2 Things I've always wondered...

[Escalus]

1. Every time somebody blows staff one of the things people still inside say is "overts", "withholds", as if that's the only reason someone would leave the group to go into the regular world. But how come nobody says the reason a person is leaving the regular world is because of their "overts" and "withholds" against THAT group? Or do they... cuz if they do that I must have missed that.

ANYway

2. I think if I hear (read) one more person dismiss an argument as just "inval" I'm going to pop a cork. In the first place (that is, seems to me) that THAT is - firstly - the PERFECT invalidation of a comment in itself but, secondly, if an idea or theory is wrong it DESERVES to be invalidated because... uhhh.. it's invalid. God damn it. And this sci-speak about "oh you're just here to invalidate stuff" is really nothing more than the clever antic of the intellectually challenged to prove a claim or show how an argument is wrong.

Yes that was a question. What?

Or am I just showing my 30+ years away from this absurd collection of specious misdirects and asinine hokus pokus known as Sci-Speak?

I think probably yes. But any attempt to explain these things to me will be NOT-IS'D.

 

[Pliny Younger]

1. Every time somebody blows staff one of the things people still inside say is "overts", "withholds", as if that's the only reason someone would leave the group to go into the regular world. But how come nobody says the reason a person is leaving the regular world is because of their "overts" and "withholds" against THAT group? Or do they... cuz if they do that I must have missed that.

ANYway

2. I think if I hear (read) one more person dismiss an argument as just "inval" I'm going to pop a cork. In the first place (that is, seems to me) that THAT is - firstly - the PERFECT invalidation of a comment in itself but, secondly, if an idea or theory is wrong it DESERVES to be invalidated because... uhhh.. it's invalid. God damn it. And this sci-speak about "oh you're just here to invalidate stuff" is really nothing more than the clever antic of the intellectually challenged to prove a claim or show how an argument is wrong.

Yes that was a question. What?

Or am I just showing my 30+ years away from this absurd collection of specious misdirects and asinine hokus pokus known as Sci-Speak?

I think probably yes. But any attempt to explain these things to me will be NOT-IS'D.

You talking to me cupcake?

 

[Escalus]

Hmm... I need a ninja smiley right about here...

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Escalus,

Regarding point one: Should we all have stayed in High School? By leaving, didn't we all technically "blow" high school. You make a good point, by joining the CofS, we did all technically "blow" our prior lifestyle and a lot of us "blew" our families.

And you're right - if a theory is not able to be proved out, then it should be noted as "invalid".

 

[SchwimmelPuckel]

I never spawned the very idea that I 'left' the WOG world actually! - So I never considered what 'overts' that I might have done there..

It's part of the mindfuck methinks.. Actually, it was many years after I left I realized that CofS had 'declared' the WOG world an enemy. While in I thought we were there to do some good.. I still considered myself and CofS belonging to humanity.

Did I consider that I had 'overts' against the scamcult as the 'why' I left that group? - You bet! - I didn't really have to, because all my scio 'freinds' considered it for me.

As far as I'm concerned the 'why of overts' is used solely to make you responsible or guilty when you are not. Just some more mindfuck..

I left CofS because of a lot of issues that were no overts of mine. In fact it turned out that I had to put them in a condition of treason to me! - That was a conclusion I had at the time.

 

[Curiosity]

Hmm... I need a ninja smiley right about here...

At your service!

 

[Escalus]

Pliny - I'll trade you two beers for that stupid plate-maker in the dungeon.

ImOut - I can't regard graduating high school and going into the rest of one's life quite like leaving the real world and going into Scientology. There's something about that equation that just doesn't work. I guess leaving high school is like a natural progression of one's life, where leaving the real world to go into Scientology is not only unnatural but also probably a big mistake.

Schwim - All you're interested in is INVAL! And that's a good thing.

 

[Escalus]

At your service!

GAH!

 

[SchwimmelPuckel]

Schwim - All you're interested in is INVAL! And that's a good thing.

Not so! - I'm interested in volupteous babes too!

 

[Reasonable Lady]

Scientology is full of double standards. If I pull in an attack, I have overts. If the church pulls in an attack, it is because SPs always attack uptone, powerful groups, especially right before a big expansion. Constant carping and complaining about something indicates missed witholds and or similar overts of your own; unless it is Ron's constant natter about psychiatry. The church views everything in black and white, they are the "good guys" so anyone who leaves is the bad guy = overts and witholds.
As far as responding to disagreement as "inval", well, reasoned discussion is not encouraged in the church.

