Hey, steady there. I know it's like trying to walk on shifting sand, but you don't have to do anything just now.
Did something happen today?
I'm here for a while tonight, if you want to talk,
Solo
Cannot reach escape velocity
- Thread starter Stratospheric
- Start date
Hey, steady there. I know it's like trying to walk on shifting sand, but you don't have to do anything just now.
Did something happen today?
I'm here for a while tonight, if you want to talk,
Solo
Free to shine
Shiny & Free
It's funny, I was thinking about this sort of feeling today. Remembering what it was like to 'switch' and how at one time it was a sort of relief to sink back into the scientology viewpoint. For example if something critical came on tv, it was so much easier to think "it's entheta and I will let OSA take care of it". That lasted a long time, though there was no internet then of course.
You are walking in the rough patch Crash, that's all. When one is going through the "what if" scenarios, you are sort of in limbo land. That's why reading and reading does help, because the more different viewpoints you get to see, the less hold the "don't think" scientology one has. And then one day you find that it is no longer comfortable to slip back into accepting what you are told without questioning it, and somehow something has really altered forever and you feel free in a way that is hard to explain.
Remember there are no "musts" here. This is a totally individual journey that we all take, with different degrees of intensity depending on your personal scientology experience. You are not being judged and the only expectation and hope of any kind is that you find peace for yourself.
What I suggest is finding a subject that you have personal questions about, and doing a search here or on the web. I know for me a major turning point was reading stories from people I knew personally at Saint Hill....I knew the background was correct and seeing it all from a new perspective changed my views forever. You will know when it happens for you....then you are no longer in limbo land and the pain eases.
I understand entirely that you feel so torn and shattered by the emotional experience you are going through. Finding yourself questioning 'certainties' completely destroys your confidence in your own judgment. You are in a place where you have no compass. But don't give up, and don't feel bad. The fact that you are going through this period of enlightenment and questioning is a good thing. And it will get better. I am new to this site but I believe pretty much everyone posting has been through some dark times before they were free of the madness. I haven't been involved in Scientology for about 30 years and I still use some of the stuff I learned - without thinking it raises any questions about my disbelief in general - because LRH nicked most of the good bits from other philosophies and religions anyway. There always was some truth in it, which is why he managed to hoodwink so many people for so long.
Julie
Julie
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Solo,
Thank you, really appreciated! You seem to have been here.
Nothing in particular happened... Just seemed to spin on my heels and lose height and velocity... If you get my meaning...
I am a little embarrassed by my post... I am not used to being so open, especially in such public place.
Hope I did not offend or embarrass you.
Seems like I am feeling strong and positive again, hopefully it was just a minor glitch.
Crash
johnAnchovie
Still raging
This is your place, Crashed. Say what the hell you like. It is public, but it is also just read and interacted with by a fairly small, tight group of pretty good people who have all been through the same shit to one degree or another.
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Free to shine,
This is really lovely... Wow! Thank you. I can relate to "walking in the rough patch"... I think it is a little rougher than I had imagined.
Interesting how entrenched certain things have become. Not really obvious things, but behavioural things...
I really do feel like a crashed alien at the moment... I feel as if I am in a surreal world that will be gone if I wake up. Strange really.
I almost feel bad... Or guilty? about taking my own path and doing what I feel that I want to do... The more I look at it, the more angry I feel about the shackles that I seem to be shaking off...
Your thought about achieving peace is positive and interesting and yet somehow out of reach for me at this point.
The internal conflict I have is extraordinary... I find myself fighting me! I then wonder if that is normal or healthy? It is painful and uncomfortable, but I can't let go of it. I feel that I need to free myself... Sorry, ranting again!
You also mentioned finding a subject that I have queries about. I know quite a lot of stuff from the inside and from the outside... The one thing I have learnt is to never close ones eyes... Just keep looking.
Your advice is sound, I will look and will investigate.
There is a particular subject that was the trigger point for my "turn", for my radical change of viewpoint.
I am still having difficultly with that, and unfortunately (or fortunately), when I get a bee in my bonnet about something, I don't let it go...
