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multixperience

Patron with Honors
and as an addum to the technique 88, it actually violates the scientology axioms from 11 to 20 i guess, as those axioms clearly talk about the subject of devaluating conditions merely by reviewing them, as they are.

So Technique 88 was just a kind of a scale process, processing the aesthetic band (the emotion of love or affinity or better say beaty and enforced beauty) that really could get a being higher, but didnt get the facs erased.

Considering the awareness level of a human new to technology not knowing about his natural abilities, it would be a too steep gradient for him to do.

and to keep in mind the fact, one can erase more incidents by finding a basic one, but for this one has to have enough free considered attention to erase such thing. And in any way Tech 88 can help to get such attention unit amount free, it can be only helpful in erasure of abberation source, and certainly is not supposed to replace the process of incident running.

Anyhow, it can free attention unit in much higher amount and in shorter time, then single incident running. LRH was right in this one...
 

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
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Veda

Sponsor
Veda,

I'm curious about the "white Scientology" and if this have ever been accomplished.

Below is a repost. I've included it to avoid confusion in the minds of Scientologists who think of "White Scientology" as Scientology when its "tech is in," etc., etc.:


Usually, Scientologists can grasp the notion that "Black Scientology" might be used on "Suppressive Persons," but not the idea that Scientology's founder used "Black Scientology" on his own loyal followers. This is difficult to explain to Scientologists, since Scientology (Hubbard's teachings and "applied philosophy") is regarded as a "gift" from Hubbard for their benefit. Yet Scientology, as crafted by Hubbard, is a devious mix of "Black" and "White" Scientology, and this mixture is what makes Scientology a trap.

Currently, about as far as "Independent" and FreeZone" Scientologists can venture is to assert that corporate Scientology's current leader, David Miscavige, uses "Black Scientology." Beyond that, things become foggy for them.

In his confidential writings, Hubbard taught that Scientology's enemies should be subjected to "enemy tactics," and to the various mechanisms of the mind (and "reactive mind"), and Hubbard, in writings and lectures, would sometimes describe these and, on a few occasions (usually at lectures), even warn the wide eyed and eager Scientologists that some evil force (not him of course, but the communists, Nazis, psychiatrists, the "12 bankers," etc.) could use Scientology to enslave - such is "the power the tech," etc. FZ and Indy Scientologists are fond of quoting these warnings. This, while remaining subject to many of the manipulative ideas and methods woven into Scientology by its founder.

L. Ron Hubbard described himself as "Mankind's Greatest Friend," etc., so his writings and comments about "aberrative mechanisms" and "enemy tactics" never came across as a warning about himself. If anything, it made others more inclined to trust him.

For example, in Dianetics, what's "aberrative"? Something that equates to "survival." The "held down 7s" are "aberrative" because they're identified with the person's survival. "Survival," as a "mechanism" becomes "aberrative."

Even in 1950, Dianetics was presented as being a "race with the atomic bomb." The message was plain enough: Dianetics = Survival. No Dianetics = Doom.

And this continued into Scientology. One of many examples: In 1956, Hubbard wrote, "With Man now equipped with weapons sufficient to destroy all Mankind and Earth... The primary race on Earth is... the one being run between Scientology and the atomic bomb."

How many Scientologists read Hubbard's descriptions of Dianetics and Scientology as essential for Mankind's "Survival!" - and their own "Survival" - and thought, "Oh, Ron's using the 'Survival mechanism' to manipulate me" ?

Another example from 1950 Dianetics is the "ally computation." Someone comes out of the blue and helps another person, helps the other person in some way or other. The "help" could be indifferently offered, or insincerely offered, but if the needy person regards it as aiding in his "Survival!" (or well being, or the alleviation of pain or the attainment of pleasure or relief), then (so the theory goes) the "ally" mechanism is in place and in effect. For example, an uncle, who may not be a particularly nice fellow, gets his little nephew a glass of water when that nephew is sick in bed and thirsty. The uncle (in the mind of the little nephew) becomes an "ally," and the uncle become identified with "Survival!"

Now, who would have thought that "Mankind's Greatest Friend," on whom the "Survival!" of Mankind, and the "Survival!" of each person (Scientologists, through Ron's "Bridge") depended, would use the "ally computation" and the "Survival mechanism" in order to deceive, manipulate, and exploit? Nah, that could never happen.

However, it did happen, and not only years later, but sometimes the same day, or previous to Hubbard mentioning a deceptive, manipulative or destructive mechanism or tactic.

