BBC and Mike Rinder

Pascal

Silver Meritorious Patron
Why doesn't the BBC try and interview Mike Rinder at the COS?

They could do a scoop on his blow and send the COS PR machine down in flames.
 

OHTEEATE

Silver Meritorious Patron
Mike Rinder

Mike Rinder is taking a break. I think he knows who to talk to if he decides to talk to the press. Or get a book published. Right now he is resting up and putting his life back together. I'm pretty sure when he decides what he wants to do, he will do the right thing. When I first got out, talking to the press was not something I immediately wanted to do. It took a couple of years to get to that point.:yes:
 

Björkist

Silver Meritorious Patron
Mike Rinder is taking a break. I think he knows who to talk to if he decides to talk to the press. Or get a book published. Right now he is resting up and putting his life back together. I'm pretty sure when he decides what he wants to do, he will do the right thing. When I first got out, talking to the press was not something I immediately wanted to do. It took a couple of years to get to that point.:yes:


Although very likely needed and deserved, "taking a break" is open to interpretation. Is he actually considered a "blown staff member"?
 

OHTEEATE

Silver Meritorious Patron
blown

I don't read the official sites, which would not PR it any way. He is blown, and probably for good. I would think a comm line in to his wife would be the next target, to see if she desires to join him on the outside. It's a rough situation. I recently re-read all the stuff they make you sign when you are routing out or leaving quickly(technically a blow). We were told we had to sign documents that said we were psychotic. Knowing I had previously signed Introspection Rundown waivers, I refused to sign. I also refused to sign docs that said I agreed not to live in the Tampa Bay area. How un-American is THAT? Donna and I were side by side reading this crap, with an MAA watching us. We looked at each other often, and pointed out stuff in the "fine print" that we were not signing, or crossing out sections. The CofS may have the idea that their legal brilliance will carry them through, but I assure you, if any judge or jury saw these documents, and picked them apart for Constitutionality, they would NOT stand up for long. These cult members live in a fantasy world, supported with parishoners who are also living a protected pseudo-life of "us and them", giving their money to prevent the destruction of all that is good. What a devious crock of shit. Mike Rinder is probably in shock at what he was into his entire adult life. I'm inclined to be patient with him.
 

Little Bear Victor

Silver Meritorious Patron
Although very likely needed and deserved, "taking a break" is open to interpretation. Is he actually considered a "blown staff member"?

From the COS point of view he is considered "blown, armed and dangerous."

From his viewpoint he probably is "blown, tired and desperate."

Blown: That part is straightforward. When you leave and don't return you are considered blown. Especially when the Church does not know where you are. (I don't know if they do or don't; that's beside the point.)

Tired: If you look at the BBC interview videos where he is in the background you can see how he looked for the past couple of years before he blew. And the BBC footage is probably with make-up on. If you had had as little sleep as he did for the last several years, in addition to mental and physical abuse, you would be tired too. Sick and tired.

Desperate: You would be if your wife was held in the Hall and you were not allowed to communicate to her, nor would you be allowed to communicate to your daughter. You'd think of some handling eventually. And let me assure you, it won't be to go back there.

That is of course my evaluation. But at least it is well-founded.

Are you expecting a personal letter from him before you believe it?

(Or an announcement on the front page of www.scientology.org?)

V
 

Björkist

Silver Meritorious Patron
From the COS point of view he is considered "blown, armed and dangerous."

From his viewpoint he probably is "blown, tired and desperate."

Blown: That part is straightforward. When you leave and don't return you are considered blown. Especially when the Church does not know where you are. (I don't know if they do or don't; that's beside the point.)

Tired: If you look at the BBC interview videos where he is in the background you can see how he looked for the past couple of years before he blew. And the BBC footage is probably with make-up on. If you had had as little sleep as he did for the last several years, in addition to mental and physical abuse, you would be tired too. Sick and tired.

Desperate: You would be if your wife was held in the Hall and you were not allowed to communicate to her, nor would you be allowed to communicate to your daughter. You'd think of some handling eventually. And let me assure you, it won't be to go back there.

That is of course my evaluation. But at least it is well-founded.

Are you expecting a personal letter from him before you believe it?

(Or an announcement on the front page of www.scientology.org?)

V


Yeah he definitely started to have BIs in some of the recent videos I saw. He smiled at interviewers but you could see the "things" going on in behind his eyes.

Eyes are truly windows to the thetan.

No, I am not expecting an announcement on Scientology's homepage or personal letter from Mike...although, if he did write me I would be thrilled.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Yeah he definitely started to have BIs in some of the recent videos I saw. He smiled at interviewers but you could see the "things" going on in behind his eyes.

Eyes are truly windows to the thetan.

No, I am not expecting an announcement on Scientology's homepage or personal letter from Mike...although, if he did write me I would be thrilled.

Why? It's possible he's a nice guy, but, his entire claim to fame is being an abject flunky for a bug-shit-crazy UFO Cult who specialized in overseeing harrassments ranging from the repulsively petty to the horrifically depraved.

It's not even about his competence in his 'office', since he functioned through the period of the collapse of 'Church' ability to terrorize its enemies into silence.

He tortured his 'juniors' and allowed himself to be beaten by his 'leader'. I see little admirable in the man.

He may be a 'nice guy', but he's also a moral and human cripple. Of his own making and with his own assistance.

Zinj
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Why? It's possible he's a nice guy, but, his entire claim to fame is being an abject flunky for a bug-shit-crazy UFO Cult who specialized in overseeing harrassments ranging from the repulsively petty to the horrifically depraved.

It's not even about his competence in his 'office', since he functioned through the period of the collapse of 'Church' ability to terrorize its enemies into silence.

