Colm & Janet (Light) McLaughlin freed from DM's chains..

[Infinite]

..

 

[Terril park]

He does sound critical; however, Marty also changed his tone to a gentler demeaner when another poster to his blog took the same tone. Marty did not fail to jump to the McLaughlins' defense by reminding readers that both Janet and Colm expressed disagreement and were thus subjected to physical/mental "reform" for a 5-year period.

Geez, I know there are a great deal of Marty Haters here, but the man has made tremendous, global in-roads toward taking down the Miniscule Midget. Agree or disagree with the Indies for holding the subject of scientology dear to heart, but do not fail to recognize our commonalities and the strength of the Indie movement.

Agreed, Marty can be annoyingly and painfully confrontational to those who voice their disagreements with him. However, it is this trait that helped him see the Cult for what it is, and to provide an example, a path, and a safe haven for many others to leave. And, unlike the retentive, retarded runt, Marty openly publishes critical comments and responses on his blog.

One thing I have observed in Marty is a pattern of reflecting upon his own hard-nosed stances, then coming to a compassionate conclusion. Remember when asked whether he felt bad about his role in bringing Annie back to Int when she blew to reunite with her husband, Jim? Marty's first response was "No" - that she had made her own decision, that she could have continued on to her connecting flight to be with her husband. However, upon later reflection he said he actually did feel bad that he had participated in that suppressive process. It is hard for anyone to admit wrongdoing, especially on a public platform, but Marty has done so. And he has been strong enough to have publicly done so even after publicly denying responsibility.

So, he was inconsistent. Well, damn good for him for being inconsistent in this manner!

Marty has not perfected the art of "living right", whatever that may be. Have you? (I haven't.) If you have, have you also influenced and provided a path for denizens of other Kool-Aid Drinkers to leave the Co$? Have you provided them shelter, sustenance and provisions with which to move on to a new life of their own choosing?

OK, flame away...

Well said. Marty is even more critical in his book.

 

[Veda]

-snip-

Marty Haters

-snip-

I think most people are rooting for Marty to change, but Marty is still bullshitting on behalf of L. Ron Hubbard and L. Ron Hubbard's Scientology, which, supposedly, David Miscavige has "reversed."

It's not hate to notice and point out another person's attempt to deceive and manipulate, under the guise of being a reformer and a whistle blower.

The heavy lifting - whistle blowing-wise - regarding Scientology was done mostly in the 1970s and 1980s.

And people have been leaving Scientology since Scientology has existed.

And others have been helping others, leaving Scientology, since Scientology has existed.

I'm glad Marty is there. It's an interesting development.

He's very late joining the parade, and wants an unwarranted amount of credit, while at the same time gushing forth such nonsense as his 'Ode to L. Ron Hubbard'.

Because people are not swooning over Marty, that doesn't make them "haters."

By the way, how long have you been casually calling people "haters"?

Did you have another term that you used before you adopted the term, "haters"?

 

[Mick Wenlock]

Geez, I know there are a great deal of Marty Haters here, but the man has made tremendous, global in-roads toward taking down the Miniscule Midget. Agree or disagree with the Indies for holding the subject of scientology dear to heart, but do not fail to recognize our commonalities and the strength of the Indie movement.

OK, flame away...

ah the retreat into "haters", how disappointingly predictable and I assume from your statement that you are one such 'indie" who has failed utterly to put the scientology cant behind him/her.

How did you fare on Marty's blog when you pointed out that he himself is a 'hater'? Did you stand up for ESMB on his blog when he was busily "hating" on it? How did he respond to you? How did the others on the Blog repsond to your principled stand against "haters"?

Or did you not make one? And only come here to use the term where it willl just be laughed off as part of the dreck that scientology imbues its followers with?

 

[palehorse]

Mike Wenlock said: "ah the retreat into "haters", how disappointingly predictable and I assume from your statement that you are one such 'indie" who has failed utterly to put the scientology cant behind him/her."

Palehorse responded: Uh ya, Mike, common slang is pretty predictable. UrbanDictionary.com gives the following definition of hater:
A person that simply cannot be happy for another person's success. So rather than be happy they make a point of exposing a flaw in that person.

It's a pretty harmless description. The prevalence of negative comments about Marty on this blog clearly shows a great deal of Marty Haters. Apparenty you took offense at that term. Why? It is not derogatory - it is simply descriptive. I understand why there are Marty Haters, and simply wanted to address those who feel that way. What makes it so disappointing to you?

