A Coup Against Miscavige if Tommy Tells the Truth?

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
I think Tommy and his close family need to sit down in a circle facing each other and do the TR: Truth or Lies for Eternity.

The only materials they need for the drill are playing cards which are marked Truth on one side and False(Lies) on the other side.

They are allowed 10 questions each to the group which have to lay down their cards as a 'vote' as an answer to the questions.

1) Can I name an OT who completely matches the ORIGINAL GRADE CHART DESCRIPTION OF OT ?
2) Can I name a Clear who completely matches the ORIGINAL DESCIPTION OF CLEAR of which LRH said he made in DMSMH ?
3) Did LRH come back after 20 years as promised?
4) Are all the org academies 40 times as full as they were in the mid 1970s?
5) Had psychiatry been eradicated from the face of earth by 2000 as promised by DM?
5) Is TOTAL FREEDOM adequately proven by locking up executives in "The Hole" ?
6) Can they open up and tell DM he has made a mistake and be thanked for the KR?
7) Are they completely free to live life as they want?
8) ----their choice question....here ?
9) Do they wish to enforce ALTER-IS (lying) ON EACH OTHER to ensure their mutual integrity?
10) Do they want the CONDITION of a Dead Man who was hiding from the law and all scientologist to be an omen for their destiny?
11) Do they want to follow or cower to a tiny demented madman who is pretending to be a Pope.
12) Do they want to want to throw off the shackles and bad habits of lying and take back the control of their own lives.

The drill is passed when 12 is a faced up as TRUTH as a MAJOR STABLE WIN:biggrin:

As the second part of the OP Why would anyone even want to take over such a FAIL.:confused2:
 

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
Lest it be forgotten.... and did LRH think of everything to keep his minions in line?

The more that Scn is attacked, the more determined and resolute its members become. They thoroughly believe that the more they are attacked, the better they are doing, because they are getting bigger and better and it is driving the SPs wild with rage! Ridiculous!

So they may feel stronger and more powerful than EVER right now! Phew. It's exhausting being THIS strong and powerful! Wow, lets get some more of that delicious Kool-Aid!!!
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
I got physically beaten up tons of times in the Sea Org. just not by COB. Just in regular duties on my post. There is physical aggression from more than just David M. I stayed on for years after that. It is so normal that in my story, I don't think I talked about it hardly at all.

Lot's of Sea Org members have been subjected to months of sec checking, RPFing, aggressiveness and they still stay on. Or if they do leave, they apologize and try to make good with the group and become public.

The belief that one is doing THE BEST THING for society overrides everything else that has gone on. The bigger purpose.

----

My point is aggression in the Sea Org alone is not something that I think would make the die-hard long-term guys wake up and walk out.

:omg: And this is a 'BRIDGE TO TOTAL FREEDOM"??????:bighug: to you Bea Kiddo ....Fuck:angry:
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
My prediction - there will be a COUP against Miscavige soon even without Tommy Davis squawking.
:wink2:
Here is the clue that Tommy Davis may tell the truth - SCIENTOLOGY'S ATTORNEY'S FILED A MOTION TO NOT LET HIM TESTIFY!!

:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
Tommy Davis BLEW Scientology and moved far, far away! WHY? Doesn't Scientology work? That would be the first question to answer and someone knows. As soon as that "someone" leaves - we will find out.

Tommy Davis has a long decompression to go through. If he "LOOKS" he will heal faster. If he sits on the fringes - he will suffer and never know why.

How was it for Scientologist's who left - and still "believed" but left because of the constant abuse, turmoil, upset and no results....spinning your wheels and nothing gets done!! What were you waiting for? Scientology to get "better and work"??? And nothing changed - ever - just got worse.

My bet - Tommy Davis will not lie and will tell the truth! In order to heal - one must tell the truth. I bet he is LOOKING!!

My other bet - he and Jessica Feshbach are out!
 

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
Surely she was top exec of div 6?

Is this about Diana? She was Div6 Internal Exec Int, which was an Exec Strata post under ED Int Guillume Leserve (not sure of spelling). That was late 80's. Never saw her after that.

Suzette was in CMO - not sure the full name. It was the CMO that was around when the Flag Bureaux (which had an earlier name that escapes me now - I was a child back then) was at the complex on the second floor of main building. There was a wing that was CMO and Suzette worked there. That was around 1985 or 86 I think.

---

Random comment, sorry: I remember a muster where they were showing a gift they were giving to LRH... so it must have been 84 or 83. Suzette was at the muster. It was a set of stirrups made of solid silver and they cost around $6000.00 they were saying. I was like whut?
 

JustSheila

Crusader
Surely she was top exec of div 6?

Yes. Diana was posted as CS 6 by Hubbard on one of the early organizational charts.

I don't know the history as to why, but I know for sure I heard when I was in the SO that LRH put her on this list.

Maybe one of the other old timers may know more.

She was put on the list after she was busted as CS6. I don't know any other details, but that was the last senior exec post she held while L Ron was alive. Any posts afterward was while DM was in charge (see Bea's post).
 
