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AnonyMary & Churchill at the Getting Clear Conference

Discussion in 'Conferences, Speeches, Radio Shows, and Live Publi' started by Churchill, Jul 6, 2015.

  1. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    AnonyMary and I, after a brief discussion, have decided to create a thread that focuses on the Getting Clear Conference, which ended just over a week ago. We'll try to share our deeply personal thoughts about this remarkable event.

    I attended the entire conference, missing only the Thursday evening presentations of Chris Shelton and Gerry Armstrong.

    Some background on myself and Canada: In 1966, two years before becoming involved with Scientology, I had dropped out of Brooklyn College, and decided to see a bit of the world, like many of my generation were doing. I spent one last evening at the Cafe Rienzi in Greenwich Village drinking espresso and smoking cigarettes. I had a few hundred dollars, a backpack with a tent and sleeping bag, and took a train from New York to Montreal, and proceeded to hitch-hike across the Trans-Canada
    Highway, working for a short while in Alberta, and then making my way north to Fairbanks, Alaska.
    I love Canada and the Canadian people. And I loved Alaska.

    About 8 years later, as a Sea Org Member, I was sent by Kate (Al) Bornstein on missions to Toronto, Montreal and Winnipeg. Where my life had been filled with the wanderlust of youth, it had now been replaced with purpose and a sense of mission.

    Having a purpose and a sense of mission are not necessarily bad. In fact, they're good, provided one has not joined a fascistic, totalitarian, mind-control cult that is masquerading under the guise of a benevolent self-help religious organization, an applied religious philosophy.

    So, until last week, it had been 40 years since I last visited Canada.

    I reached the border crossing around 5am. What was the purpose of my visit, the Canadian wanted to know. "I'm attending an anti-Scientology Conference in Toronto". With that, he smiled, and waved me through. "Don't you want to see my passport?"
    "No need," "enjoy your stay" he smiled.

    (have I mentioned I love Canada?)

    I arrived early Monday morning at the Toronto Sheraton, after having driven about 6 hours from Western Massachusetts where I live. I'd slept maybe 2 hours. Didn't care. Adrenaline and Caffeine would see me through the day.

    After all these many years, I would finally meet Paulette Cooper...
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2015
  2. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    Before I begin with my experiences about the conference and what lead to my attending it, I first think it's important that the members and lurkers here understand just who Len Zinberg aka Churchill aka " Mike Leopold" is in the grand scheme of the history of Scientology and how I came to seek him out privately on ESMB before I knew his real name and detailed history with the church.

    First, This is our Churchill :


    The Scientology spy who came in from the cold: Len Zinberg, who apologized to Paulette Cooper

    In reading Churchill's posts and comments on ESMB last year, I'd come to feel that there was something very deep and painful behind the humble things he was writing about himself, the few times he had mentioned himself. A few posts indicated he was from the NY area and that he'dbeen in a long time ago. That he'd regretfully been involved is some previous former GO or OSA volunteer activities. Nothing specific, IIRC, but I felt that I should contact him as I had also been an OSA volunteer in NY. Perhaps he might know some of the people I knew in my early days from when I lived in NY and had married a scientologist.

    It turned out that he had been in earlier than those I knew back then, but did recognize some of them by name. In recollection, what was most striking to me in his response was sadness about things he had done. I don't recall all that went back and forth on this at the time but it was clear that he was working something out for himself on his past activities. I felt it was not my place to ask for specifics... I was left with the feeling that he had regrets... as many of us do.

    Then a few months later I saw another comment that prompted me to write him and follow up. Unfortunately, in error, I had deleted all my previous correspondences with him and some others while trying to make space for more PMs, so I wrote the following to him ( and I hope he is OK with this and my posting his response )

    It was then that he replied, telling me

    And indeed, the story of Len Zinberg aka Churchill and his involvement with the GO in their Fair Gaming of Paulette Cooper has been told!

