HELLO THAR! Introduction and polite request for assistance

Hello everybody! This post is a bit long. In short:
"Hello. Hows everyone doing? I need help from some ex SO members, if you would be so kind"

yet another scientology activist here. I have been protesting the cult for the last year and I am currently on an assignment to create a to the point, properly referenced press pack and corresponding wiki to be sent ASAP to just about every single politician of note in the western world.

The idea is to focus initially on Australian senators, to give Xenophon the extra ammunition he will need to get the enquiry off the ground. Then expand the mailouts to other western countries likely to follow suit should the aussies launch an enquiry.

An awful lot of pro-cult emails are being sent their way from dedicated scientologists, who in many cases feel hurt that the religion they have been practising is under fire. The idea is to provide a counter point that the average politician can understand, that steers WELL AWAY from any unsubstantiated claims or anything that could be considered as ridiculing the scientology theology.

Instead, it has been decided to focus entirely on the sea org, and entirely on SPECIFIC allegations of illegal activities. We just need a nice, neat paragraph of summaries of abuse, by category, with decent, sourced evidence to back up these claims.

The idea was bourne out as a reaction to ex CMO worker Aaron Saxton's (now unfortunately removed but re-mirrored) "call to arms" video. He has been instrumental in getting the attention of Xenophon in the first place.

Currently I am focusing (and horribly behind schedule) on:

SEA ORG AS AN EMPLOYER--
--The sea org pays it's staff, therefore, it is an employer.
--Employers have specific duties in the areas of working conditions, hours, and pay
--These conditions are not being met, as the pay (in the US I believe its around $50 a week) hours (up to 80 hour weeks) and conditions (shared, crammed berthing, lack of healthcare provision etc) are well below legally binding standards for employers.

In this regard I am struggling to find some specific evidence to back up my claims regarding hours, pay and conditions. Testimonials are of course a brilliant source. A lot of testimonials we have cover these but only in passing, focusing on much nastier things like coerced abortions, etc.

Also I am lacking any "hard" evidence such as documents and so on. There are plenty of leaks each week and tons already on the net, but navigating through them is incredibly difficult.

So is there anyone with experience of working within the sea org who could help me with this? I have trawled through the "experiences" part of the forum but with hundreds of threads it is hard to pick out the choice paragraphs I need.

For those of you who are interested, the wiki page(currently just there so people can dump info to expand on the presspack which will draw some of its info from the wiki) can be found at http://wiki.whyweprotest.net/Operation_Presspack (work in progress)

In the last week or so we have managed to get 5 out of 18 sub headings populated with decent content, but there is very, very little time before we miss the boat, and those of us working on this are utterly overwhelmed as there is *lots* still to do!

Any help you can give, even if it's to point me in some general direction, would be fanstastic, as I am supposed to be doing a degree, not fighting Scientology! There is never enough time in the world it seems.

Anyway, sorry for the ramble. Anyone helping out will receive marble cake.
 

Mest Lover

Not Sea Org Qualified
SO pay when I was in was 30.00 per week. That was rarely paid to us due to the bills getting first priority. I spent about 14-16 hours a day on post 7days per week. 1 time while I was there I spent 3 days on post without any sleep until my snr officer figured out I was always on post, when he/she walked by, and ordered me off to sleep. go figure from there! My social security sheets that I get from time to time I think list my income about 1300 bucks at that point. I don't think I even collected that from them.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
or anything that could be considered as ridiculing the scientology theology.


Unfortunately, to even recount the Scientology Theology (it's not) verbatim and with a straight face will come across as 'ridicule' because it is Ridiculous.

It's also impossible to discuss Scientology *without* mentioning the 'theoretical basis' of Scientology; however, to do so is not only tantamount to 'ridicule', but is a High Crime called 'Verbal Tech'.

Zinj
 

Mystic

Crusader
Darn

Darn, no ridiculing the scifaggOT non-theological, twisted, goon-squad (Sea Ogre) Hubbard tulpa-apparition's spew. I'd better step aside then while you wonderful bastards get your heavy-bonking docs together.

Vaya con Dios!
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
:welcome: IE! I have no documents, and my SO story is tame compared to others, but thanks for what you are doing. :)
 
Unfortunately, to even recount the Scientology Theology (it's not) verbatim and with a straight face will come across as 'ridicule' because it is Ridiculous.

It's also impossible to discuss Scientology *without* mentioning the 'theoretical basis' of Scientology; however, to do so is not only tantamount to 'ridicule', but is a High Crime called 'Verbal Tech'.

Zinj

Well, as the only focus is on crimes, we are going to simply sidestep anything and everything that isn't 100 percent relevant to those crimes. Literally, lists of crimes and evidence point for point.

