Grass Roots Movement

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
That is true. Beingness as "Source" was very important to Hubbard. So, he protected that beingness at all costs.

Beingness is very important in Scientology, and relatively in the Western culture.

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Beingness is also important in Eastern culture. That whole thing about "face" in Oriental cultures, the caste system and status, etc, etc.
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
Beingness is also important in Eastern culture. That whole thing about "face" in Oriental cultures, the caste system and status, etc, etc.


Maybe so at the level of the common culture, but not at the higher level of philosophy and religion.

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uniquemand

Unbeliever
Which is the same in the West. Just because we have a powerful economy (even when it's hiccoughing), and a lot of people are obsessed with the dollar and porn, that doesn't mean we don't have a great deal of luminaries working in every area of science and philosophy.

Watch TED talks. Tell me this is not so.
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
Which is the same in the West. Just because we have a powerful economy (even when it's hiccoughing), and a lot of people are obsessed with the dollar and porn, that doesn't mean we don't have a great deal of luminaries working in every area of science and philosophy.

Watch TED talks. Tell me this is not so.

Luminaries in the West are more on the wavelength of Vedic than Semitic.

Would you call L. Ron Hubbard a luminary? He was of a Semitic mindset.

It is really not a matter of geographic location. "East" and "West" simply represent two different approaches of "Vedic" and "Semitic." I am sure there are a lot of "Semitic" mindsets in the geographic "East", and a lot of "Vedic" mindsets in the geographic "West."

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uniquemand

Unbeliever
I'm not down with those divisions.

The people I would call luminaries are well-represented in TED talks. Look instead of asking me.
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
I'm not down with those divisions.

The people I would call luminaries are well-represented in TED talks. Look instead of asking me.

Actually, I have listened to quite a few TED talks. You will find a link to one of them on my blog. Look under the category of education, which is my favorite area.

These luminaries are not tied to some beingness. Their thinking is very free.

They are not out there to smash their name into history.

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uniquemand

Unbeliever
Good, then you are already familiar with the sorts of things they give talks on (all kinds of topics, really). I tend to really enjoy the talks regarding logic and how to bring about social change. My favorite guy, David Deutsch, even gave TWO talks. Both interesting for a nerd such as myself.
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
Please don't try to identify yourself with either "West" or "East". And, please don't try to identify yourself with either "Semitic" or "Vedic".

Just look at what is there, and then you'll be able to see where I am coming from.

It is identification with thoughts that creates beingness.

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uniquemand

Unbeliever
Umm... I don't. That's your pogo stick, man. I told you, I don't think in those terms. A luminary is a luminary.
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
Umm... I don't. That's your pogo stick, man. I told you, I don't think in those terms. A luminary is a luminary.

Maybe that is my pogo stick for the moment, but here is how I have regarded it for some time:

VEDIC: The ultimate reality is unknowable.
SEMITIC: The ultimate reality is beingness.

Spiritual enlightement has come about whenever VEDIC thought has flowed into a SEMITIC background.

Material prosperity has come about whenever SEMITIC thought has flowed into a VEDIC background.

Scientists of the West have been luminaries of the SEMITIC kind as they have focused on the physical, have brought about better understanding of the physical, and material prosperity.

Seers of the East have been luminaries of the VEDIC kind as they have focused on the spiritual, have brought about better understanding of the spiritual, and enlightenment.

Both physical and spiritual aspects are complementary. Luminaries tend to have a wonderful balance of the two.

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Vinaire

Sponsor
KHTK 1C: LOOKING: THE MIND

I find the mind to be still very complicated in Hubbard's theory. Here is my take on the mind.


KHTK 1C: LOOKING: THE MIND

This KHTK essay takes a look at the mind and its contents. Most simply the mind is a repository of visualizations.


THEORY

To get an idea of the contents of the mind, do the following experiment:

Close your eyes. Think of a cat, or your favorite small pet animal. Have that pet come to you and jump in your lap. Pick it up and caress it. Feel its weight and the texture of its fur. Now let that pet jump and run away from you. Open your eyes and point to the direction in which your pet ran away.

WE MAY VISUALIZE IN OUR MINDS WHAT WE DESIRE. ALL THOUGHTS ARE BASICALLY VISUALIZATIONS.

We continually receive input through our sense channels. The mind turns this input into visualizations. We interpret these visualizations to mean what is out there. These visualizations become our perceptions.

WHAT WE SEE, FEEL, PERCEIVE, ETC. ARE VISUALIZATIONS CREATED BY THE MIND FROM THE INPUT RECEIVED THROUGH SENSE CHANNELS.

These visualizations take the form of “pictures” that contain more than just visual perceptions. One looks at these pictures and processes them through thinking. Once processed these pictures reduce to knowledge. When not looked at, these pictures may simply stack up waiting to be processed. This is usually the case with most people.

THE MIND USUALLY CONSISTS OF PERCEPTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN STACKED UP OVER A LONG PERIOD OF TIME, WAITING TO BE LOOKED AT AND PROCESSED.

When a question is asked, a picture matching the question may come up almost immediately in the mind. However, sometimes it may take minutes, hours or even days if that picture is stacked deeply in the mind. At other times there may simply be no response if no picture exists in the mind which matches that question.

The mind seems to “un-stack” itself most readily in the order that it got stacked up. A violation of the natural order in which the mind wants to un-stack itself, seem to make the mind increasingly unresponsive. A question asked may not always parallel the way a mind is stacked up. Therefore, one should not attempt to give answers to oneself or go foraging in the mind for answers.

THE MIND USUALLY RESPONDS IMMEDIATELY TO A QUESTION WITH MATCHING VISUALIZATION. BUT WHEN THERE IS NO IMMEDIATE RESPONSE, IT IS BEST TO GO TO ANOTHER QUESTION OR SIMPLY WAIT FOR THE MIND TO RESPOND.

