Bob Adams - Church of Scientology International Vice-President -- April 2014

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
I think you are missing the point JB is making. I know what you are saying, my sister is a Phd. But Scientology takes real world words like Church, Minister, confessional, for example , that people have an understanding of, but in Scientology they mean something entirely different. They fool people.

Oh I agree. This using a word that everyone thinks they understand in a non-standard way (hello, ethics?) is a hallmark of $cientology. But it's perfectly legit to have honorary titles in a business. Japanese companies do this all the time to senior execs past their prime but not yet ready to retire - as Japanese firms are newbie-to-retirement socialist employment engines. The problem is using that honorary title in public. A make-work VP in Japan would never pretend to be a major officer of the company in public (but then, a Japanese firm would never send a make-work VP out as a mouthpiece).
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
Thanks, Infinite, for providing your excellent insight :thumbsup: and, too, for the written policy.:ohmy:

Here, then, as pared down from the complete policy, are the only available response options a Co$ spokesrep, such as Bob Adams, is authorized to use when dealing with reporters/journalists:

1. Answering non loaded questions
Purpose: To train a PRO to answer such questions with confidence and
simplicity, as are often asked by reporters.
2. No Answer
Purpose: To train a PRO to give a 'no answer' to questions he has no
wish to answer directly.
3. Non sequitur events
Purpose: To enable a PRO to practice getting his "message" across and
tag it on to any current event.
4. Handling a suppressive T.V. interviewer
Purpose: To train a PRO to get his message across in spite of the
'interviewer', in the few short minutes usually available on television.
This is so that .... million people have no doubts after the programme
what the Scientologist stands for and what he is against
5. Handling an SP
a) By overwhelm
Purpose: To train a PRO to be able to establish Ethics presence over an
SP reporter if the occasion arises, by such things as shouting, banging,
pointing, swearing. To do this completely causatively until the poor
reporter is 'caved in'.
b) By being knowingly covertly hostile
Purpose: To train the PRO to handle an SP reporter by word alone without
the use of force as in (a). He uses the word as a rapier and plunges it
in at the reporter, so that the reporter introverts and drops the
question.
c) By stalling for time
Purpose: To train a PRO to maintain his confront and composure when
given some SP sensational news by a reporter, of which he has no prior
knowledge.
d) By handling the reporter in front of you (verbal Karate)
Purpose: To train a PRO to handle the reporter in front of him, with
judgement in present time.


What I see is how, when dealing with a reporter/journalist, a Co$ spokesperson may only:
(1) bluff, (2) avoid, (3) evade, (4) ignore, (5a) physically intimidate, (5b) verbally abuse, (5c) feign ignorance, and (5d) bicker.

But I don't see anything about how a Co$ spokesperson is supposed to tell the truth.
Or how to best present factual information.
Or which 'tech' should be used to befriend a reporter/journalist.
Or how to 'handle' a non-SP reporter/journalist. (<---Although I suppose there is no such thing in the Co$ literature.)


Bob Adams is a spokesperson for Co$/Co$-related groups, and the policy for Co$ spokespeople doesn't authorize telling the truth to reporters/journalists, so... __________? <----YMMV.

JB



Great and valuable cheat sheet for everyone to know when listening to or reading press releases from Scientology's professionally trained con artists.

It would be wonderful for more media outlets and journalists learn about these self-incriminating parts of the cult's holy scripture.

Scientology: The world's only religion with an academy dedicated to training it's members to lie about their beliefs & practices. The academy also affords Scientologists the opportunity to clay demo how lying is the best way to create a world without criminality and insanity.
 

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
JB here is a definitive, over-simplified answer to your question:

His address is listed as the HGB, Suite 1200. That would be the 12th floor of the HGB, which is OSA. All of the 12th floor is OSA, period. Except they MAY have some RTC space, but he is not RTC (no RTC ever speaks, right?).

It looks like he is a PR, which is a separate division of OSA and has nothing to do with the OPs.

OSA OPs people have always been a separate and very secretive unit. Everything they do is super secret and regular staff are not at all informed of anything they are involved in. Ever.

The other divisions of OSA would have no information about what the OPs are doing.