He tortured his 'juniors' and allowed himself to be beaten by his 'leader'. I see little admirable in the man.

He may be a 'nice guy', but he's also a moral and human cripple. Of his own making and with his own assistance.

Zinj

I'll extend on this. After a lifetime of being at the *center* of the Scientology abomination, Mike Rinder did not leave because of some moral revelation, but, because the same 'Ethics' that he had applied to others was about to be applied to him. He left, abandoning his family to the inevitable retaliation by a system that he himself had helped structure and which he had ruthlesslessly enforced on others.

Mike Rinder did not leave because he recognized that the 'system' was evil or in recognition of his own 'bad acts', he left because the same system he had helped construct and had operated for decades was about to be turned on him.

Are there human failings that would excuse his own culpability? Well, as a Scientologist, he *should* be taking responsibility for *everything*, but, that's not bloody likely :)

Yes, he was a miserable indoctrinated water-carrier who was only following orders, but, he is not showing *any* remorse that I know of, and, considering his position, he could pretty much single-handedly collapse the horror he spent his life constructing, which would *free* thousands of people still held hostage, including his own family.

But, does he do that? Nah. Mike Rinder may be out, but, he's only out for himself.

Zinj
 

everfree

Patron Meritorious
Mike Rinder did not leave because he recognized that the 'system' was evil or in recognition of his own 'bad acts', he left because the same system he had helped construct and had operated for decades was about to be turned on him.

Do you talk to him often? Otherwise, how would you know what he does or doesn't think.

Yes, he was a miserable indoctrinated water-carrier who was only following orders, but, he is not showing *any* remorse that I know of,

Based on?

and, considering his position, he could pretty much single-handedly collapse the horror he spent his life constructing, which would *free* thousands of people still held hostage, including his own family.

But, does he do that? Nah. Mike Rinder may be out, but, he's only out for himself.

Zinj

I know when I first got off staff, I didn't want to do anything. I was in total shock. I felt free at last with a huge burden lifted off me but still in a state of shock at what I'd been through. I felt like curling in a ball and panting from relief. The very last thing in the world that I wanted was to throw myself back into some sort of fray. I quietly, determinedly step by step started rebuilding my life.

Although I was in CofS extremely deep, I didn't have nearly the hill to climb that Rinder does to get a life back. At least I had my own place to live, a family outside CofS, still a few close non-CofS friends, though not many. Most everybody I knew I left behind, but at least I didn't have to leave a spouse.

Rinder undoubtedly has a lot to atone for, but give him some time. We'll see what happens.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
I've spent 10 years ranting against the theory that anyone leaving Scientology must immediately work against Scientology.

It's lost me friends.

Mike Rinder is a *very very very* different case.

He is so central to the abuses of the 'Church' that the *only* acceptable course of action for him is to find a lawyer and begin negotiations with the FBI.

I'm quite serious on this.
He is in a position to save thousands of people and hundreds of families from a system he himself helped construct and very directly operated.

The fact that the 'system' turned against him doesn't mean shit, compared to the literally thousands of people it's *still* persecuting.

Zinj
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
I've spent 10 years ranting against the theory that anyone leaving Scientology must immediately work against Scientology.

It's lost me friends.

Mike Rinder is a *very very very* different case.

He is so central to the abuses of the 'Church' that the *only* acceptable course of action for him is to find a lawyer and begin negotiations with the FBI.

I'm quite serious on this.
He is in a position to save thousands of people and hundreds of families from a system he himself helped construct and very directly operated.

The fact that the 'system' turned against him doesn't mean shit, compared to the literally thousands of people it's *still* persecuting.

Zinj

You make a very good point, Zinji.

If he ever gets around to doing a Liability Formula, there is a step on it which was almost always quickied when I was playing the game and reading these things, and most people glibbed over it. It is "Make up the damage...."

That means that in order to MAKE UP the damage, you have to first assess what the damage is. As Zinji points out, in this case it is considerable indeed in terms of the misery he has actively helped create. The making up should be of comparable magnitude to the damage caused.

Yes, he was just following orders, the poor thing, and he couldn't help it. That argument hasn't held water since Nuremberg.

This doesn't mean I hate him. But it does mean I consider that when he comes to his senses a bit after a few months R&R he ought to do something REALLY EFFECTIVE about the mess he helped put there, which he CAN DO considering the posts he held.

Paul
 

Björkist

Silver Meritorious Patron
Zinj, I think you take some of the things I say too seriously...but if they assist you to crawl up on your soap-box...


500soapbox-pic.jpg



(oh hey, I'm in the 700 Cub now!)
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
I've spent 10 years ranting against the theory that anyone leaving Scientology must immediately work against Scientology.

It's lost me friends.

Mike Rinder is a *very very very* different case.

He is so central to the abuses of the 'Church' that the *only* acceptable course of action for him is to find a lawyer and begin negotiations with the FBI.

I'm quite serious on this.
He is in a position to save thousands of people and hundreds of families from a system he himself helped construct and very directly operated.

The fact that the 'system' turned against him doesn't mean shit, compared to the literally thousands of people it's *still* persecuting.

Zinj

I tend to agree. However in my experience it can take a while for the viewpoint to change enough to take action in the opposite direction, if you know what I mean. Because you blow (I did several times) doesn't always mean you suddenly see things from 'the other side'. It's more about saving yourself at the time. Confronting the real consequences of his actions - and then doing something about it - may take some time. I hope he has some help.
 

Björkist

Silver Meritorious Patron
Yeah she's great!

Wasn't bashing you for being off topic or anything...mainly being silly...


What are you listening to, atm?
 
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