RL

 

[Zinjifar]

Scientology is full of double standards. If I pull in an attack, I have overts. If the church pulls in an attack, it is because SPs always attack uptone, powerful groups, especially right before a big expansion. Constant carping and complaining about something indicates missed witholds and or similar overts of your own; unless it is Ron's constant natter about psychiatry. The church views everything in black and white, they are the "good guys" so anyone who leaves is the bad guy = overts and witholds.
As far as responding to disagreement as "inval", well, reasoned discussion is not encouraged in the church.

RL

The difference between this and hypocricy is that Scientology has 'stable data'.

Once you accept them; everything falls into place.

Zinj

 

[nozeno]

"Scientology is full of double standards. If I pull in an attack, I have overts. If the church pulls in an attack, it is because SPs always attack uptone, powerful groups, especially right before a big expansion. Constant carping and complaining about something indicates missed witholds and or similar overts of your own; unless it is Ron's constant natter about psychiatry. The church views everything in black and white, they are the "good guys" so anyone who leaves is the bad guy = overts and witholds.
As far as responding to disagreement as "inval", well, reasoned discussion is not encouraged in the church."

RL

Oops... too quick, forgot to quote.

Well said Reasonable Lady.

 

[Escalus]

Scientology is full of double standards. If I pull in an attack, I have overts. If the church pulls in an attack, it is because SPs always attack uptone, powerful groups, especially right before a big expansion. Constant carping and complaining about something indicates missed witholds and or similar overts of your own; unless it is Ron's constant natter about psychiatry. The church views everything in black and white, they are the "good guys" so anyone who leaves is the bad guy = overts and witholds.
As far as responding to disagreement as "inval", well, reasoned discussion is not encouraged in the church.

RL

I'm swooning here!

 

[Giuseppe]

ImOut - I can't regard graduating high school and going into the rest of one's life quite like leaving the real world and going into Scientology. There's something about that equation that just doesn't work. I guess leaving high school is like a natural progression of one's life, where leaving the real world to go into Scientology is not only unnatural but also probably a big mistake.

A lot of us who grew up in the SO have never gone to high school. It was either disregarded, or we were encouraged to take the GED. Giuseppe really had a hard time getting employment without HS Diploma or GED.

 

[Marie]

ImOut - I can't regard graduating high school and going into the rest of one's life quite like leaving the real world and going into Scientology. There's something about that equation that just doesn't work. I guess leaving high school is like a natural progression of one's life, where leaving the real world to go into Scientology is not only unnatural but also probably a big mistake.

And some of us started and "blew"... Yes leaving high school is a natural progression, but most of the time it is with a diplomia in hand that is what is required to get a job in real life.. But I got around it by getting a GED and jumping into college classes that way it never really is noticed you did not graduate.

Yes, leaving life to go into Scn is a big mistake but... Here we are, too late to learn from that observation.

 

[johnAnchovie]

Don't...

Escalus, don't even try to reason using Hubbardian illogic, it is a system designed to keep you focused inward, Pavlovian responses are built in over a short period of time in to make you avoid looking at the world with anything else but a Scino view point.

In terms of Scino speak, don't even use it, use English or commonly understood psycology terms, this will help unravel your Scino ingrained thinking, I find it such a freeing experience to disiplin myself to find 'normal' nomencleture for Hubbardian speak, it helps to breakdown the traps Hubbard put there for little old you and me.

The 'blowing due to overts' is a patently obvious trick to make you STAY THERE and not question Hubbard or his political thought police - ethics officers in Scino lingo -

 

[Bea Kiddo]

A lot of us who grew up in the SO have never gone to high school. It was either disregarded, or we were encouraged to take the GED. Giuseppe really had a hard time getting employment without HS Diploma or GED.

GED is really easy to get, dude!! Youe could totally pass... especially with that grammar...

I guess since you are in Italy now, you don't need the GED.

But if you decide to come to the states, look me up. Coffee or beer on me, eh? And I can help you get a stupid GED. Paper is paper in this world...

 

[Bea Kiddo]

So if you were bron into the church, what did you blow from?

 

[Pliny Younger]

Pliny - I'll trade you two beers for that stupid plate-maker in the dungeon.

As long as you drink one and I drink the other.

 

[SchwimmelPuckel]

Hmm.. The scino word 'blow'!?

It means 'desert', as in being a coward in a war deserting you comrades to be killed. It's Hubbard being a dramaqueen about being in his mindbender cult. Likewise conditions where you have 'treason'. CofS is made up like it's in a war condition.

All this is wholly unnecessary for something like a mental therapy like Dianetics & the rest of the 'tech'...

Get a clue from the way Astrology is run!