Its has been secretive for the 30 years that I was involved in Scn and the Sea Org. Always. Should have seen the signs, eh?

But I have never seen or heard of Bob Adams. But I have been out since 2004.... ]

Hope this helps.
 

RogerB

Crusader
Thanks, Infinite, for providing your excellent insight :thumbsup: and, too, for the written policy.:ohmy:

. . . Snipped . . .

What I see is how, when dealing with a reporter/journalist, a Co$ spokesperson may only:
(1) bluff, (2) avoid, (3) evade, (4) ignore, (5a) physically intimidate, (5b) verbally abuse, (5c) feign ignorance, and (5d) bicker.

But I don't see anything about how a Co$ spokesperson is supposed to tell the truth.
Or how to best present factual information.
Or which 'tech' should be used to befriend a reporter/journalist.
Or how to 'handle' a non-SP reporter/journalist. (<---Although I suppose there is no such thing in the Co$ literature.)


Bob Adams is a spokesperson for Co$/Co$-related groups, and the policy for Co$ spokespeople doesn't authorize telling the truth to reporters/journalists, so... __________? <----YMMV.

JB

JB, you are being brilliant again :biggrin:

Actually, that (dealing with truth) is something I'd say they should drill the shit out of as that is the foreign item to them . . . but if we analyze that HCO PL and the Scn mind-set, being presented with the truth as SP interviewers do :melodramatic: . . . of course the presented truth has to be handled in the ways you highlighted.

The trap is that the culties can't stand truth and call it lies, hence their perversion in handling it.

The fact is, the truth of the Cof$ is so horrific it can't easily be confronted by decent folks and is easily made look to appear as a little off the wall.

R
 

Veda

Sponsor
President Church or Scientology International Full Hat Check sheet:

http://www.xenu.net/archive/go/heberhat.htm

This is Heber's 1988 Checksheet, done when he re-treaded the course on how to be President of the CSI. It surfaced as the result of some legal action, and - at the time - I was asked to do some paralegal work researching its contents, so I can recall wading through the Green Volumes, plus confidential HCOPLs, plus stacks of confidential Hubbard Propaganda, Intel oobleck, in an attempt to de-code and explain this stuff to a "wog" attorney in a legal battle with Scn Inc.

The check sheet shows that Heber had to, at least, be able to pretend to be an "executive," when confronting the "wogs," many of whom really thought he was the leader of Scientology Inc.

The bulk of the check sheet has to do with PR and Propaganda, which was Heber's main job.

At the same time, the check sheet also included the confidential Hubbard issue, INTELLIGENCE, ITS ROLE of 3 June 1973. http://www.suppressiveperson.org/sp/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/4D-19.pdf

"We are potentially successful beyond the greatest dreams and aspirations of any former Intelligence service in the universe bar none.

'Intelligence furnishes much of the data on which evaluation is based.

"What could be called SUPPORT Intelligence (or attack or offensive Intelligence) is the other side of the coin, and also forms a vital part of Intelligence activities. But here Intelligence is carrying out part of a program furnished by evaluation to command and ordered executed."


So, Heber was expected to have a over-all understanding of Intel in all its aspects, even though he would not be privy to many details in the highly compartmentalized area of on-going Scn Inc. Intel.

Some understanding of Intel, and the relationship between PR and Intel, was necessary, as one of his jobs was covering up, with PR and Propaganda tactics, flubbed Intel operations.

It's interesting that, these days, there doesn't seem to be a President of the CSI, only a Vice President.

Is it possible that Miscavige became jealous of someone being regarded, by the "wogs," as the leader of Scientology, so he eliminated the position of President, leaving only Vice President. After all, no one is going to mistake the Vice President of the CSI with the leader Scn Inc.

Anyway, my guess if that Adams' VP check sheet resembles Heber's old check sheet.

PS: I just did a google image search of 'President of the Church of Scientology' and zero images of President Heber appeared; however, several images of Bob Adams, the VP, were prominent. I think President Heber, and perhaps the office of President, have been "erased":

Scientology1.jpg
 
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Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
<snip>

It's interesting that, these days, there doesn't seem to be President if the CSI, only a Vice President.

