Is Greg Wilhere Evil or is he Only A Scientologist?

aaron saxton

Patron with Honors
Is Greg Wilhere Evil?

The short answer, yes.

Like LRH or even DM, Charismatic, but rotten to the core.

In March 1995 I went on a mission to the Ship and spent several days with Greg Wilhere.

His comments were out of this world. He lied and stated things in an attempt to convince me in taking further actions that were ludicrous. Stating a crew member of importance had been involved with the NSA, CIA and FBI. Total Fabrication.

I have no doubt whatsoever that we can thank Greg for Marty's state of mind. Marty was stuck with Greg for ages on the Ship.

The irony is that I actually liked his wife, sandy, she was pleasant like Greg. However if they both had a job to do, they both did it ruthlessley.

It seems to be that all dictators have this quality. It is also the quality of Confidence Men as well.
 
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Winston Smith

Flunked Scientology
I think men and women are both basically evil and good. i don't know anyone, personally, who is all one or the other.

The "man is basically good" slogan is a "feel good" sort of thing, rooted in hog wash. We all want to feel that we are good, but I keep finding areas to own, that invalidates the hell out of that line.

I'll take Clint Eastwood movies over Mr. Rogers any day.

That made me smile because Clint Eastwood is an actor. It is an act. In person, he loathes the sort of people he played. Who knows, maybe Mr Rogers was a ruthless maniac under that "would you be my friend." (Rogers was a US Marine in WWII I believe, maybe Korea :))
 

Happy Days

Silver Meritorious Patron
I dont think they do so much because the viewpoint when you are "in" is sooooo different from when you are out. its like two different planets with two totally different cultures.

Maybe greg wilhere is just being a scientologist in his mind. just "making it go right" and applying "dont be afraid to hurt someone in a just cause!!". who knows?
I mean 30 plus years in the SO, how many times has all that shit been drilled into him and made to hit home?? You can lose "yourself" in there for sure.:confused2:

Yes, your right... I still hold out hope that the person, family/friend, that you had known is still in there somewhere if only you could make contact and impinge...
Where there is life there is hope ... is a stable for me ...
 

Lee_from_phx

Patron with Honors
Is it evil if you truly, honestly believe you have just saved a woman's soul from a crazy SP?

Is it?

To us the action is evil because we feel we know better, but what if he TRULY believes that his actions saved her life?

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
 

Kookaburra

Gold Meritorious Patron
The short answer, yes.

Like LRH or even DM, Charismatic, but rotten to the core.

In March 1995 I went on a mission to the Ship and spent several days with Greg Wilhere.

His comments were out of this world. He lied and stated things in an attempt to convince me in taking further actions that were ludicrous. Stating a crew member of importance had been involved with the NSA, CIA and FBI. Total Fabrication.

I have no doubt whatsoever that we can thank Greg for Marty's state of mind. Marty was stuck with Greg for ages on the Ship.

The irony is that I actually liked his wife, sandy, she was pleasant like Greg. However if they both had a job to do, they both did it ruthlessley.

It seems to be that all dictators have this quality. It is also the quality of Confidence Men as well.

There is something about charisma. It seems it really is a "charm" in the majick sense. It covers evil. Or covers an evil intention. I have learned to be very suspicious of charismatic people.
 

Spirited

Patron with Honors
Yes, your right... I still hold out hope that the person, family/friend, that you had known is still in there somewhere if only you could make contact and impinge...
Where there is life there is hope ... is a stable for me ...
ABSOLUTELY!!!!!:)
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
This is a common comment whenever someone mentions good intentions here. It always leaves me wondering if people really believe this and, if so, what sort of intentions they think might pave the road in the opposite direction of Hell. Just curious.
 

SchwimmelPuckel

Genuine Meatball
This is a common comment whenever someone mentions good intentions here. It always leaves me wondering if people really believe this and, if so, what sort of intentions they think might pave the road in the opposite direction of Hell. Just curious.
It's profound philosophy! - It right up there with: 'If you can't learn from your mistakes, there's no good reason to make another!'

:yes:
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
This is a common comment whenever someone mentions good intentions here. It always leaves me wondering if people really believe this and, if so, what sort of intentions they think might pave the road in the opposite direction of Hell. Just curious.

The problem with 'good intentions' is that they are not *enough*. And, combined with sufficient 'certainty' that they will be enough they have a long human history of very very bad results.

So, good intentions are good, but, it's essential to actually have a program in mind to apply those intentions and some kind of rational reason to think that whatever is going to be done will achieve those goals, and do so without creating collateral damage of magnitude.

*If* Scientology were indeed Mankind's Only Hope, then it's possible that the 'good intention' of Clearing the Planet per KSW would be justified. And, that's *despite* the damage caused.

It's not. So, the justification is lost and all the vapid 'good intentions' in the world won't balance the evil.

Example: I want to end world hunger. So, I begin a campaign to leave a fresh turd in every living room from Chicago to Calabassas. Since I have good intentions, I will break in to houses, and, if someone tries to stop me, I may be forced to kill or at least disable them.

See any problems here?

