Did LRH admit he failed?

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
I'm not surprised by LRH's death-bed confession in the slightest. It makes perfect sense.

In many ways, in almost all ways, L. Ron Hubbard did fail. He went after psychiatrists after Dianetics because he was pissed that they shut him out of their little club and refused to acknowledge the value of his work. That's when he really created this whole thing about the "psychs". Despite his swashbuckling confidence, he really wanted approval.

LRH wanted to be seen on the world's stage as a genius, a brilliant man, an innovator and someone who moved society forward and made a great contribution. But he wrestled with the demons of his need for absolute power and his greed. I think he had contempt for the Scientologists that followed him ("I don't want to belong to any club that would have me as a member") which is why he humiliated so many people in the organization and in his private life - he was externalizing his own contempt. Ultimately, he wanted to win a Pulitzer Prize or a Nobel Peace Prize or something that would say he was a great man in the eyes of the world.

But after Scientologists went to prison for infiltrating, burglarizing and wiretapping (he should have gone too) and after he'd been on the run for tax evasion and other crimes on the Apollo, I think he must have known before his death that something had gone terribly, terribly wrong.

Maybe he was drugged and delusional when he said he'd failed, but people say this kind of stuff before they die all the time. Maybe he had a real spiritual vision - unlike the crap he'd been telling/selling people for years, sort of like in the movies where the man finds out the magic potions he's been selling for years as a scam really work when the genie appears. Maybe he saw God.

In other words, he remembered suddenly that it wasn't about the money after all, but that he wanted to be admired, and instead, he was hiding like a wharf rat, dying in private when he should have been feted by society. And, even worse, he wasn't going to be able to turn the church over to another man, or son, who, (as he considered himself to be), was, for all his faults, at least a thinker/writer/intellectual, but to David M, who was at best a vulgarian, not intellectual at all, and was a creation of all that was wrong with Scientology.

LRH failure was that he created David Miscavige, Son of Scientology. (John McCain felt the same way when he unleashed Sarah Palin onto the free world.)

LRH knew he failed because he would never be seen as a real man of the arts, but a snake-oil salesman. He had all the money he wanted in the end, more than he needed, but it wasn't about the money because he couldn't take that with him, and DM ripped him off anyway before he died so he was probably broke anyway.

It was the approval - and not from the people he brainwashed, but from his peers. And it wasn't going to happen. That's what he found out in the end.

His legacy would be considered duplicitous, covert, and ultimately something shameful. And that hurt him deeply.
 
Last edited:

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
Strangely enough it doesn't work with Kindles, just iOS devices or the Nook.

This is what it says on the Amazon page for this item:

Going Clear (Enhanced Edition) instantly on your Kindle Fire tablet or on the free Kindle apps for iPad, Android tablets, PC or Mac.
http://www.amazon.com/Going-Clear-Enhanced-Edition-ebook/dp/B00AWUEDGA

In another section it indicates that you can use it on a regular Kindle as well.

Where did you get that it doesn't work with Kindles? :unsure:

And even if true, it looks like you can just download a free Kindle app and view this enhanced version e-book on a PC or Mac as well. :yes:
 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
This is what it says on the Amazon page for this item:



In another section it indicates that you can use it on a regular Kindle as well.

Where did you get that it doesn't work with Kindles? :unsure:

And even if true, it looks like you can just download a free Kindle app and view this enhanced version e-book on a PC or Mac as well. :yes:

I bought the enhanced edition and it doesn't work on my Kindle.
I tried the downloadable app, Kindle for PC, and that didn't work either.
Customer Service confirmed that it's for iOS devices only.

Also see this thread,
http://www.amazon.com/review/RV2BYO...AWUEDGA&linkCode=&nodeID=&tag=#wasThisHelpful
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
I think it is meaningless. For one, he lied so much that nothing he ever said could be taken at face value.

And there is a lot of difference between telling one person something in private and issuing it broadly under one's own name for the world to read.

Paul
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
I bought the enhanced edition and it doesn't work on my Kindle.
I tried the downloadable app, Kindle for PC, and that didn't work either.
Customer Service confirmed that it's for iOS devices only.

OK, thanks. That's really messed up that they're calling it a Kindle product when it's not fully compatible with a Kindle! :duh:
 

Thrak

Gold Meritorious Patron
e

I think Marty realizes that he will be the next total failure if he were to step into those shoes. So he is madly trying to change the program. Of course, he's got to come up with a new name. He can't call it Scientology. I bet he's surveying names as we speak, LOL!

I like it. Scientology® The Bridge to Total Failure! That indicates.
 

CommunicatorIC

@IndieScieNews on Twitter
I bought the enhanced edition and it doesn't work on my Kindle.
I tried the downloadable app, Kindle for PC, and that didn't work either.
Customer Service confirmed that it's for iOS devices only.