Is it possible that Miscavige became jealous of someone being regarded, by the "wogs," as the leader of Scientology, so he eliminated the position of President, leaving only Vice President. After all, no one is going to mistake the Vice President of the CSI with the leader Scn Inc.

<snip>

The current Wikipedia article on Heber still lists him as the President, but also notes that he's not been seen publicly since 2004.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heber_Jentzsch





President_zpsddcce59b.jpg







He's 78 years old now and he told his brother:
"I'll never get out of here alive"
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
JB here is a definitive, over-simplified answer to your question:

His address is listed as the HGB, Suite 1200. That would be the 12th floor of the HGB, which is OSA. All of the 12th floor is OSA, period. Except they MAY have some RTC space, but he is not RTC (no RTC ever speaks, right?).

It looks like he is a PR, which is a separate division of OSA and has nothing to do with the OPs.

OSA OPs people have always been a separate and very secretive unit. Everything they do is super secret and regular staff are not at all informed of anything they are involved in. Ever.

The other divisions of OSA would have no information about what the OPs are doing.

Its has been secretive for the 30 years that I was involved in Scn and the Sea Org. Always. Should have seen the signs, eh?

But I have never seen or heard of Bob Adams. But I have been out since 2004.... ]

Hope this helps.

Thanks, Bea Kiddo; your efforts never fail to educate/enlighten me (<--not an easy task, btw, lol) and I'm greatly appreciative. :thumbsup:

First, let's make sure the acronyms used are understood by us all.

HGB = Hollywood Guarantee Building, for those who didn't/don't know.

OPs as used above and elsewhere may refer to:
"OSA OPs" = OSA Operations Unit (Example sentence: "The folks in OSA OPs borrowed the office vacuum cleaner again.")
"OPs" = Operatives (Ex.: "Those three people? Yep, they're OPs from up on the 12th floor.")
"OPs" = Operations (Ex.: "Yep, I heard they ran some hush-hush OPs in Nevada, but now they're back in L.A.")

So far, so good?

I'd thought there were 2 separate OSA departments: Public Relations ("PR") and Legal.
I'd thought that, generally speaking, PR managed media for CSI & all of the Co$ front groups, while Legal managed lawsuits & protesters.
I'd thought that, Legal was the only department with the OPs staff/dirty tricks playbook.

Is there an OPs staff under/within the PR department, too?
Are there only 2 departments in OSA - PR & Legal - or are there more?

CSI, I'd thought, was the international Corporation itself.
1 international Corporate Division = OSA. (Many other international/domestic corporate divisions exist.)
OSA International Division = 2 Departments (PR & Legal)

Bob Adams, "VP of CSI" = Ill-defined title (whether intentional or not.)

After reading BeaKiddo's post above that confirms Bob Adams works on the 12th Floor of HGB,
and taking the "Spokesperson" title from the CSI current website page Type4_PTS kindly provided,
it seems a more correct title after Bob Adams' name might be any 1 of the 4 below:

"VP of CSI, and Spokesperson, OSA Division, PR Department"
"VP of CSI, and Spokesperson, OSA Division, PR Department, OPs Unit"
"VP of CSI, and Spokesperson, OSA Division, Legal Department"
"VP of CSI, and Spokesperson, OSA Division, Legal Department, OPs Unit"

As depicted in the short video clip in Post #1 of this thread, Bob Adams appeared at a public Zoning Board meeting in Georgia and introduced himself as "Vice President of the Church of Scientology".

Had he instead uttered the words, "Office of Special Affairs" the word "special" would have raised a red flag in the minds of more than one non-scientologist in that room. Red flags would have prompted questions from the attendees/zoning officials, and Bob Adams would have had to address those questions....using the 'PR tech" described in earlier posts. <---Footbullet(s) and toe pain, guaranteed.

And if he'd dared to utter "OPs Unit"? The public-at-large is well-acquainted with the phrase "black ops" -- enough to know it connotes 'something shady'. Red flags would yet wave, alarm bells would yet ring, and the video snippet in Post #1 would have been much longer...with a decidedly higher view count. Footbulletry run amok always makes for viral-sized viewing stats; people do love to watch liars squirm when they get called-out.

