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I no longer suffer because of Scientology or Scientologists. I am enlightened.


Oh suffering is a great subject. Lots of suffering.

If anyone thinks they know what suffering is, wait til next week.


Hi Will! Good to see you again and know you're well. :thumbsup:

I know what you're saying. My way of dealing with it is similar - I learn to say "thank you" to God for whatever happens, for what might be learned from it.

It seems to take the stress off and make big problems so much smaller.

Will Fry

Hiya Will, awesome OP! You're a good man, dontcha ever forget it!

On Tolle, though I find that he recycles a lot of universal ideas, a few years ago I read one of his articles ( he regularly contribute to a few local free mags here) regarding what it takes for one to become content, it was excellent and I have a tonne of respect for him and his brand of woo.

Cheers man, and :carryon:

On the day you see a blade of grass as your equal, you will find peace within.

Will Fry

You are indeed awesome at being awesome. You always were.

I appreciate what you are trying to do here. But this just is not true. Neither the opposite.

Your mind betrays you, my friend.

It tells you to agree with things that seem smart and positive.

It does this so it can recognize itself as being smart and positive. And thus, better than those who are dumb and negative.

And so you continue to seek acceptance from others who do the same, weather they are aware of this or not. And so they are all suffering. As are you.

But this is not "bad" or "wrong". It just is.


Angelic Poster
So, are you going to hang around for a while now and tell us what we're really experiencing?

Will Fry

So, are you going to hang around for a while now and tell us what we're really experiencing?

The past and future are of grave importance to the ego. Without them, it would be powerless.

There is only now.

And my ego is pleased in telling you so. lol

Will Fry


Re: thread title, "I am enlightened." Will, sounds like you may not have yet gotten to the part about "enlightenment," itself, being only another state, a condition, and therefore subject to temporal change; and, thusly, is not the "real deal." Not that I actually know that much about it myself. Jes' sayin'.


I feel no stress. No worry. No fear or anxiety. No shame, blame or regret. No anger. No pity. No sadness. No desire. No obsession. No greed. No lust.

And as a professional blackjack dealer of 9 years... I could give a fuck what the next card is. And that's probably more puzzling to me than being grateful for all my suffering.

I feel connected to all things. And existence has become an unimaginable joy.

So you, or anyone else, please tell me what it is.

Will Fry


Re: thread title, "I am enlightened." Will, sounds like you may not have yet gotten to the part about "enlightenment," itself, being only another state, a condition, and therefore subject to temporal change; and, thusly, is not the "real deal." Not that I actually know that much about it myself. Jes' sayin'.

Tried to send you a PM that would read "Tell me everything!"


"PM: Disabled"


Will Fry

ya I was just calling your bluff.

people think they know what sex is like until they have sex.

suffer well, my friend.


Gold Meritorious Patron
Yeah but

I've read Tolle and some makes sense. But sometimes it looks like just another new age cult where a new "demon" has been named and targetted for eradication.

In Christianity it's the devil, in Scientology it's the reactive mind (or SPs!). In Tolle's writings (and a lot of new age stuff) the new demon is EGO. Big bad EGO! But putting a label on something and trying to eradicate it..... doesn't that just give it more power???

And Mystic.... WTF - if you're going to make predictions, make em!


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Welcome Back Will

Welcome back, Will. :clap: Great post. Hang around. We'd all like to hear moar ! :yes:


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Peak Experiences


Peak experience is a term used to describe certain transpersonal and ecstatic states, particularly ones tinged with themes of euphoria, harmonization and interconnectedness. Participants characterize these experiences, and the revelations imparted therein, as possessing an ineffably mystical (or overtly religious) quality or essence.

Many of the nuances the term now connotes were expounded by psychologist Abraham Maslow, in his 1964 work Religions, Values, and Peak Experiences.[1] To some extent the term represents Maslow's attempt to "naturalize" those experiences which have generally been identified as religious experiences and whose origin has, by implication, been thought of as supernatural. Maslow (1970) believed that the origin, core and essence of every known "high religion" was "the private, lonely, personal illumination, revelation, or ecstasy of some acutely sensitive prophet or seer" (p. 19).

