Barefaced Messiah

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
Ive recently downloaded a copy of this book and have started reading it on my lunchbreaks at work.

Im constantly AMAZED AND DISGUSTED with what Ron was ACTUALLY like, from a racist and spoilt child, to irresponsible and admiration-seeking adult.

If that book is to be believed, he was an out-ethics, compulsive lying, egotistical, meglomaniacal SACK OF SHIT. The crap he did before writing Dianetics and Scientology makes my skin crawl - Im not even going to mention what I think of his behaviour after.

One thing I have struggled with since leaving is the idea that Scn is inherintly bad. I got a lot of gains from training, enjoyed auditing, and I always thought it was peoples own banks and so on that have made management so dodgy now.

But since reading this book, Im over it. I dont care if the most fantastic processes came from this guy, he was not the sort of person I would EVER EVER give money, time, credit or credence to. His behaviour and motives through his entire life were DISGUSTING. He did NOT care about the "human condition". He cared about HIMSELF and nothing else.

If you havent read this book, please do.
 

programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
And, he really didn't have any extensive "research" to back up his claims in DMSMH except for his prior experiences and practices in hypnosis. (I have changed my opinion on this.)
 

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
Yeah, the interviews at the end of the book with the girl who was his girlfriend at the time are really interesting. She had done a dregree in psychology and thought he was paranoid manic depressive. He got all his info on psychology from her, he never researched anything. She reckons he made up most of the Dianetic case studies as well.
 

programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
Bent's book is also good... from the view of an "insider" and executive director of one of the biggest SCN missions. The text of "L. Ron Hubbard: Messiah or Madman" is also on the Operation Clambake website. However, I don't know if it is the latest revision of his book.
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
Funnily enough I have just finished reading a hardcover of this book for the first time. I'd read bits and pieces online, and many posts covering LRH (including Dart's excellent ones here) and never really wanted to delver further than that. Yet presented with the book in hand by a friend, I read it as though I had known nothing and it is totally appalling. You can really see how he turned his delusions into what became dianetics etc and the paranoia, the justifications for everything bad and criminal he did with absolutely no empathy or care for those who loved him. His treatment of Mary Sue always disgusted me, and now I have more background on it.

The book is so full of his never ending meglomaniac actions it almost defies belief. And yet scientology exists because of them and carries on some of the most degrading and awful things he started with people piously thinking they are saving the world. :grouch:
 

cantsay

Patron Meritorious
The bit where he was married to Polly, and finally earnt one decent paycheck - only to buy a boat instead of paying a single bill - THIS was the author of admin tech???? No wonder there were so many contradictory bits of tech all over the place.
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
One of the things that struck me was how he so often joked, elaborated stories and ideas and thought it funny when people took them seriously. How many hundreds of thousands of hours have people spent word clearing what he wrote because "he was always right"? :duh:
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
Ive recently downloaded a copy of this book and have started reading it on my lunchbreaks at work.

Im constantly AMAZED AND DISGUSTED with what Ron was ACTUALLY like, from a racist and spoilt child, to irresponsible and admiration-seeking adult.

If that book is to be believed, he was an out-ethics, compulsive lying, egotistical, meglomaniacal SACK OF SHIT. The crap he did before writing Dianetics and Scientology makes my skin crawl - Im not even going to mention what I think of his behaviour after.

One thing I have struggled with since leaving is the idea that Scn is inherintly bad. I got a lot of gains from training, enjoyed auditing, and I always thought it was peoples own banks and so on that have made management so dodgy now.

But since reading this book, Im over it. I dont care if the most fantastic processes came from this guy, he was not the sort of person I would EVER EVER give money, time, credit or credence to. His behaviour and motives through his entire life were DISGUSTING. He did NOT care about the "human condition". He cared about HIMSELF and nothing else.

If you haven't read this book, please do.

Barefaced Messiah was the first thing I read of the critical material. It was actually YEARS after I got out of the SO. So I had been in that no man's land of being out because of being ex SO with a huge freeloader bill, getting on with my life, not in comm with any Scientologists, but still sort of semi sorta kinda considering myself a Scientologist without really thinking about it. That book was the perfect thing to start on. It wasn't rabid, but it sure presented a lot of information in a very rational matter of fact way, all backed up with evidence. By the time I got halfway through it, I was ready to delve into the rest of it. It's a great place to start if you want a good overview of the man who created Scientology, and a great one to give to friends who have their doubts about being in or out. Highly reccomended.
 

Challenge

Silver Meritorious Patron
And, he really didn't have any extensive "research" to back up his claims in DMSMH except for his prior experiences and practices in hypnosis. (I have changed my opinion on this.)

Yes. You just about have to change your opinion on his use of, and his liberally plagerizing from, Hypnosis.
I just read 3 small books by Michael Newton, PHD.Dr. Newton's is an Hypnotherapist.
It is no wonder that Hubbard didn't want anyone to touch the subject of Hypnosis. Had they done so, they would have recognised him as a conman from the get-go.
Dr. Newton's first book is Destiny of Souls. This is case studies of life between lives. I was shocked to see a major portion of the OT3 story recounted here . This guy started hypnotising people in 1947. Another of his books in the same manner is Journey of Souls. Another is Life Between Lives.
These 3 books all contain case histories taken from clients under hypnosis.

Chlng
 

DartSmohen

Silver Meritorious Patron
Barefaced Messiah was the first thing I read of the critical material. It was actually YEARS after I got out of the SO. So I had been in that no man's land of being out because of being ex SO with a huge freeloader bill, getting on with my life, not in comm with any Scientologists, but still sort of semi sorta kinda considering myself a Scientologist without really thinking about it. That book was the perfect thing to start on. It wasn't rabid, but it sure presented a lot of information in a very rational matter of fact way, all backed up with evidence. By the time I got halfway through it, I was ready to delve into the rest of it. It's a great place to start if you want a good overview of the man who created Scientology, and a great one to give to friends who have their doubts about being in or out. Highly reccomended.

