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Fundamentalist KSW Independent Scientology

Ralph Hilton

Patron Meritorious
Hi Communicator,
Many of my posts to the new "blog" which isn't a blog according to Lana have been deleted. I did think that there was a vague chance of sanity enroaching upon the Independendent Scene but was rapidly disillusioned.
You do seem to have a rather good perception of events with the required degree of objectivitity. A blog is sometimes a pretentious substitute for a forum which allows the moderator to act like a fascist.
But to give Marty his due he does graciously allow some of my posts to his blog through if they align with his agenda.
From time to time I wonder if I am the only sane person left on this planet. I even occasionally wonder about myself. The conclusion I usually come to after pondering on such matters is that we are all fairly clueless about the actual nature of existence but afraid to admit it.
Anyway the new blog has far less activity than my facebook page so I think the chances that a New World Civilization will emerge from it are rather remote.


Angelic Poster
Ralph, I dunno what the iScientology crowd deleted that you wrote, but I saw something you wrote not long ago that gave me pause as well:

Ralph Hilton | April 19, 2013 at 5:27 pm | Reply​

Consider what you wish about this. Scientology is not a new discovery that LRH came up with 60 years ago. It is something that a very strong being put together from the work that many of us have done over the ages.

Many of us have worked together or apart over many lifetimes to solve the human situation. The overt acts that we all have committed across the ages make David Miscavage look like a baby throwing his rattle out his pram.

We have been doing this for a very very very long time.

People like Marty and Alan Walter and David Mayo and Bill Franks and John McMaster and Mary Sue and Bill Robertson and many others have been intertwined in so many lifetimes. I have to include David Miscavage in that list as I have some vivid recalls of his participation in a research project some 75 million years back.​

Do you really believe that stuff?



@IndieScieNews on Twitter
Look for Fundamentalist Independent Scientology Goodwill Tours in the future

Do not look for Fundamentalist Independent Scientology Reg tours in the future. But do look for Fundamentalist Independent Scientology Goodwill tours.

Also, the problem is that, "DM did not read KSW."

Look for Fundamentalist Independent Scientology Goodwill Tours in the future
We need to plant seeds

By Tom Martiniano

Hi all. It has been intimated in recent articles that there is a new group coming. And you will hear much on this in the next short while. There are a number of the old guard who have banded together, to get the show on the road – and in accord with the coming announcement of this, Lana asked me to write up a series of articles based on a plan on how we move forward as an independent Scientology community.

Before I do that I want to lay down a few solid basics here. I’ll do this with a good story from the days before the bottom fell out. There are false datums and local false policies that were laid in just before the bottom fell out in 1987 that I want to bring to everyone’s attention so that we don’t go down this road again.

In 1986 I was the Sea Org Programs Chief in middle management. I was in charge of the establishment and the actual running of AOLA, ASHOD, ASHOF, AOSHEU, AOSHUK and AOSHANZO. I was also running FSO on the side. Around August of 1986 Mark Yager (then CO CMO INT) sent Owen Starkey to me. Owen was running around in EU on the Freewinds Reg Mission getting donations to purchase the new ship to deliver OT VIII. He was also telling FSO and AOSHEU regges that they were squirreling with their reg missions in the orgs. FSO and AOSHEU GI were crashing. Owen was found to be at the bottom of the GI crashes.

Owen arrived at my desk and I asked him why he was telling FSO and AOSHEU regges to quit regging and then tell them that they were squirreling. He said to me: “Because they are squirreling.” I said “You’ve lost your mind.” Owen said to me with 100% certainty “Find the LRH reference on AOSHEU and FSO Reg tours to orgs. In fact find any references by LRH on reg tours at all. Find it and then talk to me, otherwise you are talking out of your ass.” I dismissed him back to HCO and I looked in my hat pack. To my utter shock, there were no references on reg tours by AOSH or FSO. The only references I could find were “Goodwill Tours”.

A Goodwill Tour is where the AO or St Hill orgs send Sea Org members out to orgs on tour and ask the staff “What do you need?”
If the ED says “I need a good reg” or “I need a good supervisor” the tour will stay there until they procure and post a “Good reg” or a “Good supervisor”.

