Farrakhan calls on Nation of Islam to start killing

[oneonewasaracecar]

I can't find the quote right now, but Hubbard's instruction re. alliances with other groups of this sort is aimed at siphoning off the desired - useful - members of those groups and phasing them into Scientology. That's the aim, not a permanent alliance.

The idea is that a certain number of NOI members will become full fledged Scientologists and, quietly, cease their involvement with the NOI. That's already happening - but slowly, and very discreetly.

As for the general public, they only "get" that Farrakhan is inciting violence - which he has done many times over the years - but the Scientology connection is mostly lost on them.

Once the NOI/Scientology alliance ends, Scientology will have a supply of former NOI people as staffers, etc., and NOI with have a bunch of 'Book One' auditors, and Scn Inc. will likely tolerate their less than standard use of 'Book One'.

Then Farrakhan will die (he's already old), and it will matter even less.

And Scn will still have its few hundred former NOI people as staff.

This is an interesting point. Farrakhan can hardly take kindly to that in the long run.

I wonder if HH is right about a violent takeover of Scientology by NOI.

 

[Enthetan]

This is an interesting point. Farrakhan can hardly take kindly to that in the long run.

I wonder if HH is right about a violent takeover of Scientology by NOI.

So much of what happens in Scientology has to do with implied threat of force. People go to hear a speech, and the auditorium doors are barred with SO members standing guard so you can't leave until you talk to the reg.

You say something that annoys somebody with power, and you get a "gang bang sec check", with several people standing around you, with the implication that they will forcibly make you stay if you try to leave. Etc, etc.

Now, watch what happens when they try this on an NoI member, who then proceeds to smash the CMO person's head against the concrete, or otherwise demonstrates that he will, without hesitation, use extreme violence against anybody who attempts to physically control him.

Or, as a famous Nation of Islam spokesman once said:

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

So much of what happens in Scientology has to do with implied threat of force. People go to hear a speech, and the auditorium doors are barred with SO members standing guard so you can't leave until you talk to the reg.

You say something that annoys somebody with power, and you get a "gang bang sec check", with several people standing around you, with the implication that they will forcibly make you stay if you try to leave. Etc, etc.

Now, watch what happens when they try this on an NoI member, who then proceeds to smash the CMO person's head against the concrete, or otherwise demonstrates that he will, without hesitation, use extreme violence against anybody who attempts to physically control him.

Or, as a famous Nation of Islam spokesman once said:

View attachment 11022

We're clearly talking desperate measures here. Are they trained to use force against anyone who knows how to fight? I don't know, but it's never been my impression that that's the case. None of the people I knew in the CofS had been anywhere near a martial arts class or taken classes in self-defence.

The real trap IMO isn't so much the threat of violence, but the need to remain in good standing to get your Bridge and not be disconnected from your friends and family. If you hit any of them then you're going to be in big trouble with Ethics the next time you show up at the Org.

 

[Enthetan]

We're clearly taking desperate measures here. Are they trained to use force against anyone who knows how to fight? I don't know, but it's never been my impression that that's the case.

The real trap IMO isn't the threat of violence, but the need to remain in good standing to get your Bridge and not be disconnected. If you hit any of them then you're going to be trouble with Ethics the next time you show up at the Org.

Are you asking (A)"Are org staff trained to use force?" or (B)"Are NoI members trained to use force?"

re (A), outside of some SO security guards, staff have no "use of force" training, beyond what individuals might personally have gotten outside Scn. It's 99% bluff, on the viewpoint that THEY can physically intimidate YOU, but any attempt by YOU to push BACK will get you declared.

re: (B), In earlier times, NoI members were given military-type training, but I think that's either dropped out, or gone very much low-key. My guess is that the average NoI member would be able to handle himself in a fight.

ADDING: After a quick check, it looks like martial arts training in NOI is currently being done

[video=youtube;avE6ToRAHIM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avE6ToRAHIM&index=5&list=PLD9E465FB30706E29[/video]

FURTHER ADDING: I've been out of the loop for many years, and I should not imply any knowledge of what Scn staff training in use of force might be TODAY.