Whoever Bob Adams is, he works for a group that does not authorize him to tell the truth, so he, along with anyone he speaks to in his role as "spokesperson" is the poorer for it. That's not fair to anyone involved.

JB




 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
JB, you are being brilliant again :biggrin:

Actually, that (dealing with truth) is something I'd say they should drill the shit out of as that is the foreign item to them . . . but if we analyze that HCO PL and the Scn mind-set, being presented with the truth as SP interviewers do :melodramatic: . . . of course the presented truth has to be handled in the ways you highlighted.

The trap is that the culties can't stand truth and call it lies, hence their perversion in handling it.

The fact is, the truth of the Cof$ is so horrific it can't easily be confronted by decent folks and is easily made look to appear as a little off the wall.

R

I can understand wanting to get a group's message(s) out into the world.
I can understand wanting to get a group's factual information correctly reported by journalists, too.

What that policy authorizes & condones, however, does nothing to further the 2 understandable aims above.

To read and "drill" the PR policy, over and over and over again, produces David Miscavige's Nightline appearance in 1990 (-ish).
And every Tommy Davis media interview I've ever seen. (20 or so.) Especially the interviews with the BBC's John Sweeney.

No viewer of average intellect & life experience can look at David Miscavige's interview on Nightline, for example, and later articulate correctly: what DM's message was or what factual information he presented.

However, Bob Adams' brief appearance at the Zoning Board in Georgia, is an excellent example of how a simple job title - "vice president" - can be used to evade the minefield of natural doubt indigenous to minds untouched by scientology's corrosive effects. In one sense, Bob Adams 'got over' more effectively on that small Georgia audience using two little words, than did David Miscavige in 60 televised minutes broadcast to millions.

JB
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
I'd thought there were 2 separate OSA departments: Public Relations ("PR") and Legal.
I'd thought that, generally speaking, PR managed media for CSI & all of the Co$ front groups, while Legal managed lawsuits & protesters.
I'd thought that, Legal was the only department with the OPs staff/dirty tricks playbook.

Is there an OPs staff under/within the PR department, too?
Are there only 2 departments in OSA - PR & Legal - or are there more?

Here's how I remember it to be. My info is 25 years old though so if there have been changes - someone please correct me.

Within a regular CoS there is 1 department that is called the Department of Special Affairs, and it includes PR, Legal, as well as Intelligence functions. (possibly some others as well). All these areas work together to achieve the same purpose, "handling situations which result in the total acceptance of Scientology and its Founder throughout the area".

There's policies that instruct on how you decide whether to handle a situation with PR, Intel, or Legal, and probably included in the post Veda made for the checksheet of the President.

The OPs could be carried out by Intel, or farmed out to 3'rd parties including PI's.

And while PR, Intel, and Legal work together to accomplish the same objective I imagine that what Bea said is true. Not all the OSA personnel will be aware of the OPs that are carried out. The info is compartmentalized, just as within any other intelligence agency.
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
My recall is that OSA, the GO replacement, hired back some 'volunteer' criminals who were convicted and are currently wearing their voluntary criminal hats again, and that the GO and thus OSA actually had/has 7 divisions per Hubbard's spiraling awareness levels (7x7x7 = 342 or some LRH math answer..:biggrin: (reference would be the Org bd and livingness tape and related HCOPLs) . I think I have only seen 5 of the divisions published and they were IIRC known as Bureaus most commonly mentioned in OSA circles as B1, B2, B3 etc. Of course for the 'wog' world these would be further masked as VP, Director etc. These would correspond in some semblance to the 7 division org board of any Class V org. At least that is my understanding. I was not privy to the "network' issues/organizational doc's but I have run across an occasional one or more online.

Keep in mind that at least as I understand it 'musical chairs' and top level cabals and 'coups' were taking place often in accordance who would/could claim the most "commode door intention' often stated in the scionacular as 'command intention'. :yes::headspin: Everyone in the "SO' is an elite, until someone else is. Right davey M boy?? the most elitist is whoever can "assume power" :punch::catfight: the best!
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
These are the reasons he cannot be trusted.

