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There is something about Indie Scientology that is very telling.
The refusal of most Independents to speak about certain subjects openly and honestly.
That doesn't sound very independent to me.
Why would a great religion or reform movement have so little to say about matters of such great importance about their beliefs.
When certain troubling questions come up, Indies tend to:
Not saying what they really believe is more than reminiscent of Scientology not telling new public exactly how much their Bridge is going to cost nor even hinting that after attaining the supernatural state of Clear, they will be at "great risk" unless they spend the next decade or so hunting and eliminating invisible space aliens.
From time to time I have posed questions for Indies--exactly as I have posed questions in real life to Scientologists. I am simply not getting any answers.
Here is a new idea. Like the children's game "20 Questions", I thought a cool list could be put together for Independent Scientologists.
If they are who they say they are, they should not only be WILLING to answer the questions but they should be most HAPPY to respond. Why wouldn't someone want to share their religion or philosophy-especially Scientologist (Indie or otherwise) who supports Ron's goal of clearing the planet?
I will list out the first questions that come to mind. Maybe if some of the knowledgeable people on ESMB find it interesting, a lot of better questions can be formulated.
Ultimately, I think the best of the best should be formulated into one list of 20 Questions.
And that list of questions should be offered to any and all Indie Scientologists to talk about their religion.
If they answer, I think it will be quite illuminating.
If they don't answer, I think that will be equally illuminating.
I will personally send the first two questionnaires to Marty and Mike. I am guessing that they will not post it on their website. Nor answer me personally. It is almost assuredly going to viewed as "natter" or "entheta" or "low toned" or "hateful" or even "suppressive". But, I am ready to be very pleasantly surprised if they wish to answer.
Before starting the list, it seems remarkable to me that simple questions like these pose such a threat to Indie Scientologists that they refuse to answer--or more likely, even think about why they don't want to answer it.
SUGGESTED QUESTIONS:
1. If an individual commits serious felonies but is not caught by authorities, do you nonetheless consider that person to be a criminal?
2. Do you think that L. Ron Hubbard was a criminal?
3. Can you list the crimes (that you are aware of) that Ron committed or caused others to commit?
4. Can a person be both a high level Operating Thetan and a criminal at the same time? Explain why you feel that way.
5. Do you think that anyone has achieved the state of Clear as defined in DMSMH? Have you? Why do you think Clear is or is not a true and attainable state?
6. Do you think that Ron or you or anyone else ever achieved the state of Operating Thetan, capable of operating outside of a body as described in the basic books of the 1950's? Can you or anyone you know stably be exterior with perception?
7. Do you think the Fair Game Policies that Ron wrote are anti-social (suppressive), per the PTS/SP tech? Please explain.
8. Do you think that all of Ron's tech is 100% correct and works? Would you cancel any of it? How about KSW, would you make all Scientologists study and apply that?
9. Are there policies and tech and admin that Ron wrote which you as an Independent do not think should be followed? Can you list out specifically what you think should be canceled?
10. Are you aware of the story of Ron and Paulette Cooper (Operation Freakout)? How about Ron and Mary Sue Hubbard? (Operation Snow White) If not, would you like to know the details of what Ron, the founder of your church, did? If not, why not?
11. If Ron was a high level Operating Thetan with the tech and the advanced abilities to make it go right, why was he forced to resort to criminal behavior with Paulette and Mary Sue in order to get his product?
12. Are there things that Ron said about gains from doing the Bridge that you don't think are true? Do you literally believe all of the OT abilities Ron claims to have or claims that a Scientologist will attain by doing the Bridge? Please explain.
...13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20.
GOT QUESTIONS?
Honestly, if the questions are simple and direct, it will be quite obvious that they are not being answered when the Indie responds with things like "Hey, Ron has been dead 25 years."
If Marty Rathbun (or others) are truly decent and honest leaders of a decent and honest movement, they should have no trouble whatsoever publishing their beliefs.
If they can't say what they think, exactly, they are not "independent" but fully "dependent" on the cult of Scientology.
There is something about Indie Scientology that is very telling.
The refusal of most Independents to speak about certain subjects openly and honestly.
That doesn't sound very independent to me.