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

Are you asking (A)"Are org staff trained to use force?" or (B)"Are NoI members trained to use force?"

re (A), outside of some SO security guards, staff have no "use of force" training, beyond what individuals might personally have gotten outside Scn. It's 99% bluff, on the viewpoint that THEY can physically intimidate YOU, but any attempt by YOU to push BACK will get you declared.

re: (B), In earlier times, NoI members were given military-type training, but I think that's either dropped out, or gone very much low-key. My guess is that the average NoI member would be able to handle himself in a fight.

Thanks for replying, that's pretty much what I thought would be the case. I was thinking of (A), Org staff and run of the mill SO (I take it for granted that the NoI have training).

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Just a slight correction.

Credit where it is due...

...or is shooting innocent unarmed [STRIKE]endangered lions involved in population studies[/STRIKE] African Americans cowardly?

I find the intellectual fashions regarding guns in the USA difficult to understand.

You seem to miss the aerial view of what is happening on the inner-city streets of America. Did you ever live or work there? I have, sometimes right in the high crime areas teeming with urban terrorists in the form of heavily armed, sociopathic and well-organized Hispanic and black gangs.

The police, in many of these cities, have been overwhelmed by two simultaneous trends--the stratospheric rise in violent crimes/murder COUPLED WITH the prohibition of police to use the methods and systems that had traditionally proved to reduce those spiraling crime waves to a fraction of what they now are.

ONE EXAMPLE: New York City. Don't know if you ever visited or lived in NYC during one of the decades where robbery, rape, muggings and murder spiked to such inconceivable levels that the city was turned into a very dangerous war zone. I was there. When Mayor Giuliani and his staff took office, certain policing methods were put (back) in place and over the next decade the murder and crime rate dropped by approximately 60%! Since you seem concerned about the murder of blacks, you will be happy to know that under Giuliani's empowered police force, the number of blacks saved from being shot, knifed, robbed and murdered was in the tens of thousands!

Now, you also seem extremely focused on the very rare instances where police might have or did in fact used deadly force where it could well have been avoided. It is a tiny number. It is identical to every other profession known to mankind in that there are a tiny percentage of practictioners who need to be a) not hired in the first place; or, b) fired immediately; or, c) prosecuted for criminal behavior. That is precisely what is happening. Yet you are using those anomalies and projecting it back on the 99.99% of highly professional and innocent policemen who do their job every day, despite monumental personal danger.

You mention nothing about the TENS OF THOUSANDS OF YOUNG BLACK MEN that are murdered each year by other young black men.

This kind of inverted focus is analogous to a HURRICANE or TSUNAMI hitting a major coastline city (Tokyo, NYC, et al) with devastating property damage and catastrophic death toll. Yet, in the midst of that, focusing on just the death toll in the black areas--to the exclusion of the big picture that all were affected. For your information, on rare occasion the police in the US sometimes exert too much force or end up killing a white person or asian person too. Far more often, in fact, than it happens to your mythical concept of blacks being the only ones targeted.

The inner cities in America are defacto war zones, due to ultra-liberal ("Democratic") administrations, largely voted for and staffed by African Americans themselves. The blacks are not living in white-controlled gulags, despite your theories. In Baltimore, for example, the majority of city gov't and the police force is actually black--yet the media seems to have convinced you that white people are running it to the detriment of blacks.

It is inevitable in any war (or "war zone") that there is collateral damage, because that is the nature of what happens when heavily armed urban terrorists are policed--sometimes it goes badly and the blame can fall on either side. There is not a special problem with blacks being targeted for murder, unless one considers that the 95% of murdered black men are killed by other black men.

I appreciate your effort to mourn the death of innocent people, but don't forget to mourn the death of innocent blacks at the hands of other blacks. And don't forget to equally mourn the deaths of police officers by blacks as well. It's a very difficult situation that, provably, can be remedied by the style of policing that gets guns and criminals off the street. Nothing else has ever worked.

And exclusively focusing on the rare instances where an innocent is killed (black or white) is not the solution. The solution is to remove criminals and place them in jails/prisons where they cannot run their murderous campaigns against citizens.

 

[Enthetan]

Just a slight correction.

Credit where it is due...

...or is shooting innocent unarmed [STRIKE]endangered lions involved in population studies[/STRIKE] African Americans cowardly?

I find the intellectual fashions regarding guns in the USA difficult to understand.

