Did Scn turn you off to spirit?

Veda

Sponsor
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Physicalism is the idea that everything is physical.
 

Sindy

Crusader
To be honest, yes though not entirely. What it really turned me off to, mainly, is preachers and gurus. I simply can't listen to any of them anymore. Someone posted an Alan Watts video yesterday and I could only listen to less than 5 minutes of it before I wanted to tell him to go fuck himself. Seriously. I am currently sorting this out for myself but I think the paradigm needs to change where those who want to help people spiritually need to stop talking from an exalted position and need to have discussions on equal footing.
 

JustSheila

Crusader
Yes.

I came into Scientology a Christian. I was shown references about how Jesus is an implant. RTC had me in session for some 40-50 hours in an attempt to "audit out" my Christian beliefs as some sort of delusion before I was approved to start the OT levels.

When I brought up God and connectiveness with others, I was often laughed at or referred to the "8th Dynamic" and shown more references of how we are basically fallen Gods and there is no God.

Scientology was about work, money, more work and serving L Ron Hubbard and his church that wasn't a church. Management abused the Sea Org, Sea Org abused org staff, org staff abused mission staff and everyone abused the public because they had so much more freedom. Despite everyone's lofty goals to "clear the planet", there was nothing spiritual or virtuous about what went on from day to day.

They did all they could to stop me from taking my vacation time and seeing my family. Children were neglected and ill-treated.

It was like a black hole that sucked my ideals and spirituality right out of me.

Sometimes I'm negative and cynical when I write on here. Sometimes I think I should just walk away from it altogether and never think of Scientology again, because everything that isn't Scientology is so much happier, lighter, more spiritual and wonderful by comparison. I've done that before, though and it wasn't the answer. I was in that cult, that's just the way it is, and that past is part of me.
 

Sindy

Crusader
Yes.

I came into Scientology a Christian. I was shown references about how Jesus is an implant. RTC had me in session for some 40-50 hours in an attempt to "audit out" my Christian beliefs as some sort of delusion before I was approved to start the OT levels.

When I brought up God and connectiveness with others, I was often laughed at or referred to the "8th Dynamic" and shown more references of how we are basically fallen Gods and there is no God.

Scientology was about work, money, more work and serving L Ron Hubbard and his church that wasn't a church. Management abused the Sea Org, Sea Org abused org staff, org staff abused mission staff and everyone abused the public because they had so much more freedom. Despite everyone's lofty goals to "clear the planet", there was nothing spiritual or virtuous about what went on from day to day.

They did all they could to stop me from taking my vacation time and seeing my family. Children were neglected and ill-treated.

It was like a black hole that sucked my ideals and spirituality right out of me.

Sometimes I'm negative and cynical when I write on here. Sometimes I think I should just walk away from it altogether and never think of Scientology again, because everything that isn't Scientology is so much happier, lighter, more spiritual and wonderful by comparison. I've done that before, though and it wasn't the answer. I was in that cult, that's just the way it is, and that past is part of me.

I hear you loud and clear and feel the same way exactly.
 

lotus

stubborn rebel sheep!
For me it ressemble what you both have well said! :yes:

I leaft the cult when I realized it was only ''sucking'' the spirit out of people..out of me...

No wonder why people crave for auditing\processing - they are litterally emptied when they come in and are craving to fill the emptyness.... :unsure:

Despite the cult, I never gave up in my belief in ''god'' as eternity, as the oneness, love, energy, neither by my years of buddhism did.
It always have been in my heart and soul, despite the connection became weak while in Snc, it came back stronger.

I have an allergy and am cynical about pseudo-gurus, esoterism, here, out there, or whereever....enough for me, enough for mankind! I turned me off to this yes!
 
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Reasonable

Silver Meritorious Patron
It turned me off to trying to figure it out. We may be spirit and we may not be. No one really knows. If no one can prove it in thousands of years then I doubt I will.

And for that reason I certainly will not be enrolling in another "ology" "anity" or "ism"

And if we are spirits then what will that information do for me? What difference does it make if I believe or not?

If we are we are, if we are not we are not. Why waste my time figure out something that I never will.

The funny think is that Scientology tells you that it makes you be able to know but it taught me that in the case of spirituality that no one knows.
 

