The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[FoTi]

FoTi, my Dear,

My records show I sent you the "Unpleasant Sensation Handling" in an email dated February 13 . . . . dig it out. Though it is on this board, it'd take me a bit of hunting to locate it.

This one is on my dining room table. I don't have to dig it out. Are you feeling short with me?

Maybe I wasn't clear on what I was asking. It was the other 2, below, that I was asking about. Thanks for those links. I'll make a file for them so that I have them on hand.

Here is the Basic Chronic Mood Handling:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?p=439304#post439304

Here is the "Thoughts are Things" R/D
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?p=438687#post438687

Rog

Thanks again for taking the time to put the links here, so that I can find them.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Nice!

It is a faculty that I find is native to us. Fortunate, or gifted, are those who have it (or at least some remaining parts of it) intact. Many have occluded it under denials and abandonment.

Rog

I remember, in 6th grade, being able to turn to the exact page in the dictionary of the word I was looking for.

 

[FoTi]

Dropping >>>site:forum.exscn.net "Unpleasant Sensation Handling"<<< into a Google search box finds it in a trice.

Paul

Wow! Paul, that's really cool. I think we should dub you:

The Official Guide to Using and Navigating ESMB - The Mr Make Life Easier Guy

You are so smart.

 

[RogerB]

Originally Posted by RogerB View Post
FoTi, my Dear,

My records show I sent you the "Unpleasant Sensation Handling" in an email dated February 13 . . . . dig it out. Though it is on this board, it'd take me a bit of hunting to locate it.

This one is on my dining room table. I don't have to dig it out. Are you feeling short with me?

Maybe I wasn't clear on what I was asking. It was the other 2, below, that I was asking about. Thanks for those links. I'll make a file for them so that I have them on hand.

Here is the Basic Chronic Mood Handling:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthrea...304#post439304

Here is the "Thoughts are Things" R/D
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthrea...687#post438687

Rog

Thanks again for taking the time to put the links here, so that I can find them.

F,

You asked "Are you feeling short with me?"

Hell no It's just my "to the point" simple communication style. That and me running on to the next thing I have to deal with.

Good to see you getting on with using some tech to lift yourself. You're in for some wins!

Rog

 

[FoTi]

Thanks FoTi, as Roger said, its empowering to be duplicated by good people and you are one and you did! I am so happy for you that Roger is working with you and the processes you are runing are biting! Roger's assessment of your potential gains, etc. is extremely encouraging; also, his actions speak louder than words as to his motives.

Yes, I agree. Roger is very good at what he does.

About Hector, he is not retired and he still works but I have no idea what he does. The three conversations I have had with him, we just start discussing the old days and various people we mutually knew and he usually brings me up to date on them. I will PM you his contact information and you can contact him directly.

Thanks for the info. I emailed Hector and asked him to please come to ESMB and join us. I hope he does. I'd love to hear his stories about CC and the SO.

Please give us updates as to how your processing is progressing. Many of us are intensely interested and want to stay abreast of how you are doing.




I'm doing a WHOLE LOT BETTER. I blew off a lot of stuff that night and PMing with a couple of people that night really helped me a lot because I got someone elses viewpoints on some things, which I needed and they let me just talk, shared their thoughts and were there for me....the ESMB Angels. That helped immensely.

I haven't started on the other processing that Roger recommended yet. I'm kind of letting things settle out a bit first. What Roger did, really impinged. Whew! That one is still going....I can feel and see some difference in myself. A lot of that confusion and self inval seems to have disapated. The enemy seems to have retreated, for the moment, anyway.

That guy is really powerful! Knowledge is king and he sure has it.....along with the intention to make life better...what a beautiful combination. You are something else, Roger. Great session. Auditing by posting. How cool. VVWD/FNVGI's.

Commendation sent to Roger B's Ethics File.



How about that word, "abreast"? when it looks as if breast cancer is the next topic up for discussion on the thread.


Lakey

There is your progress report, Lakey.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

... and second, fighting off the temptatioin to break totally and cleanly from Hubbard and sever all ties.

This second "issue" has been "solved" for you. Hubbard's dead. He is simply no longer relevant to the process of moving forward.

Any useful ideas or materials associated with him are useful in themselves, not in their relationship to him. They retain that usefulness. Similarly with those people who remain "fixated" on Hubbard, either "pro" or "con". Their individual "fixations" possess no particular value, either to themselves or others.

Examining what is available for utility to one's self has always been the intelligent way to proceed. What is valuable in this proceeding is the data itself. Those who claim authorship become useful as "tags" for organizing or arranging such data, but are not relevant to whether the data so organized is itself useful.

