already be on the radar and have their folders culled.

You might get the info, or you might create a lot of cognitive dissonance....or both.
 

Div6

Crusader
There is no way the Church is going to hand them over. No CS is going to allow a pc folder into the public domain, let alone an ethics folder - if they arent handing out people own declares to them for fear of it being public, then a pc folder is never going to make it out of an org ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE CLEAR OR ABOVE.

You will be told that your folder has been lost, sent to another org, or just told point-blank no. If by some legal miracle you DO get a folder, it will be missing any data incriminating to the church, and they will keep copies of anything they do give you.

Simply for asking they will assume you are trying to take your folder to cover up crimes you have against the Church - so your folders that may have been sitting in storage for years will be gone through with a fine-tooth comb, and you will be put on to top of OSAs radar. Remember that the only LOGICAL reason in a Scientologists mind for you wanting those files, is to attack the Church, or protect yourself when you attack the Church in the future. So of course, they will want to attack you first.

Im not saying you shouldnt try, just be prepared for the backlash and runaround. Let me know how you go! If everyone suddenly asked for their files back, it would be the flap of the century - particularly for Class V orgs who are sheltered from news of whats happening around the world!

I'm not asking to get them back. I'm asking for them TO BE DESTROYED.

They simply cannot be trusted.
 

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
I'm not asking to get them back. I'm asking for them TO BE DESTROYED.

They simply cannot be trusted.

They arent going to do that either. You might come back next lifetime damanding to keep going up the Bridge, you know! :melodramatic:
 

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
I think if people are brave enough, bring on the cognitive dissonance. I can just imagine the looks on the receptionists face when she gets the call....
 

Once bitten

Patron Meritorious
OSA member states folders can be returned

On this interview on National Radio, Mike Ferriss, 'OSA Mike' who claims to be the secretary of the NZ church of scientology, says that folders are returned to ex-members if they ask for it. He says this at 33 on the interview which is on the link below. He also says a whole lot of other rubbish, but it is interesting that here we have a spokesperson for the cofs stating on National Radio that the folders are there for the taking. :omg:


http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/20081218

So people who are thinking of demanding their folders back, use this quote by Mike Ferriss in your letter. He says that there is no problem with getting back the folders

:yes:
 
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