    As Tony Ortega wrote
    If you have not read this book, get it and read it now! The book itself is chock full of information hitherto unknown but Len's involvement and his eventually contacting, confessing and apologizing to Paulette ( the only operative of the lot to do so ) is remarkable. That he does not toot his horn like some former GO/OSA staff and volunteers have (and who refused to talk with Paulette when she contacted them) the book is a testament to the humble and caring person Len Zinberg is in admitting and apologizing for the things he did for the cult that hurt Paulette and her family.

    So it was with much anticipation that, when I finally decided to take up an offer to come speak at the Getting Clear Conference in Toronto, I went knowing I would finally have the pleasure to meet our wonderful Churchill in person!

    More about that and me in a bit... I just want to make it known that we are very fortunate to have 'Churchill' on board and as a participating member on ESMB!
  3. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    OK, I'm back after a lovely break with some coffee and a wonderful gluten-free chocolate chip and banana pancake ( not for fad purposes. I have had Celiac Disease most of my life and the diet is a must)

    Anyway, I knew about the upcoming Getting Clear Conference in Toronto for some time in advance. Dr. James "Jim" Beverley and I have been in contact with each other for a few years now and I was initially asked to speak there. I declined but agreed to ask around and find some of the 'experts' Jim wanted for the event.

    I was delighted to see that he and Jon Atack were working together on this. Jon and I have corresponded over the years and share a bond of sorts because of the common issue of finding food we can eat when traveling. He has Celiac Disease as well.

    Jim's logic in having me speak was because he felt I was the most expert at explaining the program and what was going on with the lawsuits. I begged to differ, hoping I could get Lucas Catton or someone else to be able to give a presentation that the subject deserved. But none of those I mentioned could attend.

    Jim was aware that Narconon and OSA already knew my identity, we had discussed the matter of how I had been 'outed' and subsequently trolled, harassed ( myself and my family ) and followed by private investigators. That I had eventually been subpoenaed and ordered to testify by deposition and submit a tremendous amount of communications between myself, and others, including attorneys, former Narconon staff and any that I might have from a list of many plaintiffs in lawsuits that attorneys had filed against the various Narconon facilities. My concern was and still is for my family. My children, one of whom was a minor at the time he was contacted - my son has an autistic disorder.

    He is diagnosed with autism very young but is one of the rare ones who responded and improved significantly with lots of early and continuous intervention by traditional means. Never the less, he is disabled and the cult and some trolls had gotten his contact info and attempted to reach him multiple times. My daughter, who is older than my son, was also contacted multiple times.Both of them were very afraid for me - while I was ( and am ) afraid for them. I didn't want attention brought on me to then be brought on them. The internet and back channels seem to know no boundaries. They didn't deserve to be further harassed.

    How I was outed is a sad story which wound up being briefly discussed here on ESMB...

    Emma responds to poster about it...

    I respond to Emma ( re: her response to poster )

    Emma responds to poster and me

    I reply to Emma

    It was in short time that my real name was then intentionally spread to some trolls on Facebook in concert with OSA, who then sent emails around to others about me. Then stuff began to be posted about me on the internet, then emails and calls started coming to myself, ethercat, my daughter and my son and others. We know who you are. We know who your friends are. You are the enemy and spreading hate and lies about Narconon. Essentially doing and telling me that they are pressuring my friends and loved ones to get me to stop helping victims and attorneys against Narconon. They contacted ethercat. She changed my name to Xenu in this audio tape of a voice message left which she posted on Narconon Reviews "We got an interesting phone call last week… "

    So I was eventually served a subpoena and made to testify and turn over stuff to Narconon Fresh Start in one of Ryan Hamilton's cases against them and the higher entities included in many of his lawsuits. This was the first of possibly 40 + other cases against Narconon that I may be called for as a witness. The deposition was held in December. I was fortunate to be represented by attorney Jeffrey Ray who has and continues in Michigan to sue Narconon Freedom Center, A Forever Recovery, and Best Drug rehab.

    My story in Scientology is not one I like to talk much about because there is much heartache and family issues, many of which ended in losses over time. I had a long, active involvement in KSW.