Sindy

Crusader
It turned me off to trying to figure it out. We may be spirit and we may not be. No one really knows. If no one can prove it in thousands of years then I doubt I will.

And for that reason I certainly will not be enrolling in another "ology" "anity" or "ism"

And if we are spirits then what will that information do for me? What difference does it make if I believe or not?

If we are we are, if we are not we are not. Why waste my time figure out something that I never will.

The funny think is that Scientology tells you that it makes you be able to know but it taught me that in the case of spirituality that no one knows.

Nice post and I get what you're saying. There's peace in dropping the "need to know" and that is just as right a place to stake one's claim on this Earth, as any, as to why the hell we're here. Who knows?

For myself, I'm at the same place while simultaneously still considering that the spiritual quest is worthy and still bears fruit.
 
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Veda

Sponsor
It turned me off to trying to figure it out. We may be spirit and we may not be. No one really knows. If no one can prove it in thousands of years then I doubt I will.

And for that reason I certainly will not be enrolling in another "ology" "anity" or "ism"

And if we are spirits then what will that information do for me? What difference does it make if I believe or not?

If we are we are, if we are not we are not. Why waste my time figure out something that I never will.

The funny think is that Scientology tells you that it makes you be able to know but it taught me that in the case of spirituality that no one knows.

The funny thing is, Scientology in not truly spiritual, except to wrap itself (as in cloak itself) in a kind of spirituality.

Beneath the spiritual, with its "thetans," etc., is a grasping and clawing psychological and philosophical system that emphasizes survival. Very Darwinian, or as some have commented, "Nietzschean."

And below that, and closer yet to the core, it's a kind of political ideology with long lists of enemies, a covert intelligence system with its own "Intelligence tech," and very materialistic money making racket.

Maybe a better question would be, "What did Scientology turn you off to?"

:)
 

Techless

Patron Meritorious
luckily, scn didn't turn me off spiritually, but I eventually noted that it had very effectively turned others off. Some, not all for sure.

Then I never was there hanging with the 'way up lines' folks much either. There were always just enough 'cool' folks, (by only my estimation) higher levels/training and all, that made me want to keep on investigating it. But the closer I got to higher levels, (and I read/listened to everything I possibly could) the ratio of cool vs. strange got out of proportion and that's when I decided things were not all right - the self-planted seed - and that there were secrets way above and beyond the secrets that were openly mentioned as 'higher level material'. I just got major vibes of a more sinister, evil secret, than OTwhatever training or processing.

Something too I had discovered prior to all this and of major impact: I realized that the whole of the tech was engineered. I.E. designed by a mere human (regardless of whether insane or genius). I don't think I'd have ever seen this if I had not been one myself (an engineer). Then hubby's completely bs attempts and explanations of electricity made it clear that he knew nothing of...

I guess I'm a bit different here than many in that I was never really, really 'into' it all, but for way too long and in the end, just like whats happening now, they are the ones who eventually reveal themselves (the bullshit). I'd figured it out through observation, and never having the big bucks to invest (waste). Something just clicked in my own head.

it really does still cause me pain, to think that others have been so effectively shut down by it, and are still drifting around in a parallel world that isn't doing much of anything for mankind. I mean, the zombie thing seems so medieval - but here it is - present day.

Unreal.

I think Veda, answering your alternate suggestion of a question, could take anyone a lifetime to answer, tone it down! laughs...it would just be the definition of scn, which was such a painful, time-consuming waste of time to begin with...
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
To be honest, yes though not entirely. What it really turned me off to, mainly, is preachers and gurus. I simply can't listen to any of them anymore. Someone posted an Alan Watts video yesterday and I could only listen to less than 5 minutes of it before I wanted to tell him to go fuck himself. Seriously. I am currently sorting this out for myself but I think the paradigm needs to change where those who want to help people spiritually need to stop talking from an exalted position and need to have discussions on equal footing.

Hey Sindy, I'd say you're probably on a pretty good path! :thumbsup:

Here's what I believe: Anything requiring a preacher, a guru or money can (and should) be dismissed, because that sort of stuff can only do one thing: It keeps you from finding anything that contains any form of true spirituality.

