trepidatious

[Gadfly]

Only Travolta was silly enough to cash out his celebrity status to do a film written by Hubbard and it was an unqualified disaster, often called "the worst movie ever made".

I was doing training at the Tampa org for my A - E steps for my first SP declare.

I had recently seen the movie, Battlefield Earth, and the students were on break standing around talking. Someone brought up Battlefield Earth. I had to be careful what I said, because I sure as hell couldn't come out all critical when I was on my steps to get undeclared.

But, I couldn't help it.

I suffer from GNMS - Gadfly Noisy Mouth Syndrome.

I formed it into a PR comm using ARC by saying. "while I really liked the book, I mean the book was so extremely great, it was sad that the movie was such a poor rendition of what was a truly fantastic book". Others started talking about it negatively too, but it didn't take long for that cloud of guilt and nervous hysteria to settle in as they got quiet, and self-monitored themselves into silence - lest they commit that horrible Scientology crime and actually say what they REALLY think.

I hated that about involvement with Scientology. All the pretending and taking extreme care to NEVER say what you really were thinkiing.

 

[Gadfly]

Even back in the early 90's there was a must watch on all movies TC. this was not the case for JT. Which was odd to ma at the time. In CST we would have a movie night, fridays. All staff were to attend and watch the movie. It was not that bad as most of the movies he was doing at that time were pretty good.

My son told me a funny story when he was still in the Sea Org.

Flag staff were often herded into the Flag auditorium to watch a Tom Cruise movie. Whoever did the movie selection decided to show Eyes Wide Shut.

I giggled and laughed as my son described the reactions of various staff to the sex scenes (which weren't mild). I could well envision the uncomfortable squirming.

He told me that the guy who chose the movie got into DEEP SHIT.

And, when Nicole looks at Tom in the last line of the movie, with TOTAL TONE 40 INTENTION, says, "Let's Fuck"!



It was one of those "you had to be there to see it" moments.

 

[R6Basic]

I remember reading an article when one of the people involved with Battlefield Earth was interviewed because it received a Razzie for worst film.

He stated that when they started production they kept getting new instructions about camera angles and how to present to plot, etc. etc. Apparently Hubbard had left all kinds of notes about BE if and when it became a movie.

Well, one of Hubbard's OT abilities shows forth from this action. He can screw things up even from beyond the grave.

 

[Gadfly]

I remember reading an article when one of the people involved with Battlefield Earth was interviewed because it received a Razzie for worst film.

He stated that when they started production they kept getting new instructions about camera angles and how to present to plot, etc. etc. Apparently Hubbard had left all kinds of notes about BE if and when it became a movie.

Well, one of Hubbard's OT abilities shows forth from this action. He can screw things up even from beyond the grave.

As I recall Miscavige was ALL OVER the production of the movie. His massive mediocre footprint is in great evidence. These idiots who think that "Scientology Tech" can help anything to be the best that it can be and succeed - what planet are they on? :confused2:

Geez, these people are just so stupid.

Scientology - where the stupid never stops.

 

[afaceinthecrowd]

Re: Happy Trails, Cowboy

Face,

Speaking for myself, and I'm sure a whole lot of other people here, you are very much loved, admired and respected.

You have given this place a whole new dimension of understanding of what all of us, as a collective group, experienced.

You were in the belly of the beast.

And you lived to tell about it.

Please don't ever stop communicating.

You have helped so many more than you'll ever know.

You're one of the folks that has kept me a goin' here, Lulu Belle...Honestly.

From my Heart, Thank You...Thank You So Much.

I Luv's Ya Mucho.

Face

 

[guanoloco]

Battlefield Earth has to be one of the worst books ever written.

Flunk for flop.

 

[Div6]

Battlefield Earth has to be one of the worst books ever written.

Flunk for flop.

I thought the book "wasn't bad", if you had no expectations above a summer reading project. The Scn "Easter Eggs" were kind of funny. Like the movie "Magnolia", it was a bit too long......

 

[Mick Wenlock]

I was doing training at the Tampa org for my A - E steps for my first SP declare.

I had recently seen the movie, Battlefield Earth, and the students were on break standing around talking. Someone brought up Battlefield Earth. I had to be careful what I said, because I sure as hell couldn't come out all critical when I was on my steps to get undeclared.

But, I couldn't help it.

I suffer from GNMS - Gadfly Noisy Mouth Syndrome.

