Can Mosey Get an Order to Depose David Miscavige?

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
Thank you Lulu Belle, Bea Kiddo, ThetanExterior, and Lone Star for taking the time to provide such comprehensive answers about 'sec checks'. :biggrin:
Apologies & thanks to all who read this thread and have tolerated my derail, too.

Now, with a more solid understanding of the 'sec check' process-as-practiced, it's much easier to see how important Mercy Lingenfelter's declaration is to tying David Miscavige directly to the harassment alleged in Texas.

I'm still writing out my questions for all of the other declarations, but I'll post 'em on the other thread so as not to further derail here.

JB
 

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
Thank you Lulu Belle, Bea Kiddo, ThetanExterior, and Lone Star for taking the time to provide such comprehensive answers about 'sec checks'. :biggrin:
Apologies & thanks to all who read this thread and have tolerated my derail, too.

Now, with a more solid understanding of the 'sec check' process-as-practiced, it's much easier to see how important Mercy Lingenfelter's declaration is to tying David Miscavige directly to the harassment alleged in Texas.

I'm still writing out my questions for all of the other declarations, but I'll post 'em on the other thread so as not to further derail here.

JB


I'm actually glad you brought this up. It was a very good question.
 

Lone Star

Crusader
Someone asked me if I was going to the court hearing on the 11th. Of course since this person is below me I had to exclaim, "You don't have the Fucking Rank to ask that question!!!"

Anyway, I can neither confirm nor deny whether I will indeed be going....but if I do I was thinking about showing up in disguise. I'm gravitating towards dressing up as one of the Blues Brothers. Instead of a brief case handcuffed to my wrist I'll have an E-Meter with case.....then in the courtroom I'll pull it out and start a solo auditing session just to give Judge Waldrip some moar mass on the craziness of Scientology. :yes:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aK9cdYpE7A
 
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clamicide

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: Monique Rathbun vs. Scientology: Affidavits Declarations

Thanks, LuluBelle.
Sorry I wasn't clear.

<snip>

A staff member whose 5-yr contract is almost up -- would that non-sea-org person undergo a 'sec check' prior to leaving staff? If so, would the 'sec check' have to be administered by a Sea Org member?

JB

Any staff member at a Class V leaving whose contract is about up does undergo a sec check if all points are in. They are done by a staff auditor. It would piss off the Qual Sec, because he wanted the auditors auditing paying public, as that was his important statistic. There are supposed to be staff-staff auditors who conduct auditing actions on staff, who would handle this and other actions on staff. Haven't seen a lot of orgs that really had that and so the 'regular' auditors would have to be used, which meant staff waited. I've seen staff who had a way to get money (their spouse or whatever) actually pay for their routing-off sec check so they could get out of there sooner.

I did a few of these, and it SUCKED. There was vicious pressure on the auditor to pull the right withholds so the staff member would stay. I got threatened quite a few times with an SP declare. I'd be shown the references where the only reason a person wants to leave is because of a missed withhold. Missing a withhold was a High Crime, i.e. Suppressive Act; therefore if the staff member still wanted to leave, then the auditor had really messed up:eyeroll:. My worksheets and tapes were reviewed constantly, with input from the ED. The C/S would try to keep adding more and more questions to get the person to cog and stay. Freaking nightmare.

The other sec checks given while I was there was for people in HCO being posted. Someone who goes into HCO is supposed to receive a sec check. I haven't always seen this done, but there was policy, and it came from uplines that this needed to start happening.

Contrary to what you hear, what I saw, it was rarely that staff members went through sec checks. They had to be valuable--up in the org board or making money (such as a reg) or on some other post really important for the more important stats; and then fuck it up, and the sec checks went crazy to handle the scene. More often, the person would be stuck in the ethics area continually writing up the O/Ws and doing lower conditions and very often MEST work, until they 'popped out of it'. They were also pretty shunned by the rest of the staff.

As far as who does the sec checks, there aren't really many SO members hanging out at Class V orgs. Those that are are on the admin side, and so wouldn't be auditing anyone, let alone staff. There are 2 real exceptions. When an org reaches "St. Hill size", they get a team from the "Universe Corp" (composed of SO members), whose job it is to audit the staff up through the OT levels.

The second is when an org really fucks up and a mission comes in to sort stuff out. These come in with the intent to handle ethics, and boy did that suck. Mostly, ethics interviews and rollback and conditions, with some folks getting sec checked... very nasty business. You'd walk into the org, and see all these staff members scrubbing the walls with toothbrushes. Seriously.

