Geir Isene: Scientology Fair Game & forced Disconnection. So what?

[AnonyMary]

All I am saying is that he didn't mean any harm or insult by it. He's saying that he feels they are alike. That's all.

Now you are speaking for him?

How do you know Cat Daddy is AnonKat? And that Cat Daddy has Asperger's?

Regardess, it's a socially inappropriate comment. It is harmful in that it's insulting and derogatory about Geir and his wife. If Cat Daddy has Asperger's then he is not exempt from being told his comment is not appropriate. That it's a personal attack. Especially the part about the wife.

An inappropriate comment is an inappropriate comment. My reply to Cat Daddy's comment is not inappropriate. I feel it is important to say something, regardless if the person has Asperger's. My work puts me in contact with people with Autism Spectrum Disorders every day. When I see or hear comments like that from someone on the spectrum, it's a teaching moment about the rules, just as it is for someone not on the spectrum. Especially someone who supposedly is a new member who has just started posting here.

I appreciate your concern but Cat Daddy needs to speak for himself on this.

Thanks

 

[Anonycat]

Empty your inbox. I said all I want to.

 

[TG1]

I know that Anon Kat and Cat Daddy and Kitty Kat Spanker (on WWP) are the same person.

He is from the Netherlands.

He is an Aspie.

He doesn't think of Asperger's as "an accusation."

Nor do I.

It is simply a part of who he is. For him, it's like the color of his hair or eyes.

 

[Free to shine]

I for one have found Geir's journey out of the COS interesting and relevant. I don't know where he was at when he made these comments maybe he had a couple too many cocktails. But I'm not going to rip him to shreds over a couple of comments when a lot of the other things he's said have been valuable. Kind of amazing to see how people react to things. I guess he's replaced Marty for SP of the week.

I don't care who made the comments (except the part about being a speaker at Flag Down) I would have the same reaction. It's the issue I care about.

 

[Bluebell]

I don't know where he was at when he made these comments maybe he had a couple too many cocktails.

It doesn´t seem so.

"
Let me elaborate on the OP:
John: “OMG!! There are pickpockets in this city!!”
Peter: “Yeah, I know…”
John: “But that’s HORRIBLE!!!
Peter: “Yeah…”
John: “But aren’t you OUTRAGED??”
Peter: “Not really.”
John: “What?? Why NOT??? And you know what – the police isn’t even serious about doing something about it!! OMG!!””
Peter: “Well, there are crimes going on that is far worse and more important for the police to tackle.”
John: “Sure, there are worse crimes! But you cannot seriously be saying that since there are worse, crimes – that pickpocketing isn’t something that we should take seriously! I mean, people are loosing their valuables. Precious jewellery is stolen! There are even reports of kids having been robbed of their teddy bears for Christ’s sake!! You can’t seriously not be serious about these horrible, horrible crimes! Gosh man! This is bad, Bad , BAD!”
Peter: “Man, I think it’s a tad disrespectful of you to unravel so thoroughly about this when other people are suffering from crimes that are far, far worse. It’s great if you want to do something about the pickpocketing, but please stop over-reacting like this.”
John: “OVER-REACTING? OVERREACTING?!?!?!? WTF! OMG! BBQ!

posted 2 days ago by Geir Isene

"

 

[Cat Daddy]

Yes I am AnonKat I have Aspergers and ADHD, alsoo I express more of my wackiness as KittyKatspanker

Lost my Password due to los of my E-mail account. no biggie. Starting new earning me new lil stars.

HELL , if you want to know just LOOK at Geir you'd know , my opinion of course.

And thank you for your good works

AK, KKS, CD

Now you are speaking for him?

How do you know Cat Daddy is AnonKat? And that Cat Daddy has Asperger's?

Regardess, it's a socially inappropriate comment. It is harmful in that it's insulting and derogatory about Geir and his wife. If Cat Daddy has Asperger's then he is not exempt from being told his comment is not appropriate. That it's a personal attack. Especially the part about the wife.

An inappropriate comment is an inappropriate comment. My reply to Cat Daddy's comment is not inappropriate. I feel it is important to say something, regardless if the person has Asperger's. My work puts me in contact with people with Autism Spectrum Disorders every day. When I see or hear comments like that from someone on the spectrum, it's a teaching moment about the rules, just as it is for someone not on the spectrum. Especially someone who supposedly is a new member who has just started posting here.

I appreciate your concern but Cat Daddy needs to speak for himself on this.

Thanks

 

[Cat Daddy]

All I am saying is that he didn't mean any harm or insult by it. He's saying that he feels they are alike. That's all.

Not an Insult, let me refrase than. Geir has the capacity to think along a path that can get more obsessive and narrow loosing touch with reality.