Everyone contributes. That needs to be respected. Not all contributions are necessarily helpful to a given individual facing a specific set of circumstances. Nor can any be completely discounted. Even a "suppressive environment" can prove to have been a valuable learning experience. The horror of the Holocaust lives on in contemporary culture as a warning to complacency over such another destructive excess.


Mark A. Baker

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Much Love to FoTi!

Please think again. I will be 76 next month, I am in a wheelchair, I take 15 medications a day, I only have one breast (masectomy), I am divorced, I am so poor that I have Medicare and Medicade, I can't stop smoking, I am over weight, I live in subsidized Senior Housing, everyone in my family except for an adopted brother have passed away, and some days I have a shitty attitude.

However, I have a Gratitude Journal and each day I write what I am grateful for. I am grateful that although 76 my mind is as sharp as it was at 26. I am grateful that I have an electric wheelchair to zip around in. I am grateful that there are meds to handle my physical problems. I am grateful that the doctor found the cancer in my breast and I only lost a breast and not my life. I am grateful that I was aware enough to divorce my last husband 29 years ago and find I survive much better on my own. I am grateful for the Social Security I paid into many years and the programs that allow me to handle my illnesses. I am grateful for the cigarettes and the and the effects they have on me. Maybe one day I will stop being grateful for them and stop smoking. I am grateful that I have good stuff to eat like chocolate and peach pie and I am overweight not obese. I am grateful that I live with people my own age who recognize an old song when I hum it, and mostly are wise with wisdom that comes from experience. I am grateful that I had the parents and sisters for the many years they were with me and that I know I will see them again. I am even grateful for my adopted brother, even if we don't get along all that well. At least he married a wonderful woman who is my angel and helps me in many ways. I am even grateful for the days I have a shitty attitude because I am reminded that an attitude is the easiest thing to change. Most of all I am gratefull for Gods' love and amazing grace and know without these I would be a basket case.

FoTi, please, re-asses your situation and look for things you are grateful for. I think you will find your blessings.

Love and Light
Pat

And let me add that I dearly LOVE Aunt Pat and have always enjoyed so much her postings on the board...I have already adopted her as MY Aunt Pat! She is a very loving, compassionate, wise and spiritual being whose light shines forth brightly for all who can see. I'd take her advice, FoTi! Go eat some peach pie and savor every bite!

FoTi, NOBODY is going to kick you off this thread, trust me! I may be the welcome wagon, but I am also a very fierce protector! Your viewpoints will shift, and things will get better...just keep hanging out here with us for a while longer, and you'll see and experience it for yourself! Please trust me on this.

Lakey and Carmelo and I are ALL postulating success and a flourishing and thriving life of freedom for all of our readers and posters on this thread...even the lurkers still trapped.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

What might have been?

I think that LRH's great fear was of Scientologists bonding together in groups, if those groups were things he did not control utterly.

Enthetan, I think I (and many others) witnessed proof of this this firsthand with the Mission takeover of the 80's. The history of Scientology might have been much more successful if the RTC had not been formed and this action (the Mission takeover) had not been allowed by the parishioners at the time. Oh well.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I remember, in 6th grade, being able to turn to the exact page in the dictionary of the word I was looking for.

(Pssst! I still do this, for passages I need to quote, etc. )

 

[EP - Ethics Particle]

For FoTi and more...

...snip...

Lakey and Carmelo and I are ALL postulating success and a flourishing and thriving life of freedom for all of our readers and posters on this thread...even the lurkers still trapped.

This old ethics particle is tuned in to the same wavelengths and sending positive postulates too!

There must be many more EPs out there contributing to the processes. :wink2:

EP

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Ah, Paul, you are so fast and on the ball it is amazing . . . . do you have some sort of system that flashes to you the need of us of your wisdom each instant?

Thanks. I was pedantically going through my posts history to find stuff

Rog

Yes, he has his native intelligence (which is CONSIDERABLE!) and his spiritual teammates! I think they are often tickling him on his ears when he shows up to help us when we need it! Dear Dully!

 

[SweetnessandLight]

A full refund as a nest egg to go on with...

Yes, Roger, you call our attention to, state and summarize this very important point which is common to virtually everyone on this thread. What you say is perfectly stated,

I am working on handling two issues, first, the lost opportunities caused by it which may or may not be recoverable and second, fighting off the temptatioin to break totally and cleanly from Hubbard and sever all ties.

On the first count, I went half a lifetime under Hubbard's spell. There were many lost opportunities. If there was more time in a lifetime, many of those opportunities could definitely be recovered but due to the limited life span we have many of them will have to wait for another lifetime and a fresh start.