I am a DM-hater. I could never be happy about any success he might have. Rather, I will happily expose his flaws and denigrate him to the best of my ability. Do you find that disappointing as well? Or would you prefer I flow ARC to DM when he states that his "church" has had some sort of "win?"

As far as my ex-scn status, what difference does it make? Do you purposely treat people differently based on whether they totally reject Scn or feel they had some gains or found some truth in the subject? If my status is so deeply important to you then here is my brief statement: I paid a fuckload of money (over a quarter-million dollars) for some moderately helpful gains. I am not convinced those gains were solely the result of my experiences in Scientology.

Now, do you feel better knowing that I have put Scientology behind me?


Mike Wenlock said: "How did you fare on Marty's blog when you pointed out that he himself is a 'hater?'Did you stand up for ESMB on his blog when he was busily "hating" on it? How did he respond to you? How did the others on the Blog repsond to your principled stand against "haters"? Or did you not make one? And only come here to use the term where it willl just be laughed off as part of the dreck that scientology imbues its followers with."

Palehorse responded: How are these questions relevent responses to my statements? If you have a disagreement with my post why not respond to what you find disagreeable? Instead, your questions are attacks on my credibility rather than genuine inquiries. You do not give a shit about my answers to your questions. Perhaps you still subscribe to LRH's instructions to "never defend" but rather, "attack." He would be proud of you.

Still, I will answer your insincere questions.

I received varied responses on Marty's blog when I defended Tony Ortega and those who utterly reject Scientology. I have not specifically cited ESMB as a decided ex/anti-Scn site because ESMB does not publically state such a stance.

Marty usually does not respond to my posts. I rarely recieve antagonistic responses to my posts on Marty's blog, although I have observed some pretty embarrassing behavior, as I have also observed (and responded to) here on ESMB. I have stated the same objections to Marty and to Indies as I have stated on this blog.

Apparently, Mike, you have decided that I have dedicated my loyalty to Marty and his followers. My loyalty is not reserved to Marty, nor to you or ESMB, nor to Tony Ortega, nor to the Cult, nor to anyone else but myself. All avenues have broadcasted important stances, and I align with those stances with which I agree and decry those I do not.

I speak only for myself.

My general point is that indies, exes and interested nons have more in common than not. We have a common goal in bringing down David Miscavige and eradicating the Church of Scientology. We also have our deep humanity and compassion in common. We even have a common goal with the Scilons, however general it may be: a world without war and insanity. THIS is an important part of my plea to all interested parties.

My plea, as described in my original post, is to recognize and acknowledge the humanity of others including all those inconvenient human frailties. Recognize, acknowledge, and forgive human fault and fallibility. Recognize our commonality. Once we are confident enough in our own commitment to our own stances, we will have no need to fear that respecting the stance of another will destroy our own reality.

 

[Veda]

-snip-

common slang is pretty predictable. UrbanDictionary.com gives the following definition of hater:
A person that simply cannot be happy for another person's success. So rather than be happy they make a point of exposing a flaw in that person.

It's a pretty harmless description.

-snip-

That's disingenuous.

"Hater" is used by inside and outside the CofS Scientologists as a euphemism for "SP" or "Suppressive Person." Additionally, you used it in capitalized form - "Marty Haters" - as in Jew Haters, as in, "Someone who hates and would persecute."

Just as Hubbard used "Communist" in the 1950s and 1960s to smear his perceived enemies, and used "Nazis" in the 1970s - when public opinion shifted due to the unpopular Vietnam war - these days, emotionally charged words, such as "hater" and "bigot," are used by Scientologists in their attempts to manipulate public opinion. This is in accordance with their spiritual leader's writings on the use of propaganda.

My advice to you is not to use Scientology on ex-Scientologists in an attempt to "handle" them.

 

[Petey C]

If anyone knows how to get in touch with Janet, could they pls send me a PM.

 

[Gottabrain]

That's disingenuous.

"Hater" is used by inside and outside the CofS Scientologists as a euphemism for "SP" or "Suppressive Person." Additionally, you used it in capitalized form - "Marty Haters" - as in Jew Haters, as in, "Someone who hates and would persecute."