When kids are being targeted, well let's just say I get worked up.

Oops forgot link BRB

http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=23997

Wow - thanks, Daisy! :thumbsup::clap::thumbsup:

And here we are, 8 years later.
Can the public-at-large see evidence that Bob Adams' direct recruitment efforts produced 10 new members of Co$? 100? 1000? 10,000?
Can the public-at-large see evidence that anyone directly recruited for membership in CoS by Bob Adams, whether 8 years ago or last week, has contributed anything worthwhile which positively benefits any other person (or living creature) in a town, state, country, continent, and/or Earth?

I see Jillian Schlesinger.
I see Leah Remini.
I see Chris Shelton.
I see Tory Magoo.
I see Denise Brennan.
I see Karen#1.
I see Lori Hodges.

I don't see Bob Adams, or anyone working on behalf of Co$, because they are not authorized to be seen as they really are - either to me or to themselves. And it's the latter that is the worst harm.
Every person is entitled to see themselves completely as s/he is... except when that basic human entitlement is stolen.
Thieves steal, that's what they do.
Thievery as a spiritual aim to greatness - or greater beingness? Bullsh*t.
Thievery as espoused within an applied philosophy? Bullsh*t, double serving.
"Giving" a complete person "tools" to help steal larger and larger chunks until the person is eventually incomplete? That's bullsh*t scientology-style.

JB
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
My recall is that OSA, the GO replacement, hired back some 'volunteer' criminals who were convicted and are currently wearing their voluntary criminal hats again,
<snip>

According to Marty, former GO staff member George Pilat, is now serving as a public person doing work as a private investigator.

This is snipped from a post Marty wrote back in 2010:

Recently, I obtained documentary evidence that two unindicted co-conspirators from the DC 9 case are being used by OSA to run warfare against dissent on the internet and in the media. The DC 9 case is US v Mary Sue Hubbard, and eight other high level Guardian’s Office Officials. In 1978 they were convicted of Obstruction of Justice for kidnapping a witness who ultimately blew the whistle on the Guardian’s Office’s ten year massive intelligence ops against government officials and private citizens.


Former Guardian’s Office Bureau One (Intelligence) staff George Pilat and Bruce Ullman started a company in Clearwater Florida several years ago. It is aptly named Intelligence Network Online, Inc. (aka Intnet Online, address: intnet.net). Here is what the sentencing memorandum submitted by the Department of Justice to the US Federal District Court in the DC 9 case disclosed about George:



In February 1977, the Guardian’s Office promulgated Guardian Program Order 1017 entitled “ARM (Anti-Religion Movement) Clean Sweep.” (Document no. 13724.) It was written by unindicted co-conspirator George Pilat for defendants Heldt, Weigand and Budlong, and promulgated by fugitive defendant Jane Kember, the Guardian World-Wide. That order caIled for the placement of “covert agents” for “data collection lines” with anti-cult groups. (Id at 1) It provided, however, that only defendant Heldt and Weigand could authorize the use by other bureaus of the Guardian’s Office of the documents so obtained. (Id at 2)


Ullman was involved directly with the government witness who ultimately was kidnapped and falsely imprisoned by the GO (Guardian’s Office) in an attempt to cover up the hundreds of crimes he ultimately disclosed. Incidentally, Kendrick Moxon, Esq (in house attorney currently for OSA INT) was also named an unindicted co-conspirator for his role in the conspiracy to obstruct justice. The same fellow for whom the recently posted (and all OSA Intel programs) OSA Intel program on Tory Christman justified the stamp “Attorney-Client Privilege”. He, along with Eliott Abelson are the cats referred to in the vital target to “clear all handlings with counsel.”



For the past couple decades Pilat has done private investigator work for OSA. For the past several years, and continuing in present time, Pilat and his partner are running Internet Dark Ops out of Intelligence Network Online, Inc. Directed at yours truly and friends, and even folks who consider themselves foes of mine (but won’t any longer when the dust finally settles and all OSA trolls and operatives are outed).