Adding to what HH just wrote:

According to the most recent FBI homicide stats, the black population in the US, although only 13 percent of the total population, accounts for just over 50% of homicide victims. In over 90% of those cases, the black victim was killed by another black. Out of 12,765 homicides, police shootings account for only 410.

The average black person in the US is at far more risk of being killed by another black person, than by the police.

Another interesting statistic, is that around 90% of murder victims have criminal records.

 

[Veda]

So much of what happens in Scientology has to do with implied threat of force. People go to hear a speech, and the auditorium doors are barred with SO members standing guard so you can't leave until you talk to the reg.

You say something that annoys somebody with power, and you get a "gang bang sec check", with several people standing around you, with the implication that they will forcibly make you stay if you try to leave. Etc, etc.

Now, watch what happens when they try this on an NoI member, who then proceeds to smash the CMO person's head against the concrete, or otherwise demonstrates that he will, without hesitation, use extreme violence against anybody who attempts to physically control him.

Or, as a famous Nation of Islam spokesman once said:

View attachment 11022

Malcolm X was assassinated in 1965. His wife and children believed Louis Farrakhan to have been behind the assassination.

As recently as 1993, Farrakhan said:

"Was Malcolm a traitor of ours? And if we dealt with a traitor like a nation deals with a traitor, what the hell business is it of yours? A nation has to be able to deal with traitors and cutthroats and turncoats."​

 

[ILove2Lurk]

. . .
Why do I get sucked into these threads that seem indelicate to some readers?

Because I've lived in a couple of these big cities and have friends who've been victims of the crime and violence.
I fled decades ago to safer more exclusive ground. I could afford to do it thankfully. Now I live off the crossroads
of the world and won't ever even visit larger cities with these high crime rates.

Stories are here if curious, but a warning: not too politically correct.
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...guson-Missouri&p=982087&viewfull=1#post982087

Chicago by the numbers today

• Obama's home town; primary residence in Kenwood; three block from Farrakhan
• About 600 gangs
• Between 100,000 and 150,000 gang members
• About 12,000 cops
• Chicago prohibits sale of handguns within city limits
• But 60,000 to 80,000 illegal guns on the streets
• Mexican and South American drug cartels moving in to control drug trade
• And already use Chicago as a main US drug trafficking hub
• Expect more violence as this trend continues

Mexico by the numbers in last ten years

• About 100,000 drug cartel foot soldiers
• Roughly 100,000 people murdered just over the border
• 22,000 people gone missing
• Over 1500 journalists murdered

Open borders?

• Well, I guess all this coming soon to a large American city near you.

Thanks Washington and big city politicians!

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Malcolm X was assassinated in 1965. His wife and children believed Louis Farrakhan to have been behind the assassination.

As recently as 1993, Farrakhan said:

"Was Malcolm a traitor of ours? And if we dealt with a traitor like a nation deals with a traitor, what the hell business is it of yours? A nation has to be able to deal with traitors and cutthroats and turncoats."​

Farrakhan openly declared a fatwa (i.e. death sentence) against Malcolm X and his agents committed the murder. As published by numerous journalists and publications:

In 1964, Malcolm X revealed publicly that Elijah Mohammed--the leader of the Nation of Islam-- was guilty of impregnating several of his teenage secretaries, in direct violation of his own preachings against sex outside of marriage.

Farrakhan was outraged. He publicly called Malcom X a traitor and wrote, two months before the killing, that "such a man is worthy of death".

Three (3) men tied to the National of Islam were convicted of the murder.

​

Straight out of L. Ron Hubbard's sociopath's playbook. Make others commit the crime and make others take the blame and prison sentences.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Are you asking (A)"Are org staff trained to use force?" or (B)"Are NoI members trained to use force?"

re (A), outside of some SO security guards, staff have no "use of force" training, beyond what individuals might personally have gotten outside Scn. It's 99% bluff, on the viewpoint that THEY can physically intimidate YOU, but any attempt by YOU to push BACK will get you declared.

re: (B), In earlier times, NoI members were given military-type training, but I think that's either dropped out, or gone very much low-key. My guess is that the average NoI member would be able to handle himself in a fight.

ADDING: After a quick check, it looks like martial arts training in NOI is currently being done

[video=youtube;avE6ToRAHIM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avE6ToRAHIM&index=5&list=PLD9E465FB30706E29[/video]

Impressive demonstration of martial arts?

