Commodore's Messenger tells all

Gib

Crusader
Ain't read those.I know you recommended them ...but my days are quite full..maybe I will just try to grok them next time I am laying at the bottom of the pool holding my breath for the first real Clear to appear.
too funny, that's about what heinlein said when he asked for proof of a clear from hubbard and campbell.
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
I thought scientology, the so called religion, was not about beliefs?

It's supposed to be about certainty. LOL


Scientology is a crock of shit, and it ain't no religion.

Jeez.

I mean if you believe sientology is a religion, then you believe you can go "clear" and the OT.


IMO, Scientology is closer to being an organized crime outfit utilizing religious cloaking than a legitimate religion. But even if it were a legitimate religion why do governments tolerate it? The U.S. Constitution does not give the right to anyone to defraud or destroy others because one is practicing their religion. Any judges who have interpreted it in that way must be smoking crack.
 

Dotey OT

Cyclops Duck of the North - BEWARE
Whats not so funny are the lies. There is no truth in the cherch. The stats they quote as true, that they always have said are true and continue to say are true, they aren't.

Practically everything claimed by Hubtard about his history and accomplishments, lies.

The front groups, CCHR, TWTH, the "Colombian miracle". All lies.

I went Clear out of scientology and OuT the door for good!
 
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Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
No comment.

I liked your quick autobiographical blurb Stratsie. It reminded me of a great line from a Lee Marvin flick you might like, which you might even have a chance to use.

It was a western morality play and Marvin had a role as a Cavalry officer who thwarted some grifter who was cheating the settlers and near the end Lee is on horseback and the dusty grifter looks up at him and says "You bastard!". Lee says "In my case the circumstance of birth but you, you're a self made man."
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
IMO, Scientology is closer to being an organized crime outfit utilizing religious cloaking than a legitimate religion. But even if it were a legitimate religion why do governments tolerate it? The U.S. Constitution does not give the right to anyone to defraud or destroy others because one is practicing their religion. Any judges who have interpreted it in that way must be smoking crack.

It appears to have gotten pretty bad Pitsy but it was played pretty straight when I was in.


Even now to call it an organized crime outfit is hyperbole.


But...

Pretty bad these days. Someone posted a recent PL titled "Refunds and Repayments" that promised SP Declare for anyone asking funds be returned even if they had not taken services.

That don't stack up too good against the moneyback policy when I was in which applied ONLY to refunds for services completed and the only penalty was may not again get services
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
The Internal Revenue Service awarded tax exemption to the California and Washington, D.C. churches in 1956 and 1957 respectively. In 1958, however, the Washington church lost its tax-exempt status on the grounds that its tenets and practices did not constitute an exclusively religious or educational activity.[7] A key factor in the revocation of its exemption was the issue of private inurement – the use of tax-exempt monies to benefit a non-tax-exempt individual or entity. The Court of Claims found that Hubbard and his family had profited from the Washington Church of Scientology. He had been given $108,000 over four years by the church, with the free use of a car and a private residence. His family had withdrawn thousands of dollars from the church's funds, and his wife Mary Sue had earned over $10,000 from renting property to it. Hubbard had also been tithed ten percent of the church's gross income.[8] The church appealed to the US Court of Claims, but lost. The court ruled that Scientology was a "business, a profit-making organization run by Hubbard for his personal enrichment."[7]
In 1959, Hubbard moved to England where he purchased Saint Hill Manor in East Sussex to serve as a family home and world headquarters of Scientology.[9] Over the following seven years, he tried repeatedly to establish a tax-exempt corporate vehicle in the United Kingdom by establishing multiple limited companies under the aegis of various Scientology entities and applying for non-profit status. However, the British Inland Revenue consistently refused the applications

******

I'll repeat the audited FACTS
In 1958,,,,,,,,,,, private inurement – the use of tax-exempt monies to benefit a non-tax-exempt individual or entity. The Court of Claims found that Hubbard and his family had profited from the Washington Church of Scientology. He had been given $108,000 over four years by the church, with the free use of a car and a private residence. His family had withdrawn thousands of dollars from the church's funds, and his wife Mary Sue had earned over $10,000 from renting property to it. Hubbard had also been tithed ten percent of the church's gross income.[8] The church appealed to the US Court of Claims, but lost. The court ruled that Scientology was a "business, a profit-making organization run by Hubbard for his personal enrichment."[7]
In 1959, Hubbard moved to England
Thank you...