So I will take your advice and thank you for it...
I hope that one day I might return the favour in some way, without any obligation, but with the same sincerity and compassion that you are showing me.
Crash
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Kulie,
Thank you... I have just read your post...
You are quite right, my confidence in my own judgement is more than a bit dented at the moment. I cannot believe that I was so blind, that I did not see my friends being hurt... I feel ashamed.
I have done some wild things in my life, I have had pretty heavy experiences as well as pretty good ones, but I have never felt like this, I have never experienced shame like this.
Torn and shattered is a bit of an understatement really... This "emotional experience" is new ground for me and is pretty unpleasant as I am having to look at me and what I did or did not do. It is really tough.
I keep looking to see if I deliberately "looked the other way", or deliberately or arrogantly ignored what was happening.
Most of my own 'certainties' are still in tact, but some key ones are not...
Mostly, my compassion has returned completely and I feel emotions that I thought I had lost, or thought might have gone forever.
I feel like a child right now...
I hope that you are OK, and have been doing really well over the past 30 years...
Thank you so much for the care and compassion that you have shown me...
Crash
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Hi Crash,
no need to feel embarrassed and no, you didn't offend or embarrass me. I was just concerned and wondering if you had been getting any pressure from anywhere.
Glad you're feeling positive again, that's great! And I'm glad you're getting so much positive support here.
Solo
ps oh yes, Tanya Quirino, I remember her now!
Commander Birdsong
Crusader
no, i suppose we yanks aren't entirely civilized. we even misspell civilised. what utter barbarity.
perfectly damnable louts that we are we've been known to refer to Her Royal Highness as lizzie. but i was just reading today that this year marks six full decades of what is now one of the most noble peacable and prosperous reigns of any great monarch in history.
party hearty brits!
perfectly damnable louts that we are we've been known to refer to Her Royal Highness as lizzie. but i was just reading today that this year marks six full decades of what is now one of the most noble peacable and prosperous reigns of any great monarch in history.
party hearty brits!
Free to shine
Shiny & Free
Crash, "pay it forward" is one concept I use a lot... it frees you from the dreaded "exchange" demands of scientology. It is a wonderful lesson in itself, to be able to accept something freely given and not feel guilty or beholden, and to do what you can for others further down the road. I did have trouble with it at first I have to admit, I myself have had some remarkable support from people in this community though now it is a source of joy rather than a dilemma. Have you seen the movie by that name? It's a good one to watch.
Yes, feeling guilty about doing what you want to do ... "being selfish"... is not viewed well in scientology but the more you do what feels right for you, the easier it gets.
If you can't find the info you want, send me a PM and I'll search out some threads for you.
Commander Birdsong
Crusader
well...
speaking of civilized brits...
"The Iron Lady" is on the screens here in the colonies. perfectly uncanny work by ms. streep and a director with a deft hand. unique concept and a brilliant screenplay. the film in poetic terms is an ode and it's climax transcendent. barry golwater's book was "conscience of a conservative". this work charts the soul of a conservative. and at it's center a sublime and tender romance. almost sort of a chick flick for guys.
here's to you maggie. you have our deepest gratitude...
speaking of civilized brits...
"The Iron Lady" is on the screens here in the colonies. perfectly uncanny work by ms. streep and a director with a deft hand. unique concept and a brilliant screenplay. the film in poetic terms is an ode and it's climax transcendent. barry golwater's book was "conscience of a conservative". this work charts the soul of a conservative. and at it's center a sublime and tender romance. almost sort of a chick flick for guys.
here's to you maggie. you have our deepest gratitude...
When I first tried to connect to this link I was unable to do so. It turned out Malwarebytes antimalware was blocking the site. Even when I told Malwarebytes antimalware it was okay it still blocked it. I had to shut down Malwarebytes antimalware to access the site!
p.s. Welcome! I am still trying to disconnect from the church. They have $50,000 of my money in prepayments I am trying to get back. I applied properly a year ago and they are still messing with me. I may end up taking less than I am due just to get done with them. I will have to post my story here soon. I was in for over 35 years. (Heavy sigh) Yep, turning on a little H.E & R (Human Emotion and Reaction).