Um...no. LOL.

It was, however, an impressively choreographed dance routine, even though NONE of those moves would work in a real street fight or professional MMA match.

Here's another "grand master" whose fighting skills and technology are so advanced that he has never once been defeated in 200 fights!


[video=youtube;gEDaCIDvj6I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEDaCIDvj6I[/video]


For the record, here is a piece of worthless but curious information. Hubbard wrote a "Flag Order" issued to all Sea Org members that states:

"ALL SEA ORG MEMBERS SHOULD BE TRAINED
IN JUDO AND SMALL ARMS WEAPONRY." ​

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

<snip>

For the record, here is a piece of worthless but curious information. Hubbard wrote a "Flag Order" issued to all Sea Org members that states:

"ALL SEA ORG MEMBERS SHOULD BE TRAINED
IN JUDO AND SMALL ARMS WEAPONRY." ​

Thanks for this HH. Assuming that this isn't happening now, just a guess as to what the reasoning might be here; maybe DM doesn't want a bunch of martial arts trained people around him who could successfully resist his physical assaults on them?

 

[Dulloldfart]

Thanks for this HH. Assuming that this isn't happening now, just a guess as to what the reasoning might be here; maybe DM doesn't want a bunch of martial arts trained people around him who could successfully resist his physical assaults on them?

I joined the SO at Saint Hill in 1972. There were no judo or firearms courses ever really. At one point in the late 70s the young CO (Chris H) started a weekly judo class with a local Scio that I went to a couple of times, because of this FO. It got stopped after a month or so: production demands, dilettantism etc.

I believe there was something early (1966/7) on with the likes of Otto Roos etc when the SO was far more macho than the wimpy landlubbers we were.

Paul

 

[Enthetan]

I joined the SO at Saint Hill in 1972. There were no judo or firearms courses ever really. At one point in the late 70s the young CO (Chris H) started a weekly judo class with a local Scio that I went to a couple of times, because of this FO. It got stopped after a month or so: production demands, dilettantism etc.

I believe there was something early (1966/7) on with the likes of Otto Roos etc when the SO was far more macho than the wimpy landlubbers we were.

Paul

Yes, I think this went in with the early "ship" SO, and dropped out. In the early 80's at Flag Bureaux there was also an attempt to have judo classes, started by an SO member. Some people showed up, but it never really caught on. There weren't many people willing to give up the latter half of their meal times to participate.

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

..

And Scientologists stand and applaud NOI Scientologists who emcee events in the COS.

And Scientologists would instantly declare any "merchant of chaos" organization in the world that spewed hate and violence like the NOI. The COS would be running the mimeo machines 24 hours a day to declare SPs and PTSes.

But, since the NOI gives business to the COS, the Scientologists look the other way and continue talking about their wins.

You know what would be real karma? If Farrakhan had Miscavige killed the same way he had Malcom X killed, allowing him to come into power. And then the NOI would install themselves as the new leaders of Scientology.

And Scientologists, fully trained in the ways of mindless cult zombie-ism, would stand and cheer at Scientology events given by Louis Farrakhan.

Think that is far fetched?

Think again. If NOI could figure out how to do it without getting caught, there is no way they would not do that.

I am trying to decide who is more evil, the COS or the NOI.

Here's what I came up with.

The NOI is not more evil, but they are more dangerous--because they are "higher toned" than the Scientologists (according to Hubbard). The NOI is up there around "anger" and "rage" on the tone scale. The Scientologists are solidly crazy-glued in at their chronic, 65-year-long tone level -- 1.1 (covert hostility). The Scientologists would love to say and do what they think and broadly publish their sociopathic and genocidal plans--but they are too scared--especially after Hubbard tried that already and the world reacted with rejection and ridicule.

It is entirely fascinating that NOI continually exposes themselves as a TERRORIST GROUP, inciting murder, mayhem and terrorism. Yet, law enforcement does nothing about it, because they are a "church". See why NOI and COS get along so well?

