Smilla
Ordinary Human
No lets keep the threads and move Terril to the Attic. Mad aunt Edith who has been hidden away up there for years could do with some company, and I think our charming Terril would cheer her up no end.
A question for Terril.
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No lets keep the threads and move Terril to the Attic. Mad aunt Edith who has been hidden away up there for years could do with some company, and I think our charming Terril would cheer her up no end.
freethinker
Sponsor
The truth is Terril, you can't say that Marty got anyone out unless they say he did.
I know that Illegal Alien went down to get his son and though he didn't come right then, that action caused his son to rethink and leave. That's what I call getting someone out.
Feral and a number of other Aussies went down to get (I forget her name)out of the RPF in Austraulia. And though they didn't get her, they actively went down to get her and as far as I know they are still trying.
I know the above to be fact. What you say about marty may or may not be true and I'm inclined to think not.
I did see a video where Marty and Mike went to the Fort Harrison to get Mike's son. That was actively trying to get someone out.
People showing up at marty's blog is not actively getting people out IMO.
My comments in green.
I know that Illegal Alien went down to get his son and though he didn't come right then, that action caused his son to rethink and leave. That's what I call getting someone out.
Feral and a number of other Aussies went down to get (I forget her name)out of the RPF in Austraulia. And though they didn't get her, they actively went down to get her and as far as I know they are still trying.
I know the above to be fact. What you say about marty may or may not be true and I'm inclined to think not.
I did see a video where Marty and Mike went to the Fort Harrison to get Mike's son. That was actively trying to get someone out.
People showing up at marty's blog is not actively getting people out IMO.
My comments in green.
All I'm doing is answering someone's question!!
Thats a good point, in theory.
This was from the blog of " Thoughtful" one of Marty's compadres,
and IIRC is Steve Hall. His blog links to much action of Marty's including
his blog and Videos appearing in the St Pete's times and more.
This is positioning and speculation
Further note that it is a list of INDEPENDENTS!
This term has only been resurrected in recent times by Marty, who
has also at times called Freezoners Squirrels.
This is irrelevent and inconclusive.
The above indicates that these are people who mostly came out with
some inspiration from Marty and/or his friends blogs and websites.
This is speculation
No I can't specify that all those on the list left CO$ because of
Marty's actions.This is a fact Also re someone elses comments people in COS have had long suppressed needs, and reasons to leave CO$. Coming out
openly has been occurring quite regularly on Marty's Blog.
The 216 people I referenced have not previously surfaced in the FZ,
to the best of my knowledge. Speculation and leading
Did anon get them to practice Scn outside COS? perhaps helped, but don't think many are active on WWP. Did ESMB? Yes, and quite a few from ESMB came to FZ forums or asked for connection to techies.
That leaves perhaps 170 - 190 who came to practice tech outside CO$ by other paths than WWP, ESMB, and the FZ.
I shall soon look at one of the busier recent threads on Marty's blog
and give details of how many posters were previously FZers and who were not.
Incidentally Tory has posted similar comments to mine re Marty's effects on getting people out of CO$. This is referal.
AnonKat
Crusader
AnonKat
Crusader
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
Well, you guys are talking about a contributor to this forum. I thought there were rules of conduct here. But I guess those don't apply to everyone.
Kewl.
Peace out.
Kewl.
Peace out.
AnonKat
Crusader
If I ever was an ex I would let it rip. They would be sorry they existed at all or eer commented on this board. better I be not an Ex than
freethinker
Sponsor
Just saying so isn't proof either. Think of all those who say they are clear and OT
freethinker
Sponsor
yeah, you're tough.
Mystic
Crusader
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
Just saying so isn't proof either. Think of all those who say they are clear and OT
Well, wait a minute. If Jane Doe ex member says "I got out because I read blah blah etc" then I think Jane Doe ex member would know, right?
I mean, I know what got me out.
And as I mentioned I have friends who'd been fed up for years but the last straw came when they read The Truth Rundown...then they really did leave. I've no reason to consider them to be liars.
AnonKat
Crusader
Every time you pucker your ass
HelluvaHoax!
Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
I don't know about Terril, but Scientology does have a "responder" stat.
COS FIRST-RESPONDER STAT
Number of times Scn showed up at the scene of a disaster.
Number of times Scn showed up at the scene of a disaster.
They have the highest stats of anyone in the world because, not only are they the first to show up at a disaster--they actually arrived there just BEFORE they made it go wrong.
Would you attribute the entire truth rundown to marty? I see it used that way but he was but one contributor to what was great work by the st pete times.
Any ways, I don't think Marty wants to get any one out of scientology, which just makes him a snake oil salesman.
freethinker
Sponsor
It really seems to be important to you and Terril that Marty is the guy, Marty is the savior, Marty is the great motivator.
My idea of getting someone out, is going down and getting them.
Marty was not the only one in The Truth Rundown series, there were several others which boosted the effectiveness of the article but they don't seem to get the credit that marty does.
Is it possible that the combination of all those stories besides Marty's gave marty's story more credibility?
Why the need to promote this, even if it were true?
My idea of getting someone out, is going down and getting them.
Marty was not the only one in The Truth Rundown series, there were several others which boosted the effectiveness of the article but they don't seem to get the credit that marty does.