<snip>
Full Post: http://markrathbun.wordpress.com/20...rk-online-inc-radical-scientology-covert-ops/
 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
Thanks, Cakemaker, for providing a bit more guidance on this topic. :thumbsup:

The thing is, when someone like Bob Adams addresses a group of non-scientologists (as he did in the video in Post #1 of this thread) and he tells them he is the "Vice President" of CSI, the people in the group already have a working definition/understanding of what a vice-president is, so they don't ask for the Co$-approved definition of what a vice-president is, does, or where that title is positioned within the Co$ managerial infrastructure.

And when Bob Adams doesn't volunteer the Co$-approved definition for "Vice President" to a group of non-scientologists,
he is relying upon the group's 'ignorance'.
That's
objectionable to all fair-minded, decent people.

But is Bob Adams authorized to provide non-scientologists with the Co$-approved definition of any title/job?
No, I don't think he, or any other Co$ spokesperson, is.
Certainly not if he's following the policy Infinite kindly posted earlier.

"John Johnson, VP General Motors" is understandable. John is a big shot.
"John Johnson, VP Dodge Division, General Motors" is understandable. John is a semi-big shot.
"John Johnson, VP General Motors" is dishonest if John is actually only VP of Dodge Division, not all of General Motors.

"Bob Adams, VP of CSI" is a dishonest representation to 99.9% of the public-at-large who read/hear it.
It would be far less dishonest if it was written/stated:
"Bob Adams, VP OSA Division 6, PR Dept., CSI" <---If that's truly his position; I'm just using it to better illustrate the point.

"Bob Adams, Ex-scientologist, Newest ESMB member" is, of course, a future option, too. :rock:

JB

Exactly right. The post titles are really meant to mislead.
A similar thing happens in Celebrity Centers and at Flag. The post of "Captain" sounds impressive (from the old Sea Org ship days when a captain was a captain). The "captain" post was created to interface with the public so that they believe that someone in authority is paying them attention. In fact it is the "Commanding Officer" who has the power and is not easily accessible to the average Joe.

As far as truth in Scientology goes, the truism that there is an equal and opposite policy for anything, applies.
There is a PR Series issue called 'The Missing Ingredient' that has these quotes,

...
The tremendous power of newspapers, magazines, radio, TV and modern "mass media" communication is guided by the PRs of special interests and they guide with lies.
Thus PR is corrupted to "a technique of lying convincingly."
It makes a cynical world. It has smashed idealism, patriotism and morality.
...
The more lies you use in PR the more likely it is that the PR will recoil.
Thus the law
NEVER USE LIES IN PR.
...
Don't tell a lie to city officials when the truth is just as easy to tell. Why go to all the work of dreaming up a lie? If you do, it will weaken you if it is found out that it is a lie. Now you do have a PR problem with the "official public."
...
Handling truth is a touchy business also. You don't have to tell everything you know – that would jam the comm line too. Tell an acceptable truth.
Agreement with one's message is what PR is seeking to achieve. Thus the message must compare to the personal experience of the audience.
So PR becomes the technique of communicating an acceptable truth – and which will attain the desirable result.
If there's no chance of obtaining a desirable result and the truth would injure, then talk about something else.
PR is employed to obtain a result desired by the PR and his group.
Or it is employed to cancel out the undesirable PR of others.
Thus there is offensive and defensive PR.
In defending against hostile PR, once more it is the R that counts. Sun Tzu in his book about warfare gives several types of agent. One of these is the "dead agent" because he tells lies to the enemy and when they find out they will kill him.
Hostile (or counter PR) is usually the usual fabric of lies.
If one finds out the lies being told and documents just one as being false, he has made counter PR recoil. His hearer will never believe him again. He's dead.
 

Veda

Sponsor
Exactly right. The post titles are really meant to mislead.
A similar thing happens in Celebrity Centers and at Flag. The post of "Captain" sounds impressive (from the old Sea Org ship days when a captain was a captain). The "captain" post was created to interface with the public so that they believe that someone in authority is paying them attention. In fact it is the "Commanding Officer" who has the power and is not easily accessible to the average Joe.

As far as truth in Scientology goes, the truism that there is an equal and opposite policy for anything, applies.
There is a PR Series issue called 'The Missing Ingredient' that has these quotes,

That's from PR Series 2. In PR Series 1, Hubbard explains that there's PR of PR.