If the ED says “I need a real good GI week”, the tour will help them get it. I was astounded that I had read these references before, but I kind of brushed them off thinking “well, that’s not what we do now.”

I pulled Owen back in and told him what I found. He said “Did you read LRH’s letters to me?” I said “No,” He said “Well, then you’re not hatted as a Sea Org Programs Chief.” So I went and found the letters to Owen from LRH and read them.

There it was: LRH said that if you do anything but these goodwill tours, the orgs will dry up and the AOSH will dry up as well. In fact, in the advices LRH forbid AOSHEU and FSO to reg in these orgs. But there they were in these orgs in force. There were AOSH or FSO tours in every major org in EU and the orgs were struggling. So was the AOSH.

I immediately sent out orders to send out Goodwill Tours and worked out a plan to phase out the Reg tours. The orgs started to respond and as a result the AOSH went into a 2-year affluence. Of course I got into trouble with upper management for knocking out the reg tours because what I cut across more than anything phasing out the reg tours was book sales.

This was right in the middle of the book debit marathon that drove every org insolvent. I got my ass kicked by ASI for cutting across book sales. Who was running ASI? The person who currently makes empty orgs for a living; His initials are DM. I was replaced shortly afterwards with another Programs Chief who was more friendly to reg tours and book sales and everything I did in setting up the goodwill tours was erased and book debits became the way of management.

Orgs by the dozens went insolvent. ASI ran things and kicked our butts if we did anything to cut across book sales. DM had established control in 1987, one short year after LRH’s death. The ASI staff made plenty of money in their pockets from book sales. The bonuses were what this was all about. DM crammed his own pockets with loot from insolvent orgs.

But the lesson was learned: It takes a farmers mentality to expand Scientology.

You have to plant seeds for the future in order to have crops in the future.

If you shortcut it, you will get no crops, no food and death will follow shortly afterwards.

DM thinks he can shortcut all of this “management nonsense” and slam-dunk the orgs there, PR the hell out of them and reg more donations based on the PR of these fancy Ideal Orgs. This gambit of his is one of the best scams of the 21st century. It is a brilliant ruse to get existing Scientologists to pay big bucks and keep the show on the road. Orgs are very hard to kill because their very essence is survival. The org staffs are getting brilliant at keeping the doors open and keeping on going. DM knows that these staff will keep on until they die themselves. But DM did not read KSW and doesn’t understand that no farm can live without crops. At some point it will all cave in on them and DM will take his millions and go to Argentina where extradition is not allowed.

We need to have the farmer mentality. We need to plant seeds, and now. The seeds are pcs and auditor trainees. We need to start making auditors and C/Ses now, now, now.

I am going to follow up with the next leg of this plan in a few days. Stay tuned.


@IndieScieNews on Twitter
FIS: "set up a training space in each continent" New FIS Sea Org? FIST?

FIS = Fundamentalist Independent Scientology.

Will FIS be establishing its own Sea Org per the below?

Will we see Fundamentalist Independent Scientology Technology (FIST) on the Third and Fourth Dynamics?

FIS: "the action for us to take is to set up a training space in each continent" ("What caused the 70's boom")
What caused the 70's boom

By Tom Martiniano

This is the second article in a series of articles on jump-starting our activity. This article is about what caused the boom in the 70’s and how we can use this, today.

I had done an eval in the beginning of this year on what actually caused the boom of Scientology in the 70’s, as a lot of orgs were very close, if not already there, to “Saint Hill Size”. There had been a lot of speculation on what caused this boom such as; “most of the people who attended Scientology back then were Hippies who were seeking spirituality”, or it was because “society was more lenient towards movements” or other Why-is-God type of remarks.

But if you look at what really kicked the whole thing off was when LRH broke through the big barrier. What actually happened back then that was so big and so important was that LRH discovered OT III in 1967 and developed the way through of the “Wall of Fire”. Because of the volatile content of the materials of OT III LRH decided that he needed to make a cadre of strong, dedicated Scientologists. So the Sea Org was established in 1967. Management was established aboard the Apollo and in 1968 this management started putting together a plan to boom Scientology and began establishing CLOs, for management purposes, and he also established AO’s to deliver OT III.