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Lulu Belle

Moonbat
Is this about Diana? She was Div6 Internal Exec Int, which was an Exec Strata post under ED Int Guillume Leserve (not sure of spelling). That was late 80's. Never saw her after that.

Suzette was in CMO - not sure the full name. It was the CMO that was around when the Flag Bureaux (which had an earlier name that escapes me now - I was a child back then) was at the complex on the second floor of main building. There was a wing that was CMO and Suzette worked there. That was around 1985 or 86 I think.

---

Random comment, sorry: I remember a muster where they were showing a gift they were giving to LRH... so it must have been 84 or 83. Suzette was at the muster. It was a set of stirrups made of solid silver and they cost around $6000.00 they were saying. I was like whut?


Diana was DSIEI in the 80s/90s under DM. Word was he put her on that post for "PR reasons", but she actually had no power. I've heard that other people actually sent out telexes, etc. in her name and actually did her job. Don't know how true that is.

I know for sure LRH had her put on the "Never to be an Executive" list because of whatever happened the first time she was one.

Like I said; don't know the details.

Suzette was in CMO PAC in the mid 80s. She was there from at least 1983 until 1984 or so; maybe longer; I don't remember. She married Guy White, they had a baby, they both went uplines, and they left. (Don't know or remember the whole sequence of events.)
 

Out-Ethics

Patron Meritorious
A coup would be sweet but highly unlikely. DM leaves because he has a warrant for his arrest or Scientology has callasped and it's time to live in exile. To have an in-house coup DM would need to be overpowered and house arrested. Would that even be possible at the Int leveoffHow would anybody at Int plan such a event? Who does one trust? After all they practically work around the clock with no time off.

More likely Scientologists outside the SO involved in missions and CL four orgs would splinter off causing some type of civil war. Still believe in the tech Ron but DM is the SP. This nearly happened in the 80s as the SO sent out missionaries to handle disaffected Scios. I know our org execs had considered this.

And even more likely is Co$ is unable to gain new followers. The SO and org staff, public that remain grows old and die from natural causes or other causes. Hubbsard and Scientology fade from memory.
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
I don't know the history as to why, but I know for sure I heard when I was in the SO that LRH put her on this list.

Maybe one of the other old timers may know more.

I realize we are swerving off of the OP but Mike Goldstein of Idenics had some dealings with one of the Hubbard girls in the early 80's perhaps he would have a perspective on what happened.
 

Dave B.

Maximus Ultimus Mostimus
Pretty sure it ain't gonna happen. Only way the dwarf is going out is feet first ala Al Pacino in Scarface. "Say 'ello to my leetle fren."

Which actually would be a good thing. Gunfire would bring in the authorities and we'd have sort of a Jonestown type situation. The Int. clams in seige mode break out their automatic weapons and repel all boarders. Fastest way to have a live TV news event broadcast worldwide as the base burns.

I can only hope.



And yes, they do have automatic weapons. That was what freaked out a relative of mine when he was there. Church? Machine guns? ...'eh?
 
Pretty sure it ain't gonna happen. Only way the dwarf is going out is feet first ala Al Pacino in Scarface. "Say 'ello to my leetle fren."

Which actually would be a good thing. Gunfire would bring in the authorities and we'd have sort of a Jonestown type situation. The Int. clams in seige mode break out their automatic weapons and repel all boarders. Fastest way to have a live TV news event broadcast worldwide as the base burns.

I can only hope.



And yes, they do have automatic weapons. That was what freaked out a relative of mine when he was there. Church? Machine guns? ...'eh?
You're absolutely right unless he decides to leave, die, or is dragged away in handcuffs, he's not going anywhere Miscavige is the legal owner and operator of Scientology, a coup can't happen since all he has to do is call the police and have them removed from his property.
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
I realize we are swerving off of the OP but Mike Goldstein of Idenics had some dealings with one of the Hubbard girls in the early 80's perhaps he would have a perspective on what happened.

Just in case you haven't see this.

"When I completed the evaluation and basic program, Diana flew to Denver and I met her at the airport. She read and approved the program, then got back on a plane and went back to Clearwater. I was now ready to get started on, what would prove to be a very interesting adventure.

"It was now the summer of 1980, and I had Diana Hubbard's approval on my program. As a "special project under Diana", I now had an acceptable identity with the CoS. Someone could ask, "What the hell is that Mike Goldstein doing?" And someone else could say, "Oh, he's working on a special project for Diana Hubbard", and that would be acceptable. Also, if there were any problems, Diana had agreed to run additional "air cover" for me. With the above in place, I could now proceed with getting my Book One program off the ground."


More for the curious: :coolwink:

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part1.htm

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part2.htm

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part3.htm
 

oneonewasaracecar

Gold Meritorious Patron
He who inherits the mantle inherits a world of trouble.
The only workable "solution" is for Ron to return and pick up the reins.
Once scientologists are convinced that the new Ron is the real Ron (and, believe me, scientologists can believe anything if they try hard enough) all else will be possible; tech revision, policy change, practice reform, moral and ethical correction etc.
The CofS needs a Second Coming.
It'll have to be a third coming, around 2026. He came back in 2006, but he was the victim of a forced abortion.