It's necessary to read the rest of the PR issues, including confidential PR and Propaganda issues, plus confidential Intel issues, to see how this all fits together. :)

I'll post these links of an earlier discussion on the general topic. (This was a quick re-post, and the link function has changed, on ESMB, since these links were made, but the info is still there.)

#1: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392325&postcount=38

#2: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392327&postcount=39

#3: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392331&postcount=40
 

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
JB, your information is spot on. Ops is Operations. And yes, it is quite separated from everything else. People who work in that Dept have always been secretive and segrigated.

-------

Now, CSI, is another story. And more acronyms:

FCB (Flag Command Bureaux) which is at the HGB (Hollywood Guarantee Building), at Hollywood and Ivar in LA, has many divisions:

OSA
FB (International Management arm for Orgs)
SMI (International Management for Missions)
IHELP (International Management for Field Auditors)
ABLE (International management for - ugh, whatever Able does... I forget! Is it School stuff and Way to Happiness. CREEEEEEEKKKKK as my brain tries to work).
WISE (International management for the cult running of non-cult businesses, etc etc).

ALL OF THESE UNITS ABOVE are CSI.

Then you have CS WUS, which would be the Western United States version of the same things. Then you have CS EUS, which is Eastern US version of the same things (for example all of those units listed above are in the branches - ABLE WUS, WISE EUS, etc etc). Same with CS EU (Europe) Af (Africa). All of them have OSA divisions OSA WUS, OSA EUS, etc.

Most of the postitions are also mirrored down into the orgs, such as the DSA who represents OSA. In my unexperienced opinion, DSA's are not the same secretive OSA Ops (as much) as the ones higher up, who deal with the more gory stuff, so to speak.


-------

So, even if someone sued and won against CSI and bankrupted it, there are hundreds, maybe even thousands of other registered orgs/businesses. Like a lizard that regrows its tail.

Hope this helps and does not confuse.
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
JB, your information is spot on. Ops is Operations. And yes, it is quite separated from everything else. People who work in that Dept have always been secretive and segrigated.

-------

Now, CSI, is another story. And more acronyms:

FCB (Flag Command Bureaux) which is at the HGB (Hollywood Guarantee Building), at Hollywood and Ivar in LA, has many divisions:

OSA
FB (International Management arm for Orgs)
SMI (International Management for Missions)
IHELP (International Management for Field Auditors)
ABLE (International management for - ugh, whatever Able does... I forget! Is it School stuff and Way to Happiness. CREEEEEEEKKKKK as my brain tries to work).
WISE (International management for the cult running of non-cult businesses, etc etc).

ALL OF THESE UNITS ABOVE are CSI.

Then you have CS WUS, which would be the Western United States version of the same things. Then you have CS EUS, which is Eastern US version of the same things (for example all of those units listed above are in the branches - ABLE WUS, WISE EUS, etc etc). Same with CS EU (Europe) Af (Africa). All of them have OSA divisions OSA WUS, OSA EUS, etc.

Most of the postitions are also mirrored down into the orgs, such as the DSA who represents OSA. In my unexperienced opinion, DSA's are not the same secretive OSA Ops (as much) as the ones higher up, who deal with the more gory stuff, so to speak.


-------

So, even if someone sued and won against CSI and bankrupted it, there are hundreds, maybe even thousands of other registered orgs/businesses. Like a lizard that regrows its tail.

Hope this helps and does not confuse.

Terrific info, Bea Kiddo, and it's very helpful. :hattip::thumbsup:

Using the above info, let's apply it to Bob Adams (and any other individual who serves as a "VP of CSI") in a regular corporate example.

If CSI = General Motors Corporation, then...

OSA = Pontiac Division Int'l.
FB = Opel Division Int'l.
SMI = Cadillac Division Int'l.
IHELP = Hummer Division Int'l.
ABLE = Chevrolet Division Int'l.
WISE = Buick Division Int'l.

CS WUS = GM US-Western Dealership(s) Territory
CS EUS = GM US-Eastern Dealership(s) Territory
CS EU = GM Europoean Dealerships(s) Territory
CS Af = GM African Dealership(s) Territory

Org-based DSA = Local Pontiac Dealership

With me, so far?

