Hubbard and Children

olska

Silver Meritorious Patron
FWIW:
back somewhere in the mid 70s, a couple, not quite friends of ours, left the husband's 16 yr old boy on their doorstep, after they had sold the house, and moved to Florida to spend a couple hundred thou on becoming Clear OTs.

By the conversation earlier on this thread, they treated him like an adult. "Make it go right. blah blah blah..."

by my definition, they treated him like yesterday's trash

We took him in, no papers signed, no thought by anyone. He stayed with us through his second year in college. I don't recall anyone saying "thank you."

I had a similar experience. Her parents were divorced; one parent was a scientologist, the other was not. It seems I got lucky when these people discarded a perfectly good daughter, who turned out to be a wonderful addition to my little family for the next three years until she was truly able to handle life on her own. She did say "thank you."
 
before we hooked up, my wife and I, had each read "Cheaper by the Dozen"
She had(and still has) a private school.
We picked up a lot of strays along the way.
Some people do coke, some scientology.
We do kids. They are just as expensive.
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation




I protected my own children from scientology for 20 years, and I did it very carefully as I didn't want to get declared at the time, but it was hard, because the person that was so determined to indoctrinate them was their own (well meaning) Father even though his own life was a train wreck as a direct result of being in the cult.

I thought I'd been successful until they arrived (as adults) to visit one day and I knew immediately that they had been sent (by their Father) to 'handle' me. They had the look in the eye that every scientologist has and that cultic demeanor that made me cringe and they proceeded to inform me that I was 'downstat' (regarding scientology) and that I needed to contribute more. That was the devastating day when I knew I'd lost them, disconnection a few years later was almost a relief because by then they were unpleasant to be around, I became nervous when they were near me and I had to watch every single word I said, and that is not a healthy way to live for anyone.

I've a lot be happy about though and I've decided in the last few months that its OK to relax now and to lose the constant guilt I've been carrying because I wasn't able to protect them from the madness of the cult. They are now (no doubt) carrying all that pointless planet saving angst that I've been able to throw off, so I'll always feel some guilt, because I am guilty.

It's a completely insane situation that only fellow Exes would ever understand, and without ESMB I think I would have gone completely mad.

Olska, I too 'adopted' a gorgeous teenage girl that arrived on my doorstep late one night for similar reasons, she said thank you too when she went on her way around 3 years later.

:yes:
 

Kutta

Silver Meritorious Patron
Oh, how I feel for you Trouble. I do hope they see the light — soon. It's so hard to understand anyone still toeing the party line what with everything that's going on at present.:heartflower:
 




I protected my own children from scientology for 20 years, and I did it very carefully as I didn't want to get declared at the time, but it was hard, because the person that was so determined to indoctrinate them was their own (well meaning) Father even though his own life was a train wreck as a direct result of being in the cult.

I thought I'd been successful until they arrived (as adults) to visit one day and I knew immediately that they had been sent (by their Father) to 'handle' me. They had the look in the eye that every scientologist has and that cultic demeanor that made me cringe and they proceeded to inform me that I was 'downstat' (regarding scientology) and that I needed to contribute more. That was the devastating day when I knew I'd lost them, disconnection a few years later was almost a relief because by then they were unpleasant to be around, I became nervous when they were near me and I had to watch every single word I said, and that is not a healthy way to live for anyone.

I've a lot be happy about though and I've decided in the last few months that its OK to relax now and to lose the constant guilt I've been carrying because I wasn't able to protect them from the madness of the cult. They are now (no doubt) carrying all that pointless planet saving angst that I've been able to throw off, so I'll always feel some guilt, because I am guilty.

It's a completely insane situation that only fellow Exes would ever understand, and without ESMB I think I would have gone completely mad.

Olska, I too 'adopted' a gorgeous teenage girl that arrived on my doorstep late one night for similar reasons, she said thank you too when she went on her way around 3 years later.

:yes:

On a recent week end, I spent a good couple of days with a member of the Co$, who has been a friend for decades. been a a go to person for the old guy who preceded davey. I wasn't judged. we just had a good times and no pressure of any type or degree.

I have to think your ex is an abusive jerk first and foremost

None of my friends (about a dozen) who are still in give me any flack. I think they're all OT7 or more, most Class Vlll.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
<snip>None of my friends (about a dozen) who are still in give me any flack. I think they're all OT7 or more, most Class Vlll.