The intention is good, but, the program has no rational hope of achieving the stated goal, will inevitably cause other evil and is *worse* than a waste of time. No matter *how* good my intentions.

Zinj
 

Winston Smith

Flunked Scientology
The problem with 'good intentions' is that they are not *enough*. And, combined with sufficient 'certainty' that they will be enough they have a long human history of very very bad results.

So, good intentions are good, but, it's essential to actually have a program in mind to apply those intentions and some kind of rational reason to think that whatever is going to be done will achieve those goals, and do so without creating collateral damage of magnitude.

*If* Scientology were indeed Mankind's Only Hope, then it's possible that the 'good intention' of Clearing the Planet per KSW would be justified. And, that's *despite* the damage caused.

It's not. So, the justification is lost and all the vapid 'good intentions' in the world won't balance the evil.

Example: I want to end world hunger. So, I begin a campaign to leave a fresh turd in every living room from Chicago to Calabassas. Since I have good intentions, I will break in to houses, and, if someone tries to stop me, I may be forced to kill or at least disable them.

See any problems here?

The intention is good, but, the program has no rational hope of achieving the stated goal, will inevitably cause other evil and is *worse* than a waste of time. No matter *how* good my intentions.

Zinj

You are so smart Zinjy! :) I want you for my Secretary of State when I am elected President.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
The problem with 'good intentions' is that they are not *enough*. And, combined with sufficient 'certainty' that they will be enough they have a long human history of very very bad results.
Makes sense to me.
So, good intentions are good, but, it's essential to actually have a program in mind to apply those intentions and some kind of rational reason to think that whatever is going to be done will achieve those goals, and do so without creating collateral damage of magnitude.
Makes sense to me.
*If* Scientology were indeed Mankind's Only Hope, then it's possible that the 'good intention' of Clearing the Planet per KSW would be justified. And, that's *despite* the damage caused.
It's not. So, the justification is lost and all the vapid 'good intentions' in the world won't balance the evil.
Makes sense to me.
Example: I want to end world hunger. So, I begin a campaign to leave a fresh turd in every living room from Chicago to Calabassas. Since I have good intentions, I will break in to houses, and, if someone tries to stop me, I may be forced to kill or at least disable them.

See any problems here?
That's a shitty analogy but I see the problem. If you *actually* thought that these actions might lead to achieving the goal. I don't think that anyone in their right mind would think these actions would achieve the goal but who am I to judge? That's why God invented Psychiatrists.
The intention is good, but, the program has no rational hope of achieving the stated goal, will inevitably cause other evil and is *worse* than a waste of time. No matter *how* good my intentions.
Zinj
Now it sounds like you're talking about scientology again.
Makes sense to me.

PS: Is there a road that leads in the opposite direction of Hell and, if so, what is it paved with? :)
 

Mystic

Crusader
Greg Wilhere is a fine example of successful Lips Hubbard spewed scifaggOTness: A worthless POS non-human who believes the evil called Ethics-Tech-Admin.
 

me myself & i

Patron Meritorious
The problem with 'good intentions' is that they are not *enough*.

Yes and No Zinj.

The senior problem with 'good intentions' is that while the word 'intention' is near universally agreed upon to mean the one thing, e.g. 'a desired result', the word 'good' is not. The former being relatively absolute, whilst the later is absolutely relative.

Absolutely relative.

If all of humanity were brought to the proverbial Garden of Eden to the place of the proverbial Tree of Knowledge (of Good and Evil) and each human being were given an axe and an instruction, the instruction being: 'cut off only those evil branchs on that Tree', within moments only a stump would remain.

Only a stump.

And, combined with sufficient 'certainty' that they will be enough they have a long human history of very very bad results.

Agreed, however I suggest: the characterizations of the results as being very very very bad reveals a flaw in the phrasing of the initial question itself. Which captures the personal rage but misses the impersonal point that underlies the experience itself (at least the point that could teach us). The point being impersonal, the experience being personal. In other words, the eradication of evil would demand an eradication of goodness as well as evil. Which point is sufficiently overwhelmed by the presence of human personal anger to render it, well, impersonally pointless.

It is a circle humanity has traversed and is traversing for unimaginable spans of time. And will not be un-traversing anytime soon. At least according to the Gods. Lol.

Hubbards 'date time place form event' (paraphrased for lack of perfect recall) is a beautiful presentation/revelation of a shocking misunderstanding of the reality of being a so called thetan.

Greg Wilhere is and was an imaginary human personal identity that will pass. As Goodness & Evil are likewise (though impersonal in nature, they pass too). Imaginary concepts of the spiritual being imagining itself as #1. not only being human, but #2. imagining their personal human identity as somehow in someway being significant to the universe (& or to the Gods).

It is not.

Aside from the sheer joy of human righteous indignation, nothing much else can come of it. Lol. Not that there's anything wrong with the sheer joy of human indignation mind you. Lol.

me myself & i
 

Mystic

Crusader
The senior senior non-problem has only a limited somewhat to do with a knowledge of "good and evil". Immortality goes way beyond such.
 
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