We're going to have a breif intro to what the organisation is (a very breif one), and intro to the Sea ORG (a slightly longer one) and then just plow right into allegations and evidence.

The press pack will refer back to the wiki with its millions of testimonials.

If you take a look at the link you can see the sub headings that are there.

The idea is that the person receiveing the presspack won't sit there going:
"LOL! CONSPIRACY THEORIES!" or "LOL, XENU" or even "MMM, RELIGIOUS HATRED"

and instead will be like "oh, this is horrible, but I doubt it's tru- oh. Okay, but what abou- oh. Oh God. OH GOD!"

"Can we tax these bastards?"

etc. They probably won't care about all the "fluff", it's got to be relevant to law and the allegations Xenophon has made. It has to leave no room for doubt. Besides, the organisation can be killed but an idea cannot, and like it or not scientology as a theology will likely outlive all of us unfortunately, in one way or another, long after Misgavige takes a stand in the docks.

MEST LOVER: what country were you living in at the time? Also, whats the population of Australian exes like on this board?

Thank you so much for the replies so far, I'll be glad to be of use for anyone wanting to spread the word
 

smartone

My Own Boss
I was never in the SO so cannot help you.

I do understand that incriminating documents carry much more clout as they validate the horror stories of the SO and illegal carryings on.

I'm not even sure that ex-SO people would have any paperwork from their stint in the SO though. Once they were out, they probably were only too glad to get rid of anything which reminded them of it.

I'm sure you'll get pointed in the right direction from some ESMB members here. :)
 

Mest Lover

Not Sea Org Qualified
I think there is a 1099 form in my evidence box from that time, only other thing i have on that is my periodical social security forms, i have no way of showing how long I worked. we didn't punch time cards just showed up for post.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Well, as the only focus is on crimes, we are going to simply sidestep anything and everything that isn't 100 percent relevant to those crimes. Literally, lists of crimes and evidence point for point.

Sounds fine and good luck. But, in the real world, in real criminal prosecutions, it's necessary to show motive. And, there is no 'sane' motive for why Scientology does what it does; no sane motive for why it acts like it does; no sane motive for why it commits the crimes it does.

Because it's the insane 'theology' that mandates and justifies the crimes.

Which is why I have to laugh at people who speculate about 'Scientology' being run by a cabal of lawyers or the CIA or, well, any of those 'non-Scientologists' whom Scientologists like to posit as the 'suppressives' who are trying to ruin the 'Tech'.

No *sane* group would operate like Scn does. It's only the insane 'dogma' that shows motive.

Zinj
 
Sounds fine and good luck. But, in the real world, in real criminal prosecutions, it's necessary to show motive. And, there is no 'sane' motive for why Scientology does what it does; no sane motive for why it acts like it does; no sane motive for why it commits the crimes it does.

Because it's the insane 'theology' that mandates and justifies the crimes.

Which is why I have to laugh at people who speculate about 'Scientology' being run by a cabal of lawyers or the CIA or, well, any of those 'non-Scientologists' whom Scientologists like to posit as the 'suppressives' who are trying to ruin the 'Tech'.

No *sane* group would operate like Scn does. It's only the insane 'dogma' that shows motive.

Zinj

hmm.. as far as motive is concerned, I just put it down to "I would like to build a new facility but I do not wish to pay for it" or "I would like to sell books at the smallest possible cost to myself in terms of staff wages" etc.

Straight-forward unethical employment. Getting work done, for next to no pay. Like Nike and their sweatshops. Same deal. (okay, not the same at all, but we want aussie politicians to think like this. How the hell are these people side-stepping employment law in my back yard!?" etc)

Of course we will also cover other angles, all of them in fact, but in a "this is what you need to be worried about and why" format with not an extra word that isnt need to convey this. The long winded stuff goes on the wiki (and its growing quickly) but its the write up of this press pack thats causing the most problems. Thank you all SO MUCH for your early replies on this, I feel that 2010 is going to be the Year of The Ex's, slamming the cult with tasty evidence.

Remember, us protestors are literally only as strong as our insider backup. It's good to see you guys are at such a strength! Im off to plow through the testimonials and see what I can uncover. For now I will stop bumping this thread because I have dragged it far from being an "introduction" although anyone with any insight please feel free to dump it here. It's probably best I have a good plow through what is here already, then maybe make another thread later in the week in the relevant part of the forum to see what gaps I still have.

Thanks so much for your help on this guys, you're the ones with the power!
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Sounds fine and good luck. But, in the real world, in real criminal prosecutions, it's necessary to show motive. And, there is no 'sane' motive for why Scientology does what it does; no sane motive for why it acts like it does; no sane motive for why it commits the crimes it does.

Because it's the insane 'theology' that mandates and justifies the crimes.