Just as Hubbard used "Communist" in the 1950s and 1960s to smear his perceived enemies, and used "Nazis" in the 1970s - when public opinion shifted due to the unpopular Vietnam war - these days, emotionally charged words, such as "hater" and "bigot," are used by Scientologists in their attempts to manipulate public opinion. This is in accordance with their spiritual leader's writings on the use of propaganda.

My advice to you is not to use Scientology on ex-Scientologists in an attempt to "handle" them.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Posted by palehorse


snipped

My general point is that indies, exes and interested nons have more in common than not. We have a common goal in bringing down David Miscavige and eradicating the Church of Scientology.

I wish that (bolded) were true, but I don't believe that it is.

 

[palehorse]

That's disingenuous.

"Hater" is used by inside and outside the CofS Scientologists as a euphemism for "SP" or "Suppressive Person." Additionally, you used it in capitalized form - "Marty Haters" - as in Jew Haters, as in, "Someone who hates and would persecute."

Just as Hubbard used "Communist" in the 1950s and 1960s to smear his perceived enemies, and used "Nazis" in the 1970s - when public opinion shifted due to the unpopular Vietnam war - these days, emotionally charged words, such as "hater" and "bigot," are used by Scientologists in their attempts to manipulate public opinion. This is in accordance with their spiritual leader's writings on the use of propaganda.

My advice to you is not to use Scientology on ex-Scientologists in an attempt to "handle" them.

I was not aware of the Hater = SP definition. The word is not emotionally charged to me. I used it the way I said I used it, not how you said I used it.

My advice to you is to stop misassigning biased meaning to the words of others.

 

[Veda]

-snip-

My advice to you is to stop misassigning biased meaning to the words of others.

My advice to you is to refrain from calling people "Haters" - with a capital "H" - unless they really are Haters.

The things I wrote in my two posts on this thread are accurate. I suggest, kindly , that you become better informed.

 

[palehorse]

The things I wrote in my two posts on this thread are accurate. I suggest, kindly , that you become better informed.

Putting your own definitions to my words is not accurate. I used a definition of hater that is referenced in a slang dictionary. Your definition is based on assumption and interpretation.

Please do not tell me your interpretations of my statements are accurate. I made the statements, not you.

 

[elwood]

Putting your own definitions to my words is not accurate. I used a definition of hater that is referenced in a slang dictionary. Your definition is based on assumption and interpretation.

Please do not tell me your interpretations of my statements are accurate. I made the statements, not you.

Don't start that "was there some word there you didn't understand?" crap. Using the word, then trying to weasel out of it by claiming you used the "slang" definition is disingenuous at best. Veda is right. You are wrong.

 

[Panda Termint]

... or the other way around? :confused2:
Right/wrong, business as usual.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

...


My name is HelluvaHoax! and I am a hater.

I hate the lies, criminality, fraud and terrorism in Scientology.

Is there some process that can help me get rid of my "charge" and "case" in this area?

 

[Lone Star]

...


My name is HelluvaHoax! and I am a hater.

I hate the lies, criminality, fraud and terrorism in Scientology.

Is there some process that can help me get rid of my "charge" and "case" in this area?

You just have to keep on hating until you're flat on it.

I hate the same things you stated plus I also hate the lies, bullshit, and hypocrisy of MartyWorld. And if anyone doesn't like it.....Fuck 'em.

I'm a hatin' motherfucker!

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

You just have to keep on hating until you're flat on it.

I hate the same things you stated plus I also hate the lies, bullshit, and hypocrisy of MartyWorld. And if anyone doesn't like it.....Fuck 'em.

I'm a hatin' motherfucker!

LOLOL

The people who use the word "Hater" act as if there is something wrong with that reaction.

Hate is no different than Love, in that both can be a powerful and natural force for good. There is no Love without Hate. There is no light without dark, no up without down.

It would be like someone criticizing another for experiencing "Pain", as if it were a bad thing. What if the Pain results in their taking their hand out of a fire or going to a doctor to be diagnosed with a treatable disease that otherwise would have (like fire) consumed them?

 

[palehorse]

Don't start that "was there some word there you didn't understand?" crap. Using the word, then trying to weasel out of it by claiming you used the "slang" definition is disingenuous at best. Veda is right. You are wrong.

Oh good lord... are you serious? I meant what I said I meant. Get over it.

 

[palehorse]

...


My name is HelluvaHoax! and I am a hater.

I hate the lies, criminality, fraud and terrorism in Scientology.

 

[palehorse]

Well, enjoy your new Palehorse Hater thread.

You are a disappointing lot.