Hubbard on sex with little boys

[I told you I was trouble]

T


I agree. I called him a Fuck Turd earlier in a term of endearment kinda way.

I do that all the time IRL. In fact a few days ago I called my loveable postman that and he smiled and gave me a thumbs up. (Most call him a miserable SOB so he really appreciates FT. It's different and has a nicer ring to it.)

But I'm also considering that I might have past life overts on coots. (Yes I know he spells it with a "K" but my reactive mind doesn't differentiate.)

That's true, it does have a very nice ring to it. Tell you what ... you can call me an FT whenever you like and I promise not to demand to know what your crimes are.

 

[Terril park]

I don't see your point.

As an an example there is green on white saying
never tell lies in PR. This is routinely violated. For
example the number of scientologists has been stated to
be anything between 4 and 15 million. The religious surveys
conducted in UK and Australia are both about 2000 scientologists
and they are relative strongholds of Scn . In the US the ARIS survey states that the sample was too small to be accurate by their survey methods, but the raw data indicated 25,000 declaring themselves as scientologists at the last survey. The US has around 50% of the worlds scientologists. Jefferson Hawkins, who created COS best marketing campaign had all data on members andit came to around 40,000 members.

As an exercise see what other lies COS have said in PR.

 

[Bill]

YOU accepted that Lie. So, what exactly was LRH's actual involvement in the day to day control of THE CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY, Inc. (Please give dates) What Orders did you lie about or see being lied about? I do not think DM was placed by LRH AND What makes you think an OT is a good judge of character? OTs created this trap and trapped themselves too , HA! SUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!

Great comedy bit there koot! You've been here defending Hubbard like a true fanatic; You've been here defending Hubbard's "tech" like a true fanatic. And then you accuse someone else here of being a "sucker"?


I love a good laugh in the morning!

 

[Veda]

As an an example there is green on white saying
never tell lies in PR. This is routinely violated.

-snip-

You're referring to PR Series #2 which describes "PR of PR." What do you think "PR of PR" is?

Have you carefully and thoughtfully read the entire PR Series? including PR Series 18? and also including the Confidential PR Series issues?

Have you, then, integrated those issues with Confidential HCOPLs on Tactics and Propaganda?

How you done at least that much?

Obviously not.


Discussion re. overt/covert nature of Scientology

#1: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392325&postcount=38

#2: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392327&postcount=39

#3: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392331&postcount=40

 

[Koot]

Koot,

Seriously? Read Dianetics and then this book back-to-back. The hearsay goes away...especially the way both books talk about cells.

I can appreciate your effort to give me the "true data" but I have seen enough of both sides of this GPM and have things to do that seem more important to me. ie strumming and singing in such a way as to make people have an aesthetic experience and maybe even a good message.

 

[Koot]

Great comedy bit there koot! You've been here defending Hubbard like a true fanatic; You've been here defending Hubbard's "tech" like a true fanatic. And then you accuse someone else here of being a "sucker"?


I love a good laugh in the morning!

I meant ALL of us myself included, when we were all OT, long long ago before we spiraled down this far, the trap being this universe. Glad you got a laugh.

 

[Koot]

As an an example there is green on white saying
never tell lies in PR. This is routinely violated. For
example the number of scientologists has been stated to
be anything between 4 and 15 million. The religious surveys
conducted in UK and Australia are both about 2000 scientologists
and they are relative strongholds of Scn . In the US the ARIS survey states that the sample was too small to be accurate by their survey methods, but the raw data indicated 25,000 declaring themselves as scientologists at the last survey. The US has around 50% of the worlds scientologists. Jefferson Hawkins, who created COS best marketing campaign had all data on members andit came to around 40,000 members.

As an exercise see what other lies COS have said in PR.

Makes sense to me. The COS is off the rails to say the least. What did LRH say about cutting theta comm lines?

 

[guanoloco]

I can appreciate your effort to give me the "true data" but I have seen enough of both sides of this GPM and have things to do that seem more important to me. ie strumming and singing in such a way as to make people have an aesthetic experience and maybe even a good message.

Sounds like Nero. I'm talking about truth. There is no GPM or controversy or hearsay.

Hubbard authored that book.

That clearly demonstrates his duplicitous nature.

He cheated the VA, his wives, his business partners, his entrance into the military, his exit from the military, his war record and medals, his college diploma, his "nuclear physicist", his taxes, his orgs, his missions...

But you're convinced he wrote the truth with Scientology.

 

[Gib]

As an an example there is green on white saying
never tell lies in PR. This is routinely violated. For
example the number of scientologists has been stated to
be anything between 4 and 15 million. The religious surveys
conducted in UK and Australia are both about 2000 scientologists
and they are relative strongholds of Scn . In the US the ARIS survey states that the sample was too small to be accurate by their survey methods, but the raw data indicated 25,000 declaring themselves as scientologists at the last survey. The US has around 50% of the worlds scientologists. Jefferson Hawkins, who created COS best marketing campaign had all data on members andit came to around 40,000 members.

