ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

A new theory about what motivated Hubbard (from Chris Shelton's podcast)

Discussion in 'Chris Shelton's Videos' started by Chris Shelton, Aug 13, 2016.

  1. Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton Patron with Honors

    On my podcast this week, Yuval Laor and I discuss his theory of what could have been behind much of L. Ron Hubbard's madness and why he did a lot of what he did. While it doesn't give the guy a pass for being a horrible human being, nor is this an attempt to offer up a single source for Hubbard's evil, twisted madness, it's still a damn interesting theory and actually helped provide some closure for me.

    Last edited: Aug 13, 2016
  2. Helena Handbasket

    Helena Handbasket Gold Meritorious Patron


  3. uncover

    uncover Gold Meritorious Patron

    Oh, thats easily explained - my theory is a short and simple one:

    "El Con Hubbard was the incarnated inferiority complex - and his inferiority complex was justified."
  4. scooter

    scooter Gold Meritorious Patron

    I've just listened thro' this podcast and it was very well worth it.:yes:

    It's taken a few stops and starts because I just don't have 75 minutes available to me, even on a Sunday.:no:

    Chris, congratulations yet again for a great insightful piece. It did provide me with some info. that made Hubbard the (mad)man a lot more understandable.:clap:

    Love your work, Mr Shelton.:thumbsup:

    For all you lurkers and regulars to here, listen to this somehow because it's the best theory yet for how Hubbard was what He was that covers the masses of contradictions in His behaviour. I still detest the guy for what He was and did, but my contempt is mixed with a fair bit more understanding after listening to this.:biggrin:

    Oh, and of course:

    FUCK YOU, OSA !!!

  5. oneonewasaracecar

    oneonewasaracecar Gold Meritorious Patron

    I agree. This is the first time anyone has ever proposed this and it makes perfect sense.

    This is probably the most important video you have made yet Chris.
  6. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on


    This is going to be a very unpopular post. LOL

    I made it through about 0:45 of the video. To be honest, I struggled with the diagnostic "matches".

    It felt like the same kind of reverse engineering that can be done with Astrological readings--where the descriptions are general enough that one can say: "Uhhhhh, yeah! He did make a lot of rules and wanted everyone to follow them exactly!"

    But, such symptoms could just as easily apply to determined businessmen, military types or just "bossy" people. The pattern matching seemed too vague and wholly interpretative to have definitive diagnostic values.

    I am hoping that not enthusiastically agreeing with the theories and speculation in this video is not proof that I have TLE, lol.

    EDIT: Something brought to my attention by other posters, thanks. I meant to say that I had listened to 45 minutes, not 45 seconds, lol.
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2016
  7. scooter

    scooter Gold Meritorious Patron

    Sorry you couldn't make it any further than 45 seconds on this, HH.:bigcry:

    And no, I'm not going to come up with some sort of "diagnosis" on why this should be so for you.:coolwink:

    I had trouble setting aside the time to view this but, having liked all of Chris's stuff previously, I was determined to sit through at least some of it to see where it was going. So I did it in a few blocks of minutes today until I got through it all.

    It is worth it if you can get through it and get what Chris and Yuval were proposing - it makes the "good" or "contradictory" behaviours of the late unlamented HubTurd understandable and makes a mockery of those who would have you believe that Hubbard was a misunderstood genius who really did come up with His Tehc out of His love for all Humanity. :puke:

    And, as Racecar has suggested, this may well be Chris's most important vid yet - it really is that good and original for exes like us who've long pondered how we wound up slaves to Hubbardism.:omg:

    So again :hattip: to Mr Shelton for the good work.:thumbsup:
  8. Glenda

    Glenda Crusader

    Oh dear. :melodramatic: Has attention span of a gnat. :wink2:

    I'm up to 24 mins and it is getting me thinking. It's not a diagnosis. It is two people sharing some information which, the further I listen, is not only relevant, but also interesting, regarding our former [STRIKE]sauce[/STRIKE] source.

    Option one: try again HH and report back into ESMB Ethics section tomorrow. :p

    Option two: throw a tantrum cos I said you had an attention span of a gnat. :p
    (I'm allowed to say such things, I have the focus and attention span of an
    unevolved gnat, at least you're an evolved gnat)

    Option three: Shun me. Call me names. :p
  9. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on

    Thanks, I will make a run at the last half hour of the video when I am of fresh mind.

