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Greetings from colorado

Kremnari

New Member
Hello everyone.

I am not an ex-scientologist. I was lucky enough to be poor when I was first introduced to the CoS, and I sought to begin my tech elsewise and did not join the CoS. That was about 6 years ago. I have only recently started doing much of anything, but I am picking up quite a bit of steam.

I am currently looking for people in the northern denver/boulder area who would be interested in running co-auditing courses with me.

Kremnari
 
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Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
Welcome to the board! My dear - you are shopping in the wrong mall!! I suggest you go to "moving up a little higher" by Marty Rathbun! This house hates hubbard, hates the cult of scientology and the tek!

If you like trouble - stick around and tell us how wonderful the tek and hubbard is.

If you are new to scientology - I suggest you read: "going clear" by Lawrence Wright, "Inside Scientology" by Janet Reitman for starters.

Google: Lisa McPherson and look at all of the photos of her after she went CLEAR!!

Google: Maria Pia Gardini - she was OT8 and trained all the way to the top - joined the Sea Org and worked as an auditor for years...see how well she is doing right now.

Google: Theodore Babbitt - click on the link "Scientology litigation" and read the lawsuit currently filed against the Church of scientology - for FRAUD!

Then let us know if you need more information about what Scientology is - and is not. There is enough information on the internet for you too look at and decide if you want to find a co-auditor and audit!!

You have been warned - do not thread lightly my friend...you are entering dangerous waters with your curiosity!! It is a trap!
 

Lurker5

Gold Meritorious Patron
Thank you Idle Morgue. :thumbsup:

And :welcome: Kremnari. :wave: Take heed of the warnings. Read the suggested books. And if you must, go see Marty. Save your Soul/Mind/Body/Freedom - and pocketbook/wallet. Save yourself a tremendous amount of misery and heartache. There are better ways to live. Many better ways. Find another.
 

Mick Wenlock

Admin Emeritus (retired)
Hello everyone.

I am not an ex-scientologist. I was lucky enough to be poor when I was first introduced to the CoS, and I sought to begin my tech elsewise and did not join the CoS. That was about 6 years ago. I have only recently started doing much of anything, but I am picking up quite a bit of steam.

I am currently looking for people in the northern denver/boulder area who would be interested in running co-auditing courses with me.

Kremnari

Oh no, giving Colorado a bad name!! PLease stay near the PRB and avoid eastern Adams at all costs. Thanks.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Hello everyone.

I am not an ex-scientologist. I was lucky enough to be poor when I was first introduced to the CoS, and I sought to begin my tech elsewise and did not join the CoS. That was about 6 years ago. I have only recently started doing much of anything, but I am picking up quite a bit of steam.

I am currently looking for people in the northern denver/boulder area who would be interested in running co-auditing courses with me.

Kremnari

I might be able to find someone.
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
Hi, Kremnari. I'm the one who jumped on you last night.
:)

But still -- welcome to ESMB. I hope you find a good home here.

What somebody earlier said was good advice: Read Lawrence Wright's Going Clear as soon as you possibly can.

Best wishes to you,

TG1
 

Veda

Sponsor
Hello everyone.

I am not an ex-scientologist. I was lucky enough to be poor when I was first introduced to the CoS, and I sought to begin my tech elsewise and did not join the CoS. That was about 6 years ago. I have only recently started doing much of anything, but I am picking up quite a bit of steam.

I am currently looking for people in the northern denver/boulder area who would be interested in running co-auditing courses with me.

Kremnari

Hi Kremnari,

I've read your two posts. Welcome. :)

Do you intend to do the entire Scientology Bridge?

Frankly, I would suggest both of you to gain some knowledge of what Scientology is all about, the Tech not the CoS. While you obviously don't agree with the cult (and none of us here do), most of us would likely attest to the Tech as long as there is no force to use it.

Understanding the basics of ARC (look it up), and being able to recognize it being used, would be the best first step to knowing who has had contact with the tech. The second thing to look for (I am assuming, I haven't had the experience) is someone using ARC in a "salesperson"-like communication. One of the CoS's foci is money, and they want it from you like any good salesperson.

But just because the CoS sucks and has bad PR, doesn't mean the tech is; just as a salesperson can be pushy, but there are cars on his lot that are quality vehicles.


