Help wanted on how to best convey a particular message

RogerB

Crusader
Our next shot at getting the Inquiry over the line is coming up very shortly, and a few of us are again approaching MP's and the like. As I've said in other threads, the issue is not now about whether or not the crimes and abuses at the hands of the CofS need addressing, it's about *how* they should be or can be addressed.

There is a particular message (relevant to the above) that I'd like to get across to the powers that be, but that message involves concepts which outsiders or 'never scios' would/do find hard to grasp.

This is what it is:

* If there's a crime by a member of the CofS or some neglect by the CofS itself, the Church will subvert and/or obstruct justice to protect its own public image, and by doing so it protects criminals.

* There is a mindset that the Church must be protected at all cost. This includes protection from any ill repute, and is the reason that Scientologists will commit perjury (the lesser evil, in their minds).

* Nothing is sacred when it comes to the image and survival of the Church. Human rights of individual scientologists are forfeited and denied in the name of the "cause".

* To Scientologists, the authority within the church is considered superior to any outside authority which they consider amatuer and incompetant. Any knowledge of an abuse or crime, or any seeking of justice, must be reported or done "in-house" only. Scientologists don't trust outside authorities and aren't permitted to use them on matters involving the Church or its members.

* The Church is expert at pre-empting legal scrutiny and presents an acceptable image which gives the illusion that they operate within the law.

* This is why we need an Inquiry into the Church of Scientology:
An Inquiry will create a safe platform and help give courage to the many victims and witnesses who would otherwise be afraid to speak. It's only the testimonies of many which will shed light on how the Church avoids detection by law enforcement and how it manages to operate above the law.


So, while most of you will understand what I am saying here, what do you think would be the best way to communicate this to those who have had no involvement with Scientology?

Whether it's a point I've made, or the whole message/concept, how do *you* think that it could best be communicated, to those who haven't been in the loop?

Urgent reply. I've been away on business for a week. Just read this and am catching up.

I think a positioning of the situation ought be this:

Scientology considers itself to be above the law. Its mindset is that it has "superior knowledge and a superior purpose" to all others in society, and thus it is justified in conducting its hidden criminal activities and to do everything necessary to hide its true criminal activities, and that it is "correct" for them to subvert any and all of our society's laws, facilities, institutions, resources and communication lines in order to accomplish its goals on "getting Scientology in on the planet" . . . in other words, like all maniacal, religiously bigoted cults, it believes it is correct and necessary to do what ever possible by whatever means to accomplish this end of converting all of society to its religion . . . . and those who oppose scientology must be destroyed by whatever means at their disposal. They are on a modern, more sophisticated Jihad.

This is the proven track record of scientology's behaviour and conduct of affairs and is as stated in its own doctrines.

I've not read the rest of the thread . . . . this thought might also be in it.

Rog
 

Petey C

Silver Meritorious Patron
Great post, and great responses. I would add one more:

Scientologists know (they don't just believe) that Hubbard is infallible, as he was the uber-scientologist. They do what he says -- in technical bulletins, policies, whatever -- and in his absence they do what his representatives say. Hubbard is the source of all Scientology organisational policy that directs Scientologists to:
-- attack ferociously when they believe themselves to be under attack;
-- to attack by any means, including the illegal and the morally repugnant (such as violating the ethics of the confessional or digging up dirt on people);
-- to reward conforming behaviour and condemn non-conforming behaviour (such as questioning Scientology and its leaders). This enables punishment, humiliation and shaming as routine behaviour. Indeed, Hubbard is the source of naming certain behaviours as deserving of punishment or humiliation or degradation, and these can be as minor as "being reasonable" or failing to get one's stats up to the required level. He also is the source of the various kinds of punishments routinely used: the RPF (removal of personal liberty = imprisonment), overboarding, Tone 40 (= screaming), shunning (disconnection, lower conditions). Finally, he is the source of Scientology "justice" policy that itself, as the means for carrying out punishment, is an accurate reflection of life in Scientology: there is no procedural fairness, it is not evidence-based for a start.

Most of all, Hubbard has created a closed system, with interdependent principles, of viewing life. The system relies on new people accepting small, verifiable truths. And upon these small truths, a huge edifice of lies and speculation and misinformation is built, but tightly woven together so it takes a long time (or a catastrophic personal occurance) for people to start to unravel it.

Hope this makes sense. I don't want to say Hubbard is a god to Scientologists, but he sure gets treated like one. The important issue is his supposed infallibility and the fact that he is the source of all this. He even says he is.

Petey
 

Friend

Patron
Hello,

I would like to see in postings and threads that shows what the abreviations are representing and have a page to look up for special meanings. That way others besides scientologist can learn and be part. Maybe they have a family member or a relative who is involved it the cult.
Since this is international; if someone don't speak English they should be able to write in Spanish, French, Portugeese or Italian. That's better than nothing and I am sure some members speak more than one language.
I wouldn't mind to get mail from members who only speaks eg. German and Spanish.
Friend.
 

Mick Wenlock

Admin Emeritus (retired)
Trouble wrote:



I know!. I had to go on national TV and state that we'd spent between $1 and $1.2 mill on the bridge.:duh:

My claim to fame is that I was had royally!