I remember when Russell Miller came to interview me for material for his book.

To be fair, I was not really impressed by the guy. I thought there was a lot more material he could have used.

Personally, I like Piece of Blue Sky, written by John Atack. I gave him a lot of material for that book.

Dart
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
According to Amazon info, (click book, and click in one page), Michael Newton was born in 1931, and 'Journey of Souls' was published in 1994.

http://www.amazon.com/Journey-Souls-Studies-Between-Lives/dp/1567184855

If anyone can post pertinent excerpts, that would be interesting.

There's a copy or two at www.scribd.com, but not in English. However, you can find an English cached version in Google, but it is unformatted text. I.e. no line breaks. Not one in 100+ pages.

...I've been reading the first few pages. Wowsah. This is interesting! Put this search term into Google (NOT straight into the browser address bar) >>>www.scribd.com/doc/10130879/Michael-Newton-Journey-of-Souls<<< and then click on the Cached button for the first hit, then you can copy the entire unformatted book and paste it into Wordpad or something to read it.

Paul
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Journey of Souls:

Fascinating book. The first 55 pages are currently available (properly formatted!) at Google Books.

If you Google >>>"I shoot up like a column of light and I'm on my way."<<< and click on the Google Books link you'll get straight to it.

Paul

EDIT: I'm not sure how Google excerpts these books. I searched for a different section as a diagram was missing from that unformatted version and it showed a different 50 pages or so. Maybe it is possible to read the entire book online via Google Books if you play around with it a bit. I'm about halfway through the entire book right now. I still find it fascinating. There is a good summary in bullet point form here (based on what I have read so far), although the original author does not use the word "heaven" like it is used in the review.
 
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Rmack

Van Allen Belt Sunbather
I worked for Bent at the Riverside Mission in the seventies, where I also did my first cult course. I read his book in a single sitting (well, mostly lying) and it is what finally released me from the clutches of this maniac. Sort of a tidy, full circle thing.

I have my hardcover copy that I bought shortly after it went out, where LRH jr. was still being credited.

What is in the latest additions? Do they still contain LRH jr's stuff?

I thought I heard that some stuff had been edited out. Is that very disturbing section where the girl gets sort of passively raped in a sex-magic vampirism incident on the top floor of the Manor still in?

Does anyone know what, if anything has been taken out? How about new stuff that might not be in my addition?
 

Challenge

Silver Meritorious Patron
Journey of Souls:

Fascinating book. The first 55 pages are currently available (properly formatted!) at Google Books.

If you Google >>>"I shoot up like a column of light and I'm on my way."<<< and click on the Google Books link you'll get straight to it.

Paul

Thanks, Paul. My 'puter skills aren't up to much other than straight ahead posting. I don't know how to make an Avatar. I don't know how to copypasta.
I don't know how to post links. Or Smilies.
So thank you for directing the interested ones to the link.

chlng
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
I remember when Russell Miller came to interview me for material for his book.

To be fair, I was not really impressed by the guy. I thought there was a lot more material he could have used.

Personally, I like Piece of Blue Sky, written by John Atack. I gave him a lot of material for that book.

Dart

I read A Piece of Blue Sky first because that was my era, and I knew Jon. I needed to relate my experiences to that of others I knew. Then I read Messiah or Madman, and finally Bare Faced Messiah. Yes, there was a lot of detail that could have been included in the latter, but OMG - just reading about Hubbtoad's early life is such an eye-opener. If you want to get an overview of his delusions, I recommend it.

Your posts here also fill in the gaps, thanks mate!
 

Veda

Sponsor
I worked for Bent at the Riverside Mission in the seventies, where I also did my first cult course. I read his book in a single sitting (well, mostly lying) and it is what finally released me from the clutches of this maniac. Sort of a tidy, full circle thing.

I have my hardcover copy that I bought shortly after it went out, where LRH jr. was still being credited.

What is in the latest additions? Do they still contain LRH jr's stuff?

I thought I heard that some stuff had been edited out. Is that very disturbing section where the girl gets sort of passively raped in a sex-magic vampirism incident on the top floor of the Manor still in?

Does anyone know what, if anything has been taken out? How about new stuff that might not be in my addition?

There are about 5 pages from Ron Jr. in the book, and an explanation as to what happened to Ron Jr. in the Preface. The 2nd and 3rd editions have an expanded Introduction in which Bent Corydon explains his own situation.

With successive editions (1987, 1992, 1996) the books grows from 402 pages to 460 pages to 464 pages. Some chapters were reformatted slightly, and some chapters rearranged, plus about 60 pages or so added - including a new Index in the hardbound red and orange cover (1996) 3rd edition, plus a lot of detailed footnote material.

There is also a hardbound 2005 Russian language edition distributed by a Moscow publisher.

http://forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=11732&postcount=1

There's no scan (that I've ever seen) of anything but the 1987 edition, and that scan is pretty crude (made, I think, in 1998). It would be nice to have a readable scan of the 1996 third edition.
 

justaguy

Patron Meritorious
Bare faced messiah was the first real piece of hardcore, non-xenu criticism of Scientology I read. Converted me into a critic right off. Recommended. The other stuff was like "so what if they believe in aliens? Lots of people do.".
 

AnonOrange

Gold Meritorious Patron
EDIT: I'm not sure how Google excerpts these books.

The get the books scanned and OCR'ed in India. Initially you see the scanned version, and very rarely you see the hand of the scanner.

About a year ago I saw such a scanned image, which clearly showed the hand of an Indian woman, with hentai tattoos and jewelry.
 
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