The nature of peak experiences
Peak experiences are described by Maslow as especially joyous and exciting moments in life, involving sudden feelings of intense happiness and well-being, wonder and awe, and possibly also involving an awareness of transcendental unity or knowledge of higher truth (as though perceiving the world from an altered, and often vastly profound and awe-inspiring perspective). They usually come on suddenly and are often inspired by deep meditation, intense feelings of love, exposure to great art or music, or the overwhelming beauty of nature. Peak experiences can also be triggered pharmacologically. A 2006 double-blind clinical study by Griffiths and colleagues showed that psilocybin (the principal psychoactive component of various psychedelic mushroom species) induced intense peak experiences in a majority of study volunteers.[2] In a 14-month follow-up study, a majority of volunteers reported that the psilocybin-induced experience had been overwhelmingly positive and was among the five most personally meaningful spiritual experiences of their lives.[3]
Maslow describes how the peak experience tends to be uplifting and ego-transcending; it releases creative energies; it affirms the meaning and value of existence; it gives a sense of purpose to the individual; it gives a feeling of integration; it leaves a permanent mark on the individual, evidently changing them for the better. Peak experiences can be therapeutic in that they tend to increase the individual's free will, self-determination, creativity, and empathy. The highest peaks include "feelings of limitless horizons opening up to the vision, the feeling of being simultaneously more powerful and also more helpless than one ever was before, the feeling of great ecstasy and wonder and awe, and the loss of placing in time and space" (1970, p. 164). When peak experiences are especially powerful, the sense of self dissolves into an awareness of a greater unity. Maslow's theories appear to be supported by the recent reports from Griffiths and colleagues, in which community observers (such as close family members) reported a variety of positive personality changes in volunteers in the psilocybin arm of the study.
Maslow claimed that all individuals are capable of peak experiences. Virtually everyone, he suggested, has a number of peak experiences in the course of their life, but often such experiences are taken for granted. In so-called "non-peakers", peak experiences are somehow resisted and suppressed. Maslow argued that peak experiences should be studied and cultivated, so that they can be introduced to those who have never had them or who resist them, providing them a route to achieve personal growth, integration, and fulfillment.

Sustained Peak Experience
Maslow defined[4] lengthy, willfully induced peak experiences (plateau experiences) as a characteristic of the self-actualized. He described it as a state of witnessing or cognitive blissfulness, the achievement of which requires a lifetime of long and hard effort, and also self-actualization.


Gold Meritorious Patron
Thanks to Panda's advice to someone here to read Tolle's "The Power of Now" to calm one's mind, I'm in the middle of this book. :)

What's interesting and fascinating to me, is that Tolle describes experience of being in the Now just like what I've personally had at some blissful moments of my life. - Every time I've had those I was in the NOW.
So, to me what Tolle describes has not been something unseen and unheard of before.

And I see that what Tolle speaks about thew Power of being in the NOW parallels Maslow's description of Peak Experiences.

(not going to make assertions here.... just putting it out here... You can have at it)


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According to Buddhism re suffering


The Four Noble Truths

1. Life means suffering.

2. The origin of suffering is attachment.

3. The cessation of suffering is attainable.

4. The path to the cessation of suffering.

1. Life means suffering.

To live means to suffer, because the human nature is not perfect and neither is the world we live in. During our lifetime, we inevitably have to endure physical suffering such as pain, sickness, injury, tiredness, old age, and eventually death; and we have to endure psychological suffering like sadness, fear, frustration, disappointment, and depression. Although there are different degrees of suffering and there are also positive experiences in life that we perceive as the opposite of suffering, such as ease, comfort and happiness, life in its totality is imperfect and incomplete, because our world is subject to impermanence. This means we are never able to keep permanently what we strive for, and just as happy moments pass by, we ourselves and our loved ones will pass away one day, too.

2. The origin of suffering is attachment.

The origin of suffering is attachment to transient things and the ignorance thereof. Transient things do not only include the physical objects that surround us, but also ideas, and -in a greater sense- all objects of our perception. Ignorance is the lack of understanding of how our mind is attached to impermanent things. The reasons for suffering are desire, passion, ardour, pursuit of wealth and prestige, striving for fame and popularity, or in short: craving and clinging. Because the objects of our attachment are transient, their loss is inevitable, thus suffering will necessarily follow. Objects of attachment also include the idea of a "self" which is a delusion, because there is no abiding self. What we call "self" is just an imagined entity, and we are merely a part of the ceaseless becoming of the universe.

3. The cessation of suffering is attainable.

The cessation of suffering can be attained through nirodha. Nirodha means the unmaking of sensual craving and conceptual attachment. The third noble truth expresses the idea that suffering can be ended by attaining dispassion. Nirodha extinguishes all forms of clinging and attachment. This means that suffering can be overcome through human activity, simply by removing the cause of suffering. Attaining and perfecting dispassion is a process of many levels that ultimately results in the state of Nirvana. Nirvana means freedom from all worries, troubles, complexes, fabrications and ideas. Nirvana is not comprehensible for those who have not attained it.