Be seeing you!
SweetnessandLight
Crusader
Welcome Lout Zoo, LOVE your nickname! 
For those who might need to improve their cultural literacy a wee bit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laozi
Glad you are getting out of COS and wish you all the best success in getting ALL of your money back. There are several helpful threads and much good advice about it here on ESMB. Others have been successful and so can you! Don't get discouraged!
Glad you joined us, I'm sure you will meet some old friends here...and make new ones!
Welcome, welcome!
Here is a potentially helpful thread for you:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?23128-how-to-get-money-on-account-returned
Here are some articles on other sites which may also have some useful information for you:
http://www.scientology-lies.com/help/refund.html
http://possiblyhelpfuladvice.com/?p=920
http://www.lermanet.com/exit/caroline_letkeman104.htm
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505144_162-36941473/buying-god-tough-to-get-a-refund-on-salvation/
Here is the motherload with links to other sites:
http://www.xenu.net/archive/infopack/17.htm
Hope this information is helpful to others as well.
For those who might need to improve their cultural literacy a wee bit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laozi
Glad you are getting out of COS and wish you all the best success in getting ALL of your money back. There are several helpful threads and much good advice about it here on ESMB. Others have been successful and so can you! Don't get discouraged!
Glad you joined us, I'm sure you will meet some old friends here...and make new ones!
Welcome, welcome!
Here is a potentially helpful thread for you:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?23128-how-to-get-money-on-account-returned
Here are some articles on other sites which may also have some useful information for you:
http://www.scientology-lies.com/help/refund.html
http://possiblyhelpfuladvice.com/?p=920
http://www.lermanet.com/exit/caroline_letkeman104.htm
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505144_162-36941473/buying-god-tough-to-get-a-refund-on-salvation/
Here is the motherload with links to other sites:
http://www.xenu.net/archive/infopack/17.htm
Hope this information is helpful to others as well.
Last edited:
SweetnessandLight
Crusader
And this is for Crash: 
And all the Exes: 
And now, in honor of her Royal Majesty's 60th anniversary of reign, here is some more good advice
:
You are not alone, many others have successfully trod the path you are on, and all will be well as you make your journey of transition.
To fully feel and experience the whole range of human emotions again is a wonderful thing.
The thing about human emotions is that they do come and go like waves on a beach propelled by the tides...are constantly changing...shifting...it's o.k.
We feel happy when something good happens to us or someone we care about, sad when some thing bad happens, etc. Looking back over the past and seeing events in a new light is bound to stir many emotions. That's normal.
Ron talked about roller-coastering, but actually, it's normal for us to cycle through many different shades of moods and emotions and shifts in attitudes during a day. The more flexible you are about moving through these, and not getting stuck in any one, the more emotionally healthy you are. Remember, you have feelings, moods and emotions, they don't have YOU!
You are just recovering your humanity, and experiencing it more fully for the first time in a long while. It's a good sign of recovery, actually.
And all the Exes: And now, in honor of her Royal Majesty's 60th anniversary of reign, here is some more good advice
:You are not alone, many others have successfully trod the path you are on, and all will be well as you make your journey of transition.
To fully feel and experience the whole range of human emotions again is a wonderful thing.
The thing about human emotions is that they do come and go like waves on a beach propelled by the tides...are constantly changing...shifting...it's o.k.
We feel happy when something good happens to us or someone we care about, sad when some thing bad happens, etc. Looking back over the past and seeing events in a new light is bound to stir many emotions. That's normal.
Ron talked about roller-coastering, but actually, it's normal for us to cycle through many different shades of moods and emotions and shifts in attitudes during a day. The more flexible you are about moving through these, and not getting stuck in any one, the more emotionally healthy you are. Remember, you have feelings, moods and emotions, they don't have YOU!
You are just recovering your humanity, and experiencing it more fully for the first time in a long while. It's a good sign of recovery, actually.
