#3 Person Crippling Scientology - Marty Rathbun

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
I can't agree, Smilla. I'd leave Gerry out of this as he is not a recognized regular poster on the board, or if he is then I have yet to notice that fact. Nor do I have any opposition to any public statements he has made about the church or Hubbard.

However, Veda has repeatedly earned disrespect upon numerous occasions on this board, both for his deliberate distortions of the views & statements of others and the many personal attacks he has launched against others with whom he disagree in an attempt to discredit them or promote his own peculiar conspiracy theories. :eyeroll:

Veda has shown a preference for making arguments 'personal', repeatedly disparaging those he sees as in opposition to himself, rather than simply discussing the facts as they relate to hubbard, the church, and the role of individual board members and their beliefs. That is not a respectful or respectable approach to public discussions with others.

Mark A. Baker

More power to you dude, most of us can't get away with posting that personal an attack on another poster .
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
When the ability to reason is weak, and all else is lost, there's always childish trolling to fall back on.

obvious-troll.jpg
 

anonomog

Gold Meritorious Patron
always need to bear in mind that these two "Heroes of Soviet Labor" were both cowed and intimidated by Miscavige! A man of little intellect and not much stature...

And it seems quite likely that if Miscavige had kept his abusive focus off his executives and on the sanctioned acceptable external enemies, they would both still be there.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
And what conspiracy theories are those?


Hey Veda! Mark already posted the answer to your question, did you miss it?

Originally Posted by Mark Baker
Veda, apparently your intelligence and reading aptitude is far to low to understand my posts, thus I am forced to provide you with as transparent & simplistic an explanation as I am capable. With regard to your conspiracy theories, quite obviously I refer to your posts which remind everyone at ESMB of the Bacchanalia festival held in Greece in 186 BC. As everyone well knows, except you apparently, these rites occurred in the grove of Simila near the Aventine Hill on March 16th, at which the members participated in all manner of political conspiracies at their nocturnal meetings. Veda, do not think for a moment that everyone here at ESMB is not painfully aware of your thinly veiled and sly references to said conspiracies when you post here. Please do not make the mistake of believing that simply because you do not specifically mention the Bacchanalia, we don't know that you are directing our attention to such relevant matters. Now that I have exposed your ludicrous conspiracy theories, please know that all of the other ESMB posters and myself have known all along that you were trying to fixate our attention out of present time on the events of March 16, 186 BC. We have not succumbed to you, Veda, and we never shall. We remain strong against you and your wholetrack theta trapping techniques. Ha! Your conspiracy is foiled! Our freedom brotherhood (and our secret handshake) shall live on for eternity!


Special note: This message from Mark Baker was channeled. He didn't actually type it in the physical universe. But, for sure, he intended me to type it, otherwise I would not have done so.
 
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Hey Veda! Mark already posted the answer to your question, did you miss it?




Special note: This message from Mark Baker was channeled. He didn't actually type it in the physical universe. But, for sure, he intended me to type it, otherwise I would not have done so.

QUote : "...But, for sure, he intended me to type it, otherwise I would not have done so..."

Well, yes, the physical universe cannot be used to explain spiritual phemomena, which means that since there is no proof that he didn't guide your hand, :) in the physical universe, the truth of it as spiritual universe phenomena must be swallowed. It tastes good.
 

Vittorio

Patron Meritorious
Maybe it is me who is mad, but I cannot see what the fascination with Marty Rathbun is.

I'll reiterate a point I made further back; this guy worked with a team of people whose organisation has made some very unhappy and financially destitute people. He was doing this right until 2004, over TWO DECADES after Miscavige took over. And as anonmog says, if Miscavige directed his anger at their common enemies rather than at him/mike personally, they would still be there.

I wish Marty the best for the future and I hope he is able to piece his life together but he doesn't seem to be able to move on from Scientology any time soon and it might be that his whole being is invested in it. It makes me have a great sense of empathy for him, because I feel that there are other lessons to be learnt from life. I would go as far as to say that it is a little sick, taking the deaths of Lisa and many others into account that Marty is being held up as a hero by the very people who he so happily once attacked.

I have been going through a lot of self review this past month and it's been hard to let go of some deeply held ideas and beliefs and that I could be wrong, but I have to say on many occasions I was. I found that the tech of Scientology worked and therefore I accepted for years that Scientology as a whole with all it's management definitions worked; the lot. Now I know that pieces of Scientology work well on individuals and in certain situations, but there is little spiritually to be gained with filling ones head with the subject and nothing else.

Now, I consider myself anything other than a Scientologist. I woke up from what seemed a dreamscape. I realised that I used to defend Scientology against the truth just because of the bits I knew that worked.

Marty is editing difficult and awkard comments/posters at his message board.