As an exercise see what other lies COS have said in PR.

well Terril,

yes it's true green on white says never tell lies in PR. Unfortunately your leader, LR Hubbard told a lie from the get go, namely he said he cleared 270 people in his book dianetics, DMSMH. Maybe that book was a lie, aye, or a violation of "never tell lies in PR"?

As your case supervisor, or C/S, lets begin an auditing session with an E-Meter. Here are the questions:

Auditor: Did L Ron Hubbard ever tell a lie?

Terril: (awaiting response)

 

[Veda]

well Terril,

yes it's true green on white says never tell lies in PR. Unfortunately your leader, LR Hubbard told a lie from the get go, namely he said he cleared 270 people in his book dianetics, DMSMH. Maybe that book was a lie, aye, or a violation of "never tell lies in PR"?

As your case supervisor, or C/S, lets begin an auditing session with an E-Meter. Here are the questions:

Auditor: Did L Ron Hubbard ever tell a lie?

Terril: (awaiting response)

Has anyone actually read the entire PR Series?

It's all over the map.

Hubbard mentions "PR of PR," "nicey nicey PR," and the "Sunday school version" of PR, and then starts changing the definition of PR.

It turns out that there are many definitions of PR and many types of PR according to Hubbard.

The same PR Series that Scientologists insist demands truthfulness of Scientologists, when explaining to "wogs" that Scientology PR is "the first truly honest Public Relations," also advocates "curving," exaggeration, misrepresentation, and selective omission of information.

"Gimmicks" and "capers," to be used by Scientology, are mentioned.

Also authorized for use is "Black PR."

This deceptively "nicey nicey"-coated topic has been covered before, but I guess hardly anyone has seriously studied Hubbard's writings on this and related topics. (Understandably, who would want to?)

So, when some goofy Scientologist stands up and proclaims that L. Ron Hubbard demanded truthfulness in PR (barf!), we "wogs" are poorly equipped to respond.

 

[George Layton]

The issue wasn't what Tony said about Hubbard's "comments on children", whatever you mean by that. The issue was his taking out of context a short passage in Dianetics and saying that Hubbard and Scientologists are okay with pedophilia. (Leah on her show acted like she discovered this for the first time and agreed with him).

He defended this repeatedly in tweets and on his blog quite strenuously, even though he had admitted that the first time he read Dianetics that this passage didn't jump out at him, or get his attention with regards to: "Oh My God!! He's down with pedophilia!". No one did. I certainly didn't when I read it. I'm sure Leah didn't either when she read it the first time. I bet you didn't get that impression either, if you yourself read it many years ago when you were in.

"... and saying that Hubbard and Scientologists are okay with pedophilia."
Show me where Tony said that. Those things hubbard said about children might be misinterpreted by someone in scientology who has sexually assaulted children that it was not wrong to do so because they may have come to believe it's been done by everyone at some time in their "wholetrack". What your saying here looks as if your saying Tony is saying ALL scientologists or MANY scientologists are ok with it or that because they are involved in scientology they are ok with it. People have come to different ideas of what scientology is and what is permissible in being a scientologist and there is a chance that some can misconstrue or interpret, with a subconscious or even conscious self justification, their scientology learning's, to act in ways that may be harmful to others.

 

[Terril park]

well Terril,

yes it's true green on white says never tell lies in PR. Unfortunately your leader, LR Hubbard told a lie from the get go, namely he said he cleared 270 people in his book dianetics, DMSMH. Maybe that book was a lie, aye, or a violation of "never tell lies in PR"?

As your case supervisor, or C/S, lets begin an auditing session with an E-Meter. Here are the questions:

Auditor: Did L Ron Hubbard ever tell a lie?

Terril: (awaiting response)

Isn't that the point I'm making?

 

[Jim Dandy]

"... and saying that Hubbard and Scientologists are okay with pedophilia."
Show me where Tony said that. Those things hubbard said about children might be misinterpreted by someone in scientology who has sexually assaulted children that it was not wrong to do so because they may have come to believe it's been done by everyone at some time in their "wholetrack". What your saying here looks as if your saying Tony is saying ALL scientologists or MANY scientologists are ok with it or that because they are involved in scientology they are ok with it. People have come to different ideas of what scientology is and what is permissible in being a scientologist and there is a chance that some can misconstrue or interpret, with a subconscious or even conscious self justification, their scientology learning's, to act in ways that may be harmful to others.

Okay, I'm going to show you:

Last November he was replying to someone with this tweet:

Tony Ortega‏Verified account @TonyOrtega94FollowFollow @TonyOrtega94 17Nov2017

Fun question. How's this: 1. Why don't you allow your wife to see her family. 2. Why did you stop getting auditing. 3. Why do you continue to print Hubbard's statement endorsing pedophilia in new editions of Dianetics.

And...

Tony Ortega‏Verified account @TonyOrtega94FollowFollow @TonyOrtega94 8Sep2017

Why did no one in Scientology notice Hubbard's endorsement of pedophilia on page 336? Because no one reads that far into Dianetics. No one.*

*This is ridiculous stating that, "No one reads that far into Dianetics". I read it. You probably read it, and everyone now has to read it due to the Basics Course on every book by Hubbard. I'm trying to find where even Tony admits that this passage didn't stand out to him when he first read Dianetics all the way through. That's because in context it doesn't stand out. It certainly doesn't say, "Hey pedophilia is just a-okay!"