A lot of truth is in his thinking but if taken to extremes you can loose context.

I myself have that capacity too. It can result in awesome associative thinking and seeing parralels too


[video=youtube;J7QOAUcqyYc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7QOAUcqyYc[/video]

Geir Isene left the Church of Scientology in 2009, after being a member for 25 years. He is the only person in Norway that has reached the highest spiritual level in Scientology, OT 8. He recently released an autobiography where he writes openly about Scientology's inner secrets - the OT levels are described in detail. Link to his book release: http://isene.me/2013/09/01/1984/

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Auntie la la (La la Lou Lou) once mentioned (many years ago) that scientology (especially the SO) creates "Aspergers" type personalities and from what I know of it, I completely agree.

 

[Cat Daddy]

She makes a Mistake. (common mistake it seems)

People with Autism Spectrum Dissorder are not like Psychopaths

Scientology creates Psychopaths

Auntie la la (La la Lou Lou) once mentioned (many years ago) that scientology (especially the SO) creates "Aspergers" type personalities and from what I know of it, I completely agree.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

She makes a Mistake. (common mistake it seems)

People with Autism Spectrum Dissorder are not like Psychopaths

Scientology creates Psychopaths

Ah OK ... I was referring (and believe La la was too at the time) mainly just to the way scientologists often lack empathy and find genuine social interaction tricky (the TRO thing gets in the way of that too) but I admit I am not in a position to have a valid opinion ... as you certainly do.

 

[Cat Daddy]

Ah OK ... I was referring (and believe La la was too at the time) mainly just to the way scientologists often lack empathy and find genuine social interaction tricky (the TRO thing gets in the way of that too) but I admit I am not in a position to have a valid opinion ... as you certainly do.

Your opinion is as valid as mine.

I do understand why it may seem often that way. Alsoo I think the Training Routines and Communication course can especcially atract and trap people with Autism Spectrum Dissorder.

The feelings are in there in people with Asperger as is the Empathy, with me it may be more brain than heart perhaps. A lot can be achieved by upbringing in my case and reaching for the logic like what I don't like being done to me must alsoo be not fine on others.

With some it's burried deeper.


I thank my mother and my father for my upbringing

 

[Terril park]

All I am saying is that he didn't mean any harm or insult by it. He's saying that he feels they are alike. That's all.

Having spent time with him I'd say it was an attempt at humour
that is a bit obscure, rather than an attack. Its not his way to attack people.

He is Cat daddy.

 

[Terril park]

I know that Anon Kat and Cat Daddy and Kitty Kat Spanker (on WWP) are the same person.

He is from the Netherlands.

He is an Aspie.

He doesn't think of Asperger's as "an accusation."

Nor do I.

It is simply a part of who he is. For him, it's like the color of his hair or eyes.

Thats the Cat Daddy I know.

 

[Balthasar]

I bet you can all be concerned about the issues that spring from Scientology (in or out of the CoS) AND other topics because your compassion is a bit larger than Isene's.

Am I wrong or is it sort of insulting to those of you who have suffered, who have relatives and friends you can't talk to anymore, and who still are dealing with trauma caused by your years in the church to be told that it's no big deal? People who got in/got out without any serious harm who tell others to just get over it already seem sort of arrogant to me. There seems to be an underlying suggestion that they are just smarter than those who suffered.

What you have to understand is that not all people are like you. Not everybody sees himself as a victim. It is not "arrogant" or "suggesting to be smarter" to NOT see a problem with COS disconnection policy.

That's all adults persons who decide to disconnect. Why not let them do it if it makes them happy? But stop - they are all brainwashed and can't think for themselves!

Well, are you going to make the decisions for them? I don't think so.

People do things until they stop doing it. There will always be people who are being brainwashed in different ways. It occurs daily in subtle and more blatant ways. Are you sure you would not be influenced in your thinking by media, of what you read, by your friends or somebody very close to you? Watch out, be careful and analyze your thinking!

Why the rancour about Geir's post on his own blog? Why the upset?

For Christ sake, is this thread full of intolerance!

 

[He-man]

What you have to understand is that not all people are like you. Not everybody sees himself as a victim. It is not "arrogant" or "suggesting to be smarter" to NOT see a problem with COS disconnection policy.

That's all adults persons who decide to disconnect. Why not let them do it if it makes them happy? But stop - they are all brainwashed and can't think for themselves!

Well, are you going to make the decisions for them? I don't think so.

People do things until they stop doing it. There will always be people who are being brainwashed in different ways. It occurs daily in subtle and more blatant ways. Are you sure you would not be influenced in your thinking by media, of what you read, by your friends or somebody very close to you? Watch out, be careful and analyze your thinking!

Why the rancour about Geir's post on his own blog? Why the upset?