4. The path to the cessation of suffering.

There is a path to the end of suffering - a gradual path of self-improvement, which is described more detailed in the Eightfold Path. It is the middle way between the two extremes of excessive self-indulgence (hedonism) and excessive self-mortification (asceticism); and it leads to the end of the cycle of rebirth. The latter quality discerns it from other paths which are merely "wandering on the wheel of becoming", because these do not have a final object. The path to the end of suffering can extend over many lifetimes, throughout which every individual rebirth is subject to karmic conditioning. Craving, ignorance, delusions, and its effects will disappear gradually, as progress is made on the path.


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The basic idea of Buddhism is that life means suffering. - I disagree. I have always disagreed with this idea.


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Will might have been sharp in his statements. But I agree with him. He is right in his OP and main points.

Life is not and has not been "suffering".
- We made it such (i.e. we preferred to suffer, to experience things we didn't want to experience).

Life after Scientology is not such. Has not been such. Should not be such. Is not such.


Gold Meritorious Patron
Too complicated

Hello there. If you don't know me, youtube has some videos of me talking about my youth in the cult. But before you read this, know that I do not believe myself to be of any actual importance.

It has been many months since I've posted on this site. I've forgotten the password for my first account (willhaven720). I mostly goof off on the internet as an escape, and don't feel that side of me would be appropriate here.

I still don't believe myself to be a role model. And as I've always said "If you don't want them to turn out like me -- don't give your kids to Scientology!"

I have however, made a very, very significant breakthrough with regard to my personal well-being. And I believe that it is important for me to share this with ex-Scientologists who seek inner-peace.

I will try to keep it simple.

Suffering is the non-acceptance of what is.

Pain is unavoidable in life. But suffering is a choice we are always given. Weather that suffering be from slow moving traffic or the loss of a loved one, there is always a choice to resist or accept it.

Accepting reality (not suffering), requires awareness of one's own ego. This can be particularly difficult for someone who has been in Scientology.

I have spent the last few years attempting to undo the damage that was done to me in Scientology. This has finally come to fruition. Here is an example of what I mean...

I am grateful to the following people:

L Ron Hubbard. My stepfather (Scientologist). David Miscavige. The Sea Org members who managed me when I was in the Sea Org. Anyone involved in my fair-game. Childhood bullies. Girlfriends who have cheated on me.

And what do they all have in common? Quite simply, they have all been a source of suffering in my life.

So why would I be grateful to them all of a sudden?? Because it is my suffering that has pushed me to find the REAL way to happiness.

This is not a joke...

I am grateful. And I suffer no more... For ANY reason.

If we look at the history of life on this planet, we see that suffering is the driving force behind almost all evolution. A fish suffers for lack of food or fear of predators in the water and evolves to be able to survive on land. Similar stories can be told of birds, bugs, flowers, primates, bacteria, etc...

Humans suffer too much. It's time for us to evolve. If we don't, there may not be humans for much longer. Which, in reality (key word), isn't a big deal. We are not the center of universe. I just believe our beauty as artists is worth fighting for the survival of all. Also, Earth is beautiful and should stay that way if possible.

The question is 'how?'

The answer is 'now'.

This is covered at great length by Eckhart Tolle in a book called 'The Power of Now'.

You can read it. But I actually recommended listening to him do so. So get it on itunes or whatever. The reason being is that we (ex-Scientologists), have a particularly troubled history on the subjects of the mind, self-help, spirituality, and so forth. I personally feel that listening to the author helps to keep our subconscious from associating the content of this book as "something else" (*wink*).

Do not expect instant results. Just get what you can out of the book and go on living your life.

You probably need to give yourself more time to suffer. And suffer. And suffer... As most do, and will forever.

But perhaps one day you will suffer enough (without killing yourself lol). And that day could be pleasantly transformational... if you accept all things and stop bullshitting yourself about what is and is not real.

Good luck.

Wow that was like opposite of Orientation. I am so awesome at being awesome.

Too complicated. Try this: quit coffee and tobacco if you use either or both. Get on some high end effective diet suppliments. A lot of those are just fresh herbs from a good grocery store ... as in fresh ginger, habenero peppers, garlic, onions, fresh tumeric, dill, sage, etc. Growing your own is best. Get some herbal info. Spend 3 hours per day at the gym, work up to really stiff workouts. Be sure to include flexibility training in your routines. Simplify life as much as possible. For your online time, I reccommend lumosity for brain training games, and get yourself a free practice account at http://www.forex.com There is a lot of free training material online for FOREX, try babypips.com that is a good one to start with. It's the ultimate video game. Top players do 20k per night. That is real money. No shit. Realistically, that kind of juice can be brought down with an account around 300k.