Debbie's Interview

[maliauctor]

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2012/02/scientology_wav.php

doing an interview with Tony O

Woo!

 

[TheRealNoUser]

Debbie says: "I feel that this will help the church...hopefully to get it back to its origins, to its original goodness and kindness."

Wow. She is more delusional than I thought. Scientology was never known for "goodness and kindness", even when ol' hubtubs himself was in charge. It has always been about making as much money as possible.

 

[Claire Swazey]

As Emma said before, this lady is still a true believer. (hopefully I've mentioned the correct phrasing)

Cook appears to have no problem at all with all the people whom Flag reges have bankrupted and run roughshod over. She is still interested in the greater glory and magificence, (that she perceives) of Flag and of CofS in general.

So, though I wouldn't do the enemy of my enemy is my friend thing wrt Debbie Cook, I do still think that at present, she's the biggest threat to the cult and I can at least say that's one good thing.

 

[Smurf]

As Emma said before, this lady is still a true believer. (hopefully I've mentioned the correct phrasing)

Cook appears to have no problem at all with all the people whom Flag reges have bankrupted and run roughshod over. She is still interested in the greater glory and magificence, (that she perceives) of Flag and of CofS in general.

Does anyone know the current status of the Scientology lawsuit filed against ex-Scilon Maria Pia Gardini, in Italy?

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?17262-MICHEL-MARIA-PIA-GARDINI-NEEDS-HELP!

http://www.xenutv.com/blog/?cat=174

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1302527953

Remember, Maria testified that Debbie Cook scammed her for a $1 million donation and that Debbie purchased a $40,000 car in 1994 with the FSM commission on that donation.

http://community.freezone-tech.info/karen-class12cs/2011/03/04/debbie-cook-37-years-in-the-sea-org/

I hope Maria subpoenas Debbie as a witness in her case.. she could prove to be very invaluable, and likewise, help Debbie in her own legal woes.

 

[Veda]

It's not surprising that Debbie Cook sees Miscavige as the problem, in an otherwise "wonderful" Scientology, etc. What's somewhat surprising is seeing some who fall prey - if only briefly - to Hubbard's Public Opinion Manipulation Tech.

From L. Ron Hubbard's 'Black Propaganda' 12 January 1972:

"The objective is to be identified as attackers of popularly considered evils [Miscavige&"Miscavology"].This declassifies us from former labels [from creepy Hubbard cultists to likable Hubbard cultists]."

According to Jesse Prince, from 'The ever changing tech of Scientology', written in the year 2000:

"Miscavige is doing his best to forward Command Intention, which is contained in the huge LRH orders database of the INCOMM computer system of Scientology..."

http://www.ezlink.com/~perry/CoS/Theology/jesse.htm


A short excerpt from a 1986 interview of Martin Samuels, former Mission Holder, and founder of the Delphian School, from the 'Reflections' chapter of the book, 'L. Ron Hubbard, Messiah or Madman?'

http://www.amazon.com/reader/0942637577?_encoding=UTF8&ref_=sib_dp_pt:

"Hubbard operated according to a couple of key patterns.

....

"And look at this pattern... He [Hubbard] surrounded himself with absolute hooligans as 'managers'; guys who beat the shit out of people. This man, who 'is this OT, the author of Science of Survival, completely able to predict human behavior', surrounded himself with ruthless people - like Miscavige - who got there because they emulated Hubbard's savagery. They emulated his total willingness to completely break, use, and discard another person.

"And then after their hands were so bloody - and the only reason their hands were bloody was that they were doing what Hubbard wanted - when it finally started to get to the point where it couldn't be tolerated by people anymore, Hubbard wiped them out. Then he said. 'My God! I didn't know!' Scapegoat. He even did that to his own wife, who went to jail in his place..."

It's remarkable that, 25 years after Hubbard's death, scapegoat tech is still being used and still working, with Miscavige being the latest scapegoat.

As bad as Miscavige is, he is not the source of the problem.

I wish Debbie Cook well, and hope for her eventual recovery from L. Ron Hubbard's Scientology. However, I'm not interested in being "handled" by her, or by any other Hubbardite.