ETA (just because I continue to see the misconception): Staff members are not put on the RPF. That is strictly for SO, but they do have ways of abusing the lowly folks, too.
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
With an army of extraordinarily credible whistleblowers now behind Mosey, the previous settlement estimate has just risen from $5M-$10M to OVER TEN MILLION.
I'm with ya.
...
No matter how you feel about it,
brace yourself . . . it could be coming.*

throw-money-into-the-air.png

champagne-088.gif
......
champagne-088.gif
....

Marty and Mosey might have to be creating a new website soon.

I know of a photo blog that's all set up and not being used right now and could probably be
co-opted or borrowed for a while to post vacation and travel photos or "in your face" vanity
shots . . . like this one. This is your "shit-eatin-grin-no-care-in-the-world" beach shot. :coolwink:

02-Wayne-Chillin-on-the-Deck-809x400.jpg


Been offline for a while now. Just contact the site's owner, I guess.

http://waynebaumgarten.com/


*To be clear, I don't endorse this outcome. Just trying to prepare myself
for the possibility. I've just seen way too much money grubbing without
conscience
in upper management and VP levels of the corporate world
over the years.
Hardly given a thought much of the time.

My earlier posting on topic:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...GATION-OUTCOME&p=857332&viewfull=1#post857332
 
Last edited:

Bea Kiddo

Crusader
Re: Monique Rathbun vs. Scientology: Affidavits Declarations

Any staff member at a Class V leaving whose contract is about up does undergo a sec check if all points are in. They are done by a staff auditor. It would piss off the Qual Sec, because he wanted the auditors auditing paying public, as that was his important statistic. There are supposed to be staff-staff auditors who conduct auditing actions on staff, who would handle this and other actions on staff. Haven't seen a lot of orgs that really had that and so the 'regular' auditors would have to be used, which meant staff waited. I've seen staff who had a way to get money (their spouse or whatever) actually pay for their routing-off sec check so they could get out of there sooner.

I did a few of these, and it SUCKED. There was vicious pressure on the auditor to pull the right withholds so the staff member would stay. I got threatened quite a few times with an SP declare. I'd be shown the references where the only reason a person wants to leave is because of a missed withhold. Missing a withhold was a High Crime, i.e. Suppressive Act; therefore if the staff member still wanted to leave, then the auditor had really messed up:eyeroll:. My worksheets and tapes were reviewed constantly, with input from the ED. The C/S would try to keep adding more and more questions to get the person to cog and stay. Freaking nightmare.

The other sec checks given while I was there was for people in HCO being posted. Someone who goes into HCO is supposed to receive a sec check. I haven't always seen this done, but there was policy, and it came from uplines that this needed to start happening.

Contrary to what you hear, what I saw, it was rarely that staff members went through sec checks. They had to be valuable--up in the org board or making money (such as a reg) or on some other post really important for the more important stats; and then fuck it up, and the sec checks went crazy to handle the scene. More often, the person would be stuck in the ethics area continually writing up the O/Ws and doing lower conditions and very often MEST work, until they 'popped out of it'. They were also pretty shunned by the rest of the staff.

As far as who does the sec checks, there aren't really many SO members hanging out at Class V orgs. Those that are are on the admin side, and so wouldn't be auditing anyone, let alone staff. There are 2 real exceptions. When an org reaches "St. Hill size", they get a team from the "Universe Corp" (composed of SO members), whose job it is to audit the staff up through the OT levels.

The second is when an org really fucks up and a mission comes in to sort stuff out. These come in with the intent to handle ethics, and boy did that suck. Mostly, ethics interviews and rollback and conditions, with some folks getting sec checked... very nasty business. You'd walk into the org, and see all these staff members scrubbing the walls with toothbrushes. Seriously.

ETA (just because I continue to see the misconception): Staff members are not put on the RPF. That is strictly for SO, but they do have ways of abusing the lowly folks, too.



^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^


can you imagine living in a Scientology world?

I shudder at the thought.

I think I would rather be slowly eaten to death by maggots. :omg:
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
I'm with ya.
...
No matter how you feel about it,
brace yourself . . . it could be coming.

throw-money-into-the-air.png

champagne-088.gif
......
champagne-088.gif
....

Marty and Mosey might have to be creating a new website soon.

I know of a photo blog that's all set up and not being used right now and could probably be
co-opted or borrowed for a while to post vacation and travel photos or "in your face" vanity
shots . . . like this one. This is your "shit-eatin-grin-no-care-in-the-world" beach shot. :coolwink:

02-Wayne-Chillin-on-the-Deck-809x400.jpg


Been offline for a while now. Just contact the site's owner, I guess.

http://waynebaumgarten.com/



I am still mystified as to how Miscavige can settle this, assuming that the Rathbun's don't accept a gag order AND the provision that they never testify or participate in any future litigation vs. the defendants.