Which is why I have to laugh at people who speculate about 'Scientology' being run by a cabal of lawyers or the CIA or, well, any of those 'non-Scientologists' whom Scientologists like to posit as the 'suppressives' who are trying to ruin the 'Tech'.

No *sane* group would operate like Scn does. It's only the insane 'dogma' that shows motive.

Zinj

That's all kinda obvious (now) but I've never seen it stated before. Thanks very much Zinj.

Paul
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
Sounds fine and good luck. But, in the real world, in real criminal prosecutions, it's necessary to show motive. And, there is no 'sane' motive for why Scientology does what it does; no sane motive for why it acts like it does; no sane motive for why it commits the crimes it does.

Because it's the insane 'theology' that mandates and justifies the crimes.
hmm.. as far as motive is concerned, I just put it down to "I would like to build a new facility but I do not wish to pay for it" or "I would like to sell books at the smallest possible cost to myself in terms of staff wages" etc.

Yeah. What was Hitler's motive? Crimes against humanity are still crimes. :confused2:
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Yeah. What was Hitler's motive? Crimes against humanity are still crimes. :confused2:

Hitler's motive was to save the world and civilization. The Nazi ideology provided the mandate and justification for Nazi crimes.

Much like Ron's.

I agree about pursuing the actual crimes, but, it's important to understand the crimes and why they're integral to the organization. Scientology crimes are *not* the result of 'rogue agents' or mistakes; they're built in to the system.

Zinj
 

scooter

Gold Meritorious Patron
Hitler's motive was to save the world and civilization. The Nazi ideology provided the mandate and justification for Nazi crimes.

Much like Ron's.

I agree about pursuing the actual crimes, but, it's important to understand the crimes and why they're integral to the organization. Scientology crimes are *not* the result of 'rogue agents' or mistakes; they're built in to the system.

Zinj

It's all included under the mantra "The greatest good for the greatest number."

Say it often enough and you too can order Auschwitz.
 

Carmel

Crusader
Hi IE, and welcome to ESMB.

My 2 cents on a few things that would be worth including:

- GBS (gross book sales), where members are forced/heavily pressured to buy any and all new releases, which many members have already purchased earlier editions of. Include corporate details of Bridge Publications, New Era Publications (if it still exists) and the other one..?...can't think of name of it right now.

- The status and workings of ASI (Author services in LA), and where the money goes, how it's converted to platinum or whatever (under the guise of preserving the tech), then sent off shore (Aaron Saxton has these details).

- The status and workings of the IAS, and the pressure to donate to it.

- The fact that big "payers" in Oz usually have Trust funds with the CofS as a beneficiary, which means that no tax gets paid on monies given to the church (not by the member, nor the church before the money leaves the country.

- The legal corporate structure of the CofS and all it's arms.

Details of the above would be likely to get the attention of some of the MP's.

Then there's stuff like:

- Everything and anything that violates the OH&S laws.

- The child care facilities that violate laws of the land on childcare.

- Look at threads here on human trafficking....they cover a lot of abuses within the SO.

If the theme of your press pack was that it's a money making scam, and look at how they control and what they do to these people to make money, then I think it would be more effective. Yep, leave out the "religious" beliefs, but you could point out the religious cloaking the CofS uses to have licence to get away with what it does. The Creed is a good place to start......The CofS does not practice its own creed, and doesn't allow its members the alienable rights which it preaches about.

All the best with it. :)
 

BunnySkull

Silver Meritorious Patron
Sounds fine and good luck. But, in the real world, in real criminal prosecutions, it's necessary to show motive. And, there is no 'sane' motive for why Scientology does what it does; no sane motive for why it acts like it does; no sane motive for why it commits the crimes it does.

Because it's the insane 'theology' that mandates and justifies the crimes.

Which is why I have to laugh at people who speculate about 'Scientology' being run by a cabal of lawyers or the CIA or, well, any of those 'non-Scientologists' whom Scientologists like to posit as the 'suppressives' who are trying to ruin the 'Tech'.

No *sane* group would operate like Scn does. It's only the insane 'dogma' that shows motive.

Zinj

Actually that's false. It is NOT "necessary" to demonstrate motive when prosecuting a crime - at least not in the US. Don't get me wrong, it certainly helps to be able to demonstrate the motive behind a crime but it is not a legal necessity, peroid. Prosecutors will bitch to the high heavens if they don't have a good motive to back up a charge, but the lack of one does not prevent them from prosecuting a case. In fact there have been many convictions, murder and other, obtained without a motive offered for the crime.

Many times a prosecutor may have differing opinions on what the true motive behind a crime is and rather than take the chance of getting it wrong (& have a defense attorney throw their mistake back in their face) they simply don't address motive.