Axiom142
Gold Meritorious Patron
When I first tried to connect to this link I was unable to do so. It turned out Malwarebytes antimalware was blocking the site. Even when I told Malwarebytes antimalware it was okay it still blocked it. I had to shut down Malwarebytes antimalware to access the site!
p.s. Welcome! I am still trying to disconnect from the church. They have $50,000 of my money in prepayments I am trying to get back. I applied properly a year ago and they are still messing with me. I may end up taking less than I am due just to get done with them. I will have to post my story here soon. I was in for over 35 years. (Heavy sigh) Yep, turning on a little H.E & R (Human Emotion and Reaction).
Be seeing you!
Hi Lout Zoo!
How about starting a thread and telling us a bit more about yourself?
Regarding the money that you have on account, please don’t be bullied into accepting a penny less than the full amount. If they get away with it with you, they will try it with someone else. My local org (St Hill in England) tried to weasel out of paying me my money. I had to get tough with them, but they finally capitulated when I wrote to the press, the BBC, my local member of Parliament, the Charity Commission (body responsible for conferring tax-exemption in the UK) and engaged a lawyer to take them to court. Stupid really – if they had just given me my money back when they should have (and when they said they were going to) they would have save themselves a load of grief. Instead they made an enemy.
Anyway, I look forward to hearing more from you.
Axiom142
Commander Birdsong
Crusader
When I first tried to connect to this link I was unable to do so. It turned out Malwarebytes antimalware was blocking the site. Even when I told Malwarebytes antimalware it was okay it still blocked it. I had to shut down Malwarebytes antimalware to access the site!
p.s. Welcome! I am still trying to disconnect from the church. They have $50,000 of my money in prepayments I am trying to get back. I applied properly a year ago and they are still messing with me. I may end up taking less than I am due just to get done with them. I will have to post my story here soon. I was in for over 35 years. (Heavy sigh) Yep, turning on a little H.E & R (Human Emotion and Reaction).
Be seeing you!
lout zoo?
way effin' coooooool!!!
yeah. that zoo is full of louts ain't it?
jesus! it was not thus. christ knows it was bad enough when i was in but if you wanted a prepayment back it was just handed to you. even a refund was no big hassle. i was part of that line one time. a young man in a wheelchair who bought $8000 worth of auditing and his refund routing form put him on the cans in front of me. a reg had told him dianetics might undo the damage done by an auto accident. he had told the reg if it didn't he would need the $ refunded. he told me he had actually liked the auditing but he was crippled and he needed the $ and the org gave it to him with no hassle.
but...
today CoS has really gotten ethics in on finance lines
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Crash, "pay it forward" is one concept I use a lot... it frees you from the dreaded "exchange" demands of scientology. It is a wonderful lesson in itself, to be able to accept something freely given and not feel guilty or beholden, and to do what you can for others further down the road. I did have trouble with it at first I have to admit, I myself have had some remarkable support from people in this community though now it is a source of joy rather than a dilemma. Have you seen the movie by that name? It's a good one to watch.
Yes, feeling guilty about doing what you want to do ... "being selfish"... is not viewed well in scientology but the more you do what feels right for you, the easier it gets.
If you can't find the info you want, send me a PM and I'll search out some threads for you.
FTS,
I have read your post several times, and thought about what you said.
I think you are right... I am unused to people liking me or giving a helping hand just because... rather than for money or the promise of money.
I feel almost nervous that you will stop... Strange really... I keep feeling as if I should let you know that I will give fair "exchange" (which I do obviously).
But I do find it very hard to accept help... Very hard indeed.
No, I have not seen the film "pay it forward" but I will get a copy now that you have said this...
It is interesting how it seems that it is ok to save humanity but not oneself...
Thank you again for your kind and very helpful thoughts and words. They are very helpful and very warming at this time of quite considerable distress...
Crash
Crashed Alien
Patron with Honors
Commander Birdsong,
I have not seen it yet, but heard it was good...
I heard it had to be recertified from PG to 18 - Turns out The Iron Lady was no good for miners (LOL)...
Little humour to lighten things up a little...
Crash
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