 

[Panda Termint]

I don't think many (if any) ESMBers view DM as the "source of the problem", do they? :confused2:

 

[BunnySkull]

According to Jesse Prince, from 'The ever changing tech of Scientology', written in the year 2000:

"Miscavige is doing his best to forward Command Intention, which is contained in the huge LRH orders database of the INCOMM computer system of Scientology..."

http://www.ezlink.com/~perry/CoS/Theology/jesse.htm


"Hubbard operated according to a couple of key patterns.

....

"And look at this pattern... He [Hubbard] surrounded himself with absolute hooligans as 'managers'; guys who beat the shit out of people. This man, who 'is this OT, the author of Science of Survival, completely able to predict human behavior', surrounded himself with ruthless people - like Miscavige - who got there because they emulated Hubbard's savagery. They emulated his total willingness to completely break, use, and discard another person.

"And then after their hands were so bloody - and the only reason their hands were bloody was that they were doing what Hubbard wanted - when it finally started to get to the point where it couldn't be tolerated by people anymore, Hubbard wiped them out. Then he said. 'My God! I didn't know!' Scapegoat. He even did that to his own wife, who went to jail in his place..."

It's remarkable that, 25 years after Hubbard's death, scapegoat tech is still being used and still working, with Miscavige being the latest scapegoat.

As bad as Miscavige is, he is not the source of the problem.


I wish Debbie Cook well, and hope for her eventual recovery from L. Ron Hubbard's Scientology. However, I'm not interested in being "handled" by her, or by any other Hubbardite.

I agree, DM is almost a cartoon villain at this point but he is the result of a young mind being molded by LRH and his tech. He learned to grab power by any means, ruthlessly punish anyone who he viewed as opposing him and due to the paranoia engrained in LRH he views everyone as an SP against him. Because the free flow of information assured the cults decline, and stats have been crashing for years and this makes DM even more crazy because how can that be happening when he is applying the most brilliant tech in the world?? Must be surrounded by SPs...so he applies policy and that leads to 100 people being tortured in the hole and the insanity of INT. If he veered from KSW he might notice the tech is a complete failure, which would mean Hubbard was wrong, which would mean Scio was wrong...and it leads to DMs world and entire worldview crashing, so the insanity continues.

DM is the EP of scientology.

 

[Free to shine]

I don't think many (if any) ESMBers view DM as the "source of the problem", do they? :confused2:

I imagine a great deal of lurkers do.

 

[Panda Termint]

That's true!

 

[Freeminds]

...
It's remarkable that, 25 years after Hubbard's death, scapegoat tech is still being used and still working, with Miscavige being the latest scapegoat.

As bad as Miscavige is, he is not the source of the problem.

I wish Debbie Cook well, and hope for her eventual recovery from L. Ron Hubbard's Scientology. However, I'm not interested in being "handled" by her, or by any other Hubbardite.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Einstein

 

[Veda]

I don't think many (if any) ESMBers view DM as the "source of the problem", do they? :confused2:

The point is that 'wogs" and Exes should not allow themselves be influenced by a Hubbardites use of Hubbard's Public Opinion Manipulation tech. Read Hubbard's 'Black Propaganda' of 12 January 1972. This Tech has been effective. It was effective in Germany with Ursula C., and, to an extent, effective on some "wog" journalists and "scholars."

It has to do with changing our perception of the Hubbardites and, ultimately, our perceptions of their hero and leader, Hubbard.

 

[Panda Termint]

And a perfectly valid point it is too!

 

[Terril park]

Debbie says: "I feel that this will help the church...hopefully to get it back to its origins, to its original goodness and kindness."

Wow. She is more delusional than I thought. Scientology was never known for "goodness and kindness", even when ol' hubtubs himself was in charge. It has always been about making as much money as possible.

I have another opinion. Was in since 1965 or therabouts.

One hung out at the local COS because it was fun! meeting and
interactiong with others.

So yeah, things changed.

 

[Emma]

I don't think many (if any) ESMBers view DM as the "source of the problem", do they? :confused2:

Maybe 2 out of 3000?

 

[Operating DB]

.......

DM is the EP of scientology.

I got a chuckle out of your statement but in fact it is true! Unfortunately it is true for many other victims of the cult.

 

[TheRealNoUser]

I have another opinion. Was in since 1965 or therabouts.

One hung out at the local COS because it was fun! meeting and
interactiong with others.

So yeah, things changed.