Then they established St Hill Orgs in key safe areas around the planet which were designed to deliver the newly released SHSBC (St Hill Special Briefing Course) in which all of LRH’s technical tapes were studied as well as every bulletin LRH ever wrote were studied – all in chronological order. The result of this course was the powerful Class VI auditor who not only had his/her basics fully in but was now able to audit pcs on any rundown that there was and was able to repair any pc no matter how bogged down. The course was a gigantic hit and by 1970 there were more than 500 students on the Briefing course in Los Angeles alone.

Mind you, during this period of intense expansion there was very little promo coming out of the church. Most of the public on the lines were coming into the orgs from a) FSMing, b) Body Routing and c) word of mouth.

When these SHSBC students graduated their intense internships they were urged by Sea Org management to open up missions and orgs across the planet. And they did. These orgs (Toronto, Boston, New York, Detroit, St Louis, San Francisco, Munich, Paris, London, just to name a few), boomed in just a few years. Most got up to St Hill size and were churning out pc grads and were collectively making auditors and c/ses by the hundreds per month.

But the schools and education n the USA had been long since compromised and the majority of high school grads in the USA were illiterate. LRH began to notice a high blow rate on academy training and so developed the Study Tech, Word Clearing tech and Supervisor tech. The Sea Org sent out implementation programs for study tech and word clearing and as soon as the orgs implemented them, the blow rate declined and now the orgs were making auditors and c/ses without much attrition. The Primary Rundown was released in 1971. I did this course myself. It took me a year and a half to do it but I went from super un-literate to super-literate and now I could study. I set up our academy courseroom and I made all my students do the Primary Rundown before they did academy training. It worked like a dream and each one of these students went on to be excellent auditors.

The Word Clearing Festival came out in 1971. My post at the time was “Word Clearer”. My post duties were set up in two parts: 1. I word cleared staff on their hats until they were sure to not have any confusions on their posts. This alone kicked off an overall affluence in the org. 2. We word cleared public. We concentrated on getting in public who had been in the org at least once. We sent them “Qual Summons’” in which they were given appointments to meet with me. Public would actually call in and make an appointment and I would have them come in. I would explain to them that I wanted to give them “another chance”. So I put them on the meter and asked them what was their first contact with Scientology and then their next contact and so on until I got either a Long Fall on the Meter or a Blowdown. Let’s say they had a Blowdown on their first contact being a friend of theirs disseminating to them. I would ask them if there was something in that talk that he didn’t fully get (Method 4 Word Clearing). I would get the instant read and follow it up. They would say something like “I didn’t get what he was saying about something called “Engrams”. “What word was misunderstood just prior to Engrams?” would be the next command I could give. The earlier MU would be “Scientology” (or something like that) and I would then clear that. I swear to you that I got more Dial Wide F/Ns and Floating TAs by doing this action than any other action I ever did. You see – Mis Us block interest and purpose (Talk to Department 15 by LRH) and when you clear the mu you automatically rehab the original purpose that the person came into Scn for in the first place. We flooded the org with these people who were so happy that we pulled them back in and handled them. They did services and went up the bridge.

So, it appears that the action for us to take is to set up a training space in each continent and let people know they are there. We must do this now. Then we start word clearing everyone in the field. They will love it, trust me.

We need to find people in each continent who will fund setting up training areas. In FEBC tape 4 LRH says that “Function monitors structure” and where there are auditors there will be paying PCs and the training facilities will start making money off of paying pcs. There are thousands and thousands of pcs in each continent who are stalled Dianetic Clears that need help. I’ve helped a lot of them and I assure you they are in big trouble. The Church takes 6 intensive on average to verify a person clear or not. We verify them in one or two sessions (because of no sec checks).

So study tech, and word clearing, the actions taken on orgs just prior to the boom.

Makes sense, eh?


Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
Re: FIS: "set up a training space in each continent" New FIS Sea Org? FIST?

. . . I’ve helped a lot of them and I assure you they are in big trouble . . .

Heh! I think I get what Tom really means but isn't saying "thousands and thousands" are in "big trouble" something of a generality and an evaluation? I would suggest that the problem is not that these potential PCs do not understand and, thus, need to be issued with a "Qual summons" and put through word-clearing, but that they do understand perfectly well: Scientology - do not want. And that's just part of the problem Scientologists have when seeking to disseminate.