DM already established precedent that control of the finances and the organization under one person can be accomplished through force. Within the ranks of Scientology at the time he was basically up against kids, and old hippies. The church has limits that they will not go beyond. Even their lawyers and PIs have limitations. There have been conspiracy theories that government entities have or could try to take over the church but even they have limitations. Terrorist groups, cartels and mafia have no limitations. To them Davey is a spoiled punk who happens to be a signatory on about 3 billion in assets and control over an international organization that can be turned to their use. DM's little contingent of Sea Org and private security guards or an armored limo cannot stop a rocket launcher or a mafia manned by former 3rd world Special Ops and Intelligence agents. Even the NOI is small fry in this neighborhood. All that needs to happen is for some auditor to take down the details of a drug cartel hit, an extortion scheme, or info about their organizational structure in a PC Folder to start the whole ball rolling.

 

[Axiom142]

When I first heard how The Cult had apparently teamed up with the NOI, my first thought was, “This will not end well.”

I’m sure to an egomaniac like Miscavige - desperate to do anything the ‘get the stats up!’ - this seemed like a great idea. Join forces with another authoritarian cu- excuse me, religious movement, and get their leadership to demand that the rank and file partake of services at their local CoS.

Except it wasn’t. Early reports suggested that Scns were told to treat the new recruits with kid gloves and not reg them until their pips squeaked like they did with their own kind. So what is the point of having all that raw meat if you can’t extract the last pound of flesh and pay for all those nice things Der Leader likes so much?

I don’t pretend to be an expert on the subject, but from what I have heard and read, the NOI is a public relations nightmare in-waiting for any partner.

And, I have this feeling that any short-term gain will be wiped out with interest when the inevitable falling out happens. Farrakhan strikes me as the sort of person that will not willingly play second-fiddle to anyone. Miscavige has to be the boss in whatever he does. He won’t tolerate any challenge to his authority or encroachment into his territory. This is an explosive mix. What will The Cult do when NOI members decide that they will ‘do the Tech their way’ and ‘why should they listen to some long-dead honky muthaf***er?’ (OK, so I watched ‘Shaft’ a few times) and start committing Technical Degrades on an industrial scale?

I’d love to see some pimply-faced Ethics Officer try to hand out an SRA to some bad-ass ex-gang-banger from da hood and demand compliance or else!

The genie will not be stuffed back into the bottle. Imagine The Cult having to sue the NOI to wrest back control of The Tech?

Yep, things could start to get real ugly, all too soon.

Axiom142

 

[Enthetan]

I’d love to see some pimply-faced Ethics Officer try to hand out an SRA to some bad-ass ex-gang-banger from da hood and demand compliance or else!

The genie will not be stuffed back into the bottle. Imagine The Cult having to sue the NOI to wrest back control of The Tech?

Yep, things could start to get real ugly, all too soon.

Axiom142

I think that, when the blow up happens, it will be spectacular.

It will be inevitable. Some day, some CMO girl with more arrogance than common sense will unload on some NoI member, and it will turn out very badly.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Yes, I think this went in with the early "ship" SO, and dropped out. In the early 80's at Flag Bureaux there was also an attempt to have judo classes, started by an SO member. Some people showed up, but it never really caught on. There weren't many people willing to give up the latter half of their meal times to participate.

Too bad nobody too the Commodore seriously when he ordered them to become expert martial artists.

If people had only listened to Ron, when there was a security problem in the org, it could have been solved it so easily by someone just yelling: "HCO BRING JUDO!"

 

[Enthetan]

... The real trap IMO isn't so much the threat of violence, but the need to remain in good standing to get your Bridge and not be disconnected from your friends and family. If you hit any of them then you're going to be in big trouble with Ethics the next time you show up at the Org.

Ah, but will this work with Nation of Islam?

Remember, NoI has their own auditors. They appear to be developing their own parallel service-delivery capabilities.

What happens if a SO member tries giving an NoI member a "severe reality adjustment", the NoI member decks the SO member, the SO tries to "put Ethics in" on the NoI member, and the NoI hierarchy responds with "Fuck you. We will not accept your trying to discipline one of our members"?

 

[elwood]

This thread has truly inspired me - to trade my 9mm for a .40.

Seriously, I thought Helluvahoax nailed it in one of the most concise statements of the problem I have read. The race-baiters like Farrakhan and Sharpton are no different than any other cult leader. They must have a target to demonize in order to control their followers. My issue is with a media and government officials who buy into and legitimize their rhetoric.

"Black lives matter". Of course they do. All lives matter. The slogan implies that someone (read white people) believes otherwise. More likely, gangsters believe otherwise.