I formed it into a PR comm using ARC by saying. "while I really liked the book, I mean the book was so extremely great, it was sad that the movie was such a poor rendition of what was a truly fantastic book". Others started talking about it negatively too, but it didn't take long for that cloud of guilt and nervous hysteria to settle in as they got quiet, and self-monitored themselves into silence - lest they commit that horrible Scientology crime and actually say what they REALLY think.

I hated that about involvement with Scientology. All the pretending and taking extreme care to NEVER say what you really were thinkiing.

when the book was released Janet Weiland who was PPRO EU at the time had some big staff briefing about it and asked for opinions about the book and I told her I thought it was rubbish and that as sci-fi it was hopelessly dated.

She wrote a report on me - but nothing happened beyond that and I really didn;t care about the report...

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

maybe someone knows if TC has ever done anything at the FLB? I do not recall this ever happening.

He was definitely at Flag - in the Osceolla across the street from the Sand Castle, up in one of the penthouse suites. They delivered it all there to the best of my knowledge. How do I know this - A) I was told that was so by someone there (public I think) B) on a return flight the TSA guy was asking what my meter and brief case were, I asked why, he said cause Tom Cruise went through there earlier in the day and was carrying one. I think maybe he did his OT 6 grad speach there as well. I know he did the OT 5 grad speach at AOLA

Mimsey

 

[Auditor's Toad]

I read battlefield earth while waiting to see an eo at flag... 3 or 4 days to get in to see the eo. That book was in serious need of an editor to cut it down to 20%.

The movie ? I tried several times to watch it. First time I made it two minutes & worked all the way to almost 5 minutes by the 4th attempt.

If BE is the product of ron & $cn ? Enough said. WTF else doe anyone need to know ?

 

[guanoloco]

Getting a film into production is a minor miracle. Each studio literally has HUNDREDS of projects that they have purchased, optioned or invested in the development of which never go into production. Hubbard's REVOLT IN THE STARS did not even get that far.

There was an inordinate amount of baggage that came with that screenplay, not the of which was Hubbard's name. Perhaps of equal weight was the glowing, know-it-all entourage of cult "experts" who claimed to suddenly know all about the movie business and scripts when dealing with industry professionals.

Can you imagine a studio executive (who has spent a lifetime acquiring and honing his/her knowledge, skills and network in the formidably challenging collaborative art form that is motion pictures) being told the "tech" of how the cult wants the movie made by cult members who wouldn't even qualify for the lowest rung of jobs in the studio ecosystem?

Can you even conceive of how their "tone 40 certainty" and "handling" of no-nonsense filmmakers would be perceived?

I was in Scientology at that time and cringed when I heard their unrealistic and authoritative "demands" for how Ron's movie was to be handled. It was a full force tornado of oblivious, self-important clowns running around town trying to use their "intention" to get Ron's orders enforced on people who literally did not give a shit about a wacky, reclusive, megalomaniacal cult messiah who was considered to be a con man and charlatan.

The way Battlefield Earth circumvented that same baggage was by means of John Travolta using up his accumulated good will, leverage and deferring his normal salary, additionally investing $5M of his own funds in a massive failure & loss. There were problems beyond the box-office bomb, critical meltdown and career damage to all involved--when the producer Elie Samaha's less than kosher film financing deal resulted in massive litigation by allegedly defrauded European investors and an FBI probe into his financial dealings.

In any case, Battlefield Earth, although it was produced, was a supremely disastrous loss for everyone involved at every financial, artistic and professional level.

In my opinion, this is what happens when anyone gets too close to the dark gravitational forces of L. Ron Hubbard and his cult of fraud and terrorism.

This really sucks...I was on such a cliff hanger with Episode 1...I'm beginning to think that the rest of BE won't get made...reminds me of Nero, another zero, lamenting for the world at the loss of such a poet as he.

 

[R6Basic]

Before the release of Battlefield Earth (the movie not the book). Our mission holder was so excited. She told us that there were deals for action figures and that it just might be this movie will put Scn. on the map.

Scn. seems to always be chasing after a golden horizon that they never catch.

 

[Gadfly]

Before the release of Battlefield Earth (the movie not the book). Our mission holder was so excited. She told us that there were deals for action figures and that it just might be this movie will put Scn. on the map.

Scn. seems to always be chasing after a golden horizon that they never catch.