Same here, however when they are having some difficulty with the 'group' they will discuss with me & vent as they know they are in a "KR Free" zone. I just ack them as they are venting, period.

( But, there were people I thought that were friends for life that - in spite of all -dropped me like I was a leper. And, I do not begrudge people doing what they feel is best is for them ).


I do wait for the day when they ask " How do I get out of the damn Truman Show"?
 

Claire Swazey

Spokeshole, fence sitter
My uncle also took in a troubled young teen. Glad he did that. She was included in everything for years. Still is, I think.

I never had a problem with the idea of Scn concepts being taught to kids, but I've always treated kids like kids and J and I always felt that if you don't teach them one of the prevailing religions, they aren't going to know what anyone's talking about. By prevailing, we mean Xtianity, Judaism, that sort of thing. They can make up their own minds when they get older.

Of course children are beings in little bodies. But young minds and stages of emotional and physical development go with that and people who don't give children the emotional nourishment they need, citing Hubbard or anything else, are just justifying their own failure as guardians/parents. I would never bring a child up as anything other than a child. One simply does not interact with children, as a general rule, the way one would interact with a 20 or 30 or 40 year old. No way.

That's why I've always been against convicting young teens and pre teens who commit murder- as adults. The other day I read about someone who was now 70 and who'd been incarcerated since his early teens. I'm sorry, but there's no way I go for that, either.
 

Claire Swazey

Spokeshole, fence sitter
I think this has thread has generated some good discussion, despite the occasional bit of finger wagging and a false comment alluding to my family.

Virtually any concept can be used to harm. But one of the things we were batting around was-- were these theories and comments of Hubbard's about children originally written and said with abusive purpose- are they innately abusive- or, as I felt, did Hubbard abuse children (and others) notwithstanding and in addition to those theories about children being beings in big bodies?

We can see the net result. We all can see it. It gets discussed every day here. Nothing but abuse and at the very best they can offer, a really bad environment for families.

Children and adolescents go through developmental stages. That has to be recognized and not only accomodated but encouraged and nurtured. And regardless of what anyone says, I've always felt that way- not that I should have to explain that. But their spirits, their spiritual nature, does not go through childhood toward maturity. There's no harm in saying that. The harm is, potentially, what one does about it.

IMO, Hubbard would have used anything- the Way to Happiness, HCOBs, PABs, the local goddamn phone book- to accomplish his ends. It's not so much that his goal was to go after people. No, his goals were power and money, seems to me. And he thought everyone was in the way and that they didn't matter. Believe me, this is not remotely what I used to think about him. I think it now, though. And I think that's why he ended up as he did.

As for me, I'm going to continue to recognize that children are eternal and infinite spiritual beings in small bodies and that their behavior, if carried out by adults, would occasionally be thought psychotic. These two comments are almost diametrically opposed, and seem contradictory, in any event, which is also very interesting.

And I'm also going to continue to treat children like children. Welcome and precious individuals who have very different needs (and wants) than do adults but to whom one may occasionally speak in a more adult way, though this would not be the majority of the time.
 

Francois Tremblay

Patron with Honors
With all due respect, I think the OP is projecting a lot of insecurities about children. Little children are not psychos unless you raise them that way (or the rare case of sociopathic individuals). They depend on the parents for their survival and thus develop mechanisms to cope with that dependence. Calling a child psycho because of that is like calling hostages maladjusted for trying to manipulate the feelings of their captors. Blaming the victim.
 

omnom

Patron with Honors
Little children are not psychos unless you raise them that way (or the rare case of sociopathic individuals).

I dunno about that - just the other day, my little psycho woke me up by pulling my eyelids open (ARCX!), smiling gently (covert hostility!), and whispering in my ear: "Daddy, I had an accident." (giant overt!).
 

Veda

Sponsor
eKBwu.png
 

Claire Swazey

Spokeshole, fence sitter
With all due respect, I think the OP is projecting a lot of insecurities about children. Little children are not psychos unless you raise them that way (or the rare case of sociopathic individuals). They depend on the parents for their survival and thus develop mechanisms to cope with that dependence. Calling a child psycho because of that is like calling hostages maladjusted for trying to manipulate the feelings of their captors. Blaming the victim.

I have no insecurities about children. I only have insecurities about my hair.

I'm only discussing concepts. And so should you.
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
We have entered Scientology Defense State Four.

Secure all concepts and blow the main ballast.
 
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