    I have spent over 8 years now anonymously sharing tidbits of it and contributing to what I know about Scientology. That and helping expose Narconon, helping victims of the program and assisting ethercat with her forum at Reaching For The Tipping Point and excellent Narconon Reviews sites has been an important factor where anonymity has been a necessity.

    Never the less, people in Scientology who knew me knew me as Kathy Mace. Here are some links to things I wrote on the internet about myself and my involvement in Scientology.

    Keep in mind that in my comments about my former boss in this link, he has since stated that he really wanted to help me and that was why he contacted me, when I though he was just doing it because he was being pressured. It should be noted that is is also out of Scientology now!

    Since I and my children have not been harassed since I was subpoenaed, I am in a free, for the time being anyway, to speak without retribution zone of sorts. The only time I had ever spoken up publicly was a very quick decision to help at recent public meeting on Narconon Trout Run in Frederick County, MD. I was ill at the time and just starting to understand the issues before the County Council but I felt obligated to educate them and help keep Narconon out of my state of residence.

    After consulting my friends and children, and finding out that some of the attorneys would also be speaking about Narconon at the event, I finally gave in and told James I would go.

    It was the best decision I could have ever made. Besides meting so many wonderful heroes and heroines in the critic realm, I also had the opportunity to represent ethercats wonderful and informative site Narconon Reviews, and present information about the Narconon program and how it is composed of Scientology every step of the way.

    Andreas Heldal-Lund posted this photo of the panel on June 25.
    "Subject now is Narconon at Getting Clear Conference. — at Sheraton Toronto Airport Hotel & Conference Centre."

    From left is Angela Harris, PhD, toxicologist expert and witness for Ryan Hamilton cases. Next is attorney Jon Little; next is paralegal and law student Kat Villanueva - who works for attorney Jeffrey Ray's MI firm; speaking into the mike is attorney David Miller, myself, then Jon Atack on far right.

    The lovely head in front of Andreas' camera belongs to Len Zinberg :D

    Keep in mind that one of the attorneys, Jonathan Little, arrived just before the time of our presentation and had no time to check in and do a change of clothes a due to unexpected flight issues. It was decided I would not dress up as planned to balance things out since David Miller and Kat dressed up for the occasion :)

    More soon on the best event ever!

    Next, I will explain what was discussed there. And and then all the wonders of what I experienced in listening , seeing and meeting such stellar and wonderful exes, never-ins and professionals.

    Hope I have not bored you so far.
  4. Cornelius Bigot

    Cornelius Bigot Patron with Honors

    Thank you both so very much for doing this. Looking forward to reading this thread.
    Big giant hugs to both of you.
  5. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    I am sitting, in stunned silence, marveling at your courage, dignity, and decency.
    There is such a wealth of information that you have just revealed...people need to
    take the time to read all that you have posted here.
  6. Glenda

    Glenda Crusader

    Respect to you both, AnonyMary and Churchill! :flowers:

    Thank you and thank you. :) :hug:
  7. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

  8. Glenda

    Glenda Crusader

    Thanks for posting this AnonyMary. :)

    Sorry to hear Pete got hit with the head-cold from hell. Tedious damn things head-colds.

    Conferences like this one inspire and bring healing. One day I really hope I can attend a conference/gathering and just be with loads of others ex's/critics. It would mean a lot to me. I'm really looking forward to vid footage of Toronto Conference when it is ready/released.

    Speaking of inspiration...AnonyMary, could you please let Pete know I want his hat! Love it! I'll sit quietly by the letterbox awaiting its arrival. :wink2:
  9. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    Thank you, Glenda :) Yes, poor Pete. I met him Thursday morning and he was still very under the weather but he was feeling better enough to attend some or all of the day of sessions in spite of it and attending did bring healing.

    By Friday evening, he seemed to me to be almost 100%, entertaining us all with his wonderful humor and pool playing skills which I believe Nora Crest bested. We all can't say enough about her. A real fireball. It was a fun final evening gathering despite the fact that we could not get the restaurant to turn down the piped-in music. They even managed to turn it up louder after Pete, myself and someone else managed to get in a fun acapella version of "We Stand Tall"!