Action figures . . . .

Like any kid would want one of those.

 

[Commander Birdsong]

I do not share your rose colored glasses viewing Ron. Did he or did he not have a deaf mute child put in the chain locker? Did he or did he not have a 6 year old child put in the chain locker for falling asleep on duty at 2 AM ? Is the same ron that had a 50 yesr old-ish man push a peanut all the way around the decks of the Apollo his nose bleeding with his wife & children watching..crying. That ron?
Our oredering the overboarding of people who could not swim? Or overyweight people who ron filmed as they struggled ( and were pushed from below ) up the dock ladder from the water ? That ron ?

The rton that wrote the policies you think others may have been mean with ?

ron may have had moments of brilliance but he damn sure had well documented icidents of being cruel... and later deranged.

I look at the list of SPs, Johnny Mac, John Galusha, David Mayo, Karen... I mean THOUSANDs of declared SPs. All of 'em that were right up against this " genius " who did all this " brilliant " work? Some can buy that. To me, this legacy of ron the Great look like bullshit, smells like bullshit, lays there all worthless like bullshit, so, I got to go with it is bullshit.

So he made a contribution to humanity, a bad contribution but still a contribution.

Hey, other have done worse..Hitler & a few others did do a lot worse. The name of L Ron Hubbard wi;; not go down as anything but a delusional con man. History? Nah, he didn't make into history in the terms we think of real historical figures.

sorry i didn't get back to you yesterday AT. i read your post just as my computer time ran out


sort of odd you should choose two of the more overblown charges against ron for your riposte. the first actually isn't serious child abuse. no, i don't like the idea of locking a kid up. thankfully and by the grace of god i wouldn't do it. i don't condone it and if i were in a position to block it i would. still it's not impossible but that is very unlikely to seriously traumatize a kid. it makes the kid pretty uncomfortable but doesn't injure. children are very resilient. once the kid gets out their going to be so happy about it they'll bounce right up the tone scale and leave the moment in the past, a thing they might recall later or might not.

and something else. i doubt many people on this board are truly aware of the astonishing magnitude of the influence of dr. benjamin spock's postwar writing on childrearing on societal standards and attitudes. in the world in which ron was born and raised locking a kid up for a day or two wasn't even considered child abuse

by our current standards which i endorse and practice it is thought to be abuse. it still isn't severe. hey! anyone see the recent documentary on bukowski? that kid got abused. three times a week from the age of five until he was eleven his german father marched him into the bathroom had him drop his pants put his hands on the windowsill and whacked his hindside eight, ten, fourteen times with a leather belt. jesus! you think that's bad? there was a middleaged woman in the office at the cab company where i worked in the nineties and i got to know her driving her home a few times. you wouldn't expect it in a middle class jewish home but her parents beat her badly. the worst incident resulted in 147 stitches in the ER. THAT is serious child abuse.

the guy with the peanut...
i'm not into hazing. that college frat boy crap ain't my style. but although i am not trained and certified as an army DI i am qualified for the task. i am ready willing and able to address a recruit as "maggot" with unrestrained tone 40/one point five TR-1 and smack my right combat boot into his rump if it sticks up while he traverses the low crawl pit. you want to acheive mission objective and bring your men home that's how you train your troops. the peanut with the nose around the deck is an acceptable disciplinary action. the guy was 50 and the usual cutoff age is 45 but if he had no physical infirmity i wouldn't nitpick on that point. you didn't mention that he had to perform in front of his wife and child. in front of his wife is considered a serious violation of the form and in front of his child a gross and highly pejorative violation.

yeah. right on. it is entirely proper to question ron's character and it's meaning in relation to his work.

but...

bottom line...

michealangelo was a pederaast. i'm sure some of my fellow prods would cheerfully wallpaper the ceiling of the sistine chapel but it ain't gonna happen. and though it was kept out of the gossip columns and scansal sheets, our much beloved dulcet voiced crooner bing crosby was a bigtime wifebeater and childbeater. you think that's gonna stop your local DJ from playing "white christmas" 473 times this december?

hey AT, i notice on one of your posts on this thread you were in 25 years. i didn't know that.

please...

if you would be so kind...

tell me...

were you one of our ex-scn kids born in who escaped or did you walk in on your own? public? staff? SO? trained auditor? if so could you give a thumbnail estimate of WDAH? did declare clear?

time short, more later

 

[David Mayo]

No, didn't say that.