On the second count, Hubbard is one of those persons who it is hard to totally disconnect from because of the dichotomies of his personality. I would like to just dump him in the trash can as Helluva Hoax has done but I can not in good conscience do so. He still must be acknowledged and honored for the good things he has done. He helped a lot of people and organized and packaged a lot of important data and presented it to the world. Though it is not the end all and final word in all cases as he asserted, it still provides the basis for further study and research by other reearchers in the field as Alan was and you are.
Lakey

Lakey, I still would like to see you get to the point eventually where you will feel comfortable and entitled to ask for a refund of your money, and feel that it is owed to you as recompense for the other things that you cannot get back! I will probably keep bringing this up once every six months or so for the rest of your lifetime! I have witnessed so much good growth and change in you during the past year... Keep up the good work!

FoTi, I don't know how much you paid for services, processing or training, or "donated" to various COS fundraisers, but a potential solution to some of your issues might be for you to ask for a refund, too! There are threads here with how to advice and helpful people who have done it successfully.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Just a thought, worth trying!

Lakey, I love this post. It's really great.....from beginning to end.

It's wonderful. I really enjoyed reading this.

I wish you could get Hector to come over here on this board. He was my favorite reg. He never put any pressure on me in any way. He just sort of sat behind his desk, and we'd postulate what I wanted, and we'd fill out these phoney postulate checks and then things just began to happen and I'd showed up with the money shortly after that. It was kind of amazing to me. I thought Hector was really cool. I also thought the SO was stupid when they got rid of him. He was a real asset to CC, in my estimation. He was always really nice to me. What is he doing these days, anyway?

Honey, maybe YOU can get Hector to come on the board with us...that would be a big win! Why not get into comm with him and invite him? He likely would value hearing your positive recollections of him! We all need validation from time to time!

 

[FoTi]

And let me add that I dearly LOVE Aunt Pat and have always enjoyed so much her postings on the board...I have already adopted her as MY Aunt Pat! She is a very loving, compassionate, wise and spiritual being whose light shines forth brightly for all who can see. I'd take her advice, FoTi! Go eat some peach pie and savor every bite!

FoTi, NOBODY is going to kick you off this thread, trust me! I may be the welcome wagon, but I am also a very fierce protector! Your viewpoints will shift, and things will get better...just keep hanging out here with us for a while longer, and you'll see and experience it for yourself! Please trust me on this.

Lakey and Carmelo and I are ALL postulating success and a flourishing and thriving life of freedom for all of our readers and posters on this thread...even the lurkers still trapped.

Thanks SandL

 

[lkwdblds]

You missed my point about severing all ties.

This second "issue" has been "solved" for you. Hubbard's dead. He is simply no longer relevant to the process of moving forward.

Any useful ideas or materials associated with him are useful in themselves, not in their relationship to him. They retain that usefulness. Similarly with those people who remain "fixated" on Hubbard, either "pro" or "con". Their individual "fixations" possess no particular value, either to themselves or others.

Examining what is available for utility to one's self has always been the intelligent way to proceed. What is valuable in this proceeding is the data itself. Those who claim authorship become useful as "tags" for organizing or arranging such data, but are not relevant to whether the data so organized is itself useful.

Everyone contributes. That needs to be respected. Not all contributions are necessarily helpful to a given individual facing a specific set of circumstances. Nor can any be completely discounted. Even a "suppressive environment" can prove to have been a valuable learning experience. The horror of the Holocaust lives on in contemporary culture as a warning to complacency over such another destructive excess.


Mark A. Baker

You missed my point about severing all ties. Just because he is dead, that has nothing whatsoever to do with severing ties to him as far as I'm concerned. When he was alive, I never spoke face to face with him and never exchanged any thoughts or ideas with him and he was usually thousands of miles away. Now that his body is dead, and he is not mocking up the LRH valence anymore, I still have many ties with him just as I did before.

When someone is antisocial and I am directly effected, I like to cut all ties and essentially just disconnect from them. The FSM's Wendy and Joanne are two such people. The only thing I am willing to do is to answer "Hi" if they say hello to me but I will not engage in any communication beyond that.

What I mean by severing all ties with LRH is that I would like to just disconnect from him, never bring him up in conversation and just let him go from my thoughts. The way it is now, I do not have that luxury. I say that LRH was a scum bag for lying to us in KSW #1 but I always feel compelled to add that he did things that benefitted a lot of people including myself and that he had brilliance and was not always bad. IT IS HAVING TO ALWAYS ADD THIS DISCLAIMER THAT I OBJECT TO AND WHICH KEEPS A TIE BETWEEN US. Whether he is alive or not has no bearing on me feeling I have to add this disclainer.