Why would a great religion or reform movement have so little to say about matters of such great importance about their beliefs.
When certain troubling questions come up, Indies tend to:
A) Not answer directly.
B) Ignore the question entirely.
C) Not answer truthfully with regard to indisputable facts.
D) Change the subject.
E) Spin the facts with acceptable truths, shore stories or lies.
B) Ignore the question entirely.
C) Not answer truthfully with regard to indisputable facts.
D) Change the subject.
E) Spin the facts with acceptable truths, shore stories or lies.
Not saying what they really believe is more than reminiscent of Scientology not telling new public exactly how much their Bridge is going to cost nor even hinting that after attaining the supernatural state of Clear, they will be at "great risk" unless they spend the next decade or so hunting and eliminating invisible space aliens.
From time to time I have posed questions for Indies--exactly as I have posed questions in real life to Scientologists. I am simply not getting any answers.
Here is a new idea. Like the children's game "20 Questions", I thought a cool list could be put together for Independent Scientologists.
If they are who they say they are, they should not only be WILLING to answer the questions but they should be most HAPPY to respond. Why wouldn't someone want to share their religion or philosophy-especially Scientologist (Indie or otherwise) who supports Ron's goal of clearing the planet?
I will list out the first questions that come to mind. Maybe if some of the knowledgeable people on ESMB find it interesting, a lot of better questions can be formulated.
Ultimately, I think the best of the best should be formulated into one list of 20 Questions.
And that list of questions should be offered to any and all Indie Scientologists to talk about their religion.
If they answer, I think it will be quite illuminating.
If they don't answer, I think that will be equally illuminating.
I will personally send the first two questionnaires to Marty and Mike. I am guessing that they will not post it on their website. Nor answer me personally. It is almost assuredly going to viewed as "natter" or "entheta" or "low toned" or "hateful" or even "suppressive". But, I am ready to be very pleasantly surprised if they wish to answer.
Before starting the list, it seems remarkable to me that simple questions like these pose such a threat to Indie Scientologists that they refuse to answer--or more likely, even think about why they don't want to answer it.
SUGGESTED QUESTIONS:
1. If an individual commits serious felonies but is not caught by authorities, do you nonetheless consider that person to be a criminal?
2. Do you think that L. Ron Hubbard was a criminal?
3. Can you list the crimes (that you are aware of) that Ron committed or caused others to commit?
4. Can a person be both a high level Operating Thetan and a criminal at the same time? Explain why you feel that way.
5. Do you think that anyone has achieved the state of Clear as defined in DMSMH? Have you? Why do you think Clear is or is not a true and attainable state?
6. Do you think that Ron or you or anyone else ever achieved the state of Operating Thetan, capable of operating outside of a body as described in the basic books of the 1950's? Can you or anyone you know stably be exterior with perception?
7. Do you think the Fair Game Policies that Ron wrote are anti-social (suppressive), per the PTS/SP tech? Please explain.
8. Do you think that all of Ron's tech is 100% correct and works? Would you cancel any of it? How about KSW, would you make all Scientologists study and apply that?
9. Are there policies and tech and admin that Ron wrote which you as an Independent do not think should be followed? Can you list out specifically what you think should be canceled?
10. Are you aware of the story of Ron and Paulette Cooper (Operation Freakout)? How about Ron and Mary Sue Hubbard? (Operation Snow White) If not, would you like to know the details of what Ron, the founder of your church, did? If not, why not?
11. If Ron was a high level Operating Thetan with the tech and the advanced abilities to make it go right, why was he forced to resort to criminal behavior with Paulette and Mary Sue in order to get his product?
12. Are there things that Ron said about gains from doing the Bridge that you don't think are true? Do you literally believe all of the OT abilities Ron claims to have or claims that a Scientologist will attain by doing the Bridge? Please explain.
...13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20.
GOT QUESTIONS?
Honestly, if the questions are simple and direct, it will be quite obvious that they are not being answered when the Indie responds with things like "Hey, Ron has been dead 25 years."
If Marty Rathbun (or others) are truly decent and honest leaders of a decent and honest movement, they should have no trouble whatsoever publishing their beliefs.
If they can't say what they think, exactly, they are not "independent" but fully "dependent" on the cult of Scientology.
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