For Christ sake, is this thread full of intolerance!

The Church of Scientology is infamous for their Fair Game practice and their forced disconnection.

But so what? What’s the big deal?

I mean, this is nothing more than the daily routine in the US and most other countries in the world. With the immigration laws of countries like UK, Norway and the US, families are regularly torn apart. And citizens in scores of countries are fair gamed and worse for speaking their mind. And people go into fits about the Church of Scientology doing this on a much smaller scale and being much nicer about it. US is regularly going apeshit to “protect their rights” or freedom. Scientology is doing the same on a comparably microscopic scale. Put into this proportion, I can’t help wonder what all the fuss is about.

In my opinion the "deal" is that a lot of members on this board are, or have been suffering from Scientologys fair game and disconnection policys.

For people being affected by it, this is not a small deal, it is a big deal, and should be so in my opinion.

To compare one "smaller evil" to some "bigger evils" doesn't make the smaller evil any less "evil" on those that it targets. Is that really so hard to comprehend?

You claim this thread of full of intolerance. I claim that the original post brought in by CiC from Geir, is what is filled with intolerance. And it should be highlighted, brought out, and discussed.

I have no problem with having my opinions brought out to wash, I consider it something in this day and age that is extremely healthy. I hope you feel the same.

 

[degraded being]

What you have to understand is that not all people are like you. Not everybody sees himself as a victim. It is not "arrogant" or "suggesting to be smarter" to NOT see a problem with COS disconnection policy.

That's all adults persons who decide to disconnect. Why not let them do it if it makes them happy? But stop - they are all brainwashed and can't think for themselves!

Well, are you going to make the decisions for them? I don't think so.

People do things until they stop doing it. There will always be people who are being brainwashed in different ways. It occurs daily in subtle and more blatant ways. Are you sure you would not be influenced in your thinking by media, of what you read, by your friends or somebody very close to you? Watch out, be careful and analyze your thinking!

Why the rancour about Geir's post on his own blog? Why the upset?

For Christ sake, is this thread full of intolerance!

You are being as obnoxious as Geir.

 

[Knows]

Only because we are on the subject of Geir would I bring this up. I am happy he and his wife are out and they are doing some damage to Scientology - walking into the New York Org - was fricken awesome. He has been out 5 years now and it appears he is trying to take the information and experience to make something out of it.

The trouble is IMHO, is that if you keep hanging on to the tech - you don't shed the filter. You will always think in Scientologese. So the comment from Geir is not Wog Thinking. Most Wogs have Compassion and if a wog heard the horror stories about Scientology - most would have compassion for those abused and ruined by the cult.

Scientology thinking would minimize something terrible about Scientology to justify hanging on to it. That is what I see with Geir.

According to the protest Geir spoke at in Norway (later posted on this thread) from 2009, Geir lost friends and business associates so he has experienced disconnection. I don't know if he lost children to the Sea Org, got driven into bankruptcy with a family to feed, lost his home to foreclosure, lost a loved one to a Scientological Suicide - and maybe that is what it would take it to keep it real.

Maybe he is so programmed from doing Scientology on minimizing anything negative - this "implant" kicked in so he could survive...he had to do that for many years in order to BE OAT TEA ATE!

Geir, IMHO, is still suffering from the side effects of Scientology and is trying to make sense of it all.

What I have observed is that there are different BEING-NESS-ES of Ex Scientologist's.

One healthy "beingness" I have observed is Claire Headley.

She makes fun of the tech, she is beautiful and smart she is not afraid to talk about anything -Scientology-to expose the lies and crimes. She sued the Church and lost but still kept going. She is strong, defiant, resolute! (LOL)

She does not have "delusions of grandeur"because she worked next to Miss Cabbage ( Mike and Marty displayed this for a while and still may have some of that side effect going on)

She did not think she "knew it all" because she was an Oat Tea or Tom Cruise's C/S.

She comes across wholesome and real!

I love Claire Headley!

That woman went through complete HELL but has risen above it all to become -what I can see - a healthy, intelligent woman who is flourishing and prospering regardless of the abuse she endured....and SHE IS DOING SOMETHING ABOUT IT! She continues to expose the cult for what it is and never gives up!

I do think Tubb's condition formula's does have some merit.

One must deliver a blow to Scientology in order to progress up and out of the Scientological Bubble. Then make up to the damage to the group that helps you. Geir's statement pissed people off...why? cuz it is more Scientology thinking and bad behavior.

Geir is doing some good work but IMO - is hampering his progress by hanging on the to "think" by continuing to use the "tech" of Scientology masked with changing of some words. If you read his blog - he is still using Scamonology but has twisted it up a bit to mask the similarities.

KRC is replaced with POA - potential, opportunity and ability= Responsibility. In my opinion, this does not make sense but KRC does.