I don't know how Rathbun would ever sign that.

Right now it is looking as though this one goes to trial with the court imposing the resolution and financial damages. That is the only scenario I can think of where the COS (Crimewave of Scientology) pays and ShutsTFU.

Probably, far more damaging to Miscavige and the cult is the strategy, precedent and foundational materials (declarations) that can be used by other litigants vs. Scientology. Much like the RICO statutes vs. the Mafia, piercing the corporate veils of Scientology's multi-faceted shell game certainly evens the playing field against a terrorist cult with a billion dollar war chest.

Go Mosey!
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
I am still mystified as to how Miscavige can settle this, assuming that the Rathbun's don't accept a gag order AND the provision that they never testify or participate in any future litigation vs. the defendants.

I don't know how Rathbun would ever sign that.

I don't either.

Someone pulls out a checkbook. Someone decides to take a check. Not unheard of. Precedent has been set already. Stranger things have happened.

Scientology is a world of the incredible, the strange swerves in the plot, the unexpected, and on and on.

There's not many times in life when someone has a chance to get a multimillion dollar payday by signing a document. Sometimes people have a change of heart as the check is slide across the negotiation table . . . in spite of their noble ideals and goals. For the right price.

As Marty said in a recent interview, he didn't know what he might be doing six months from now . . . maybe even selling real estate. All I see is that things are shifting very rapidly within his head as evidence by his recent writings.

For a $15 million dollar check, I'd be willing to turn off my "Internet laptop" and never turn it back on again, never visit heretical blogs again for the rest of my life. I'd find other things to do.

Any offers? :biggrin:
 

Jump

Operating teatime
I don't know the answer to that but I would have thought the biggest problem for Miscavige is that there is so much information coming out now that the IRS must be under huge pressure to pull the plug on the tax exemption scam.

If that happens, and the CofS can no longer claim to be a religion then they can be treated as any other corporation and then his whole house of cards could come tumbling down.

If they did pull the plug on the tax exemption scam, the appropriate back-taxes could mean Davey would be buying an economy ticket to Bulgravia.

If not the big house...
 

AnonKat

Crusader
Nelson Mandela's inaugural address

[video=youtube;grh03-NjHzc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grh03-NjHzc[/video]
 

Terril park

Sponsor
I don't either.

Someone pulls out a checkbook. Someone decides to take a check. Not unheard of. Precedent has been set already. Stranger things have happened.

Scientology is a world of the incredible, the strange swerves in the plot, the unexpected, and on and on.

There's not many times in life when someone has a chance to get a multimillion dollar payday by signing a document. Sometimes people have a change of heart as the check is slide across the negotiation table . . . in spite of their noble ideals and goals. For the right price.

As Marty said in a recent interview, he didn't know what he might be doing six months from now . . . maybe even selling real estate. All I see is that things are shifting very rapidly within his head as evidence by his recent writings.

For a $15 million dollar check, I'd be willing to turn off my "Internet laptop" and never turn it back on again, never visit heretical blogs again for the rest of my life. I'd find other things to do.

Any offers? :biggrin:

If everyone on ESMB made such a deal CO$ would be bankrupt.

You may be on to something here.
 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
Here comes the unraveling of the 501C 3 Tax exemption.

snip...

Well 3 days ago, a friend of mine, a long term OT VII who was refusing to return for 6 month sec checks to Flag was reading Internet sites, a lot of them.

His wife carefully "Knowledge Reported" his misconduct. His 2 sons (2nd generation, now adults) joined in the KRs to OSA about their own father. The religion of family snitching and ratting on each other to the *Mother* Church :omg:

He was summoned to report to OSA INT for sec checks for almost a year. He refused. he did not return phone calls.
And then it happened...3 nights ago...

With all the Internet reporting, with all the YouTube horror stories, with Twitter and Google, and message boards and blogs, and with law suits describing their misconduct in depth...

They did it again !!!!!!
No different than Armie Lerma days.

They arrived. The confiscated his computers, his lap top and hard drives for OSA. He was kicked out of house to live on the street. His wife went postal on him in a lunatic explosion for reading the Internet and befriending Indies

He rushed to his work space, quickly changed passwords (his sons had Admin access), he secured what he could in the early hours of the morning and he got a Lawyer.

A Church member of 40 years with a RAID taking away his personal computer and his private papers and belongings and thrown out on the street in the middle of the night and locks changed.

snip...