Kremnari

If nothing else, I should share with you that the nature of Scientology auditing tech changes as one goes further into the tech, as one enters the parts of Scientology tech that are "confidential." At that point the tech authoritatively tells the person the contents of his own mind and space. Some feel that this violates the Auditor's Code, and more closely resembles hypnosis than auditing.

Informally, this is called "bait and switch."

Many people on ESMB have experience as auditors and C/Ses. Even former C/S International and Class 12 David Mayo is a member. There are posts on ESMB from two of the earliest Class 8s, who did the course on the ship with Hubbard lecturing in 1968.

Recommend looking into Scientology tech a little more, before you, trustingly, open wide your mind to the parts of the tech that come after the "switch."
 
and a rocky mountain HI! colorado

idle morgue is a good spokesman for many people on this board. as he got tapped for half a mil by CoS/IAS i certainly respect him and his opinions

there are many opinions about ron, the church and the tech here.

if you can do it you might scoot off to elma washington. i understand they do very close to same basic auditot training i received in CoS
 

Kremnari

New Member
Do you intend to do the entire Scientology Bridge?

If nothing else, I should share with you that the nature of Scientology auditing tech changes as one goes further into the tech, as one enters the parts of Scientology tech that are "confidential." At that point the tech authoritatively tells the person the contents of his own mind and space. Some feel that this violates the Auditor's Code, and more closely resembles hypnosis than auditing.

Perhaps, I want to solo asap. I'm working on becoming a Book One Clear, and then doing the grades. As for the higher levels of the bridge, I have acquired the information from several different online sources, and I'd check the content against my own past to see if any of it is even relevant to run. Several groups I've been in contact with have the impression that LRH assumes that most of the events in the upper levels applied to everyone. They also talk about reaching a point where they come up with their own processes for their own cases. This is my goal.

My immediate goals are TRs and M1/M8.

Kremnari
 

Kremnari

New Member
Thank you all for most of your comments. I am aware of the bad PR and criticisms of the CoS and LRH, especially higher on the bridge that require more money. This is why I would rather find a smaller group to work with in my area, and stay away from the church.

I do however agree with most of the lower level stuff, up through the grades. They do seem to make sense, even with a critical eye. As for past the point of 'clear,' I shall reserve judgement until I have made it that far. If it takes me longer doing it myself/with a small group, then so be it.

I have read many of the "reform scientology" and "violations of the tech by the church" kinds of pages, and shall keep their observations in mind as I progress.


Kremnari

P.s. I now have a better understanding of what kind of board this is.
 
Thank you all for most of your comments. I am aware of the bad PR and criticisms of the CoS and LRH, especially higher on the bridge that require more money. This is why I would rather find a smaller group to work with in my area, and stay away from the church. ...

If you find yourself desiring assistance from highly experienced practitioners the Freeman's and the Warren's are well known old timers who are highly thought of freezoner/independents and very nice people also. They work together, although the Freeman's run a facility in eastern Washington (Spokane area) (click the link for their site data). The Warren's are just over the state border from them in western Idaho (Couer d'Alene).

They aren't in your immediate area but they are good people for you to contact should you have questions or desire assistance. I don't happen to have a link to the Warren's site but the Freeman's can easily put you in contact with them if desired.

Also, since you are interested in self-study and co-auditing, I recommend using the Clearbird materials for this purpose. These materials have been developed specifically for the purpose of training and self-study. They fully reflect the ideas embodied in "standard tech" without most of the problems associated with the original hubbard materials. In particular they are much easier to understand and apply having been specifically written for training purposes.

Hubbard's own materials often lack the same degree of clarity or direct applicability. Clearbird systematically covers all the materials required to audit what scientology terms the "lower bridge".

Good luck and Best Wishes.


Mark A. Baker
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
Thank you all for most of your comments. I am aware of the bad PR and criticisms of the CoS and LRH, especially higher on the bridge that require more money. This is why I would rather find a smaller group to work with in my area, and stay away from the church.

I do however agree with most of the lower level stuff, up through the grades. They do seem to make sense, even with a critical eye. As for past the point of 'clear,' I shall reserve judgement until I have made it that far.


Then, unfortunately, you shall reserve judgment for a very, very, very long time. In fact, eternity.

But, if you are like 100% of other Scientologists, you will "attest" to something else other than "Clear" and yet think of yourself as "Clear".

Here's an experiment. Go into Dianetics The Modern Science of Mental Health and copy or photocopy the definition(s) and description(s) of "Clear". Put that piece of paper in your wallet or a secure place. When you are asked if you want to attest to "Clear", pull out that piece of paper and read it. Then, honestly ask yourself if you attained those phenomenal abilities.