I add the disclaimer so that I can communicate with people who still strongly support LRH and I am trying to project that I am viewing him objectively from an unbiased point of view. It is his dichotomies of personality that prevent me from just disconnecting as I have from Wendy and Jo Anne. I hope that clears up for you the point which I was trying to make.
Lakey

 

[FoTi]

FoTi, I don't know how much you paid for services, processing or training, or "donated" to various COS fundraisers, but a potential solution to some of your issues might be for you to ask for a refund, too! There are threads here with how to advice and helpful people who have done it successfully.

I don't think something like this is possible because there is a deadline on how far back you can ask for your money back, isn't there? I don't recall how far from the last service it is. I haven't received any services since 1994.

Also, when they handed me back some of my unused money on account I signed some kind of paper, that I had received everything back. I didn't agree with it, (they screwed around with it so that I got back a whole lot less than was on my account), but I just wanted to get the hell away from them. I had no resources to fight them, and I was alone. So, I just took what they offered, signed their paper, and walked away. At the time, I was afraid of them and I figured, well, at least I got something back, which was better than nothing. I was told I could continue on course at the Tampa Org, if I wanted to, which I didn't. But, I still wasn't sure what was going on and I was thinking maybe all this mess would get cleaned up and things would be put to right again and then maybe I would be able to continue on up the Bridge, so I didn't want to go for the whole refund thing.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

You missed my point about severing all ties. Just because he is dead, that has nothing whatsoever to do with severing ties to him as far as I'm concerned. When he was alive, I never spoke face to face with him and never exchanged any thoughts or idea with him and he was usually thousands of miles away. Now that his body is dead, and he is not mocking up the LRH valence anymore, I still have many ties with him just as I did before.

No. The point is there are no ties. There is nothing to which to be tied. You have a consideration about ties and you view your consideration as a problem for you.

I add the disclaimer so that I can communicate with people who still strongly support LRH and I am trying to project that I am viewing him objectively from an unbiased point of view. It is his dichotomies of personality that prevent me from just disconnecting as I have from Wendy and Jo Anne. I hope that clears up for you the point which I was trying to make.
Lakey

It's no different than it would be were you talking with a fire-breathing Reaganite. You can avoid him. You can talk to him but evade talking about Reagan. You can talk to him about Reagan but only in ways which he can "have". You can talk to him any way you feel like about Reagan accepting the prospect that he won't be able to "have" all your viewpoints, i.e. "be responsible" for his agreement AND disagreement.

It's all a matter of: for what can YOU be responsible (a very powerful process).

The point is to realize that which ever approach YOU choose, is the approach YOU have CHOSEN. You are not responsible for other people's reactions. You are responsible for your own CHOICES and the INTENTION you have underlying those choices.

The power of choice is always yours. That is why you can't escape your responsibility for having chosen.

This ain't a popularity contest unless you choose to consider that it is one. Then it becomes one for YOU and you now have the problem of how to play your new game.

So I repeat, Hubbard is dead. He is no longer a part of any problem.


Mark A. Baker

 

[Ted]

I don't think something like this is possible because there is a deadline on how far back you can ask for your money back, isn't there? I don't recall how far from the last service it is. I haven't received any services since 1994.

Also, when they handed me back some of my unused money on account I signed some kind of paper, that I had received everything back. I didn't agree with it, (they screwed around with it so that I got back a whole lot less than was on my account), but I just wanted to get the hell away from them. I had no resources to fight them, and I was alone. So, I just took what they offered, signed their paper, and walked away. At the time, I was afraid of them and I figured, well, at least I got something back, which was better than nothing. I was told I could continue on course at the Tampa Org, if I wanted to, which I didn't. But, I still wasn't sure what was going on and I was thinking maybe all this mess would get cleaned up and things would be put to right again and then maybe I would be able to continue on up the Bridge, so I didn't want to go for the whole refund thing.

THE Bridge is a trap for a lot of people. My wish for you is that you are able to continue on YOUR Bridge, whatever that happens to be.

 

[Roland ami]

John McMaster and being gay

If John McM was really at least stuck in the win of being JC, or someone similar around that time, he might also have been stuck in that culture - in which only men counted. If you wanted to have a serious emotional relationship, pretty much your only option was to have it with a man. Otherwise it would have been like having one with your dog.

Fortunately things are different nowadays.

Roland

 

[FoTi]

THE Bridge is a trap for a lot of people. My wish for you is that you are able to continue on YOUR Bridge, whatever that happens to be.

Ted, that statement that I made had to do with what was going on in my life back in 2003 or 2004....before I got on the net and found more data on LRH and Scientology and the Bridge. It doesn't apply to now. The subject of that post had to do with getting a refund and I was just trying to explain what my situation and thinking was back then.

I'm not looking for any Bridges these days, but thanks for your wishes. :wink2: