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Disconnection - A bit of a bitch that causes a hitch.

Carmel

Crusader
Speaking out publicly to media means disconnection. That disconnection often has a ripple effect on so many others. As a result of that, many who want to speak out, won't or can't without having an adverse affect on more than themselves.

A made up example of the nasty web, but typical all the same ...

There's a lad (a second generation Scn'ist) who wants to speak out. Dad is in the SO. Mum is out of the SO, doesn't like the church, but is married to someone on course in the org and she works for a boss who is a Scientologist (well, she *thinks* her boss is a Scientologist). Boss though wants out and desperately wants to speak out, but she has a daughter in the SO, so remains under the radar *waiting* for something to change. The lad is willing to lose his dad, he figures he's already lost him. He knows though, that his mum is on side with him, but if he speaks out, then he knows that if his mum sticks by him, she’ll lose her husband and her job. The boss wouldn't want to sack the lad's mum, but if she didn't, then she'd lose other employees who were scientologists and her SO daughter would disconnect from her. It goes on and on and on. The ripple effect is humongous.

What does the lad do? The Church has people by the short and curlies on this one. They know it and they use it.

Per our calculations, only 3 -5% of all the people in ANZO who have left the CofS and who are out of Scn, have been prepared to speak ‘publicly’ against it. The rest won't because of fear of being "fair gamed", but for the vast majority who won’t or can’t, it’s because the ramifications of disconnection will not only affect them, but also severely affect their loved ones, and sometimes severely affect those who have nothing to do with it or no choice in the matter (like the second generation for example).

I’ve had so many people contact me now about speaking out publicly, since the announcement of the Inquiry. Since the Lateline news segments in the last two days, it’s kinda gone ballistic. Still though, when it’s come to the crunch, only one of many who have contacted me in the last week with the intention of doing it, can or actually will, now that they've looked at the ramifications.

So how do we get around this? We have been ‘managing’ it to some degree, but after today, I’ve been wondering how the hell to blast through it.

I’ve often dreamed of a ‘day of reckoning’, or a day when everyone would put their bloody cards on the table. If they did so in ANZO, they would be bloody surprised! They’d realise that the the vast majority of their mates, clients, customers, their boss or their employees were under the damn radar just like they are. However, if they didn't all come out at the same time, that'd be a problem.

If all those under the radar had or felt the freedom to communicate to their friends and associates about where they were at on the CofS and Scn, they would find out where their friends and associates were really at, and the vast majority would be gobsmacked by the insidiousness of the façade they have been maintaining.

For sure, for many, to just discard the facade *alone* could and would have dire consequences to self and loved ones. But imagine if the majority who keep up the facade all discarded it on the same day. Who would be left standing? Crikey, it wouldn’t be those against the Church and Scientology who would be out of work, ostracised, kicked out of home, losing clients, losing business or whatever…….it’d be those few still sticking with their old allegiance, coz now it would be them who would be standing alone......and they'd be thinking “where the fuck has everyone gone?” and “maybe I should go too”. Then, with the vast majority of those "out" now speaking out (instead of staying under the radar), and no *imaginary* field anymore, maybe a lot of SO members would walk and go and reconnect with their families.

Aaaaarrrrgggghhhhhhhhh! I know things are changing and that they’ll continue to do so. I’m just wondering how ta give it a bit of a nudge, coz today it’s been a bit of a bitch.

Dreams are free. :)
 

Purple Rain

Crusader
Is there nobody that could give this lady a job? And if she really thinks about it, is it really worth being in a relationship where you will be cast off like yesterday's socks for not believing the right thing?

My husband chose me over the church. That is real love. Anything else is an illusion. I wouldn't want anybody willing to choose the church over me, nor would they deserve my love and allegiance.

If she was able to get out of doubt on this, then her son would be free to speak.

We should all be free to speak.
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
Carmel, great post.

To anyone who is thinking about speaking out:

There has never been a time when it has been safer to speak out. The cult has you cowed into silence, into covering up it's crimes, into giving tacit consent to it's rampant and unchecked out ethics. Take back your integrity!!! You will not find it while cowering under the bed hiding from the thought police.

The big disconnection stick exists solely and only as a control mechanism to keep those in line who realize something is not right and might do or say something about it. As does rollback, sec-checking, the ethics codes (look closely, they have NOTHING to do with ethics), conditions, declares, and the concept of enemy lines.

This week we have seen two acts of extrordinary bravery by two young ladies who have sacrificed a great deal to expose the underbelly of the cult. We have a senator calling for a judicial enquiry. NOW is the time. Come out and tell what you know, all of you, and in a few weeks disconnection will be no more. And you can stop living a lie, you can say what you observe, and you can speak the truth.

Stop feeding the monster!

And don't leave Scarlett and Carmen standing on the front line alone!
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
My suggestion to you all is

GET IN THE FUCKING LIFEBOAT NOW

sinkingship.jpg


If that silly guy playing the violin insists on staying then so be it. You can only do so much.

Oh, and might I point out that once the ship goes down, everyone will be free to talk to everyone.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
As long as there's a 'Church' of Scientology there will be this problem. Disconnection is the last-best whip the 'Church' has to keep its prisoners in line. They're not going to give it up.

However, things will get better. Especially when actual inquests start and witnesses begin to have the protection of 'wog' law. Still, as long as there's a 'Church' of Scientology individuals are going to have to face this.

Zinj
 

Cherished

Silver Meritorious Patron
I remember you telling me ages ago, Carmel how some best friends in Scientology were both "out" and "under the radar" and had told you, but they hadn't told each other.

That is crazy stuff. I would hope that, for a start, people who know you (and Kev and others) might trust you to disclose to someone else who is known to you to be out and to see if you can't link people up that way one by one.

I told you once that I imagined you holding a dinner party or an afternoon tea where a small group of people who trusted you agreed to come, not knowing who was going to be there, but knowing that you would only invite people you knew were definitely "out". Imagine turning up to such an event and finding your best friend there too. Or your boss.

That'd be cool.
 

Arthur Dent

Silver Meritorious Patron
Speaking out publicly to media means disconnection. That disconnection often has a ripple effect on so many others. As a result of that, many who want to speak out, won't or can't without having an adverse affect on more than themselves. ....

Excellent post, Carmel. Exactly how it goes. Fear, losing loved ones - family or not, being fair-gamed, etc., etc.
Reading this board pushes one closer to speaking out though.
Closer and closer.....
 

Mick Wenlock

Admin Emeritus (retired)
Is there nobody that could give this lady a job? And if she really thinks about it, is it really worth being in a relationship where you will be cast off like yesterday's socks for not believing the right thing?

My husband chose me over the church. That is real love. Anything else is an illusion. I wouldn't want anybody willing to choose the church over me, nor would they deserve my love and allegiance.

If she was able to get out of doubt on this, then her son would be free to speak.

We should all be free to speak.

If wishes were horses even a beggar would ride.

Scientology makes cowards of its members. Some recover quicker than others - like some of the people on this board (Kev, Carm, Panda, Emma) some take longer - like me - and some never recover properly.

Saying what someone "should" do, when they patently cannot do it, is to ignore THEIR situation. Not yours or mine.
 

Doom

Lurking.
Great post Carmel, that first line really holds true,
since going to the media I have gotten a total of 1 phone call from my still in Brother and father (I have hade a birthday since then).

Also I was lurking for quite some time before Shredder made her choice and told me right away (I was too worried about what would happen).
If I hade told her earlier we may have been out years earlier.

We might find that most of the so called field is under the radar and just too chicken to tell the truth and get out of the Cult.
 

RogerB

Crusader
A Stake in the Heart of the Monster

Carmel, my Love, you got me thinking!

You know, this whole “Disconnection” thing can be used as a key stake in the heart of the monster.

When Xeno frames the terms of reference for the “Royal Commission/Judicial Inquiry,” what should be mentioned are the following facts for use to whip the CofS:

1) The CofS has denied disconnection is practiced as either retaliation or as duress on its members.

2) The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902, expressly forbids the above (retaliation/duress/pressure/influence) from being used to silence or otherwise intimidate or suppress witnesses.

3) The terms of the COMMISSION should make reference to the historically proven, long standing and continued practice by the CofS of disconnection and Fair Game policy and warn both potential witnesses and the CofS that such illegal interference with witnesses during or after the completion of the COMMISSION’S investigation will not be tolerated and that to avoid any possibility of potential witnesses being intimidated due to historic behaviour by the CofS, it is to state for the record that it and its members will not so retaliate or invoke any policies to punish witnesses before the COMMISSION under pain of Contempt of Court.

4) I’m not up to date on the Australian Constitution (there have been two changes in published form since I was there), but last I heard it does not contain the same provisions of freedom of speech as the UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS . . . which, unfortunately has no force of law within Oz. See the Declaration here: http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and here: http://www2.ohchr.org/english/law/
But the laws on tampering with witnesses, before judicial proceedings, and as specifically articulated in The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902 should be invoked against the CofS to give freedom of witness to those who wish to speak.

5) What is to be exposed, loud and clear, is that most scientologists live in fear of and under the threat of discrimination and retaliatory action based on CofS practice in the event of their “breaking ranks” and speaking any truth that is derogatory of the CofS and its practices.

6) The setting up of the COMMISSION and its terms of reference should address this very issue of CofS conduct (as business as usual for them), and the COMMISSSION should gazette the fact of this CofS practice and give protection loud and clear to witnesses that it is safe for them to speak.

7) from the point of view of “the faithful” churchies, well, if they want things cleaned up, then this is their chance to do so.

Rog
 
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Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Speaking out publicly to media means disconnection. That disconnection often has a ripple effect on so many others. As a result of that, many who want to speak out, won't or can't without having an adverse affect on more than themselves.

A made up example of the nasty web, but typical all the same ...and sometimes severely affect those who have nothing to do with it or no choice in the matter (like the second generation for example).

Great example, Carm. How about this?

It would require someone that is unquestionably trustworthy. You would be great, but it's probably far too much work for you. It would also need someone with some computer database (and encryption!) skills, no less trustworthy than yourself.

The general idea is that on ___ date, everyone in the database goes public simultaneously, provided they still want to. "Go public" basically means a statement that "My real name is ___ and I've had it with being bossed around by the CofS" along with whatever details the person wishes to provide. There could be a website showing the number of people in the database ready to go public once a critical mass is achieved, along with some kind of geographical location.

What is the number of new "outies" needed for critical mass? 100? 500?

Disconnection is the only real problem. If people want to get services outside the CofS they can, with far less cost and hassle. Once there are enough people saying screw it, I've had enough, then it's all downhill after that.

Paul
 
Aaaaarrrrgggghhhhhhhhh! I know things are changing and that they’ll continue to do so. I’m just wondering how ta give it a bit of a nudge, coz today it’s been a bit of a bitch.

Dreams are free. :)


With regard to the government inquiries they must have facilities available for taking testimony privately & without disclosure of identities or details of testimony. As long as their identities are protected & their privacy is preserved from public disclosure many disaffected scientologists might well be willing to give testimony privately to state inquiries.

As far as the media, black out screens & voice altering can disguise distinguishing characteristics. Names & precise details can be left out of accounts so as to eliminate identification by Co$ agents. The press should be old hands at handling anonymous whistle blowers. For obvious reasons they would prefer clearly sourced reports. However, the combination of identified sources with many anonymous sources, along with indications of why the anonymity is needed, should paint a very grim picture of the realities of life in the cult to the general public.


Mark A. Baker
 
Carmel, my Love, you got me thinking!

You know, this whole “Disconnection” thing can be used as a key stake in the heart of the monster.

When Xeno frames the terms of reference for the “Royal Commission/Judicial Inquiry,” what should be mentioned are the following facts for use to whip the CofS:

1) The CofS has denied disconnection is practiced as either retaliation or as duress on its members.

2) The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902, expressly forbids the above (retaliation/duress/pressure/influence) from being used to silence or otherwise intimidate or suppress witnesses.

3) The terms of the COMMISSION should make reference to the historically proven, long standing and continued practice by the CofS of disconnection and Fair Game policy and warn both potential witnesses and the CofS that such illegal interference with witnesses during or after the completion of the COMMISSION’S investigation will not be tolerated and that to avoid any possibility of potential witnesses being intimidated due to historic behaviour by the CofS, it is to state for the record that it and its members will not so retaliate or invoke any policies to punish witnesses before the COMMISSION under pain of Contempt of Court.

4) I’m not up to date on the Australian Constitution (there have been two changes in published form since I was there), but last I heard it does not contain the same provisions of freedom of speech as the UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS . . . which, unfortunately has no force of law within Oz. See the Declaration here: http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and here: http://www2.ohchr.org/english/law/
But the laws on tampering with witnesses, before judicial proceedings, and as specifically articulated in The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902 should be invoked against the CofS to give freedom of witness to those who wish to speak.

5) What is to be exposed, loud and clear, is that most scientologists live in fear of and under the threat of discrimination and retaliatory action based on CofS practice in the event of their “breaking ranks” and speaking any truth that is derogatory of the CofS and its practices.

6) The setting up of the COMMISSION and its terms of reference should address this very issue of CofS conduct (as business as usual for them), and the COMMISSSION should gazette the fact of this CofS practice and give protection loud and clear to witnesses that it is safe for them to speak.

7) from the point of view of “the faithful” churchies, well, if they want things cleaned up, then this is their chance to do so.

Rog

:thumbsup:


Mark A. Baker
 

Purple Rain

Crusader
If wishes were horses even a beggar would ride.

Scientology makes cowards of its members. Some recover quicker than others - like some of the people on this board (Kev, Carm, Panda, Emma) some take longer - like me - and some never recover properly.

Saying what someone "should" do, when they patently cannot do it, is to ignore THEIR situation. Not yours or mine.

Ok, I take that back. Nobody offer her a job or point out that she's married to someone who doesn't really value her.
 

RogerB

Crusader
With regard to the government inquiries they must have facilities available for taking testimony privately & without disclosure of identities or details of testimony. As long as their identities are protected & their privacy is preserved from public disclosure many disaffected scientologists might well be willing to give testimony privately to state inquiries.

As far as the media, black out screens & voice altering can disguise distinguishing characteristics. Names & precise details can be left out of accounts so as to eliminate identification by Co$ agents. The press should be old hands at handling anonymous whistle blowers. For obvious reasons they would prefer clearly sourced reports. However, the combination of identified sources with many anonymous sources, along with indications of why the anonymity is needed, should paint a very grim picture of the realities of life in the cult to the general public.


Mark A. Baker

Oh yes, this can be done. Indeed part of my testimony in the "Melbourne Inquiry" was done "in camera." That's the legal term for in confidence or without disclosure to the public.

Any witness could request this as to identity while leaving the substance of the evidence on the public record.

Oh, edit: by the way, all evidence would be under oath and subject to the law on perjury if false.

Rog
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
Carmel, my Love, you got me thinking!

You know, this whole “Disconnection” thing can be used as a key stake in the heart of the monster.

When Xeno frames the terms of reference for the “Royal Commission/Judicial Inquiry,” what should be mentioned are the following facts for use to whip the CofS:

1) The CofS has denied disconnection is practiced as either retaliation or as duress on its members.

2) The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902, expressly forbids the above (retaliation/duress/pressure/influence) from being used to silence or otherwise intimidate or suppress witnesses.

3) The terms of the COMMISSION should make reference to the historically proven, long standing and continued practice by the CofS of disconnection and Fair Game policy and warn both potential witnesses and the CofS that such illegal interference with witnesses during or after the completion of the COMMISSION’S investigation will not be tolerated and that to avoid any possibility of potential witnesses being intimidated due to historic behaviour by the CofS, it is to state for the record that it and its members will not so retaliate or invoke any policies to punish witnesses before the COMMISSION under pain of Contempt of Court.

4) I’m not up to date on the Australian Constitution (there have been two changes in published form since I was there), but last I heard it does not contain the same provisions of freedom of speech as the UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS . . . which, unfortunately has no force of law within Oz. See the Declaration here: http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and here: http://www2.ohchr.org/english/law/
But the laws on tampering with witnesses, before judicial proceedings, and as specifically articulated in The ROYAL COMMISSIONS ACT 1902 should be invoked against the CofS to give freedom of witness to those who wish to speak.

5) What is to be exposed, loud and clear, is that most scientologists live in fear of and under the threat of discrimination and retaliatory action based on CofS practice in the event of their “breaking ranks” and speaking any truth that is derogatory of the CofS and its practices.

6) The setting up of the COMMISSION and its terms of reference should address this very issue of CofS conduct (as business as usual for them), and the COMMISSSION should gazette the fact of this CofS practice and give protection loud and clear to witnesses that it is safe for them to speak.

7) from the point of view of “the faithful” churchies, well, if they want things cleaned up, then this is their chance to do so.

Rog
That's really clever thinking Roger. Bravo :)
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Hi Carmel,
I know you struggle to keep up with PMs so I'll post this here.
See the hypocritical program of the world's leading opponents of religious discrimination.

Let the senator and any other suspect know they have similar programs targeted at them personally. If you're not up to speed on similar past COS efforts just say so and the likes of Zinj and Hartley et al can bring you up to speed.



From Marty's Blog.
=============
S E C R E T



FREEZONE CIS – FINAL HANDLING PROGRAM

References Section:

HCO PL 11 May 1971, Issue II, PR Series 7, Black PR

HCO PL 21 Nov 1972, PR Series 18, How to Handle Black Propaganda

HCO PL 16 Feb 69, re-iss. 24 Sep 1984, Battle Tactics

HCOB 26 Dec 1968, The Third Party Law

ED 149 INT, 2 Dec 1966, Project Squirrel

HCO Exec Letter, 27 Sep 1965, re-iss. 24 Sep 1983, Amprinistics

HCO PL 7 Mar 65, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scn & Scientologists

HCO PL 1 Dec 1979, Flourish and Prosper

INFORMATION:

During the second half of 2006, 5 Freezone (FZ) delivery activities closed down in Russia. Still, these handlings are moving too slow. There are another 15 groups that are part of the CIS Freezone network. There are also four groups in the Ukraine and one each in Moldova and Belarus. The squirrels violate our marks and copyrights and they must be handled NOW.

There are connections between CIS squirrel activities and the Western EU groups in Bern, Frankfurt and Munich. The Swiss squirrels operate as OLs for the Russian ones. The Swiss ringleader has organized “training camps” in Russia. It was also learned that the key FZ members in Switzerland and Germany have “solved” their shortage of delivery materials by concentrating the lower level training materials on a Russia-based server which they access through a secret password they share.

PAST EFFECTIVE ACTIONS:

By analysis, the following actions have proven successful to deal with squirrels in CIS over the last couple of years:
Using resources to gain insight and prediction
Using the insight to discover out legal ruds and getting authorities to act
Generating threats of copyright infringement action
Spreading defeatism and disaffection on the squirrel news sites
Creating 3P between Russian group leaders and the Swiss ringleader.
Labeling the FZ an OPC intell operation
Locating crimes of the squirrels’ top strata (e.g. tax evasion) and causing complaints to be filed and official action to be taken.



PROGRAM PURPOSE:

TO TERMINATEDLY HANDLE THE FREEZONE IN RUSSIA AND CIS AS A SOURCE OF BLACK PR ON SCIENTOLOGY AND AS A TRAVESTY OF STANDARD TECH THAT RUINS PEOPLE’S SPIRITUAL FUTURE.

MAJOR TARGETS:

1. To permanently break the connection between the Swiss and Russian Freezone and

get the CIS groups engaging in internecine feuds that shatter the network to its core.

2. Establish effective control over the squirrel newsgroups for CIS and make the sites a

hotbed of messages about disaffection and defeatism.

3. To expose the Freezone leadership to their membership as criminal fraud and get them under official investigation so they lose the support of their clientele and can no longer afford to operate and must fold.
[snip]
 

RogerB

Crusader
More on Our Rights

Doing a little research and reading, I came to the conclusion that the Ozzie Constitution does not need the sort of provisions regarding free speech etcetera as contained in the US Constitution/Bill of Rights and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights as they are already guaranteed in the ENGLISH BILL OF RIGHTS which is also law (old and ancient, of course, but) in effect in all British Commonwealth countries.

The wording used along with the occasion of its origin is a little convoluted, but none-the-less, Englishmen are by it guaranteed essential freedoms.

I point this out because any effort by the CofS to abridge individual rights by the use of any duress, threat or force is a violation of very basic British (and Oz, NZ) law.

Ummmm, so add this to the list of CofS crimes!!!

RogerB
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
Speaking out publicly to media means disconnection.
Not for much longer. :coolwink:
I’ve had so many people contact me now about speaking out publicly, since the announcement of the Inquiry.
See? :D
Aaaaarrrrgggghhhhhhhhh! I know things are changing and that they’ll continue to do so. I’m just wondering how ta give it a bit of a nudge, coz today it’s been a bit of a bitch.
You need to stop beating yourself up!!! Yesterday CoS had total unencumbered power. Today the abuse is worldwide news and the SENATE of a country is going after them. That's big. Stop :punch: ing yourself or I'll have to :smack: ya!!

Dreams are free. :)
And you are achieving them!!!!! :cheerleader: :happydance: :thumbsup: :clap:
Read Tory's post: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=18110
 
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