If you decide to attest, you will have become a true-believing Scientologist.

On the other hand, if you are honest, you will want to ask some questions about why you did not achieve those. And, if you are really brave, you might want to ask Scientologists if they can introduce you to only one (1) real Clear who has those abilities.

If they tell you the definition of "Clear" has changed, you might want to ask them why the book DMSMH was never changed in that case.

If you are really serious about attaining the abilities of a "Clear" you are going to be sadly disappointed. Hopefully you will not have invested too much of your time, money and dreams in it.

If you are just in it for the status of telling others (and yourself) that you are a "Clear" you will flourish and prosper in Scientology. Kinda.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
That's exciting news:

If you reach the state of Clear, you'll be the first one ever.

Imagine that.



Hilarious!

One of the funniest and truest statements ever made about Clear!

The idea that people are still wanting to believe the hoax called "Clear", after it has been debunked for 63 years and all over the Internet, is simply amazing.

I am a certified "Clear" and therefore a pre-Clear should trust what I am telling them, right? But when I say that "Clear" is a fraud and a hoax that doesn't work, the newbie thinks I am "aberrated" and "dramatizing my reactive mind". LOL.

What a concept! A pre-clear and member of the "I WANT TO GO CLEAR CLUB" who does not trust nor believe Clears. That's not good. LOL.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
If you find yourself desiring assistance from highly experienced practitioners the Freeman's and the Warren's are well known old timers who are highly thought of freezoner/independents and very nice people also. They work together, although the Freeman's run a facility in eastern Washington (Spokane area) (click the link for their site data). The Warren's are just over the state border from them in western Idaho (Couer d'Alene).

They aren't in your immediate area but they are good people for you to contact should you have questions or desire assistance. I don't happen to have a link to the Warren's site but the Freeman's can easily put you in contact with them if desired.

Also, since you are interested in self-study and co-auditing, I recommend using the Clearbird materials for this purpose. These materials have been developed specifically for the purpose of training and self-study. They fully reflect the ideas embodied in "standard tech" without most of the problems associated with the original hubbard materials. In particular they are much easier to understand and apply having been specifically written for training purposes.

Hubbard's own materials often lack the same degree of clarity or direct applicability. Clearbird systematically covers all the materials required to audit what scientology terms the "lower bridge".

Good luck and Best Wishes.


Mark A. Baker


All that supposedly helpful advice. But you fail to inform the guy what will happen when he tries to go "Clear".
 
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programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
Then, unfortunately, you shall reserve judgment for a very, very, very long time. In fact, eternity.

But, if you are like 100% of other Scientologists, you will "attest" to something else other than "Clear" and yet think of yourself as "Clear".

Here's an experiment. Go into Dianetics The Modern Science of Mental Health and copy or photocopy the definition(s) and description(s) of "Clear". Put that piece of paper in your wallet or a secure place. When you are asked if you want to attest to "Clear", pull out that piece of paper and read it. Then, honestly ask yourself if you attained those phenomenal abilities.

If you decide to attest, you will have become a true-believing Scientologist.

On the other hand, if you are honest, you will want to ask some questions about why you did not achieve those. And, if you are really brave, you might want to ask Scientologists if they can introduce you to only one (1) real Clear who has those abilities.

If they tell you the definition of "Clear" has changed, you might want to ask them why the book DMSMH was never changed in that case.

If you are really serious about attaining the abilities of a "Clear" you are going to be sadly disappointed. Hopefully you will not have invested too much of your time, money and dreams in it.

If you are just in it for the status of telling others (and yourself) that you are a "Clear" you will flourish and prosper in Scientology. Kinda.

I am trying to remember the grade chart from the 1970s... wasn't it changed to "Dianetics Release" instead of "Dianetics Clear"?
Or am I wrong about this?
 

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
Hi, Kremnari. I'm the one who jumped on you last night.
:)

But still -- welcome to ESMB. I hope you find a good home here.

What somebody earlier said was good advice: Read Lawrence Wright's Going Clear as soon as you possibly can.

Best wishes to you,

TG1


I would also suggest reading Margery Wakefield's The Road to Xenu: Life Inside Scientology. My feeling is that you are young (she entered in as a college student) and her book details very specifically what happens in many Scientology processes and the consequences. Good luck.
 
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