Also see this thread,
http://www.amazon.com/review/RV2BYO...AWUEDGA&linkCode=&nodeID=&tag=#wasThisHelpful
A regular, e-link Kindle is incapable of playing video. The e-link Kindle was never designed to play video. The refresh rate of e-link is far too slow.

Only Android devices (i.e., the Kindle tablets and Nook tablets) and Android and IOS apps (such as on an iPad or other Android tablets) can play video.

.
 

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
..

I've already chucked in my 2 cents on this question:

..

Being the cynic that I am, I'm not buying Sarge's statement that L Ron Hubbard said he had "failed" because it ascribes a positive intention. There's no doubt that Scientology is FAIL when it comes to setting the human spirit free from the bounds of the material, but that was never what L Ron Hubbard was about. Rather, ole fatso was only ever interested in amassing cash, slaves, and adolation which, all things considered, he achieved, in abundance. The alleged statement also suggests that even right to the end L Ron Hubbard maintained the mental faculties required for such insight. Given other witnesses' descriptions of Hubbard's last few months and the fact that he was pumped full of psych drugs, I doubt L Ron Hubbard knew what day it was let alone have a considered opinion of his life's work. And then there's the fact that Marty was seeking to if not misdirect then at least temper the content of Mr Wright's book. We know of at least one case of this. Sarge's fealty to Marty borders on the crazy so it seems likely that Marty would have had an influence on what was said to Mr Wright by him.

Accordingly, I'm putting the "I failed" statement down on the list of "acceptable truths" and suggest that it is designed to be a plaintive play on Indie Dependent HE&R; the subtext being: "we let the Ole Man down - (boo hoo) lets get this show on the road and do it for him - (hip hip)". I see this suggesting meme is being repeated in the latest M&M Show OP.

Since then, a friend has suggested that the comment could well be true and that L Ron Hubbard was just trying to make Sarge feel sorry for him at the time. There's a certain Occam's Razor quality to that idea which I find appealing.
 

WildKat

Gold Meritorious Patron
My bad. :unsure:

Marty did make an official public statement on his blog earlier today.

"Could someone get hold of Sarge and ask him . . ."


martyrathbun09 | January 28, 2013 at 11:14 am

I already did. It will be afforded the
full context L. Ron Hubbard deserves.


I guess maybe this is the "teaser" to promote Marty's next book?? Maybe in order "give LRH his full context", he has to tell the story of all the SPs that went after LRH and how strong he remained despite all the suppression and CI (which his tech on shattering suppression couldn't handle for some reason.)

I wonder when Marty is going to grow tired of trying to defend the indefensible?
 

WildKat

Gold Meritorious Patron
It was the approval - and not from the people he brainwashed, but from his peers. And it wasn't going to happen. That's what he found out in the end.
His legacy would be considered duplicitous, covert, and ultimately something shameful. And that hurt him deeply.

I think this is probably spot-on.
 

pollywog

Patron with Honors
Death is the great equalizer, no?

He was just a guy. He was scared, maybe more than most of us will be, at least those of us us who have lived an authentic life. Life has a way with catching up with one. It's nothing new. Nothing different. He was JUST A MAN.
 

Gib

Crusader
I'm not surprised by LRH's death-bed confession in the slightest. It makes perfect sense.

In many ways, in almost all ways, L. Ron Hubbard did fail. He went after psychiatrists after Dianetics because he was pissed that they shut him out of their little club and refused to acknowledge the value of his work. That's when he really created this whole thing about the "psychs". Despite his swashbuckling confidence, he really wanted approval.

LRH wanted to be seen on the world's stage as a genius, a brilliant man, an innovator and someone who moved society forward and made a great contribution. But he wrestled with the demons of his need for absolute power and his greed. I think he had contempt for the Scientologists that followed him ("I don't want to belong to any club that would have me as a member") which is why he humiliated so many people in the organization and in his private life - he was externalizing his own contempt. Ultimately, he wanted to win a Pulitzer Prize or a Nobel Peace Prize or something that would say he was a great man in the eyes of the world.

But after Scientologists went to prison for infiltrating, burglarizing and wiretapping (he should have gone too) and after he'd been on the run for tax evasion and other crimes on the Apollo, I think he must have known before his death that something had gone terribly, terribly wrong.

Maybe he was drugged and delusional when he said he'd failed, but people say this kind of stuff before they die all the time. Maybe he had a real spiritual vision - unlike the crap he'd been telling/selling people for years, sort of like in the movies where the man finds out the magic potions he's been selling for years as a scam really work when the genie appears. Maybe he saw God.