(My father was a prosecuting attorney for years in the US. I was just on the phone with him and double checked this just to be sure, so this isn't just my opinion.)
 

Div6

Crusader
Hi IE, and welcome to ESMB.

My 2 cents on a few things that would be worth including:

- GBS (gross book sales), where members are forced/heavily pressured to buy any and all new releases, which many members have already purchased earlier editions of. Include corporate details of Bridge Publications, New Era Publications (if it still exists) and the other one..?...can't think of name of it right now.

- The status and workings of ASI (Author services in LA), and where the money goes, how it's converted to platinum or whatever (under the guise of preserving the tech), then sent off shore (Aaron Saxton has these details).

- The status and workings of the IAS, and the pressure to donate to it.

- The fact that big "payers" in Oz usually have Trust funds with the CofS as a beneficiary, which means that no tax gets paid on monies given to the church (not by the member, nor the church before the money leaves the country.

- The legal corporate structure of the CofS and all it's arms.

Details of the above would be likely to get the attention of some of the MP's.

Then there's stuff like:

- Everything and anything that violates the OH&S laws.

- The child care facilities that violate laws of the land on childcare.

- Look at threads here on human trafficking....they cover a lot of abuses within the SO.

If the theme of your press pack was that it's a money making scam, and look at how they control and what they do to these people to make money, then I think it would be more effective. Yep, leave out the "religious" beliefs, but you could point out the religious cloaking the CofS uses to have licence to get away with what it does. The Creed is a good place to start......The CofS does not practice its own creed, and doesn't allow its members the alienable rights which it preaches about.

All the best with it. :)

^^^^^ Wot She Said! ^^^^
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Actually that's false. It is NOT "necessary" to demonstrate motive when prosecuting a crime - at least not in the US. Don't get me wrong, it certainly helps to be able to demonstrate the motive behind a crime but it is not a legal necessity, peroid. Prosecutors will bitch to the high heavens if they don't have a good motive to back up a charge, but the lack of one does not prevent them from prosecuting a case. In fact there have been many convictions, murder and other, obtained without a motive offered for the crime.

Many times a prosecutor may have differing opinions on what the true motive behind a crime is and rather than take the chance of getting it wrong (& have a defense attorney throw their mistake back in their face) they simply don't address motive.

(My father was a prosecuting attorney for years in the US. I was just on the phone with him and double checked this just to be sure, so this isn't just my opinion.)

Of course, you're right, but a case without a motive is inherently a weaker case and, even worse, to try to demonstrate a *wrong* motive can be a fatal flaw.

And, that's something that comes up often. To say that Scientology is a money-making scam is the core of the 'Scientology Being Run By Lawyers' chimera. And, it's even one that's easily debunked, because if Scientology were primarily about *money* it would not be run the way it is. There would be no need for 'Clearing the Planet' or criminal abuse or spies or the sheerly malicious behavior of the 'Church' against not only its enemies but its own members. No, maximizing profits could have been done as a self-help 'therapy' with books on Oprah and working franchises and without such liabilities as OSA or the Sea Org.

What *does* make them necessary is that Scientology, as designed and created by L. Ron Hubbard is a *political* organization with a mandate to Take Over The World (for its own good.) And the reason and rationale for that is OT III and the galactic implanters and the transtemporal conspiracy of the 'Psychs' (or 'bankers' or whomever.)

That doesn't preclude the money motive, but, it also keeps it in perspective. Because Money is *not* the Scientology motive. Control is. And, that's a political motive.

Zinj
 

justaguy

Patron Meritorious
Of course, you're right, but a case without a motive is inherently a weaker case and, even worse, to try to demonstrate a *wrong* motive can be a fatal flaw.

And, that's something that comes up often. To say that Scientology is a money-making scam is the core of the 'Scientology Being Run By Lawyers' chimera. And, it's even one that's easily debunked, because if Scientology were primarily about *money* it would not be run the way it is. There would be no need for 'Clearing the Planet' or criminal abuse or spies or the sheerly malicious behavior of the 'Church' against not only its enemies but its own members. No, maximizing profits could have been done as a self-help 'therapy' with books on Oprah and working franchises and without such liabilities as OSA or the Sea Org.

What *does* make them necessary is that Scientology, as designed and created by L. Ron Hubbard is a *political* organization with a mandate to Take Over The World (for its own good.) And the reason and rationale for that is OT III and the galactic implanters and the transtemporal conspiracy of the 'Psychs' (or 'bankers' or whomever.)

That doesn't preclude the money motive, but, it also keeps it in perspective. Because Money is *not* the Scientology motive. Control is. And, that's a political motive.

Zinj
^^this.

money is nice and buys stuff. control lets short people go on power trips. it's important to keep the money thing in perspective, even though it's obviously a large factor in management decisions.
 
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