Is it possible that the combination of all those stories besides Marty's gave marty's story more credibility?
Why the need to promote this, even if it were true?
degraded being
Sponsor
Ok, left unqualified, "natural leader" has connotations that are the opposite of what I perceive Marty to be and you obviously get that, hence your qualification of the term re Marty. I have to admit there are some people who think he is and think it should be recognised as something positive. I just see a little liar.
Pied Piper? Leading the rats out of the city? Have to think about that.........
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
Nah, I wouldn't. But I think he played a part in it.
I do think he wants to see a reformed CofS with himself at the helm, though, which is what a lot of his detractors think. I understand the sentiments.
But maybe he helped some people. I would like to think so.
TG1
Angelic Poster
I'm loathe to post on this thread, given the tenor of it thus far.
However, I will contribute this personal experience of mine (nobody else's): Having lurked very minorly on ESMB for a few years prior to 2010, ESMB and the threads here (which I only grazed) never got my attention like "The Truth Rundown" in the St. Pete Times did.
I had paid little attention to Scientology for many, many years. Was already "out." Therefore, I knew nothing about the horrors of IAS financial extortion, widespread disconnection, physical abuse of Sea Org folks, enforced abortions, that occurred since 1990. Sure, you can say stuff like that went on before -- but I certainly never knew of it. And it seems from everything I've read (and I think I've read 80% now of what's available online) that things got rougher since 1990 or thereabouts.
Anyway, when I read TTR (and I watched all the videos -- all three installments of TTR), the two videos that really got to me the most, by far, were Marty's and Amy's. I believed (and still believe) that what they were saying was true.
In fact, one of the thing that impressed me about Marty's commentary was how uncomfortable he seemed in his own skin about what he was talking about. My interpretation was that he was very conflicted about some of it. He didn't like himself very much, seemed to me. He seemed to me like a man trying to find himself again. And that is part of what made me think he was telling the truth.
Amy, btw, just seemed about the straightest shooter I'd seen in a long time. She was "straight up" about everything. A bottom-line girl if I ever saw one. Loved her.
The others I also believed -- but they, for various reasons, just didn't impress me the way Amy and Marty did.
You could say "on the one hand, on the other hand" about a lot of stuff that's out there. But those videos (again, this is me, talking about me) really were powerful.
Given what I've read posted on Marty's blog by dozens and dozens of people who also read and watched The Truth Rundown videos, they seem to have felt the same way. They mentioned Marty's and Amy's videos (seemed like) more than any others.
I think it's silly to ascribe a single, "silver bullet" reason as "the why" or "the cause" of effects that occur in quite complicated contexts with very long histories. However, there are definitely "tipping points." I think The Truth Rundown (to which many contributed) was a big tipping point for many people. And I think Marty's and Amy's testimonies were the highlights of that collective tipping point.
One woman's opinion. Your mileage may vary.
TG1
However, I will contribute this personal experience of mine (nobody else's): Having lurked very minorly on ESMB for a few years prior to 2010, ESMB and the threads here (which I only grazed) never got my attention like "The Truth Rundown" in the St. Pete Times did.
I had paid little attention to Scientology for many, many years. Was already "out." Therefore, I knew nothing about the horrors of IAS financial extortion, widespread disconnection, physical abuse of Sea Org folks, enforced abortions, that occurred since 1990. Sure, you can say stuff like that went on before -- but I certainly never knew of it. And it seems from everything I've read (and I think I've read 80% now of what's available online) that things got rougher since 1990 or thereabouts.
Anyway, when I read TTR (and I watched all the videos -- all three installments of TTR), the two videos that really got to me the most, by far, were Marty's and Amy's. I believed (and still believe) that what they were saying was true.
In fact, one of the thing that impressed me about Marty's commentary was how uncomfortable he seemed in his own skin about what he was talking about. My interpretation was that he was very conflicted about some of it. He didn't like himself very much, seemed to me. He seemed to me like a man trying to find himself again. And that is part of what made me think he was telling the truth.
Amy, btw, just seemed about the straightest shooter I'd seen in a long time. She was "straight up" about everything. A bottom-line girl if I ever saw one. Loved her.
The others I also believed -- but they, for various reasons, just didn't impress me the way Amy and Marty did.
You could say "on the one hand, on the other hand" about a lot of stuff that's out there. But those videos (again, this is me, talking about me) really were powerful.
Given what I've read posted on Marty's blog by dozens and dozens of people who also read and watched The Truth Rundown videos, they seem to have felt the same way. They mentioned Marty's and Amy's videos (seemed like) more than any others.
I think it's silly to ascribe a single, "silver bullet" reason as "the why" or "the cause" of effects that occur in quite complicated contexts with very long histories. However, there are definitely "tipping points." I think The Truth Rundown (to which many contributed) was a big tipping point for many people. And I think Marty's and Amy's testimonies were the highlights of that collective tipping point.
One woman's opinion. Your mileage may vary.
TG1
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
Oh, gee, no. Not me. Terril, maybe. Not me. I'm not as pissed at him as some people, but no, I'm no Martyologist and I do think, as I just mentioned, that he wants to be a new COB kinda guy. I cannot trust or endorse that.
Truly.
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