In other words, he remembered suddenly that it wasn't about the money after all, but that he wanted to be admired, and instead, he was hiding like a wharf rat, dying in private when he should have been feted by society. And, even worse, he wasn't going to be able to turn the church over to another man, or son, who, (as he considered himself to be), was, for all his faults, at least a thinker/writer/intellectual, but to David M, who was at best a vulgarian, not intellectual at all, and was a creation of all that was wrong with Scientology.

LRH failure was that he created David Miscavige, Son of Scientology. (John McCain felt the same way when he unleashed Sarah Palin onto the free world.)

LRH knew he failed because he would never be seen as a real man of the arts, but a snake-oil salesman. He had all the money he wanted in the end, more than he needed, but it wasn't about the money because he couldn't take that with him, and DM ripped him off anyway before he died so he was probably broke anyway.

It was the approval - and not from the people he brainwashed, but from his peers. And it wasn't going to happen. That's what he found out in the end.

His legacy would be considered duplicitous, covert, and ultimately something shameful. And that hurt him deeply.

I don't think that, my bold above, is true. He died b/4 DM really took over.
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
Any word on what's in the missing Sarge videos I can't play on my Kindle?

Anyone?


Giving the Sarge topic some more thought:

The COS is not defending LRH or offering a rebuttal (LRH was healthy and strong, fully OT in capability, clearly died causatively) about Sarge's comments on their extensive Lawrence Wright Going Clear rebuttal website. Which in fact is very nit-picky about many small and obscure details in the book.

They're 100% mum about Sarge's comments, arguably a big reveal in the book. The silence is deafening, as they say.

Their silence and reluctance to defend on that point is a total confirmation that what Sarge said is honest and true.

They have the opportunity to defend freely on their website. They don't.

Their silence is your answer about Sarge. They don't understand or appreciate that significance . . . as yet. :no:

Silence can often tell the tale in a session, in life . . . and on the Internet. :whistling:

:yes: A guru once said:


quotemarkleft.png
If you tell the truth, it becomes a part of your past.
If you lie, it becomes a part of your future.
quotemarkright.png


PS: If I were a trained CS, I'd circle "Sarge comments" in red as a "hot button" (pc doesn't want to get near) in their folders. :coolwink:
 
Last edited:

JustMe

Patron Meritorious
I don't think that, my bold above, is true. He died b/4 DM really took over.

Actually DM was taking over in 1981 and in many ways took over in 1982 while Hubbard was alive.

Yes Hubbard was sending us orders weekly for about a year in 1982 and 1983 but we'd hear from him usually only once a week.

It was DM that was running things on a day by day basis while he was in Author Services. He ran things through maybe a dozen or so people then "at the top".

He saw that Hubbard's orders were carried out but he also brutally did his own stuff as well. He controlled what Hubbard was seeing via Pat Broker.

In declarations in two court cases in the 1990s DM said he was not running organized scientology then as he was too busy in Author Services. But he perjured himself.

Many details of this are covered in this free ebook:

http://paulsrabbit.com/LHBvol1a.pdf
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
My bad. :unsure:

Marty did make an official public statement on his blog earlier today.

"Could someone get hold of Sarge and ask him . . ."


martyrathbun09 | January 28, 2013 at 11:14 am

I already did. It will be afforded the
full context L. Ron Hubbard deserves.


Let's hope Marty can put in context this statement of his own, as well:

Transcend Posted on January 18, 2013 by martyrathbun09

The following is the third piece of advice I shared with Scientologists in What Is Wrong With Scientology? I would love to hear what Independent Scientologists have to say about this.[..]

[..] Pat Broeker used the threat of never turning over the alleged OT 9 and OT 10 in an effort to get Miscavige to allow him to exercise control in Scientology Inc. I was a part of three separate forcible search-and-seizures Miscavige directed in order to get at the alleged OT 9 and 10 at Broeker hideouts. Each time we came up empty-handed, and finally concluded there were no such things. This was validated by the senior technical officer of Scientology since L Ron Hubbard’s death, one Ray Mithoff. Mithoff audited Hubbard during his final week of life. Mithoff acknowledged in my presence that Hubbard had nothing intelligible to say about any levels that might exist above OT 8, let alone gave any indication that anything had been written up about them.

These horrendous big lies, growing in magnitude as years rolled by, are the continuing creation of the religious con played out through the ages, so well described in Paine’s Age of Reason. [..]
http://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2013/01/18/transcend/

to which I responded here on ESMB:

Calling Pat a liar based upon Hubbard being ill a week before his death and not being able to say anything intelligible. What does this say about Hubbard changing his will the day before he died? My God, Marty is an idiot!

Now we have Sarge's statements....