Actually KRC does work and Geir needs to apply that to his life right now.

Knowledge (he knows Hubbard was a con and the whole thing is a scam).

Control (he does not allow his mind to be controlled by the fair gaming and threats from the cult - he speaks out and tells everything to anyone who will listen about the scam.

Responsibility - he knows and can't pretend he does not know...so just tell the truth and keep it simple).

It is true - you are either 100% IN or OUT! If you are going to get out - get out all the way or the side effects may linger for years and the rest of your life.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Pointless waffle snipped.

Posted by Balthasar

What you have to understand is that not all people are like you. Not everybody sees himself as a victim. It is not "arrogant" or "suggesting to be smarter" to NOT see a problem with COS disconnection policy.

It is arrogant and will often make things harder for the people that do the disconnecting when they inevitably wake up and realise what they have done.

That's all adults persons who decide to disconnect. Why not let them do it if it makes them happy? But stop - they are all brainwashed and can't think for themselves!

Yes, they are ... and they are often not yet adults when the INDOCTRINATION begins and they are being methodically trained by people (like you?) into believing that the [STRIKE]final[/STRIKE] perfect solution to issues that they can't control is to just flick people off and play "no speakies" instead.

It's a very childish "solution" and does nothing to create true strength and character in the person doing the disconnecting.

 

[Balthasar]

Pointless waffle snipped.



It is arrogant and will often make things harder for the people that do the disconnecting when they inevitably wake up and realise what they have done.



Yes, they are ... and they are often not yet adults when the INDOCTRINATION begins and they are being methodically trained by people (like you?) into believing that the [STRIKE]final[/STRIKE] perfect solution to issues that they can't control is to just flick people off and play "no speakies" instead.

It's a very childish "solution" and does nothing to create true strength and character in the person doing the disconnecting.

Look, I agree that disconnection as applied by CoS is idiotic. Although there are some situations where it is better not to associate with. But that is not how the CoS does disconnection. The whole idea that another party, somebody else than myself, would decide who "I" am supposed to connect or disconnect is frivolous to say the least.

Friends and the people one loves are the most valuable things on earth. Never, ever let somebody take that away! Money and material things are meaningless compared to a lost friendship. I lost my best friend over 20 years ago (he died very young) and I still miss him.

It is not that I am obnoxious like somebody else suspected earlier.

No, but I do believe in freedom of making one's own mistakes. People don't learn if they are not allowed to make mistakes. And yes, they will wake up one day and realize what they have done! Once they do that, they will never be the same. You have to let them experience the sorrow, pain and shame. If it takes that to drive home the lesson, well so be it. That sounds cruel and heartless, certainly. But in the long run, now I mean long, really long run, it will make them a better person than they would have been without that heartbreaking experience.

I think that disconnection is not the end of the world. You can always reverse it, at least as long the other person is still around. Still, it is unpleasant when somebody disconnects one loves because of Scientology. Happened to me too. She didn't even reply my friendly hello on the street when I bumped into her but turned her face away. Yet, it was not the end of the world.

You have got to get over such things. For me disconnection is not an issue I would be much concerned about. It's a choice people make. Let them make it. Let them go for it, why not? Chicken are coming home to roost later

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Look, I agree that disconnection as applied by CoS is idiotic. Although there are some situations where it is better not to associate with. But that is not how the CoS does disconnection. The whole idea that another party, somebody else than myself, would decide who "I" am supposed to connect or disconnect is frivolous to say the least.

Friends and the people one loves are the most valuable things on earth. Never, ever let somebody take that away! Money and material things are meaningless compared to a lost friendship. I lost my best friend over 20 years ago (he died very young) and I still miss him.

It is not that I am obnoxious like somebody else suspected earlier.

No, but I do believe in freedom of making one's own mistakes. People don't learn if they are not allowed to make mistakes. And yes, they will wake up one day and realize what they have done! Once they do that, they will never be the same. You have to let them experience the sorrow, pain and shame. If it takes that to drive home the lesson, well so be it. That sounds cruel and heartless, certainly. But in the long run, now I mean long, really long run, it will make them a better person than they would have been without that heartbreaking experience.

I think that disconnection is not the end of the world. You can always reverse it, at least as long the other person is still around. Still, it is unpleasant when somebody disconnects one loves because of Scientology. Happened to me too. She didn't even reply my friendly hello on the street when I bumped into her but turned her face away. Yet, it was not the end of the world.

You have got to get over such things. For me disconnection is not an issue I would be much concerned about. It's a choice people make. Let them make it. Let them go for it, why not? Chicken are coming home to roost later

I've never seen anyone actually attempt to make a case that supports the concept of disconnection before.

You must live in a very different world to me.