    Sadly, we then lost out in hearing Jim Beverley's wonderful assistant, Spike Robinson, entertain the room with her songs as planned. The restaurant would not budge on the music, which was piped in throughout the whole restaurant, not just our curtained off room there. But overall, we had a terrific time.

    Yes, I suspect there will be many more conferences to bring people together in the near future!

    I will certainly tell Pete about that on the hat!!
  10. MrNobody

    MrNobody Who needs merits?

    Ugh, a restaurant bothering their guests with music? :shock: Usually, I go to a restaurant for their tasty food, not for their taste in music. :duh:

    Couldn't you guys just get up and go find a better place? :)
  11. lotus

    lotus stubborn rebel sheep!

    Thank you Churchill - you are a great being!

    Thank you Anonmary!

    I remember when some of those events happened here - I remember I thought you are a soul of decency and dignity! You are one the person with the higher standard of personnal integrity (the real one...not the corrupt CO$ version ) - you are a reliable person and I read all of your posts. :hattip:

    I wish, for you and family, that since you have been outed and now you stand up publicly, and in court cases, they give up on harrassing and intimidate you and the kids in order to muzzle you! Soon or later they will :yes:...

    I wish you deep peace, and that all the $cieno harm will transform into making all of you stronger, happier and close.
    Best to you and the kids! (hope you have been and are well supported by relatives)

    Thank you!
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  12. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

  13. Intentionally Blank

    Intentionally Blank Scientology Widow

    Churchill and Mary - you've both been among my favorite posters, always insightful and helpful. Thanks for everything you've done and continue to do to bring about the cult's reign of terror. How fun that you got to meet in Toronto.

  14. Lori

    Lori Cheryl E Love

    I'm very glad your story and the truth about a lot of things are finally coming out!
    I just want to give you a great big hug :bighug: right now and tell you how proud I am to call you my friend! You have been one of the rocks I leaned on during my coming out and one of the few people outside of my family I'd trust with my life! Love ya gal!
  15. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    My favorite meals were breakfast and lunch. I enjoyed several breakfasts with Pete, Jon and Gerry. It reminded me so much about what I really originally loved about Scientology...
    the people!

    Their kindness, curiosity, and mostly that sense of raw idealism that we had...
    an idealism that Hubbard, over time, shaped and manipulated for his own purpose, so that in the end it was unrecognizable,
    having morphed into a bizarre KSW universe of those who were worthy of immortality and (non-existent) god-like powers, and those poor unfortunates who were just too degraded to ascend the heights.

    I saw Wayne Marple before the FEBC, a natural leader, fun, happy-go-lucky guy who afterwards became hard, insolent, driven and ultimately embittered.
    Bob and Connie Harvey, such sweet dedicated people...declared.
    Clarice Jackson, Sibersky, Reynolds, Kember...always dark and soulless.
    Then came John McMaster and Hana Eltringham with such love and kindness. The love and kindness was theirs all along; Scientology just couldn't erase it; couldn't destroy it.

    There were a lot of good people. Some, like me, got caught and chewed up in the machinery of KSW.
    I understand undue influence.
    I also understand that even in the most adverse, unimaginably difficult circumstances...we still have choices.
    I consider myself extremely fortunate to be given a chance to try and set things right as best I can.

    On Monday morning when I met Paulette, we hugged briefly, and I choked back tears of joy.

    Three days later I repeated the process with AnonyMary!

    She led the panel discussion on Narconon and gave an absolutely riveting talk.
    I asked a question about Clark Carr (who I knew in '69) being in Tijuana to avoid process servers.
    (I'm sure Clark never anticipated such an ignominious fate when he originally got into Scientology.)

    Finally, it's really important that Scientologists understand that critics of Scientology don't hate them; that it's the abuses, lies, damage, and criminality that is built into Scientology that is opposed.

    OSA, please take these words, and this message to heart, You ​always have a choice.