Well Kev, in the "Total Numbnuts Stakes Race" you can comfort yourself with the knowledge that there was those of who were so stupid, we joined the Sea Org.
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
Scientology considers itself to be above the law. Its mindset is that it has "superior knowledge and a superior purpose" to all others in society, and thus it is justified in conducting its hidden criminal activities and to do everything necessary to hide its true criminal activities, and that it is "correct" for them to subvert any and all of our society's laws, facilities, institutions, resources and communication lines in order to accomplish its goals on "getting Scientology in on the planet" . . . in other words, like all maniacal, religiously bigoted cults, it believes it is correct and necessary to do what ever possible by whatever means to accomplish this end of converting all of society to its religion . . . . and those who oppose scientology must be destroyed by whatever means at their disposal. They are on a modern, more sophisticated Jihad.

I really like this as well as Mick's statement. And if time I would show that a scientologist who operates in this way would be considered "one of the most ethical beings on the planet" by those within the CoS. (by reading an excerpt from LRH). Show that they have a completely different concept of what it means to be "ethical" than what all the rest of us believe. I like the LRH policy on administering justice which indicates that someone could essentially get away with murder if they're upstat enough.
(also the policy on Kha-Khan I believe aligns with this concept).
 

Royal Prince Xenu

Trust the Psi Corps.
I really like this as well as Mick's statement. And if time I would show that a scientologist who operates in this way would be considered "one of the most ethical beings on the planet" by those within the CoS. (by reading an excerpt from LRH). Show that they have a completely different concept of what it means to be "ethical" than what all the rest of us believe. I like the LRH policy on administering justice which indicates that someone could essentially get away with murder if they're upstat enough.
(also the policy on Kha-Khan I believe aligns with this concept).

I also noted, as did some others at the time, that there was a general "Sunday Christian" attitude--"I can do what ever I like as long as I write it up in Ethics."
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
There are some really brilliant "bullet points" brought to light here by various posters!

Perhaps they can be consolidated into one fairly short document to help the Inquiry participants to have a clue what Scientology, the CoS and Scientologists are up to.

I posted a beginning concept in another thread which really belongs here.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=417946&postcount=14
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
I completely agree that the "GREATEST GOOD" doctrine will not communicate by itself.

It needs to have real examples included with it that show how this doctrine is applied. Examples where scientologists are guided by the Ethics Officer to a course of action which everyone else on the planet other than CoS would consider very harmful and destructive, but the scientologist is guided towards this course of action because it is the 'greatest good'.

"I've got to disconnect from my spouse and children who depend upon me for their survival because they have disagreements with the CoS, but the survival of the whole planet depends upon my staying here as a staff member and helping to clear the planet." So fuck them!
 

programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
I don't see any reason not to say it just the way you did.

I was blown away by Hana Whitfield's explanation of the "Scientology Culture" in a way that someone outside of Scn could understand. Maybe playing this video wll help explain the mindset.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qd00GtwXcYQ

Thanks for that YouTube link.
Some of the stuff that she is talking about was eventually written up in the small SCN book "Journey into Time".
 

Dennis

Patron
It is my view, that the delusion of Scientology should be made clear first. How it feels to be in Scientology and how one gets into that mindset. Possibly using well-known philosophical and psychological models. The use of analogy is also a great tool.

The Scientologists inability (not even an unwillingness, but the inability) to even look at another point of view and really investigate it, illustrates the power of the delusion Scientology dogma creates. The Scientology mindset cannot even entertain the possibility they may be wrong. (There are far better minds on this board that could put this across better.)

Once this frame of mind is clearly portrayed, then telling them about what occurs within Scientology becomes easier to grasp.

Though, I have found (in my, admittedly, limited experience), non-Scientologists seem more concerned about the psychological impact, or as one friend put it: “the potential for harm.” The acts that occur within scientology are secondary.

All the things that made you question your mindset are the same things that would aid the non-Scientologist understand. I am not talking about things like squirreled tech, out ethics officers, or RPF; but a change in your mental awareness. What was it in your mind that made you turn the light on? Those are the things that will connect with Scientologists and non-Scientologists alike.

My two cents ☺
 

Arthur Dent

Silver Meritorious Patron
...
Scientology considers itself to be above the law. Its mindset is that it has "superior knowledge and a superior purpose" to all others in society, and thus it is justified in conducting its hidden criminal activities and to do everything necessary to hide its true criminal activities, and that it is "correct" for them to subvert any and all of our society's laws, facilities, institutions, resources and communication lines in order to accomplish its goals on "getting Scientology in on the planet" . . . in other words, like all maniacal, religiously bigoted cults, it believes it is correct and necessary to do what ever possible by whatever means to accomplish this end of converting all of society to its religion . . . . and those who oppose scientology must be destroyed by whatever means at their disposal. They are on a modern, more sophisticated Jihad.

This is the proven track record of scientology's behaviour and conduct of affairs and is as stated in its own doctrines.

...Rog

All posts are excellent, this being perhaps the most concise.

I would add to stay away from issues where the cofs was investigated and found innocent. This would, unfortunately, include Lisa McPherson.

I could only hope that you have some direct and consistent testimonies about how police or politicians have been bought off or intimidated. I think this would be key! This combined with a short education on how scns come to think this is ok to do and how rampant it is and how oppositional it is to the public good.

I would push the UK's decision regarding public benefit foremost and very heavily. This is the senate's line of thinking as well and will save them a lot of responsibility for having to think this all through, a daunting task for them given the BS they will hear from the cofs. (No offense to the senate, but they will be fed BS from the BS feeding experts of all time.)

If it can be shown and urged that they should follow suit as it has already been determined that scn does not meet the criteria for public benefit. The work has already been done for you in this. Exactly what docs were used in that investigation? The wheel was already invented is my point.

You probably already have this covered, but just sayin'...
 
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