But it was disguised, and so wasn't recognized. Hubbard's warnings about the race between Dianetics or/and Scientology and the atomic bomb were regarded by Scientologists as warnings by their, and Mankind's, #1 "ally," L. Ron Hubbard. Who amongst Scientologists suspected? Yet, the warning noted above - from 1956 - was less than a year after Hubbard had published, and distributed, his fake "Russian Psychopolitics textbook" http://warrior.xenu.ca/Brainwashing-front.jpg (which of course denounced Dianetics), a "textbook" that, amongst the haughty "Russian Commie"-sounding rhetoric, and references to psychiatrists practicing lurid sex with their (unconscious) patients, "Pain-Drug-Hypnosis," shock treatment, lobotomies, etc., was a compendium of enemy ("Russian Communist") ideas and practices for "asserting and maintaining dominion over thoughts and loyalties."

From Hubbard's "Russian Textbook":

"The failure of Psychopolitics might well bring about the atomic bombing of the Motherland. The psychopolitical operative must succeed for his success means world peace... The end thoroughly justifies the means."

Even "Survival!" - used to manipulate - was mentioned in the fake "Russian Textbook":

"It is pointed out in many early Russian writings that this is a survival mechanism. It [the "Survival!" mechanism] has already been well and thoroughly used in the survival of Communism."

Hubbard's 1955 "Russian Textbook" was loaded with manipulative and exploitative ideas and practices, many of which were being used on Scientologists themselves - used on them by their "Greatest Friend" and ally, L. Ron Hubbard - ideas and practices which were, ultimately, from the 1960s onward, formally incorporated, by Hubbard, into Scientology doctrine and practice.

Yet, who suspected? Yet, it was right there. And because it was right there it was unthinkable.


Now, to answer your question, since "White Scientology" is essentially a clumsy way of saying "the good stuff" in Scientology, I would say, "yes, on occasion, in isolated spots."
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
This thread has provided some very hardy laughs.

Now if it could morph into a discussion on the great improvements DM has made to all of scn and how he has done so much better than LRH... that would be divinely inspirational.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
E-meters measure something, all right. Skin resistance. And skin resistance does correlate with thoughts and feelings, because your muscles tense or relax, and your sweat glands release moisture, in unconscious reaction to thoughts and feelings.

So up to a point an e-meter could possibly be a genuinely useful tool in therapy. It really can say something about thoughts and feelings. But that does nothing at all towards proving Hubbard's engram theory. The engram theory isn't just that thoughts and feelings have some physical effect or other. Duh: we knew that. I'm typing because my thoughts are having a physical effect on my fingers.

So Hubbard doesn't deserve any credit for the fact that an e-meter needle swings when you get pinched, and again when you remember the pinch. If you know anything much about electricity, biology, and psychology, then you already know that the needle will do that. So that pinch test schtick is just a clever bit of BS to suck people in, because it looks really flashy to anyone who doesn't know much about electricity, biology, or psychology. But it really doesn't do anything at all to support Scientology.

Hubbard's engram theory is a particular simple notion that certain traumatic memories behave in a certain simple way. The only attempts I know of at testing this theory have found it to be clearly false.

Note that meters are used by some mainstream therapists, and the the pioneer in this was Carl Jung, who also pioneered the use of lists to
find areas of mental charge. [ LRH stole from the best. :) ] This website below is interesting as it links Jung's research to that of Volnay Mathison
who invented the E-meter.

Can you give details of the testing of engram theory?



http://corrosion-doctors.org/Definitions/galvanic-skin-response.htm

"One of the first references describing the use of GSR instruments in psychoanalysis is in the book by Carl Gustav Jung, entitled "Studies in Word Analysis", published in 1906. Here the Swiss psychologist describes a technique of connecting the subject, via hand-electrodes, to an instrument measuring changes in the resistance of the skin. Words on a list were read out to the subject one by one. If a word on this list was emotionally charged, there was a change in body resistance causing a deflection of the needle of the galvanometer. (reference)
Voltage effects on humans

Any words which evoked a larger than usual response on the meter were assumed to be indicators of possible areas of conflict in the patient, and these areas were then explored in more detail with the subject in session. Jung used observed deflections on the meter as a monitoring device to aid his own judgment in determining which particular lines of enquiry were most likely to be fruitful with each subject." [snip]
 

Jachs

Gold Meritorious Patron
Below is a repost. I've included it to avoid confusion in the minds of Scientologists who think of "White Scientology" as Scientology when its "tech is in," etc., etc.:


Usually, Scientologists can grasp the notion that "Black Scientology" might be used on "Suppressive Persons," but not the idea that Scientology's founder used "Black Scientology" on his own loyal followers. This is difficult to explain to Scientologists, since Scientology (Hubbard's teachings and "applied philosophy") is regarded as a "gift" from Hubbard for their benefit. Yet Scientology, as crafted by Hubbard, is a devious mix of "Black" and "White" Scientology, and this mixture is what makes Scientology a trap.

Currently, about as far as "Independent" and FreeZone" Scientologists can venture is to assert that corporate Scientology's current leader, David Miscavige, uses "Black Scientology." Beyond that, things become foggy for them.