They didn't take long to change:
"MAKE MONEY. MAKE MORE MONEY. MAKE OTHER PEOPLE PRODUCE SO AS TO MAKE MORE MONEY."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 9 March 1972, MS OEC 384

and then from before the good ol' days that you remember so fondly:
"The purpose of the suit is to harass and discourage rather than to win. The law can be used very easily to harass, and enough harassment on somebody who is simply on the thin edge anyway, well knowing that he is not authorized, will generally be sufficient to cause his professional decease. If possible, of course, ruin him utterly."
- L. Ron Hubbard, A MANUAL ON THE DISSEMINATION OF MATERIAL, 1955

More happy quotes from Ron here:
http://www.xenu.net/archive/infopack/5.htm

 

[freethinker]

The Scientology that Debbie envisions will not work becasue that is not how Scientology works.

What makes Scientology work is the promise of freedom and supreme spirituality that has not been attained yet in Scientology.

What makes Scientology work is the ethics technology which explains away any reason why it doesn't work and charges you for that as well.

What makes Scientology work is hard sell crush registration that brings in big money for mediocre services at best.

What makes Scientology work is Disconnection and secrecy about not only the tech, but what goes on.

What makes Scientology work is litigation as a weapon.

What makes Scientology work is enemies of Scientology to be handled and having enemies to handle.

What makes Scientology work is staff paid so little that the church can afford to operate paying 20 staff what a normal company pays one.

What makes Scientology work is lying.


Could Debbie do without all that and, more and still have a fucntioning church?

 

[LA SCN]

I agree, DM is almost a cartoon villain at this point but he is the result of a young mind being molded by LRH and his tech. He learned to grab power by any means, ruthlessly punish anyone who he viewed as opposing him and due to the paranoia engrained in LRH he views everyone as an SP against him. Because the free flow of information assured the cults decline, and stats have been crashing for years and this makes DM even more crazy because how can that be happening when he is applying the most brilliant tech in the world?? Must be surrounded by SPs...so he applies policy and that leads to 100 people being tortured in the hole and the insanity of INT. If he veered from KSW he might notice the tech is a complete failure, which would mean Hubbard was wrong, which would mean Scio was wrong...and it leads to DMs world and entire worldview crashing, so the insanity continues.

DM is the EP of scientology.

What you've got to understand about a guy like Miscavige is that he is just another prick bastard sadistic opportunistic SP psychopath who enjoys seeing other people suffer and if possible making other people suffer. It has nothing to do with hubbardism - it would be the same if he was catholic or voodoo practioner.

He was bright enough to see how easy it would be to take over the Cof$, what with him solely sitting on the comm line of the entire church, members and crew, to hubbard. The thug gangster in him awakened date coincident with him carrying the first suitcase full of money to hubbard and realizing how easy would be the pickings and how powerless and hobbled by their beliefs and by the 'I can't believe it' syndrome were the 'sheep' The rest is history.

I think Debbie totally knows this and can play hardball with him and win.

 

[asteroid]

Debbie says: "I feel that this will help the church...hopefully to get it back to its origins, to its original goodness and kindness."

Wow. She is more delusional than I thought. Scientology was never known for "goodness and kindness", even when ol' hubtubs himself was in charge. It has always been about making as much money as possible.

It depends -- when and where.

At the lower levels (both in terms of tech and the administration), it once was a community of people who shared a lot of opinions... not the least of which was that it was possible to make this a better world. I certainly found that to be the case when I was taking courses and getting services in the 70s.

Once I got on staff and later decided to join the Sea Org, I saw something different. But absolutely: The people with whom I interacted on a daily basis were good and kind to one another. And we felt we were making a difference... both in our own lives and for those around us.

You might think ill of LRH or the tech. That's your call; I don't feel that you must see things as I do. (Which is rather a difference from the CofS right there....) But please do recognize that most people get involved because they do see something valuable in it... and that many of us got benefits from it.

And yes: Most of the people I knew were good and kind. They also could be misinformed, frightened, selfish, and the normal range of human things... some of which put them at an opposition to me at the end. But I understood that even when I knew them to be operating on wrong information and thus making lousy decisions, the "ordinary" scientologist had good goals.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

..


There is a very big difference between L. Ron Hubbard and David Miscavich.

LRH only terrorized & brutalized people who did not follow his orders.

COB only terrorized & brutalized people who did not follow his orders.​