And...


@TonyOrtega94
Follow Follow @TonyOrtega94 8Sep2017

Troll score: Read 'Dianetics' 5X. Never noticed Hubbard endorsement of pedophilia on p. 336. Offended that we accurately quote it. Winning!

And here is the post in which he essentially made it sound like Scientologists have been hiding the "vile secret" that....well you read it....

https://tonyortega.org/2017/10/14/c...-vile-secret-which-was-hiding-in-plain-sight/

In my opinion he is way overblowing this passage out of Dianetics and essentially making the claim that THIS is why the church turns a blind eye to pedophilia. Which is nonsense. Pedophilia goes on everywhere, unfortunately. Whenever the church has helped to cover up a molestation case it is because they cover up everything that can make them look bad. Everything. You know that. Tony knows that. I know that. It's not because pedophilia is "endorsed" for crying out loud.

 

[Enthetan]

Has anyone actually read the entire PR Series?

It's all over the map.

Hubbard mentions "PR of PR," "nicey nicey PR," and the "Sunday school version" of PR, and then starts changing the definition of PR.

It turns out that there are many definitions of PR and many types of PR according to Hubbard.

The same PR Series that Scientologists insist demands truthfulness of Scientologists, when explaining to "wogs" that Scientology PR is "the first truly honest Public Relations," also advocates "curving," exaggeration, misrepresentation, and selective omission of information.

"Gimmicks" and "capers," to be used by Scientology, are mentioned.

Also authorized for use is "Black PR."

This deceptively "nicey nicey"-coated topic has been covered before, but I guess hardly anyone has seriously studied Hubbard's writings on this and related topics. (Understandably, who would want to?)

So, when some goofy Scientologist stands up and proclaims that L. Ron Hubbard demanded truthfulness in PR (barf!), we "wogs" are poorly equipped to respond.

The part about "not telling lies" was tied into the part about "acceptable truths". In other words, never say something that can be proven to be a complete lie, because that will blow up in your face when it's documented to be a lie. Instead, tell an "acceptable truth", something that misleads (through not giving ALL the truth) without being an actual lie.

Like saying "Hubbard does not exert management control over Scientology", but not mentioning he does offer "advices" which are effectively treated as orders.

 

[F.Bullbait]

The part about "not telling lies" was tied into the part about "acceptable truths". In other words, never say something that can be proven to be a complete lie, because that will blow up in your face when it's documented to be a lie. Instead, tell an "acceptable truth", something that misleads (through not giving ALL the truth) without being an actual lie.

Like saying "Hubbard does not exert management control over Scientology", but not mentioning he does offer "advices" which are effectively treated as orders.

Just like you don't pay for services, you make a "donation".

 

[Terril park]

You're referring to PR Series #2 which describes "PR of PR." What do you think "PR of PR" is?

Have you carefully and thoughtfully read the entire PR Series? including PR Series 18? and also including the Confidential PR Series issues?

Have you, then, integrated those issues with Confidential HCOPLs on Tactics and Propaganda?

How you done at least that much?

Obviously not.


Discussion re. overt/covert nature of Scientology

#1: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392325&postcount=38

#2: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392327&postcount=39

#3: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=392331&postcount=40

I've studied all the PR series, more than 30 years ago. Just reread PR series 18 and it comes across as full of paranoia, for example :-

" The world is full of madmen.

The basic characteristic of extreme madness is perpetual
attack, attacks on anything, attacks on persons or things
which contain no menace."

One might say this above are the words of a "merchant of chaos".

I haven't read confidential issues on PR. Can you link to them?

 

[Terril park]

well Terril,

yes it's true green on white says never tell lies in PR. Unfortunately your leader, LR Hubbard told a lie from the get go, namely he said he cleared 270 people in his book dianetics, DMSMH. Maybe that book was a lie, aye, or a violation of "never tell lies in PR"?

As your case supervisor, or C/S, lets begin an auditing session with an E-Meter. Here are the questions:

Auditor: Did L Ron Hubbard ever tell a lie?

Terril: (awaiting response)

Many have been documented, by many, including by myself.

 

[phenomanon]

That's true, it does have a very nice ring to it. Tell you what ... you can call me an FT whenever you like and I promise not to demand to know what your crimes are.

Then why are you carrying that clipboard?

 

[phenomanon]

I meant ALL of us myself included, when we were all OT, long long ago before we spiraled down this far, the trap being this universe. Glad you got a laugh

 

[Gib]

I've studied all the PR series, more than 30 years ago. Just reread PR series 18 and it comes across as full of paranoia, for example :-

" The world is full of madmen.

The basic characteristic of extreme madness is perpetual
attack, attacks on anything, attacks on persons or things
which contain no menace."

One might say this above are the words of a "merchant of chaos".

I haven't read confidential issues on PR. Can you link to them?

yah, and that's Hubbard, a madman, he was no messiah.

That's Hubbard's rhetoric to actually create chaos and place hisself as a savior, mankinds greatest friend. Positioning tech he did.

ROFLMAO