I suspect Hubbard was not mentally capable of signing that will and that Sarge knew it ( or was in denial about it - thinking Hubbard was still God disguised as an OT yet in the shell of a delirious old man dying like he said he wanted to. Sarge was a witness to the will. A week before he died, Hubbard was 'audited by Ray Mithoff, though Hubbard couldn't communicate with anything intelligible to say. This should be fun to hear what Marty has to say
 

The COS is not defending LRH or offering a rebuttal (LRH was healthy and strong, fully OT in capability, clearly died causatively) about Sarge's comments on their extensive Lawrence Wright Going Clear rebuttal website. Which in fact is very nit-picky about many small and obscure details in the book.

They're 100% mum about Sarge's comments, arguably a big reveal in the book. The silence is deafening, as they say.

Their silence and reluctance to defend on that point is a total confirmation that what Sarge said is honest and true.
Actually, there once was a page on the topic on the attack site. Unsurprisingly, it was since taken down. I managed to get a screen shot before it disappeared, but I 'm not sure how to post the image here. Here is the text:
>> STATEMENT: [Page 364] [h=1]“I mentioned the legend in Scientology that Hubbard will return.[/h] ‘That’s bull crap, [Steve] Pfauth said, ‘He wanted to drop the body and leave, And he told me basically that he’d failed, All the work and everything, he’d failed.”
>> TRUE INFORMATION: Mr. Starkey, who was appointed by L. Ron Hubbard as the Executor of his trust states:
“This statement is absurd and false. Nothing like this ever happened. First of all, Steve Pfauth was a stable hand who was employed to tend the horses and feed the cows—Mr. Hubbard would never have invited him into his home and discussed anything with him. (A photograph of Mr. Hubbard’s Blue Bird appears on pg 94 of Music Maker: Composer & Performer.)
“Furthermore, as the appointed executor of Mr. Hubbard’s estate, I went to the ranch where Mr. Hubbard resided. I interviewed the staff who had resided on the ranch and worked for or with Mr. Hubbard. One of the first things I was briefed on was the irresponsible activities of Steve Pfauth and his drinking habits. Pfauth was found intoxicated on more than one occasion, with a proclivity for heavily over-indulging in alcohol. He was reported to me as being irresponsible, negligent and delusory. He was most certainly not in charge of any security for the ranch.
“If anything like what Pfauth now says—for the first time, some 27 years after Mr. Hubbard passed away—occurred, I would have known about it. This entire story is ridiculous and bogus.”
Of note is the fact Pfauth has not mentioned this alleged incident in twenty-five years—only now is he bringing it up, since becoming a member of Rathbun’s posse.




 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
If Steve 'Sarge' Pfauth were willing to answer some direct questions about LRH and his last days, what would those questions be?
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
Actually, there once was a page on the topic on the attack site. Unsurprisingly, it was since taken down. I managed to get a screen shot before it disappeared, but I 'm not sure how to post the image here. Here is the text:
>> STATEMENT: [Page 364] [h=1]“I mentioned the legend in Scientology that Hubbard will return.[/h] ‘That’s bull crap, [Steve] Pfauth said, ‘He wanted to drop the body and leave, And he told me basically that he’d failed, All the work and everything, he’d failed.”
>> TRUE INFORMATION: Mr. Starkey, who was appointed by L. Ron Hubbard as the Executor of his trust states:
“This statement is absurd and false. Nothing like this ever happened. First of all, Steve Pfauth was a stable hand who was employed to tend the horses and feed the cows—Mr. Hubbard would never have invited him into his home and discussed anything with him. (A photograph of Mr. Hubbard’s Blue Bird appears on pg 94 of Music Maker: Composer & Performer.)
“Furthermore, as the appointed executor of Mr. Hubbard’s estate, I went to the ranch where Mr. Hubbard resided. I interviewed the staff who had resided on the ranch and worked for or with Mr. Hubbard. One of the first things I was briefed on was the irresponsible activities of Steve Pfauth and his drinking habits. Pfauth was found intoxicated on more than one occasion, with a proclivity for heavily over-indulging in alcohol. He was reported to me as being irresponsible, negligent and delusory. He was most certainly not in charge of any security for the ranch.
“If anything like what Pfauth now says—for the first time, some 27 years after Mr. Hubbard passed away—occurred, I would have known about it. This entire story is ridiculous and bogus.”
Of note is the fact Pfauth has not mentioned this alleged incident in twenty-five years—only now is he bringing it up, since becoming a member of Rathbun’s posse.

Maybe they took it down for a good reason... like because it wasn't true.

BTW, how did you manage to find this if it was taken down? Do you have a link to the cached version ?
 

cakemaker

Patron Meritorious
Actually, there once was a page on the topic on the attack site. Unsurprisingly, it was since taken down. I managed to get a screen shot before it disappeared, but I 'm not sure how to post the image here.


Go to Tinypic.com.
Upload your picture.
It then gives you some code that you cut-and-paste into your message board post.
Preview your post to make sure the picture is there.
And that's it!
 
Top