I've wanted the details on that.

But again that was the church's tax exemption, not a prosecution of Hubbard. He did not flee to avoid prosecution; there was no prosecution against him.
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
I thought scientology, the so called religion, was not about beliefs?

It's supposed to be about certainty. LOL


Scientology is a crock of shit, and it ain't no religion.

Jeez.

I mean if you believe sientology is a religion, then you believe you can go "clear" and the OT.

Boston has six Super Bowl champs this century, nobody is even close.

It's four teams have twelve crowns this century, nobody is even close

In fact, number two is San Francisco with six crowns

Those are the two cities in which I reside Gibby

No...

I can't PROVE a damn thing.

But I ain't gonna believe you when you say there's no such thing as "OT"
 

Bill

Gold Meritorious Patron
Boston has six Super Bowl champs this century, nobody is even close.

It's four teams have twelve crowns this century, nobody is even close

In fact, number two is San Francisco with six crowns

Those are the two cities in which I reside Gibby

No...

I can't PROVE a damn thing.

But I ain't gonna believe you when you say there's no such thing as "OT"
There may be such a thing as paranormal powers but there is not and never will be "OT" -- because "OT" is Hubbard's invention and is something he guaranteed his "tech" would produce in anyone ("Standard Tech").

If anyone gained the ability of being "cause of matter, energy, space and time" from Hubbard's "tech", we'd know it and they could prove it in the real world.

Because the term "OT" is Hubbard's invention and Hubbard's definition and, by that definition, the guaranteed result of Hubbard's "tech", it has been proven that it does not exist.

Paranormal abilities and powers? I'm open to that.
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
I liked your quick autobiographical blurb Stratsie. It reminded me of a great line from a Lee Marvin flick you might like, which you might even have a chance to use.

It was a western morality play and Marvin had a role as a Cavalry officer who thwarted some grifter who was cheating the settlers and near the end Lee is on horseback and the dusty grifter looks up at him and says "You bastard!". Lee says "In my case the circumstance of birth but you, you're a self made man."
I take it from what you have written that you have jumped to the conclusion I was born out of wedlock. My 'quick autographical blurb' was quick, so quick in fact that I omitted to include the fact that my mother married the gardener well before I was born (yes, it's straight out of 'Lady Chatterley's Lover'). Just thought you ought to know.
 
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Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
There may be such a thing as paranormal powers but there is not and never will be "OT" -- because "OT" is Hubbard's invention and is something he guaranteed his "tech" would produce in anyone ("Standard Tech").

If anyone gained the ability of being "cause of matter, energy, space and time" from Hubbard's "tech", we'd know it and they could prove it in the real world.

Because the term "OT" is Hubbard's invention and Hubbard's definition and, by that definition, the guaranteed result of Hubbard's "tech", it has been proven that it does not exist.

Paranormal abilities and powers? I'm open to that.

Ahhhh...

Not necessarily...

The being with "cause over matter, energy, space, time, and spirit on all eight dynamics" might not be able to prove it because they might not be on this plane. There were "Twilight Zone" episodes dealing precisely with this. And the grade chart called that "Total Freedom".

"There are those who say to God 'Thy will be done' and there are those to whom God, in the end, says 'thy will be done'"

C.S.Lewis(?)

Yes...

And Hubbard said "If you wanted to make the perfect trap you would call it 'total freedom'"

Cunning little devil wasn't he?
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
I take it that from what you have written that you have jumped to the conclusion that I was born out of wedlock. My 'quick autographical blurb' was quick, so quick in fact that I omitted to include the fact that my mother married the gardener well before I was born (yes, it's straight out of 'Lady Chatterley's Lover'). Just thought you ought to know.
Which book they likely both read...