John Johnson, VP of General Motors Corporation, has control over 6 International Car Divisions and additionally, 4 huge Dealership Territories.
John Johnson wields tremendous power/control over an extensive amount of people who work for/on behalf of General Motors Corporation.

To a non-scientologist who has just read the above conversion cheat-sheet,
Bob Adams, "VP of CSI", would wield a corresponding amount of power/control
as exercised by John Johnson: 6 Int'l. Divisions & 4 Territories.

But Bob Adams didn't truthfully inform the Zoning Board group in Georgia.
That is, he didn't provide those nice Georgians with the long list all of the sub-entities over which CSI has authority.
He didn't truthfully inform those people - instead, he relied on their using their own definition of "vice president" to evade/avoid simple doubt.

Bob Adams (or any VP of CSI) is not authorized by Co$ to tell non-scientologists that he wields substantial power for 2 primary reasons:

(a) he really doesn't wield actual power/control over anyone else in any meaningful way, or even (sadly) over his own thoughts/feelings; and,
(b) only one person in Co$ wields power/control and it's not Bob Adams.

Doubt is the much-feared enemy of all liars -- those who know they're lying and those who don't.
Doubt is also the best friend of people who've found their way to ESMB and/or out of scientology. :yes:

Type4_PTS posted about the "Intel" component of OSA.
I think he's correct, and will need to reconfigure what I've previously posted.

Should it read thus:
OSA Division = 3 Departments: PR, Legal, and Intel.

Or is Intel a Support Division, serving (and subservient to) the Main Divisions, PR & Legal?

JB
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
Exactly right. The post titles are really meant to mislead.
A similar thing happens in Celebrity Centers and at Flag. The post of "Captain" sounds impressive (from the old Sea Org ship days when a captain was a captain). The "captain" post was created to interface with the public so that they believe that someone in authority is paying them attention. In fact it is the "Commanding Officer" who has the power and is not easily accessible to the average Joe.

As far as truth in Scientology goes, the truism that there is an equal and opposite policy for anything, applies.
There is a PR Series issue called 'The Missing Ingredient' that has these quotes,

Yes, Cakemaker, the job/position titles mislead no matter, it seems, the place/post/building/ship/etc.

We've only been able to pin down two current titles for Bob Adams: "Vice President of CSI" and "Spokesperson".
And that he works in Suite 1200 of the HGB, previously identified as the same floor as OSA offices are located.

Has anyone seen or been sent any flyers that advertise Bob Adams giving a talk or making a presentation or attending a graduation or anything else? That would help us all figure out what other job functions/job titles he currently performs.

JB
 

aegerprimo

Summa Cum Laude
Great and valuable cheat sheet for everyone to know when listening to or reading press releases from Scientology's professionally trained con artists.

It would be wonderful for more media outlets and journalists learn about these self-incriminating parts of the cult's holy scripture.

Scientology: The world's only religion with an academy dedicated to training it's members to lie about their beliefs & practices. The academy also affords Scientologists the opportunity to clay demo how lying is the best way to create a world without criminality and insanity.

JBWriter!

I hope you don't mind, but I posted a cut-and-paste of your "cheat sheet" at the Underground Bunker - http://tonyortega.org/2014/04/11/ve...david-love-and-two-others/#comment-1332671301

I mentioned that you compiled this list for this thread with a link.
 

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
Oops, I probably should have said this to start with: The position of President or Vice President in Scn is purely and strictly a PR position and has nothing to do with the day to day operations of the church, including CSI, etc.

For example when Heber was President of CSI, he would never ever ever give orders or instructions to staff relating to the running of any org. He was a spokesperson for the church and, from staff on the inside, a highly respected person.

We would not bow down or listen to his orders, but when he spoke, we liked to listen, out of respect, plus because he always had interesting stories to tell.

It is the same with the President of CC Int. She (or he) has NOTHING to do with the management of the org whatsoever. She is a PR facing person who represents Scn to non-Scnists.

Of course all of this is FAIL, but they fail to see that.
 
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