@IndieScieNews on Twitter
FIS: The solution is to reinstate the original OT levels.

Obviously, DM caused the original OT levels to be cancelled because he was afraid of the powerful OTs they would create.

FIS: The solution is to reinstate the original OT levels ("Finding spirituality - or just more MEST")


Finding spirituality - or just more MEST

By Tom Martiniano

NOTE: I was recently sent the below LRH quote by a reader, Thomas Price -- who correctly pointed out that current Corporate Scientology has lost the spirituality of Scientology and follows instead, the path of MEST – from basketball, to dances, bazaars – almost anything goes. A few hours later, I received an article from Tom Martiniano – which takes up the same subject and observation, in even more depth. I have included them both here – as they speak for themselves. Lana Mitchell

From PDC tape 35: The DEI Scale, LRH says:

“And you can get all sorts of things from a church now: anything but God.

“You can get basketball, bridge, bowling alleys, dances, bazaars – almost anything you want to.

“But don’t go in and ask for a hat full of God, because they haven’t got it to sell. It’s gotten inhibition and then scarcity, but if they gave you any God it wouldn’t be the idea – the spiritual idea – at all. It would be a piece of MEST. You can buy God: you can go down and buy a cross, and it’s MEST. It’s all solid now.

“Isn’t that interesting? Where we have desire, enforce and inhibit and out through the bottom, and you have a dying, if not dead, religion.” (L.Ron Hubbard)

So really, what is Scientology? What is it all about? What are people looking for when they come into Scientology? Why is it, when people have left Scientology, they still have their attention on it? What is it really all about?

I have been a Scientologist for 42 years and I have answered the question 10,000 times but I really don’t think I ever answered it correctly. But two days ago it hit me like a bright laser beam right between the eyes. I finally realized what Scientology is actually all about and what makes it so popular. Fantastic! Then, sadly, I saw the HUGE flaw in Scientology and saw that if we don’t change it now then we may never get the chance again. Don’t get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with Scientology itself, but there is a whole lot wrong with the way it has been administered.

First of all, let’s get clear on the subject (no pun intended) of Scientology.

I’m using the definition of Scientology in the Admin Dictionary #4 for the purpose of this article: “the ability to change condition” (SH Special 57).

Okay, that’s cool. Then I looked in LRH’s book, “Science of Survival”, and read the “theta-mest theory”. Here LRH told of how the Thetan is in a constant struggle with MEST, and how he collides with MEST and then reorganizes, regroups and attacks MEST again in hopes of bettered survival. It is truly the story of what is going on. Then I read where LRH says in the book “8-8008”: “Scientology is essentially a study of static and kinetics.” (Kinetics is the study of motion, Static is the opposite, it is “at rest, stillness and in Scientology the Static is the Thetan”)

“The static interacts with the kinetic which is considered to be the ultimate of motion.” “It is now considered that the origin of MEST, as we know the physical universe, is a product of theta.” “It can now also be demonstrated adequately in Scientology that energy seems to be produced by and emanate from theta.”

Okay, so that opens the door to a handling: We all are the effect of MEST and we need to be at cause over it. So if we actually made MEST then that means we can untangle it. It appears that all beings are involved in this constant struggle with MEST. And it has been a struggle throughout the time track of the Thetan. And because thetans have lost that battle more times than have won brings the Thetan to need of change. He wants to change this condition and has set out many, many times to figure out how to be theta the solver again. He finds Scientology and he learns that Scientology can get him back at cause over MEST. Finally, after millions of years, someone is talking his language and says “This is the way out of this mess. I want to be at cause over life and MEST, I’m in.”

So the Thetan hooks up with Scientology, pays for services with the hard-earned money he made from doing what he knows how to do - selling junk to people in malls – making people want things they don’t really want. Being part of some production line. But he makes good money and he pays for his auditing and embarks on his journey out of the MEST universe and heading for the Theta Universe. He gets his drugs handled, gets going on his Grades and then gets rid of his own reactive mind via Dianetics and goes Clear. He does his OT sections and goes all the way to OT VIII.

