How to help a friend

Intentionally Blank

Scientology Widow
The "people" at the org are not likely to treat her badly.

Only a reg....might get tough with her....to get her money.

Others, since they know she is a pysch case......probably won't get tough with her....they will handle her with kidd gloves.

Sounds kinda like they are sorta "love bombing" her. Which is not unusual at the beginning of the journey in Scientology.

Thanks, Leland. She's been in for a long time - I think she and Mr/s Blanky started at about the same time. I know she does courses. She's just convinced that if she could get auditing she would finally 'be someone'. <sigh>
 

Leland

Crusader
Yea....that is a true believer. One that has swallowed the Hubbard line....that they have all the answers and can fix anything. They can't.

It is tough.....because inside the ORG and inside Scien culture and people....there are only true believers.

They ALL want to go up the bridge...

They are all RESTRICTED from talking to each other about the tech....and how it works
They are all RESTRICTED from talking about their problems...and what is wrong.
They are all controlled this way.

Anyone that disobeys this is kicked out.

They are only indoctrinated with "it works" 100% of the time.
They are only indoctrinated with you are the best of the best....and that is why you made the choice to be here....and you found us.....because..."you know scientology is the only answer."
They are only indoctrinated individually.....and only allowed to talk amongst themselves in a restricted manner,,,,and if anyone breaks those rules....they are turned into the scientology police.
 

Leland

Crusader
Generally speaking....an Illegal is required to Petition....to get auditing.

You might ask or poke around and see if she has been told she has to petition.

Generally, one has to Petition "up lines" I suppose to International....perhaps C/S international...or some higher up individual (post). They would then be given a "program" to complete.

She might have been already given a "Program" to complete.....that if completed....the ORG will allow her to get auditing.

So. YOu could ask about that specifically....does she have a program to do to get "un-illegal" and if so....what is she required to do.
 

Leland

Crusader
If one is Illegal.....you would be asked to "write it up"....and divulge all personal information about the situation.

Of course the C of $ then has a bunch of very personal information about you.

In my case. Yes I "wrote everything" I knew about my situation up. Of course, I didn't know much.....BUT

It had been my understanding that it was not only dangerous but against the Law to talk about ....well let us just say...a CIA employee's identity. (for those under cover...)

I had three people in my family that worked for them. 1 was retired...and 2 were (at the time) active.

I wrote about everything I knew.....and therefore...felt that I had broken the Law.

I just want to point out....that the ORG....was placing themselves above the LAW of the land....and security of a Government Agency....by requiring this information.

I just want to point out that Scientology is putting many Countries intelligence Agencies at risk....by doing this....

And want to point out to Governments.....that NO Scientologist or probably any member of any Cult....can be trusted....as they give all their allegence to the Cult...and not a Government.....or even their family....
 

Intentionally Blank

Scientology Widow
Generally speaking....and Illegal is required to Petition....to get auditing.

You might ask or poke around and see if she has been told she has to petition.

Generally, one has to Petition "up lines" I suppose to International....perhaps C/S international...or some higher up individual (post). They would then be given a "program" to complete.

She might have been already given a "Program" to complete.....that if completed....the ORG will allow her to get auditing.

So. YOu could ask about that specifically....does she have a program to do to get "un-illegal" and if so....what is she required to do.

Oh, yeah. I think I called it an application but I'm sure that's what it is she was talking about. I'll see if I can find out what it is she needs to do.

Thank you!
 

Leland

Crusader
Oh, yeah. I think I called it an application but I'm sure that's what it is she was talking about. I'll see if I can find out what it is she needs to do.

Thank you!

Sure. Mis-spoke above.....

Fulfilling a Petition....will not make you "un-illegal"....one would still be illegal. You are just given an OK to do something.
 

Leland

Crusader
It might not be obvious....but a Scientology, true believer.....will give up everything....Allegiance to their Country, allegiance to their family.....or any former religious upbringing...

and ultimately....allegiance to themselves as a human being....and their bank account.....any money they earn, their spouse....their children....anything and everything....to be and stay in the Cult.

A true believer will give up their right to free speech...and give up that right for others.

A true believer would lie about anything....to protect the Cult...

A Scientologist cannot be trusted.
 

phenomanon

Canyon
We had dinner last night with a friend from the org. More accurately, Mr/s Blanky's good friend but someone I've also known and liked for years.
Here's my question. Is it possible her lack of money and illegal status are actually keeping her in the church? I don't think she's ever experienced some of the things I've read here (or most of them, for that matter). Pretty sure she doesn't get the regging (no dinero) and that she's never been on staff. I'd be surprised if she's ever been sec checked. It's all social for her with some could-be-considered-enlightenment courses. Knowing her personality I think if she had any dealings with the harsh reality of scn she would be horrified. (Full disclosure: And of course, if she bolted Mr/s Blanky might be influenced in that direction as well.)

Thoughts?

Blanky

*Details and personal information have been changed to protect the privacy of the individual in question. EFF YOU OSA.