CAUTION: DO NOT ASSUME ANSWERS, OR SEARCH FOR THEM. THIS WOULD ONLY MAKE THE MIND INCREASINGLY UNRESPONSIVE.



SOLO APPLICATION

You may do this exercise by yourself if you thoroughly understand the theory section above. It is always better to do this exercise with the help of a guide. Once you have completed this exercise, you may go to KHTK 1D.


Exercise 1-6

READ THE FOLLOWING ITEMS. PAUSE BRIEFLY AFTER EACH ITEM TO NOTICE IF THERE IS A RESPONSE FROM THE MIND. IF THERE IS NO RESPONSE THEN SIMPLY MOVE TO THE NEXT QUESTION.

Look for an instance:

1. When you were happy.
2. When you climbed a tree.
3. When you ate something good.
4. When you received a present.
5. When you enjoyed a laugh.
6. When you helped somebody.
7. When you threw a ball.
8. When something important happened to you.
9. When you played a game.
10. When you jumped down from a tree.
11. When you won a contest.
12. When you had a good laugh.
13. When you met someone you liked.
14. When you flew on a plane.
15. When you were at a beautiful place.
16. When you jumped into a pool.
17. When you enjoyed a beautiful morning.
18. When you went for a walk.
19. When somebody teased you.
20. When you sat in a coffee shop.
21. When you danced with joy.
22. When you raced with someone.
23. When you completed something important.
24. When you experienced a pleasant surprise.
25. When you met somebody after a long time.
26. When you were caught in a rain.
27. When you heard a thunder.
28. When someone smiled at you.
29. When you played with a pet.
30. When you held someone’s hand.
31. When someone picked your body up.
32. When you were spinning around.
33. When you read a good book.
34. When you felt breeze on your face.
35. When you saw a beautiful flower.
36. When you smelled a rose.
37. When somebody called you.
38. When you were in a play.
39. When you sang aloud.
40. When you watched a movie.
41. When your team won.
42. When you rode with friends.
43. When you visited a garden.
44. When you played in water.
45. When the weather was stormy.
46. When somebody gave you a hug.
47. When you liked somebody.
48. When you slid down a slide.
49. When you ran toward somebody you liked.
50. When you enjoyed a beautiful weather.



APPLICATION AS A GUIDE

A. Exercise 1-6 is much easier when a guide calls out the items, and the student looks to see if a matching response appeared in the mind. Do the following

1. Explain the exercise to the student.
“I shall be reading some items from a list. For each item, see if a response matching that item appears in the mind. If there is a response, say, “Yep,” “OK,” “I got it,” etc. If no response appears then wait for the next item.”
2. Call out the items one by one prefixing each item with “Look for an instance…”
3. Pause briefly after each item giving student some time to look.
4. Make sure that the student does not start speculating on some response received from the mind.
5. Make sure that the student does not assume a response, or searches for one.
6. Make sure that the student recognizes the absence of a response.
7. Maintain an open and friendly communication throughout the exercise. Sort out any questions and confusions.

B. Go over the theory section with the student.

1. Answer any questions as best as you can.
2. Discuss the theory materials until no questions remain.
3. Do the exercises again as necessary.

C. Make sure that the student fully grasps the following points.

• WE MAY VISUALIZE IN OUR MINDS WHAT WE DESIRE. ALL THOUGHTS ARE BASICALLY VISUALIZATIONS.

• WHAT WE SEE, FEEL, PERCEIVE, ETC. ARE VISUALIZATIONS CREATED BY THE MIND FROM THE INPUT RECEIVED THROUGH SENSE CHANNELS.

• THE MIND USUALLY CONSISTS OF PERCEPTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN STACKED UP OVER A LONG PERIOD OF TIME, WAITING TO BE LOOKED AT AND PROCESSED.

• THE MIND USUALLY RESPONDS IMMEDIATELY TO A QUESTION WITH MATCHING VISUALIZATION. BUT WHEN THERE IS NO IMMEDIATE RESPONSE, IT IS BEST TO GO TO ANOTHER QUESTION OR SIMPLY WAIT FOR THE MIND TO RESPOND.

• CAUTION: DO NOT ASSUME ANSWERS, OR SEARCH FOR THEM. THIS WOULD ONLY MAKE THE MIND INCREASINGLY UNRESPONSIVE.

D. Proceed to KHTK 1D.

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spbill

Patron with Honors
I find the mind to be still very complicated in Hubbard's theory. Here is my take on the mind.

Here's my take on Hubbard's theory: the mind is nothing but a set of pictures, like photos in an album.

Of course, it's all a matter of definition. You can accept the LRH way of looking at it or not. LRH posited a separate "thetan" (not part of the mind). Yes there may be pictues of the thetan stored in a mind but they are not the thetan itself.

Not complicated when you think of it that way.

Bill
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
Here's my take on Hubbard's theory: the mind is nothing but a set of pictures, like photos in an album.

Of course, it's all a matter of definition. You can accept the LRH way of looking at it or not. LRH posited a separate "thetan" (not part of the mind). Yes there may be pictues of the thetan stored in a mind but they are not the thetan itself.

Not complicated when you think of it that way.

Bill

Thetan is also a construct as I see it.

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Vinaire

Sponsor
I can see it that way too. I don't think Hubbard believed it was a construct. His response might be: "who constructed it?"

Bill


THETAN - MIND - BODY simply provide a gradient of manifestations.

All three are manifested.

What is unmanifested cannot be known simply because it is unmanifested.

Please see Essay #3 KNOWABLE AND UNKNOWABLE at Vinaire's Blog.

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