That's why I find some of these pseudo-spiritual "discussions" here on this board so hilariously funny. :biggrin:

The people attempting to sell something spiritual here, are even funnier. :hysterical:

Anyway, just keep on keeping on. :thumbsup:
 

ThetanExterior

Gold Meritorious Patron
For me it actually worked the other way. Scientology turned me ON to spirit.

Before I got into Scientology I thought I was just a body but then I learned I was a spiritual being in a body.

Of course I then went through many years of BS before getting out but the point is it put me onto the path of seeking enlightenment, which I'm still doing.

There are numerous things that Scientology did turn me off to, the main one being know-it-alls who say they have the answer to all of mankind's problems while secretly being ethically, morally and spiritually bankrupt.

Nowadays I want to see how a person lives their own life before I listen to any "wisdom" they want to give out.
 
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Churchill

Gold Meritorious Patron
Before Scientology, I would vacillate between belief and agnosticism.
Scn. instilled a belief in a a spirit that was strong, powerful and all-knowing,
without the moral encumbrances of compassion, and with a profound re-definition of good and evil.

Today, I still move back and forth between belief and doubt, but what​ I believe (or doubt) is vastly different.
 

Reasonable

Silver Meritorious Patron
The only thing that I find practical about spirituality any more is how spiritual practices can help me in my life today. Here is an example.

When I am in a better mood or more "uptone" things go better, I get more customers , sales etc. My results are better.

If I meditate I feel better, I do better. If I visualize what I want to happen it SEEMS to happen more easily.

The question I have is this:

Is that a mental effect, an energetic effect or is it a spiritual effect.
Or are my results really cause and effect to my practices? Maybe i am just imagining they are.
 

Lone Star

Crusader
The only thing that I find practical about spirituality any more is how spiritual practices can help me in my life today. Here is an example.

When I am in a better mood or more "uptone" things go better, I get more customers , sales etc. My results are better.

If I meditate I feel better, I do better. If I visualize what I want to happen it SEEMS to happen more easily.

The question I have is this:

Is that a mental effect, an energetic effect or is it a spiritual effect.
Or are my results really cause and effect to my practices? Maybe i am just imagining they are.

I personally think it's a waste of time to determine whether it's a mental effect, an energetic effect, or if it's a spiritual effect. Actually it's mostley a waste of time to determine if it's spiritual. It can be proven that being in a better mood is a mental effect. It also has an effect on energy. But spiritual? One runs around in circles trying to prove that. Just keep doing what has been working for you and be glad for the results.

If there's anything spiritual to humanity you'll find out when you die. Most of the living who try to prove, and then think they have proven spirituality are full of shit, and a waste of my time. I've wasted too much on them already.
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
The funny thing is, Scientology in not truly spiritual, except to wrap itself (as in cloak itself) in a kind of spirituality.

Beneath the spiritual, with its "thetans," etc., is a grasping and clawing psychological and philosophical system that emphasizes survival. Very Darwinian, or as some have commented, "Nietzschean."

And below that, and closer yet to the core, it's a kind of political ideology with long lists of enemies, a covert intelligence system with its own "Intelligence tech," and very materialistic money making racket.

Maybe a better question would be, "What did Scientology turn you off to?"

:)

Organized religion.

Anything related to seeking 'past life' awareness. -- I decided I just didn't need to know if I have lived before and if I will come back again because I'd gone that route with the cult and all it did was result in mockups and disillusion. I decided that whatever happened in the past is not as important as what is happening now. That the idea of eternity is marvelous mystery which will never be solved until one gets there, if it even exists. I believe in hope. That hope for a better future and doing what I can to make that happen now is more important than seeking to know and control the future.

Alternative medicines not scientifically substantiated.

Chiropractors for anything other than medical doctors definition of subluxations as "significant structural displacements"

Multilevel marketing

Salespeople
 

Claire Swazey

Spokeshole, fence sitter
I personally think it's a waste of time to determine whether it's a mental effect, an energetic effect, or if it's a spiritual effect. Actually it's mostley a waste of time to determine if it's spiritual. It can be proven that being in a better mood is a mental effect. It also has an effect on energy. But spiritual? One runs around in circles trying to prove that. Just keep doing what has been working for you and be glad for the results.