Now what happens? What does this thetan now do?

Upon inspection, little has apparently changed with this Thetan. He has done hundreds if not thousands of hours of auditing and after all was said and done, nothing apparent is different - he is still a salesman, selling garbage to people who don’t want it, he is still struggling to survive, with lots of debt, and he still has lots of problems. What happened? Why is this person not dramatically changed? And why the hell is he still doing the same old thing?

He is still trapped by the physical universe; trapped by MEST. The very nature of the delivery of the Church of Scientology traps the person into MEST even more than he was trapped before he started on the Bridge. Sure, he has probably had a lot of wins going up the Bridge and can operate in the confines of MEST pretty well, but he is still trapped by it.

You see, he has to produce in the MEST universe to pay off all of his bills he racked up going OT.

He has to play the MEST game, as he is in the MEST game – and he has to have a roof over h

I, for example, finished old OT VII (Rehabilitation of full intention) and had to make some money to pay for my expenses while going OT. I went back to my old trade of Automotive Design and worked on designing the wheel well molding for the 1980 Dodge Cordoba for three months, freehand drawing little frigging lines ten hours per day. I was really coming apart at the seams because I was this big thetan who was now interiorized into small lines on paper. It almost killed me. You cannot do stuff like this after you go OT. Sure, I was making big bucks at the time, but it was not worth it in the end.

And what about the people who are well off and could walk in a pay for their Bridge by simply writing a check? These people are already totally engulfed in MEST. I knew some players who came into Scientology and paid for their Bridge by short-selling stocks. Short selling is the ACTION of driving a company broke by buying and selling their stock for less and less and less. They continued to do it after they completed the bridge. These people have ruined thousands of business and therefore thousands of lives in order to feed the Church. No, no, no. And they aren’t the only ones. There is a gal who is OT VIII who is the President of the company that manages Eli Lilly PR and marketing. In other words her product is increased Prozac sales. How the blue hell is she OT? No, no. A real OT would never do anything to trap other thetans. It is just not the nature of the being. And no one in the Church is handling these people to take the “higher road” - the path of theta.

The whole idea of Scientology and the Bridge to Total Freedom was to free thetans from MEST and the trappings of MEST. Look at the awareness characteristics on the gradation chart.

The current corporate Church of Scientology is set up to cause more entrapment into MEST. First of all, the cost of services causes the thetans in the Church to spend more money and go into debt making sure they are spending the rest of their lives working stupid jobs paying off those debts. I know of several people who were told “Go deep into debt to get auditing and then you will be ‘a lot freer to make money because of the auditing.” Yes, and auditing will make you more free, unless you have to work more and slave your life away paying off your debts. Now these thetans are mired in the work-a-day world with the rest of the rats in the rat race.

And not to mention “Keeping up with the Joneses.” Somehow or other Scientologists, as they go up the Bridge, feel like they have to have a big house, big smart car, electronics and all of that MEST stuff. This is because they work for or hang with other “high stat” thetans who show off their big houses, big cars and expensive accessories and say it is their sign of success. So now other public try to emulate these rich public and off we go. Sure having a nice house and good working car and a few toys is okay, but to me it’s like having ideal orgs. Why all the MEST?

A person should be doing the Grade chart to disentangle himself from MEST. He should be coming more theta and less solid and have more freedom to do theta things. He should be surviving well on all dynamics, not becoming effect of the 6[SUP]th[/SUP] dynamic. There is plenty of policy on this in LRH writings and I can supply them as needed. I know; I did the original OT Sections. I did the OT drills and I know what direction I was supposed to go when I was doing those drills. I did have some good wins. And I can tell you that if you are trying to go up the Grade chart so you can have more and nicer MEST, then you are wasting your time.

LRH said in HCOB 23 JUNE 1960 SPECIAL ZONE PLAN – “Consider the position of the world. The story is often repeated on the whole track. As MEST is made to help too much, a plateau of civilization is reached in which each individual is downgraded to a number. The end of this – the lights eventually go out through lack of personal initiative and ability.”