I want to move onwards and upwards. I have to face truth no matter how uncomfortable and it cannot be edited. I've faced some awful truths recently and it's been hard. I'd rather make good with someone than try and push them out and avoid them.

The 'best' auditors in the Freezone; attacking critics, endlessy attacking each other as squirrels, suppressing truth and free speech. Not all of them, I've met some good apples as well, but with a belief in reincarnation and the desire to make this world a good place for all people, including the less able, I had to make a decision and not to make links to people who, because of their training can offer me therapy for hundreds/thousands of dollars/pounds, but who seem less OT than non-Scientologists. It's that whole magickal illusion that someone knows something that you don't don't and when the curtain is finally pulled back there is nothing there.

Spiritual freedom, release from pain and suffering are all available but they cannot be purchased. Secrecy and tiered levels of information is not the road out. There is no discussion of the OT levels on Marty's blog. We are living proof that it doesn't kill us when we read it. I'm sure I'm not alone when I say I was told in the Church that 'I knew someone who read it, horrible. He had headaches and died of cancer'.

Scientology was not horrible because of Miscavige alone, but because many people along the line helped keep his regime in place. These people are already leaving the Church and entering the Freezone and will continue to do so, until such a time they are running the show there as well. Marty and Mike are two of those people. What happens when Miscavige leaves? He only has Ron to blame it on. Miscavige is the fall guy for others. Terril is already trying to whitewash Marty's past rather than have him take responsibility for it.

J.Swift, although I disagree with you and you don't seem like the same person who used to post at Clambake (more like two different people), I do think you have the right to change your mind about stuff and make your own decisions which is why I will not personally attack you for supporting Marty.
 

Vittorio

Patron Meritorious
Maybe it is me who is mad, but I cannot see what the fascination with Marty Rathbun is.

I'll reiterate a point I made further back; this guy worked with a team of people whose organisation has made some very unhappy and financially destitute people. He was doing this right until 2004, over TWO DECADES after Miscavige took over. And as anonmog says, if Miscavige directed his anger at their common enemies rather than at them personally, they would still be there.

I wish Marty the best for the future and I hope he is able to piece his life together but he doesn't seem to be able to move on from Scientology any time soon and it might be that his whole being is invested in. It makes me have a great sense of empathy for him, because I feel that there are other lessons to be learnt from life. I would go as far as to say that it is a little sick, taking the deaths of Lisa and many others into account that Marty is being held up as a hero by the very people who he so happily once attacked.

I have been going through a lot of self review this past month and it's been hard to let go of some deeply held ideas and beliefs and that I could be wrong, but I have to say on many occasions I was. I found that the tech of Scientology worked and therefore I accepted for years that Scientology as a whole with all it's management definitions worked; the lot. Now I know that pieces of Scientology work well on individuals and in certain situations, but there is little spiritually to be gained with filling ones head with the subject and nothing else.

Now, I consider myself anything other than a Scientologist. I woke up from what seemed a dreamscape. I realised that I used to defend Scientology against the truth just because of the bits I knew that worked.

Marty is editing difficult and awkard comments/posters at his message board.

I want to move onwards and upwards. I have to face truth no matter how uncomfortable and it cannot be edited. I've faced some awful truths recently and it's been hard. I'd rather make good with someone than try and push them out and avoid them.

The 'best' auditors in the Freezone; attacking critics, endlessy attacking each other as squirrels, suppressing truth and free speech. Not all of them, I've met some good apples as well, but with a belief in reincarnation and the desire to make this world a good place for all people, including the less able, I had to make a decision and not to make links to people who, because of their training can offer me therapy for hundreds/thousands of dollars, pounds, but who seem less OT than non-Scientologists. It's that whole magickal illusion that someone knows something that you don't don't and when the curtain is finally pulled back there is nothing there.

Spiritual freedom, release from pain and suffering are all available but they cannot be purchased. Secrecy and tiered levels of information is not the road out. There is no discussion of the OT levels on Marty's blog. We are living proof that it doesn't kill us when we read it. I'm sure I'm not alone when I say I was told in the Church that 'I knew someone who read it, horrible. He had headaches and died of cancer'.

Scientology was not horrible because of Miscavige alone, but because many people along the line helped keep his regime in place. These people are already leaving the Church and entering the Freezone and will continue to do so, until such a time they are running the show there as well. Marty, Mike are two of those people. What happens when Miscavige leaves? He only has Ron to blame it on.

J.Swift, although I disagree with you and you don't seem like the same person who used to post at Clambake (more like two different people), I do think you have the right to change your mind about stuff and make your own decisions which is why I will not personally attack you for supporting Marty.

Has Marty ever said sorry to anyone who is a critic of Scientology other than maybe Ursula (if he did at all)? Gerry, Arnie, Tory? Or are they still suppressive? Even Terril is banned from his message board! Other Freezoners are disconnected from him.
 
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