L. Ron Hubbard described himself as "Mankind's Greatest Friend," etc.,

Yet, who suspected? Yet, it was right there. And because it was right there it was unthinkable.

Now, to answer your question, since "White Scientology" is essentially a clumsy way of saying "the good stuff" in Scientology, I would say, "yes, on occasion, in isolated spots."

Great post Veda, if you were to sum up the tactics used by the ALLY Ron Would you say he used fear of by:
Indicating ...an enemy & using the Desire , Inhihit and Enforce buttons with fear.

You desire "survival", but in Desiring to live in the game called scientology,there are rules (indoctrination),upon entering $cio you may reject these rules, but gradiently your own views are inhibited "corrected" and $cio realities Enforced.

The $cio Reactive selling technique first came to mind reading your post as a black technique used on public ,using the above Desire Inhibit Enforce buttons,

Survival is desired,a course/auditing is offered to "handle" the opposition to survival "the Problem", the public cant afford the solution (as it creates a another problem-debt) and it is not interested, so the salesman keeps Inhibiting the person forgetting about it by enforcing the person there to stay there in that seat and listen and enforcing over and over the benefits, it instills a "desire" thereafter, which is not a desire at all taken at your own conscious decision but a Compulsion laid in, you have just been implanted with anothers desire,(not enlightened) thankyou where is your credit card.

I believe its these three buttons Desire Inhibit Enforce used with fear of_________creating duress that are the core Black technique employed in the Indoctrination or instilling thought patterns where you are a robot.You believe you are evaluating but it is not this way and it is above your awareness to see it.

on any dynamic on any subject this is the control mechanism to maintain obedience like a salivating dog.This is the Implanting or cloning for survival.

look at every point where your own efforts were opposed, your own decisions overided.Wherever there was not an invitation to Choose.

Choice and seeking reason freely without fear of, freely communicating, that is sane.

The above buttons apply to Sea Org recruitment, reg cycles,IAS,Ideal Org, Loaded fear doctrine KSW1,the justice codes, disconnection(what do you desire more and enforce it), you what will you inhibit what will you enforce on yourself in the name of suvival.
You get what you resist you get what you fear.

desire to not=Fear: of going against the codes
of not being a productive part of the group
of not contributing enough $ time
of disconnection
of finding out your secrets
of communicating incorrectly
of affinities for that other than the group
of realities not a part of the group
of not being sane(not being 100% in line with group think-what Ron says)you inhibit

There are few good enforcements or inhibits that are sane.
 
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Student of Trinity

Silver Meritorious Patron
Very interesting that Jung figured this out. And used as he used it, I expect it may sometimes be worthwhile.

The only published scientific study of engram theory that I know is the one posted on Lermanet. It was just a single small experiment, but it seems to me to have been pretty well done. There has otherwise been a huge amount of research on memory, of course. Though I know that much, I don't actually know much of what has been determined, except something about the hippocampus, which (ironically) I mostly forget. I don't think any of this research has taken any cues from Hubbard, though. And if Hubbard were at all right, you'd really think that memory research would have turned up at least some of his ideas independently by now.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Very interesting that Jung figured this out. And used as he used it, I expect it may sometimes be worthwhile.

The only published scientific study of engram theory that I know is the one posted on Lermanet. It was just a single small experiment, but it seems to me to have been pretty well done. There has otherwise been a huge amount of research on memory, of course. Though I know that much, I don't actually know much of what has been determined, except something about the hippocampus, which (ironically) I mostly forget. I don't think any of this research has taken any cues from Hubbard, though. And if Hubbard were at all right, you'd really think that memory research would have turned up at least some of his ideas independently by now.

OK. Read that before . More comment tomorrow. Its late here.
 

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
Seems pretty clear to me . . .

dianetics-clinical-trial-04.jpg

. . . nothing has changed since which is why science has had no time for Scientology for 50 years.
 

Mystic

Crusader
Everyone knows that in 75 hours of 8-80 processing you will attain Clear Theta Clear. Turn it white turn it white turn it white skrawwk skrawwk pftttttt.
 

multixperience

Patron with Honors
Everyone knows that in 75 hours of 8-80 processing you will attain Clear Theta Clear. Turn it white turn it white turn it white skrawwk skrawwk pftttttt.

I have to correct this.

Technique 8-80 was introduced when LRH realised (didnt need to be him exactly) that a being acts as a mirror and so does record mental image pictures.

He got this theory of aesthetics to be a beauty wave and that aesthetics would lose up all the effort in a facsimile. While writing this book, he found it to be more usefull on the electrical incidents on the time track of the being having the concept that "running out" the aesthetic band will lose up actually all the effort and emotion of that electronic incidents.