Must have/Can't have.
 

phenomanon

Canyon
:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

She would have regs coming out of the woodwork like termites along with frantic pleas for IAS donations. Shudder.and cringe. :roflmao:

The funny part is it might work.

It would work for a time, but when it came to the oT levels, she would not be allowed on them. They would use up her money on donos and folder summaries and Eligibility and sec checks and then inform her that she will not be allowed to continue.
 

cleared cannibal

Silver Meritorious Patron
In my experience some one has to have doubts before they will listen to any thing negative or questioning of scientology. Until this point is reached anything anyone says against it does more harm than good. No matter how bad we want to help sometimes silence is best. I was looking up a Mark Twain quote for Sally's Fummy thread and run across another one of his cat quotes" There are some things one can only learn by carrying a cat by its tail." To me this means you have to do or experience something in order to understand it. The problem with scientology is that by the time you are getting the hell bit and scratched out you is that you are told this biting and scratching feels good. This is what Mockingbird would refer to as hypnosis or insidious enslavement .

This applies to some one who is already a believer and not "raw meat"

I have some experience at this sort of thing and these are my personnel experiences.
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re:help a friend: have them talk to Debbie Cook, captain of Scientology's Flag Base

I've had similar thoughts. The troublesome thing for me, as a friend, to see is how she feels 'less than' 'not good enough' 'damaged' because of the illegal label. She is certain that if she could only get auditing the rest of her life would finally get some momentum. And, of course, any failings on her part are because she is not good enough to have applied the tek she has completed well enough. If she could get up the bridge it would all be better - but she's not good enough. And so she's convinced to spend the little bit of extra cash she has on .... what's it called(?).... an application to get the illegal status removed.

How about helping s/her get online and send an email to the Captain of Flag Service Org, Debbie Cook, and see if there is anyway s/he would be eligible for a scholarship for the good things s/he has done in scientology in the past. Maybe Debbie Cook might even be able to help with a repair session delivered by one of the FSM's in the field that she would know. I mean who else would know better ways to get people to the top of the bridge....Debbie certainly has had a few years experience. She even spent some time alongside DM.

Where is that article about Debbie the Captain of Flag, helping many many people from all walks of life to solve bridge progress.

I think Debbie Cook's personal email might most easily be found by just googling "DEBBIE COOK flag " or maybe your partner Intentionally Blank coud do that at their personal computer ?? :unsure: Maybe the local E.D. could assist.?

PS I, the author of this crazy idea is not responsible for the local ED of Scientology organizations talking to each other or the consequences of such actions. Use at your own risk. But what could be safer than asking the captain of Flag for the best policy or policies to apply in this situation?
 
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dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
There is some policy/bulletins regarding auditing " Psych " "cases"....but have kinda forgotten them. There is even info about auditing people that have gotten electric shock treatments.

But as I said....no restrictions on doing courses that I know of. The idea being ( i think) that if a illegal can study....and then "prove" that they can audit.....that they could then get auditing later.

Of course, she would be required by Ethics Officer or MAA....to Disconnect from her sister. ( i am surprised she has not be required to do so already...)

I agree with other posts above ....that she might be looked upon by staff to be a "pet". " a failed psychiatric case" that has come to Scientology to be "really" fixed....They kinda like that idea....that they "could" fix her. (now this would only be allowed if she was not a problem of any sort.) Obviously....if she was a babbling, drooling....(overt and actively) exhibiting any crazy outward manifestations....they wouldn't want her anywhere near any org.....and would kick her out. There is specific policy that Scientology only handles the "able"....that those that really need help....like a crazy person....they just don't and won't help.

Well.....to answer your question...I don't know. I guess you could look up all the policies or Bulletins on psych cases....and give them to her.
You could point out that even though the C or $ claims to have all the answers....they won't help a psych case.
you could point out their hypocracy of letting her get auditing....if she had the money....even if it violates their own policy.
If the C of $ could work the miracles they claim.....why haven't they? Why not set up a "Church" specifically for crazy people....and fix them?

Well, that is a few points...

There is always "hope" for this " psych case" . If I recall correctly the head of CCHR Jan Eastgate had psych treatment and still got onto her OT levels. Maybe Blanky's friend can borrow a keyboard and search for Jan online?
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
If one is Illegal.....you would be asked to "write it up"....and divulge all personal information about the situation.

Of course the C of $ then has a bunch of very personal information about you.

In my case. Yes I "wrote everything" I knew about my situation up. Of course, I didn't know much.....BUT

It had been my understanding that it was not only dangerous but against the Law to talk about ....well let us just say...a CIA employee's identity. (for those under cover...)

I had three people in my family that worked for them. 1 was retired...and 2 were (at the time) active.

I wrote about everything I knew.....and therefore...felt that I had broken the Law.

I just want to point out....that the ORG....was placing themselves above the LAW of the land....and security of a Government Agency....by requiring this information.