This is what is happening right now in the Church. People do the Grade chart and just carry on with what they were doing before. And they are ignoring their brothers and sisters who need help. Show me current Church OTs who really actually give a crap about another who needs help. The only thing these people are interested in is more money. And that is the product of the current Church of Scientology. In fact, it is demonstrated by current Churchies who are willing to disconnect from family and friends when they are excommunicated. It is also seen when old timers who have served the Sea Org for years, are off loaded in their older years so they are not a drain or a problem for the group.

So we handle this by rearranging the Bridge and getting people to do it for real. If a person wants to go up the Bridge, he should co-audit his way there. And this is for several reasons. First of all, LRH says that “half of the wins are on the training side.” Learning how the mind works and learning how to make people clear and OT makes you a lot less trapped in the Physical Universe. Next, auditing others is one of the most rewarding endeavors that there is. LRH said that the thetan is alive as he can help others. And lastly, it is a lot less expensive to co-audit your way up the grade chart.

But there are people who are just not up to auditing others. This is fine and these people are called PCs. They simply get audited up the Bridge. But they should only pay what they can afford to pay without going into debt. While they are receiving auditing they are trained to study and then they are put on courses that will help them be more able to operate in the MEST world and be at cause over MEST.

Next is to re-instate the original OT sections. The real evil act perpetrated by the current tyrant of the Church was that he knocked out the real OT Sections. Destroying the original OT Sections makes sure all thetans connected with Scientology are trapped forever. Look at this:

The original OT IV deals with the final demise of the R6 bank and all of its implants and components. It’s a very fun level to do and very powerful. The EP of original OT IV is “NEVER BEING TRAPPED AGAIN.” Now that’s kind of important. You can see why the Emperor doesn’t want thetans doing this level.

Next: The EP of original OT V is “CAUSE OVER MEST.” This is what I am talking about here. So if the OT does this section he will be at cause over MEST. Interesting. Now we see why the Emperor wants this OT Section cancelled.

Next: Original OT VI’s EP is “ABLE TO OPERATE EXTERIOR WITH FULL PERCEPTION.” I would say this would put him at cause over the Physical Universe because the OT would be exterior to MEST and therefore out of that trap. The Emperor cannot have this going on in his domain.

OT VII EP is “REHABILITATION OF FULL INTENTION.” Now, this would be handy for putting intentions into living things. These OT Sections, done properly will release one from being trapped and be able to operate exterior and at cause. The Emperor does not want thousands of people intending him or putting intentions into him, that’s for sure.

As thetans go up the Grade chart they should be doing everything they can to be more OT. They should work at disconnecting from the MEST world trappings and work at being fully exterior and at cause. One should be flat out learning everything he can about how to become more able. He should be learning how to audit. He should be learning admin tech. He should be learning OT data and learning how to be more OT using the Philadelphia Lectures and the other OT Hatting course materials. We need to get the being OUT OF THE TRAP OF THE MEST UNIVERSE AND AT CAUSE OVER IT.

If someone moving up the Bridge is not doing anything to help, then his dynamics will never appear or expand. And he will just hold himself back.

But LRH also said the validity of a given purpose is important. So if you have your hands on the secrets of the universe, it only makes sense to share with one's fellows. And moreover, new games become possible only as you move up the Bridge and learn the tech. Now the new games that become possible are all about giving others the tech. Or helping them with the tech. Or directing them to the tech (and getting them up the Bridge). I think most people would find these games more rewarding than any games in history, because of the nature of help.

Outflowing help to the dynamics, LRH found, is what makes dynamics appear. He said in a lecture (sorry I can't remember which one) that the evidence is that the dynamics — each one — are MADE of Help. Because if you stop outflowing help on any dynamic, that dynamic will disappear. And conversely, if you outflow help, the dynamics appear and come into existence. Life blooms around you.

And then the Thetan, now that he is fully cleared and rehabilitated should be doing this kind of work to get others up to this point and not to mention putting order in on this world and universe. This type of work and function is a hell of a lot more theta and more on target than selling crap. If a full OT VIII went into an old folk’s home and taught them how to audit each other, he would be doing something real good. If an OT were to open a tutoring business and taught study tech, it would be a real good thing. If an OT were to set up a TRs course for Government people so that their people could communicate would be a good thing. Anything that makes this world a better place is what OTs should be doing.