I hope I can tell his story on my YouTube channel~~



It doesn't make sense. If someone, not the police with a warrant, comes and takes personal property, then that's theft.
Why did he not call the police?
And how can he be kicked out of his own house unless he agrees to leave on his own?
 

Lone Star

Crusader
It doesn't make sense. If someone, not the police with a warrant, comes and takes personal property, then that's theft.
Why did he not call the police?
And how can he be kicked out of his own house unless he agrees to leave on his own?

That's exactly what I've been thinking. I believe part of the problem is that people don't stand up to these OSA motherfuckers. He's the man of that house and he should've acted like it.

Here's what I would've done....

I would've ordered the OSA thugs to leave my home immediately. If they refused I would've called the police. If they still started to take apart my computers then I would've produced my shotgun, pumped a round in the chamber, and insisted that they cease and desist unless they wanted their brains splattered all over the walls. You know, exteriorize them permanently.

But that's just me. I guess.
 

Boomima

Patron with Honors
I would guess that the wife who wrote the KR "gave" the computers to OSA. I would also guess that his wife made him leave the family home.
 

oneonewasaracecar

Gold Meritorious Patron
It has been my contention for years that the FBI was infiltrated years ago. This contention is based on the information I was given, and damned if I can remember exactly who told me, but that the FBI was being trained, ( and I don't know if this was part of what I was told, but I made the connection as in the their offices in TEXAS), to use the Data Series and Investigation tech of LRH in the FBI investigations of health care company fraud which was related to the psychiatric field. As best as I can recall it was either a DSA or a long time Field Auditor who told me this, but there are a couple of other candidates a my possible source.

Lot's of reading ahead for these affidavits and I am so glad the SO CAPTAIN, was pointed out by Mike. Are there pictures somewhere of tiny fist's behind a podium at the opening of the Dallas (Padova) Ideal org April 11, 2009.??
It is a fact that the FBI was one of the organizations infiltrated during Operation Snow White. The FBI files have been released under FOIA and it is now a part of the public record along with the trials of the 11 Scientologists involved in Operation Snow White.

As to the claim that Scientology gave technical training to the FBI, there is no evidence to support this. When Scientology made similar claims regarding NASA, NASA denied their claims. I doubt Scientology would have any 'tech' that the FBI would want. The FBI has pioneered many techniques and trained law enforcement agencies around the world. Scientology has not.
 

Gib

Crusader
That's exactly what I've been thinking. I believe part of the problem is that people don't stand up to these OSA motherfuckers. He's the man of that house and he should've acted like it.

Here's what I would've done....

I would've ordered the OSA thugs to leave my home immediately. If they refused I would've called the police. If they still started to take apart my computers then I would've produced my shotgun, pumped a round in the chamber, and insisted that they cease and desist unless they wanted their brains splattered all over the walls. You know, exteriorize them permanently.

But that's just me. I guess.

I would have used my Tea cup.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cx1XhlPIeEM
 

Lone Star

Crusader
I've only just now read Brousseau's declaration and WOW!! Talk about devastating to Slappy! And that is only one declaration!

I could be wrong, but I think the door has been opened for Ray Jeffrey to possibly depose the couch jumper, Tommy the Cruiser. Paragraphs 13 and 14 relate to SO labor being performed to upgrade and renovate his homes, as well as the construction of the custom trailer and limousine.

I hope that happens!! TG1 I'm borrowing your praying avatar.....:biggrin:
 

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
I've only just now read Brousseau's declaration and WOW!! Talk about devastating to Slappy! And that is only one declaration!

I could be wrong, but I think the door has been opened for Ray Jeffrey to possibly depose the couch jumper, Tommy the Cruiser. Paragraphs 13 and 14 relate to SO labor being performed to upgrade and renovate his homes, as well as the construction of the custom trailer and limousine.

I hope that happens!! TG1 I'm borrowing your praying avatar.....:biggrin:

No fucking way that will happen. Might backfire with the judge thinking Mosey's counsel is grandstanding, and Cruise can hire competent legal muscle to drag things out further, which I don't think the Rathbun's want.

Nice fantasy, though.
 

Lone Star

Crusader
No fucking way that will happen. Might backfire with the judge thinking Mosey's counsel is grandstanding, and Cruise can hire competent legal muscle to drag things out further, which I don't think the Rathbun's want.

Nice fantasy, though.

Yeah I know. Only if he had a home in Texas would it be relevant. The only thing Brousseau's declaration shows is that Slappy runs more than just the RTC with regards to the Cruise remodeling projects.
 
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