    Like yourself, I am a huge fan of Chris' videos and have often congratulated him for such brilliant and entertaining presentations. This is the only time I ever got a glazed-over "Am I missing something" kind of feeling while watching his videos. Even if it turns out that I don't think this is a grounded assessment of Hubbard's mental/physiological state, I still think Chris Shelton is a rock star!

    It is not easy to take such a convoluted and purposely obtuse subject like Scientology and reduce it to core, simple elements. That is an amazing talent Chris has!
  10. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on


    Oops, I meant to write that I listened to 45:00 (45 minutes, not 45 seconds, lololol)

    Can I come out of the chain locker now? lol

    ps: I was wondering why Glenda joked about my short attention span. So I re-read both your posts and VOILA!
  11. Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton Patron with Honors

    Well damn, see you missed the best part at 48:15 where we reveal that Hubbard's brain was actually extracted before he was cremated and has been preserved in pickle juice in a secret chamber at the LRH Life Exhibition. Turns out that Miscavige and Norman Starkey are Transhumanists who are waiting for Earth technology to catch up to their brilliant scheme to reincarnated Hubbard in an indestructible Terminator body. They think by the time Golden Age of Tech 19 rolls around, they'll have it ready. So Yuval actually snuck in an EEG machine and performed a whole series of brain scans. He presented the graph on my podcast.

    You know, they say patience is a virtue and good things come to those who wait, so if you'd only been able to stick around a few more minutes you'd have seen proof positive of our diagnosis. Maybe next time you'll watch the WHOLE episode before jumping to rash conclusions that I don't know what I'm talking about..... :coolwink:
  12. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on



    Sounds like the plot from some awful Hubbard Sci-Fi from the 1940s.

    Maybe it's time to do an updated remake of a classic 1953 movie. It's got the "Ron's Brain" part already written, plus a luridly exploitative one-sheet poster, just like Ron used on his book covers!

  13. tetloj

    tetloj Silver Meritorious Patron

    Whether or not the diagnosis fits LRH (noting all the risks associated with arm chair diagnosis and that neither speaker is a neurologist) the idea that 'messianic' behaviours are a result of neurological pathology is fascinating.
  14. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    I watched six minutes of it, so I'm obviously going to make an assumption or two of what the rest of it says. Looking at the subject of causative factors very simplistically, there are differing views. For example:

    M -> L (i.e., medical abnormalities are a significant causative factor in how one leads one's life), and

    X -> M -> L (i.e., something personal [not random] predisposes one to having some medical abnormality, and these two factors together are significant causative factor in how one leads one's life).

    "X" includes what we could term mental, spiritual and cosmic factors. I don't believe one can exclude such a possibility.

  15. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on


    I suppose if we are going down that route, we might also consider adding:

    "I" to factor in the person being Insane to whatever degree.

    "E" to factor in the person having Evil characteristics.

    "C" to factor in behavior triggered by Criminal impulses.

    "G" in the event that the person has become the adverse effect of restimulation from Gorilla goal implants. ​

    Hey, I started out so nicely. But then something untoward in my brain suddenly forced me to throw in the gorilla stuff.
  16. uncover

    uncover Gold Meritorious Patron

    So do you want to say now, that the LRH Life Exhibition is ..... infested ? :eyeroll:
  17. Caroline

    Caroline Patron Meritorious

    From what I understand of the podcast, Yuval Laor's theory doesn't explain what motivated Hubbard. Maybe you can explain.

    Also, can you clarify what you mean by "much of L. Ron Hubbard's madness and why he did a lot of what he did"?
  18. chipgallo

    chipgallo Patron Meritorious

    Last edited: Aug 15, 2016
  19. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    . . .
    I located a copy of the original screenplay . . . before the extensive rewrites.

    The story was much different in that one. Also an earlier mock-up of a theater placard.

    Don't know what to make of this rare find.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2016
  20. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband


    Re. Step 7. Isn't that incitement to murder? That wouldn't be any kind of criminal offence would it?