This is covered in HCOB SPECIAL ZONE PLAN where LRH says, “We are in a fantastic position, at the right time and place, to halt this cycle of decay and start a new one on Earth. And I believe we should overtly do so. How? We are masters of IQ and ability. We have know-how. Any of us could select out a zone in life in which we are interested and then entering it, bring order and victory to it.”

This is the type of Bridge we should be working on. LRH’s vision was not to put people into debt so that they are trapped. His vision was for us to be at cause and to turn this world around to the better using our new gifts.

This is what we will strive for.

We are going to be a group of real and honest OTs who are free from the physical universe and who can get others through and out of the traps. This is the future.
Obviously, DM caused the original OT levels to be cancelled because was afraid of the powerful OTs they would create.



Re: FIS: The solution is to reinstate the original OT levels.

Obviously, DM caused the original OT levels to be cancelled because he was afraid of the powerful OTs they would create.

FIS: The solution is to reinstate the original OT levels ("Finding spirituality - or just more MEST")

Obviously, DM caused the original OT levels to be cancelled because was afraid of the powerful OTs they would create.


A few comments.

It was Hubbard, not Miscavige, who changed the OT levels after OT 3.

Running old OT 4 on someone who had not done the Clearing Course could be a problem.

Other than that, sure, go ahead and do old OT 5, old OT 6, and old OT 7.

The reason for NOTs, supposedly, was to remove the final barrier to full OT, just as OT 3 was supposed to have done before that, and just as the Clearing Course was to have done before that.

No OTs were produced, and none will be produced now.

But it adds some levels, and Scientologists love levels, and much of this stuff (other than old OT 4) is just recycled Rosicrucianism, and is fun.


Bottom line, a lot of the processing stuff is SO INTERESTING, that I cannot understand how any seeker would not value it. About the only stuff I object to is Sec Checking and running "implants".

Free Being Me

Bottom line, a lot of the processing stuff is SO INTERESTING, that I cannot understand how any seeker would not value it. About the only stuff I object to is Sec Checking and running "implants".

A train wreck is interesting too until looking at the dead bodies ... like scientology.


:) Last time I checked, being asked questions until you saw something more clearly didn't kill people. Of course, I'm not hip to the GATT.

Free Being Me

:) Last time I checked, being asked questions until you saw something more clearly didn't kill people. Of course, I'm not hip to the GATT.

Dissociative hypnotic contextual questions that cause false euphoria, cognitive dissonance, psychotic breaks, delusional indoctrinating beliefs, and identity fracturing, great stuff. :duh:


Dissociative hypnotic contextual questions that cause false euphoria, cognitive dissonance, psychotic breaks, delusional indoctrinating beliefs, and identity fracturing, great stuff. :duh:

Really? I'd love to see the scientific articles you are basing that assessment on.

Free Being Me

Really? I'd love to see the scientific articles you are basing that assessment on.

I would love to see you refute all the known deaths, suicides, and lengthy recoveries of ex's caused by hubbard's scientology currently known and listed here at ESMB. Just because it fascinates you doesn't make it any less a train wreck.


I don't refute that there has been a trail of death and mayhem in Hubbard's wake.

I do deny that it comes from auditing.

Free Being Me

I don't refute that there has been a trail of death and mayhem in Hubbard's wake.

I do deny that it comes from auditing.

Ahhh, the dead, suicided, recovering/recovered ex's have nothing to do with it. :giggle:

Cognitive Dissonance
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cognitive dissonance
"psychological conflict resulting from incongruous beliefs and attitudes held simultaneously."

"6: a psychological defense mechanism in which confrontation with a personal problem or with reality is avoided by denying the existence of the problem or reality."


From Class VIII, old timer, DartSmohen, on OT 3 and NOTs:

...it is nothing more than mental masturbation...

...people who have embarked on this insane program get sick, have strokes, pull in cancers, commit suicide etc.

I remember at Edinburgh one S. African guy suddenly had the "urge to fly". Well, he did, right out of a third story window.

The question is, are these particular OT levels really auditing? (Per the definition presented to a newbie Scientologist) Or are they something else, called auditing?