The truth is, that aesthetics is merely a high wave band of energy that can shutter the effort or any lower band energy.

From this one theory, and by application of this theory he (or somebody) meanwhile found, that a CONCEPT is also a high wave thought. He found some basic concepts that do lose up electronic incidents and such process is quiet tough cause it goes through the enforced concepts at the electronic incidents, restimulating them. Doing right this concept running in combination of Black and White one could possible run those electronic incidents right there.

The point is the awareness level of the person. Actually there is no electronic incidents anywhere. The being, trying to find an electronic incidents in his past, actually puts it there himself. Sure the charge of it is hanging around him. But the picture must be created to review it, so one can erase it.

Technique 8-80 is higher awareness level running procedure. It wasnt supposed to replace Incident running, as one should first have a glance of his own time track, before one would be able to "recall" it for running concept processing on it.

Later on he realised the "beauty wave" had one basic thing in it that could be used in other procesess, and that would be the admiration. Its the same thing, with the correct name for it.

Getting back again and reviewing the whole tech, he gave the phoenix lectures, where you can find a lot of admiration stuff. (actually evolved from Black and White)

But if i can give you an advice. Dont think of this time stuff, like 75 hours and all is gone. By putting the time there, thoughts get quiet tougher.
 

Veda

Sponsor
One big difference was that Jung was honest, and Hubbard was not.

IMO, meters can be useful, to a limited extent, as stress detectors. In a manipulative environment, or a manipulative system, they can - and are - used to trick and exploit.

It would have been interesting to read Hubbard's mind - in the early 1950s - while he watched the audience going 'Ooh!" and "Ah!" when demonstrations were being made with the Mathison meter using a projector to display the needle swing - as a shadow - on a screen.

"This is a cold blooded and factual account of your last sixty trillion years."

P.T. Barnum.

As he did with so many other things in Scientology that have a (limited) benign or positive aspect, Hubbard used e-meters, not only in a positive way, but also to deceive, manipulate, control, and dominate.

For example, in confidential "upper level" materials, Hubbard describes ancient implants; he provides suggestive "instructions" about what will happen, or what the person will see, presents dire warnings about this or that - while the solo auditor is watching the dial of his meter that (despite PR denials) is being used as a truth detector. Further on, the person is told he's infested with what Hubbard called "body thetans." "Body thetans" that, unless "blown," will drag him down the "dwindling spiral" into a hell worse than any envisioned by any religion.

Hubbard, through the materials, explains that what he's telling the solo auditor may seem unreal to the solo auditor, but once the solo auditor has watched enough needle swings (reactions), well, then that unreality with disappear.

And before even arriving "in session' for their "Hubbard Guidance," Scientologists will have read, and read many times, these words (which are taken quite seriously despite PR assurances that "Scientologist think for themselves."):

"The whole agonized future of this planet, every, Man, Woman, and Child on it, and you own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology.

"This is a deadly serious activity."

That's a toxic mind game, not enlightenment.
 

Veda

Sponsor
I have to correct this.

Technique 8-80 was introduced when LRH realised (didnt need to be him exactly) that a being acts as a mirror and so does record mental image pictures.

He got this theory of aesthetics to be a beauty wave and that aesthetics would lose up all the effort in a facsimile. While writing this book, he found it to be more usefull on the electrical incidents on the time track of the being having the concept that "running out" the aesthetic band will lose up actually all the effort and emotion of that electronic incidents.

-snip-

Hey, multixperince, did you do any auditing today, or are you still just listening to your Hubbard lectures?
 

Jachs

Gold Meritorious Patron
Snip..

"The whole agonized future of this planet, every, Man, Woman, and Child on it, and you own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology.

"This is a deadly serious activity."

That's a toxic mind game, not enlightenment.

Yes , instills fear to the core...
 

multixperience

Patron with Honors
Hey, multixperince, did you do any auditing today, or are you still just listening to your Hubbard lectures?

Hi Veda

I am not listening to the Hubbard lectures. Reviewing written materials. Doing som mental excer. and looking at things.

I dont think that it would be beneficial for you to degrade my activitie in a way of "or are you just listening..."

I am sure if one would listen to something in the real way, would be in very good shape.

Maybe Veda, others are flapping on the fact that are JUST LISTENING, not looking.

Would you agree with this with me, or at least a part of it?

Wouldnt you like to become my data evaluator?
 

Veda

Sponsor
Hi Veda

I am not listening to the Hubbard lectures. Reviewing written materials. Doing som mental excer. and looking at things.

-snip-

OK.

As I recall, Technique 88 is discussed in recorded lectures from around early '52, and also, briefly, in Tech Volume #1, and, perhaps, briefly, in the book, 'History of Man'.

8-80 is a book, and it appears that you're reading the book 'Scientology 8-80'.

It does seem like pretty cool stuff doesn't it?
 
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