If there's anything spiritual to humanity you'll find out when you die. Most of the living who try to prove, and then think they have proven spirituality are full of shit, and a waste of my time. I've wasted too much on them already.

I'm not waiting til I die.I'm very interested in spirituality playing a part in my life now and with my little forays into Buddhism and Shamanism, seems possible.

I think Hubbard was turned off and angered by any communion with or attempts to reach the divine. I assume that he felt this placed one "at effect". I've since reevaluated this and I feel it doesn't have to be that way; that it can be beautiful. I'll never subscribe to Judao Christian thought but there are many other ways to encounter the divine.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
I was never convinced there was such thing as "a spirit". I can work with "having the spirit" of something, or that there is spirit in a person's character that keeps expressing itself in new ways, but I never thought of it as immortal (I've THOUGHT about that, of course, but never been able to see any reason to believe it).

Gurdjieff taught that we have many "I's", as in lots of viewpoints or personalities that we rapidly or not-so-rapidly switch between. I agree with this idea. The elusive property which selects between such identities is what I think of as "spirit", but I have real trouble defining it in any way. It could just be a trick of language. In metapsychology, the concept of being able to switch between whatever identities are needed is called "versatility". It is left uncertain if there is such thing as an "ultimate identity", one which a person holds as "themselves" which is left when all other identities are shed, or transcended. I'm not convinced that there is.
 

hummingbird

Patron with Honors
Before I joined the cult, I was a lapsed Catholic.

$cn cured me of the ability to believe in anything organized by another human being. That includes all the religions and random faiths and philosophies and whathaveyous oozing around.

I hate being lectured to. No one has any right to tell me how to live my life, to decide for me what is moral and what will bring me happiness. I do not believe in a "being in the sky" that's judging me or guiding me or whatever.

The sad thing about religions, IMHO, is that they make people attribute their abilities to some other entity. For example, I was talking to this apartment manager about a partnership deduction on taxes, because I needed more info about where the number came from. She said she was puzzled too, then "the Lord" told her to look at all the partners' K-1s (a tax form) and add them together to get the value. And I thought "How sad that she can't acknowledge what she is capable of, she has to ascribe her knowledge and abilities to some other being."

That said, I do acknowledge a spiritual component to my life. But no one has the key. And I am content to live my life not knowing "what I really am" or "what my purpose really is" or "what the true nature of life is" because no one else does. And if they say they do, they are either mistaken, or a charlatan. Life is too short (and has too much fun stuff in it) for navel-gazing.
 

JustSheila

Crusader
Before I joined the cult, I was a lapsed Catholic.

$cn cured me of the ability to believe in anything organized by another human being. That includes all the religions and random faiths and philosophies and whathaveyous oozing around.

I hate being lectured to. No one has any right to tell me how to live my life, to decide for me what is moral and what will bring me happiness. I do not believe in a "being in the sky" that's judging me or guiding me or whatever.

The sad thing about religions, IMHO, is that they make people attribute their abilities to some other entity. For example, I was talking to this apartment manager about a partnership deduction on taxes, because I needed more info about where the number came from. She said she was puzzled too, then "the Lord" told her to look at all the partners' K-1s (a tax form) and add them together to get the value. And I thought "How sad that she can't acknowledge what she is capable of, she has to ascribe her knowledge and abilities to some other being."

That said, I do acknowledge a spiritual component to my life. But no one has the key. And I am content to live my life not knowing "what I really am" or "what my purpose really is" or "what the true nature of life is" because no one else does. And if they say they do, they are either mistaken, or a charlatan. Life is too short (and has too much fun stuff in it) for navel-gazing.

I get you.

It wouldn't have bothered me to hear someone say that and attribute intuition or any other spiritual or undefined quality to God. I probably would have laughed, but in a warm way. It's not like God is a person. Sometimes just another word for that which is unknowable or spirit or intuition in general that we all possess but can't explain. Yah, any of us can talk about it all day long, but none of us knows quite how it all works, so at the end of the day, what does it matter? I agree with you there.

It does bother me when people thank God for parking spaces, though. :biggrin:
 
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