Good to hear it. "Illegitimacy" has been greatly destigmatized in America but probably not so much in old blighty.
 

Bill

Gold Meritorious Patron
Boston has six Super Bowl champs this century, nobody is even close.

It's four teams have twelve crowns this century, nobody is even close

In fact, number two is San Francisco with six crowns

Those are the two cities in which I reside Gibby

No...

I can't PROVE a damn thing.

But I ain't gonna believe you when you say there's no such thing as "OT"
Actually, I know of another person who was living in those two cities and I know FOR A FACT that she, and she alone, caused all those wins..........

Of course, I can't prove it. :D
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
There may be such a thing as paranormal powers but there is not and never will be "OT" -- because "OT" is Hubbard's invention and is something he guaranteed his "tech" would produce in anyone ("Standard Tech").

If anyone gained the ability of being "cause of matter, energy, space and time" from Hubbard's "tech", we'd know it and they could prove it in the real world.

Because the term "OT" is Hubbard's invention and Hubbard's definition and, by that definition, the guaranteed result of Hubbard's "tech", it has been proven that it does not exist.

Paranormal abilities and powers? I'm open to that.
Based upon many personal experiences, I do believe that paranormal experiences exist. None of these experiences came about by applying Scientology "tech". And the most extraordinary thing I've experienced happened 6-7 years before I got involved with Scientology.

I don't view these abilities (or experiences) as 'paranormal'. Just like any abilities people are born with (or develop), some people have them and others do not. So, I view them as normal, not paranormal. That's just my opinion. I know most others don't view it that way.

People who have experienced such abilities while in Scientology generally give credit to Hubbard for those experiences, but they're looking in the wrong place IMO.
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
Actually, I know of another person who was living in those two cities and I know FOR A FACT that she, and she alone, caused all those wins..........

Of course, I can't prove it. :D

Well there's several of us

Red Sox Nation is everywhere

I'd love to dialogue with her. Sports wizards are all over the place, many of them scientology trained, many of them christian and of course there are those pesky Jewish cabalists.

AND I'VE BEEN SUCKIN' THE LOT OF 'EM UP MY TAILPIPE MUTHUH FUKKAH!!!
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
Based upon many personal experiences, I do believe that paranormal experiences exist. None of these experiences came about by applying Scientology "tech". And the most extraordinary thing I've experienced happened 6-7 years before I got involved with Scientology.

I don't view these abilities (or experiences) as 'paranormal'. Just like any abilities people are born with (or develop), some people have them and others do not. So, I view them as normal, not paranormal. That's just my opinion. I know most others don't view it that way.

People who have experienced such abilities while in Scientology generally give credit to Hubbard for those experiences, but they're looking in the wrong place IMO.
Yeah Pitsy, me too. My paranormal experience predates Scn.

I still give Hubbsie much gratitude as I learned much of good use there...

It is not and I was once terrified that it might be the be-all end-all it proclaims itself to be.

thank God!
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
Which book they likely both read...

Good to hear it. "Illegitimacy" has been greatly destigmatized in America but probably not so much in old blighty.
I have edited the first sentence in my earlier post. Obviously I can't edit the version you included in your own post. Please would you edit your copy accordingly (simply remove the first and third iterations of 'that'). If I see that abortion of a sentence I wrote in such a hurry once more I'm going to have a fit.
 

Clay Pigeon

Gold Meritorious Patron
Did the twentyfour hour limit on editing get lifted?

Not to worry. Readers read the original aren't going to read it again...
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
IMO, Scientology is closer to being an organized crime outfit utilizing religious cloaking than a legitimate religion. But even if it were a legitimate religion why do governments tolerate it? The U.S. Constitution does not give the right to anyone to defraud or destroy others because one is practicing their religion. Any judges who have interpreted it in that way must be smoking crack.
"to defraud or destroy others......Any judges who have interpreted it that way" are condoning sociopathy.

It is the sociopathy, which lies within any group or individual be they religious, political,judicial, scientific or other ideology, that needs to be identified, exposed and instead of being 'smoked' be extinguished.
 
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