 

[TG1]

LOL ... he's back!

Wish you would come by more often, David.

TG1

 

[Auditor's Toad]

<snip>
michealangelo

hubbie was no Micheangelo
<snip>

were you one of our ex-scn kids born in who escaped no
or did you walk in on your own? yes

public? yes

taff? no

SO? no

trained auditor? yes

if so could you give a thumbnail estimate of WDAH? over 6,000 hours

did declare clear?yes, declared NOT attained

Not that those questions particularly needed to be answered.

Putting a child in a chain locker for a few days in not acceptable.
Somebody else did it. So what, still not OK.
Somebody else did worse. So what does make what ron did ok.
Lots of kids had their butts smacked with leather belts, plastic belts, with willow switches, hair brushs, razor strops & who knows what else. What does tha have to do with hubbie putting a child in a chain locker?

Did Hitler order much worse done than hubbie ? Yes.

Please expalin how that lessens the abuse hubbie ordered.
( The answer - if there is one - is going to be ripe ).

 

[Auditor's Toad]

No, didn't say that.

Never got to know Mr Mayo on a personal level. I think he did CS me at flag & I ( as hubdereds of others ) get an R fac & give answers. I had some smart assed answers a time or 2.

My departure was pretty much set with the fiasco at flag when Mr Mayo was declared and I had just gotten onto OT VII.

Brings back memories.....some good......many not so good.

Damn it was long ago !

 

[Commander Birdsong]

I do not share your rose colored glasses viewing Ron. Did he or did he not have a deaf mute child put in the chain locker? Did he or did he not have a 6 year old child put in the chain locker for falling asleep on duty at 2 AM ? Is the same ron that had a 50 yesr old-ish man push a peanut all the way around the decks of the Apollo his nose bleeding with his wife & children watching..crying. That ron?
Our oredering the overboarding of people who could not swim? Or overyweight people who ron filmed as they struggled ( and were pushed from below ) up the dock ladder from the water ? That ron ?

The rton that wrote the policies you think others may have been mean with ?

ron may have had moments of brilliance but he damn sure had well documented icidents of being cruel... and later deranged.

I look at the list of SPs, Johnny Mac, John Galusha, David Mayo, Karen... I mean THOUSANDs of declared SPs. All of 'em that were right up against this " genius " who did all this " brilliant " work? Some can buy that. To me, this legacy of ron the Great look like bullshit, smells like bullshit, lays there all worthless like bullshit, so, I got to go with it is bullshit.

So he made a contribution to humanity, a bad contribution but still a contribution.

Hey, other have done worse..Hitler & a few others did do a lot worse. The name of L Ron Hubbard wi;; not go down as anything but a delusional con man. History? Nah, he didn't make into history in the terms we think of real historical figures.

well AT i don't think i look at ron through "rose-colored glasses" but my writing on this board does leave me open to the charge. i'm very grateful for the work you and so many others are doing. i could not and would not play devil's advocate without it.
i'm especially grateful for the early critics, billy borroughs, johnny mac, hana, bent coryden et al. and extra srecial kudos to gerry armstrong. DAMN! that was a helluva courageous thing to grab those archives. essential, crucial material we might never have had without him. the "affirmations" might have remained buried forever without gerry. i hear the poor bastard has gotten a bit wifty in recent years. i hope he and caroline and doing all right.

moving right along...

no one died from overboarding and a broken collarbone is the only injury i've seen reported. and it was ron who stopped the practice after a pregnant woman was dunked.

TSTO AT i don't buy SP declares. if i did i wouldn't be here.

o yeah...

this looks like a good spot to make a comment on an incident from headley's "blown for good". one night he was one of a group run ragged by some a-hole on a motorbike. WRONG. we run recruits ragged sometimes ourselves. but. we run 'em ragged running right alongside 'em. we are free men and women. they. are tyrants. they run their recruits ragged sitting on motorbikes. and sometimes push comes to tug between us and them. when that happens... we kick. their ass. every time. period.

 

[Commander Birdsong]

And it says a whole lot about those who continue to sing praises of his " accomplishments " !

geez AT...

don't call me a fukkin' asshole

i'm not a fukkin' asshole

i wish some woman of courage beauty and intelligence would turn me into a fukkin' asshole but the sad truth is i'm just an asshole