With all Hubbard's ranting about abortion, I'd say he pulled it in, as it were.
 

Good twin

Floater
Yes. :yes: What Blippy said.



L Ron Hubbard had many moments in his career when it came down to ""What To Do When All Else Fails". Read some biographies and it quickly becomes apparent that if there is one constant in his dissolute life it is that of constant reinvention. Wog world came close several times to putting a stop to the fraud. Perhaps the closest was in the late 1970s with the Julie Christofferson-Tichbournes (et al) proceedings which resulted in the massive corporate sort out which was the answer then to "what to do when all else fails". In short, L Ron Hubbard was constantly reactive and always coming up with new policies and changes to serve his circumstances.



L Ron Hubbard's modus operandi has always been draconian and there is nothing David Miscavige has done which is beyond Scientology policy and/or the personal example of L Ron Hubbard. It is true, however, that L Ron Hubbard's tech cannot be dramatically changed. With this in mind, we can probably expect a repeat of what has happened before. In other words, I'm picking David Miscavige to "resign" (but not really) and some numpty put up in his place. Alternatively, David Miscavige and his enablers may well be turfed out and we shall see a return to the fold of all those ousted over the last few years. There are many who labour under the illusion that Scientology would be great if it wasn't for David Miscavige. If that's the case, we might even see a return to the franchise model. Either way, wog world can expect a sustained apology along with claims like "it was a few rotten eggs, we've learned our lessons, we'll do as we're told, come on back, its all been sorted out". Except, as we know from the 1960s, 70s, and 80s, it will simply be a case of "meet the new boss, just like the old boss."

On the other hand, perhaps we will see the end of Scientology as we know it. Surely the primary scam has had its day, I mean Xenu is long out of the bag, perhaps now is the time for its enablers to cash-in. If that's the plan, the less pesky public and idle staff around to get in the way, the better. Might as well drag it out for as long as possible, squeeze the last penny out, and shed as many hangers-on as possible while securing the escape routes. David Miscavige and a few others are "loose ends" and could meet with unfortunate accidents or the perp-walk, probably around about the same time the cash reserves, trademarks, and real estate holdings evaporate into some labyrinthine legal artifice, along with the PC folders, and lists of corrupt officials and politicians. The Mafia call that caper a "bust out".

TL/DR: I am grateful to you for this opportunity to speculate, L Ron Hubbard was always a chameleon, I believe a focus on David Miscavige is a distraction from the ultimate aim of bringing about an end to the abuses of Scientology and delivering justice to those who cry out for it, we are, indeed, in interesting times, and Scientology is well-behind schedule for another metamorphosis.
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
That is exactly what I was talking about. Thanks for finding it and posting the links.

Just in case you haven't see this.

"When I completed the evaluation and basic program, Diana flew to Denver and I met her at the airport. She read and approved the program, then got back on a plane and went back to Clearwater. I was now ready to get started on, what would prove to be a very interesting adventure.

"It was now the summer of 1980, and I had Diana Hubbard's approval on my program. As a "special project under Diana", I now had an acceptable identity with the CoS. Someone could ask, "What the hell is that Mike Goldstein doing?" And someone else could say, "Oh, he's working on a special project for Diana Hubbard", and that would be acceptable. Also, if there were any problems, Diana had agreed to run additional "air cover" for me. With the above in place, I could now proceed with getting my Book One program off the ground."


More for the curious: :coolwink:

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part1.htm

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part2.htm

http://www.freezoneamerica.org/Goldstein/part3.htm
 

Tamlin

Patron
My prediction - there will be a COUP against Miscavige soon even without Tommy Davis squawking.
:wink2:
Here is the clue that Tommy Davis may tell the truth - SCIENTOLOGY'S ATTORNEY'S FILED A MOTION TO NOT LET HIM TESTIFY!!

:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
Tommy Davis BLEW Scientology and moved far, far away! WHY? Doesn't Scientology work? That would be the first question to answer and someone knows. As soon as that "someone" leaves - we will find out.

Tommy Davis has a long decompression to go through. If he "LOOKS" he will heal faster. If he sits on the fringes - he will suffer and never know why.

How was it for Scientologist's who left - and still "believed" but left because of the constant abuse, turmoil, upset and no results....spinning your wheels and nothing gets done!! What were you waiting for? Scientology to get "better and work"??? And nothing changed - ever - just got worse.

My bet - Tommy Davis will not lie and will tell the truth! In order to heal - one must tell the truth. I bet he is LOOKING!!

My other bet - he and Jessica Feshbach are out!

While I would love to agree with you, Idle Morgue, at yesterday's hearing the church's lawyers agreed to Davis being deposed, and IIRC (my partner was there, but his notes are a jumble and I can't read a word!) Jeffrey described Davis as "hostile" to the case.

I do agree that whatever Davis does, he is between a rock and a hard place, between the law and his church (if he's still in) or his own and his wife's families, if he's not.

I don't so much imagine a coup as DM packing his remaining parishioners on board ship and taking to open seas, just like the founder. How many people does the Freewinds hold? :p
 
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