I just want to point out that Scientology is putting many Countries intelligence Agencies at risk....by doing this....

And want to point out to Governments.....that NO Scientologist or probably any member of any Cult....can be trusted....as they give all their allegence to the Cult...and not a Government.....or even their family....

I agree 101 % with everything in your post Leland. My direct, yes personal experience, tells me it is very true and accurate.
 

Intentionally Blank

Scientology Widow
In my experience some one has to have doubts before they will listen to any thing negative or questioning of scientology. Until this point is reached anything anyone says against it does more harm than good. No matter how bad we want to help sometimes silence is best. I was looking up a Mark Twain quote for Sally's Fummy thread and run across another one of his cat quotes" There are some things one can only learn by carrying a cat by its tail." To me this means you have to do or experience something in order to understand it. The problem with scientology is that by the time you are getting the hell bit and scratched out you is that you are told this biting and scratching feels good. This is what Mockingbird would refer to as hypnosis or insidious enslavement .

This applies to some one who is already a believer and not "raw meat"


I have some experience at this sort of thing and these are my personnel experiences.

Heh. Love the cat by the tail quote. So true, some things you can only know by experience.

I tend to think she has doubts. There are thin spots in the bubble. I think she is able to ignore them because not only does she, like everyone else who is still in and not looking at the media reports, has no idea of abuses, lawsuits, failing orgs, etc AND because she's never been on the receiving end of almost any of those things.


There is always "hope" for this " psych case" . If I recall correctly the head of CCHR Jan Eastgate had psych treatment and still got onto her OT levels. Maybe Blanky's friend can borrow a keyboard and search for Jan online?

I like how you think...... :devil:
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
It would work for a time, but when it came to the oT levels, she would not be allowed on them. They would use up her money on donos and folder summaries and Eligibility and sec checks and then inform her that she will not be allowed to continue.

Surely she could find a few extra millions where she got the first. I heard that money talks louder than 'ethics" in Scn. Oh, hmm now I know why ethics is the 9 dynamic and the 10th dynamic is MONEY . EL Queso allstars even made a "training video" about it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18TilhZLewI


:biggrin:
 

Leland

Crusader
Blanky....you probably already know this....but I don't think many scientologists do.

As far as your friend.....Scientology does not really handle "personal" problems.

Pretty much, Hubbard created a "construct" of a "case"....and he believed and taught that everyone has the same case. Everyone does the same bridge. Auditing is not really tailored for any individual ( I am talking broad strokes here.)

Everyone in Scientology....does each action listed out on the Bridge...and is suppose to have the same cognition....(which hubbard already knew)

To me....the further each person goes up the Scientology bridge....the more alike or cookie cutter they become. They all turn out "alike." IMO as one goes up the bridge....there is sort of a homoginization of the person....and it is not unusual to hear a Scientologist actually say....I am a "Grade 2" or I am a Clear....or I am an OT 3.

They are in effect saying......they are .."as a case" at a certain place that Hubbard "already knows about..." and has "solved."

They then think....everything below that level...."has been fixed or handled."

They believe that Hubbard basically streamlined achieving OT or operating thetan...or being free of the body....and aware....and operating as a spiritual being.

But Hubbard changed the Bridge time and time and time again....searching for it. Today, Scientology is still changing the bridge....

They are told...any problem that they do have...."will be handled on the next level." But their problems are not addressed on the next level. The only thing addressed on the next level is some part of the Construct that Hubbard decided was next to do.

If you have a lot of money....you can do these steps that Hubbard laid out to do pretty fast. (except OT 7, which can take many years to do.)

If you don't make a lot of money....it can take your whole life to earn the money to do even a small part of the "bridge."

I wish there was some way to get your friend to understand....that she is an individual now...and a good person.

If she were to do the "bridge" she would be a cookie cut scientology robot....
 

Free Being Me

Crusader
Maybe the OP should ask her to get the Illegal PC status lifted by telling her to tell the local org she just inherited a million bucks with no idea what to spend it on. That should get her cogwheels spinning.

It would work for a time, but when it came to the oT levels, she would not be allowed on them. They would use up her money on donos and folder summaries and Eligibility and sec checks and then inform her that she will not be allowed to continue.

What was suggested was a hypothetical inheritance scenario for the person in question seeing what greedy hypocrites $cio's are. And some lulz thrown in. lol.
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
Knowing her personality I think if she had any dealings with the harsh reality of scn she would be horrified.[/b] (Full disclosure: And of course, if she bolted Mr/s Blanky might be influenced in that direction as well.)

Thoughts?

Blanky

It's like you're reading my mind. :)

I would love to point her sites like this and the others in your sig line but I can't take the chance she would say something to Mr/s Blanky. I was awake all night thinking of ways I could encourage hér to be more involved and then experience those things first hand. Lol - it's certainly the first time I've considered getting someone more involved in the org in order to get them out!

You said Kerry was on the internet - do you know her email address? Couldn't someone else (not you) send her an email that would not be tied to you, with those links?
 
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