    (too tired to edit this, so I'll post it hoping it is readable and somewhat coherent.)
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  16. Intelligence

    Intelligence Silver Meritorious Patron

    THANK YOU MARY for all you have done and continue to do... much LOVE and RESPECT.:thankyou:

    :hifive: :handinhand:

  17. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One


    Something I've always wondered about but didn't want to trouble you with at the time, were you ever subject to Fair Game or OSA shenanigans prior to that Arnie/Ginger outing?

    Feel free to ignore this question if you so choose and I apologise in advance if I missed that you've already addressed this (and for this minor thread derail).

    PS: I absolutely LOVE this thread. :)
  18. Churchill

    Churchill Gold Meritorious Patron

    The Conference began with Jon Atack and Jim Beverley welcoming us and introducing themselves. Jim stated that he had been in communication with representatives Scientology, and had invited them to speak at the Conference. Apparently they declined, yet a few days later Scientology was complaining about the one-sided and "bigoted" event taking place. What a surprise.

    Jon Atack, whose book A Piece of Blue Sky recounts the story of his own involvement and ultimate exit from Scientology, and proceeds to delve deeply into Hubbard's life, bringing to light the little known facts without which a full understanding of the man is impossible. Scientologists do not, and must not know these things.
    Jon delivered a PowerPoint presentation which juxtaposed various quotes of Hubbard; in context, and from Bulletins, Policy Letters, and in his own handwriting. Most were instantly recognizable. For example, the essay What is Greatness where Hubbard presents himself as the personification of benevolence placed side by side with his "fair game" law where opponents were to be "destroyed."

    The dozen or more of these juxtaposed quotes of his writings and speeches offered a window into the mind of Hubbard, and of his madness. When the videos are made available, I highly recommend that you watch them sequentially, or, at the very least, watch the opening video first.

    Jon Atack is that rare person one meets who defies all superlatives. A Buddhist, a man, a towering intellect, with extraordinary humility, and humor. And I haven't come close!

    Jim Beverley, with whom AnonyMary had been in touch, was unknown to me. I had read one of his books on Islam that had left me with many questions, and in conversation I was tremendously impressed with the depth and breadth of his understanding of the subject.

    For most of the Conference, I sat next to one of his wonderful students who simply adored him and we shared various tidbits of experience with one another. When Hana Whitfield took the stage, my excitement overtook me as I remembered Hana Eltringham, Yvonne Gilliam and John Mc Master who were the best public faces Scientology ever had, and I whispered "in 1972 she came to NY and to me she was like a fairy Queen!"
    In 2015 Hana was as lovely, kind, and sweet as she had always been except that
    the cloud had been lifted from her eyes; the cataract of Scientology was gone!
    She was pure radiance!

    Well, I sense that I've veered off into rambling, with an abundance of hero worship which I cannot help so I'll take a lunch break now.
    Hopefully, though, you're getting a good sense of what the event was like, from one perspective.
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  19. Nicole

    Nicole Silver Meritorious Patron

    Thanks for this great thread.:coolwink:
  20. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    As always, thank you Lori and David for your friendship and support! :thumbsup:<2

    I know :yes: but it was late in the evening, we were in an area close to Toronto International airport where there were few restaurants if any with a bar open that late. Most did not come by car so that would mean a bunch of taxis if something was located that was open that late. As well, the room and light food platters set out were planned and booked in advance with the hotel. It was just a curtain separating our room from the rest, the music was piped through ceiling speakers throughout the whole place... Lessons learned for future event purposes :)

    Thank you for the kind words and good wishes, Lotus... I try to live by standards I feel are best but no one is perfect. I do the best I can to be fair. The kids and I have good supports in our lives... they have come fully understand and support what I have been doing now, not always understanding why I involved myself in what I do, what we all have been doing to expose Scientology and make our voices heard. They now know how low the cult will go to stop the truth. They know that the truth is what wins out in the end. That the efforts are worth it for us. So all this has made us stronger. I had their full support and encouragement to go to Toronto and speak up. Before the harassment, I don't think they would have wanted that for me. It's amazing how the cult makes enemies, how well we critics are joined in support by those who have never been in once they see what is going on.

    Again, thanks <3